Arian Foster Let It Be Known That He Is A Non-Believer

[lobotomybeats]

Is it too much to ask of believers that they know more about god than those that don't believe?

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Turning @Freeze  into @WATER  in here. Sheesh...........

 

[darthska]

[quote name="HTG Designs"][quote name="DarthSka"]So they prayed.

Awesome.

The fact that they prayed further strengthens the point that country was NOT founded on Christianity, because it shows that some of them had beliefs, but NONE of those beliefs made their way into what matters: the paperwork that laid the blueprint.[/quote]Not necessarily Christianity. They were a hodgepodge of Episcopalians, Quakers, Anabaptists, Presbyterians, and Congregationalists. But what you believe does affect your perspective which in turns influences everything you do and dont do.

It would be safer to say they were believers in a conscious creator and recognized they were under that authority. Thats why God is always present in government efforts but no characteristics or attributes are accredited to Him in any way.[/quote]This might sound nitpicky, like an argument of semantics, but 'they' means all. No, I don't feel comfortable, scratch that; no, I don't feel it's accurate to say 'they' (meaning all) "were believers in a conscious creator and recognized they were under that authority."

Obviously, atheism was near non-existent back then, but I've read too many things that strongly suggest that there were atheists among the founding.

Thing is, no matter their persuasion/belief, the blueprint they laid out makes it clear that the government is NOT part of the religion game.

 

[rillo561]

Yall keep dropping them fact bombs, and freeze gonna have a lifechanging breakdown in this thread

Seriously, I've seen him post many times and is cool with me, but I had no clue he was a fundie. Nothing wrong with it, but wow.

 

[ncvikingx97]

I'm happy to see this, hopefully this will spark others to freely speak their minds.
I think at some point, everyone has doubts about their religion. If you are not capable of seeing others perspectives, that isn't a sign of faith, that is a sign of ignorance. Faith is faith because at the end of the day, there really is no proof. Atheists have just as much proof regarding the human creation as any religion.
I was born catholic, but I don't know if I would necessarily identify as that anymore. I have always tried to believe in god, but many things throughout religion conflict with my personal views. I also don't like how many of the religious will use God as a way of explaining things.

Religion helps people cope with their lives, which is why some have a hard time looking past their religion's contradictions.

With that being , I believe in god, but I try to stay in my lane when it comes to others beliefs. They are just as correct as me. I don't identify with any major religion though, I like to think I have my own beliefs.

 

[htg designs]

[quote name="HTG Designs"][quote name="DarthSka"]So they prayed.

Awesome.

The fact that they prayed further strengthens the point that country was NOT founded on Christianity, because it shows that some of them had beliefs, but NONE of those beliefs made their way into what matters: the paperwork that laid the blueprint.

Not necessarily Christianity. They were a hodgepodge of Episcopalians, Quakers, Anabaptists, Presbyterians, and Congregationalists. But what you believe does affect your perspective which in turns influences everything you do and dont do.

It would be safer to say they were believers in a conscious creator and recognized they were under that authority. Thats why God is always present in government efforts but no characteristics or attributes are accredited to Him in any way.[/quote]This might sound nitpicky, like an argument of semantics, but 'they' means all. No, I don't feel comfortable, scratch that; no, I don't feel it's accurate to say 'they' (meaning all) "were believers in a conscious creator and recognized they were under that authority."

Obviously, atheism was near non-existent back then, but I've read too many things that strongly suggest that there were atheists among the founding.

Thing is, no matter their persuasion/belief, the blueprint they laid out makes it clear that the government is NOT part of the religion game.[/quote]
Some coulda been satanist and used Christianity as a front ( i see evidence of that too) I cant really tell you whats in a mans heart, only what I have researched. I can certainly agree with the last statement. Its kinda of tricky tho.
The founders dedicated America to God and prayed over America all the time. But Americas birth is NOT because of religion/ Christianity nor was it the basis of it. It just was influenced by believers. Founders wanted to do whatever they wanted to ( withing certain rules to allow society to move forward of course) You can find both believers and non believer that say feel the same way. And thats what America is ( supposed to be). The freedom to be yourself.
There is no government ordinance to believe in anything (except for the govment itself lol)...........

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

[freeze]

[quote name="Freeze"][quote name="DarthSka"][quote name="Freeze"]People with faith have no fear of speaking on their faith

Yet I keep hearing all this talk of religious people being persecuted. [/quote]Well I take that back. They should have no fear, but people of different religions have faced penalties all through history. The syrians face a ton right now. Religion has always been one of the basis of war. It is less prevalent in America though. It's a country built on Christianity.[/quote] False.

John Adams (2nd President) said this later in his life:

"Twenty times in the course of my late reading, have I been upon the point of breaking out, "This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it!"

James Madison (4th President) said:

"Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise."

Also said, "During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution."

Ben Franklin:

"As to Jesus of Nazareth, I think the System of Morals and his Religion has received various corrupting Changes, and I have some doubts as to his Divinity; tho' it is a question I do not dogmatize upon."

But those are all just quotes from founding fathers. This is actually in the Constitution:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."

That makes it perfectly clear that the government is NOT to respect religion. It also makes it clear that the government is not to step in the way of private practices of religion, but that's not the discussion. We're talking about the country being founded as Christian.

Nope, not according to the Constitution, or the thoughts of the founding fathers. [quote name="Freeze"][quote name="BLASTERCOMBO"]Country built on what??? They came here for tobacco and freedom from taxation. Please don't tell me people actually believe that "religious freedom" stuff we learned in the 5th grade

It's in the constitution to keep your religion to your damn self for crying out loud [/quote]In God we Trust bruh. One nation under God.

Religion is out of school, but it's still a Christian country.[/quote]'In God We Trust' was added to money in the 1950s. Look it up.

Same with 'Under God' in the pledge.

Here's the original, written in 1892 by Francis Bellamy:

"I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."[/quote]

Sooo..the country moved toward religion as it grew, and not away from it?

Freeze, Christ isn't the only God. That's my point.

You're a good dude, but you're being outclassed in this thread.

lol you're acting like this is an argument you can ever hope to win. I'm being outclassed by people that think differently than I do? How's that even possible? We're playing two different sports. No matter what either of us say, we'll continue to believe what we choose. Do not for a second thing you're proving anything. I respect your opinion. But it changes nothing. It's loosely based only on what you can see. Only on what you can touch. What you can explain and have control over. It's your ego that will not allow you to believe that there's more. You want to have all the control and believe that you can just do it all. Time will tell if you're correct in that assumption.


In Christianity, there is only one God.

 

[freeze]

Yall keep dropping them fact bombs, and freeze gonna have a lifechanging breakdown in this thread

Don't act like you know me bro. My faith is stronger than these comments. It is what it is. You guys don't have to believe. I'm not trying to convert you.

 

[gwap]

 

Yall keep dropping them fact bombs, and freeze gonna have a lifechanging breakdown in this thread

Don't act like you know me bro. My faith is stronger than these comments. It is what it is. You guys don't have to believe. I'm not trying to convert you.

 

[blastercombo]

So you moved goal posts and instead of "country founded by God" it's now "country kinda going towards PC religious talk"? Where did your original point go?

 

[darthska]

[quote name="Freeze"]Sooo..the country moved toward religion as it grew, and not away from it?[/quote]Sure, in the same way a minority group 'moves towards' the desires of the whining, bullying majority.

 

[gwap]

 

Originally Posted by Freeze  
Sooo..the country moved toward religion as it grew, and not away from it?

Sure, in the same way a minority group 'moves towards' the desires of the whining, bullying majority.

 

[freeze]

 

Yall keep dropping them fact bombs, and freeze gonna have a lifechanging breakdown in this thread

Don't act like you know me bro. My faith is stronger than these comments. It is what it is. You guys don't have to believe. I'm not trying to convert you.

View media item 1643867

what facts are being dropped disproving God and religion my g? The one with the founding fathers wanting a separation of church and state? I knew that, I misspoke, in saying built, as in it was solely built on Christianity. The foundation for religious freedoms were there. They wanted a separation only so as to not not allow the country to benefit from religion or promote one over the other. But then somewhere in there, they changed that. And they wanted more of a presence. And now the government observes churches as entities, right along with tax credits.

'fundie'? lol. had to google that. people can't just be religious anymore without being fundamentalist and conservative? You're seen my posts right? I'm far from any of that. Far. extremely far. It's funny that people think of those that believe and immediately picture who they see on tv or in the park. I'm chillin. I believe in God, but I also live my life and make the choices I want to make. There's a ton of things in the Bible I don't agree with. Lots of ideals and themes. But I recognize times were different. I don't follow every rule. I can't. I'm just a good person based on my personal morals and values. Atheists always think they're so much smarter than everyone else. Like they've uncovered the truth first and are just sitting on one big inside joke. But they know as much as we know as far as what is and what isn't.

 

[darthska]

[quote name="GWAP"][QUOTE name="DarthSka"][QUOTE name="Freeze"]Sooo..the country moved toward religion as it grew, and not away from it?[/QUOTE]Sure, in the same way a minority group 'moves towards' the desires of the whining, bullying majority.[/QUOTE]View media item 1547354[/quote]Before I respond on an assumption of where I think you're going with that, I'll ask:

Where you going with that?

 

[gwap]

 

Originally Posted by GWAP  

Originally Posted by DarthSka  

Originally Posted by Freeze  
Sooo..the country moved toward religion as it grew, and not away from it?

Sure, in the same way a minority group 'moves towards' the desires of the whining, bullying majority.

Before I respond on an assumption of where I think you're going with that, I'll ask:

Where you going with that?

I just don't understand the analogy....

 

[doublemesh96]

Turning @Freeze
 into @WATER
 in here. Sheesh...........

The Lord giveth and The Lord taketh away

 

[blastercombo]

Nothing can be proven wrong if it can't even be proven to begin with. That's debating 101.


And everything f you just said about the creation of the U.S. and religious purpose is completely wrong. All of it

 

[freeze]

Nothing can be proven wrong if it can't even be proven to begin with. That's debating 101.

You cannot prove it doesnt exist though. You cannot prove big bang. Its a theory.

 

[darthska]

[quote name="GWAP"][QUOTE name="DarthSka"]Before I respond on an assumption of where I think you're going with that, I'll ask:

Where you going with that? [/QUOTE]I just don't understand the analogy....[/quote] Just saying that a smaller group (aka 'minority group') giving in to a larger group (aka 'majority group') that is bullying and whining could be seen as the smaller group and the larger group 'moving towards' the desires of the larger group that is whining and bullying. But it would obviously be misguided to call that 'moving towards'.

Hence:

[quote name="DarthSka"][quote name="Freeze"]Sooo..the country moved toward religion as it grew, and not away from it?[/quote]Sure, in the same way a minority group 'moves towards' the desires of the whining, bullying majority.[/quote]

 

[deleted]

A scientific theory means something different than just a regular theory

 

[rolaholic]

Lots of people genuinely don't understand that

 

[Master Zik]

Nothing can be proven wrong if it can't even be proven to begin with. That's debating 101.

You cannot prove it doesnt exist though.

View media item 1662908
For real man? He says you can't prove something to be wrong if you can't prove it to begin with and you just regurgitate with you can't prove it doesn't exist?

The whole point is you don't go about discussing this stuff with stating that a person can't prove a negative. If you make the claim, it's on you to prove it. Not the other way around.

You cannot prove big bang. Its a theory.

You need to figure out the difference between the layman's definition of theory and a scientific theory.

Lots of people genuinely don't understand that

I've literally repeated that and so many other logical fallacies so many times in these threads.

It's like nobody ever learns anything from them Next is the science is a religion nonsense, or back to the believe just in case, etc. like there's a guide for believers to go down a list of nonsensical stances until they're left with nothing else.

I just don't get why they even engage in it when they can't logically explain themselves. It's simple as your belief does not require logic.

 

[lobotomybeats]

lol you're acting like this is an argument you can ever hope to win. I'm being outclassed by people that think differently than I do? How's that even possible? We're playing two different sports. No matter what either of us say, we'll continue to believe what we choose. Do not for a second thing you're proving anything. I respect your opinion. But it changes nothing. It's loosely based only on what you can see. Only on what you can touch. What you can explain and have control over. It's your ego that will not allow you to believe that there's more. You want to have all the control and believe that you can just do it all. Time will tell if you're correct in that assumption.


In Christianity, there is only one God.

I was talking about the founding of our country. You're wrong there. Really really fundamentally wrong.



Also, the most absolutely BS comment in this thread was made by you.

"You look and see some of the worst natural disasters happen in countries with a different belief system than christianity. I'm not saying there's direct correlation, I have no idea, but there can be some dots connected."

Insinuating that countries that aren't Christian are more prone to natural disasters is disgusting. You've "connected dots" that don't exist just because they conform to your brand of righteousness. These countries that have natural disasters are experiencing them because they don't believe like you do! That's the sole basis of your argument. That's insane. How pompous are you? And you have the gall to talk of my ego?

 

[darthska]

[quote name="Freeze"][quote name="BLASTERCOMBO"]Nothing can be proven wrong if it can't even be proven to begin with. That's debating 101[/quote]You cannot prove it doesnt exist though. You cannot prove big bang. Its a theory.[/quote]To us, a theory is just random ramblings.

In science, a theory is quite a few steps up from random ramblings. In science, a theory has been criticized by usually hundreds of scientists, sometimes in different periods of time, sometimes in different countries. It's named a theory after much criticism and evaluating and ruling out different possibilities.

 

[freeze]

Come on guys. Lets not go there. I know scientific theory. My point was even the big bang cant be proven. Even with that theory, there are still grey areas of unknown, such as the moment immediately before singularity. Every formula after PT takes place at the moment of singularity.

Even still there are multiple other theories includibg the most recent out of egypt stating that the universe has always been.

He said it cant be proven that God exists. Ive already stated that absense of evidence is not the evidence of absence. I cannot prove he exists anymore than he can prove he doesnt. Thats where faith comes in. Belief in that which one cannot prove.