OFFICIAL 2009 DODGERS OFFSEASON THREAD: (95-57) NL West Champs --- NLCS Chumps

[Los Angeles]

Originally Posted by P MAC ONE

What exactly does that even mean?

Los Angeles Sports -

Lakers, as much as people hate them they get it done.

I hate to put the Angels in here, but they've been more relevant, as far as winning, than us

That's what I mean.

I meant - You expressed that you feel McDonald and Elbert are not viable starting rotation options. Considering the fact that numerous minor league experts project them as such, and the Dodger brass is clearly grooming them for such roles, what about their performance this year caused you to believe that they have no place in being given a shot at those roles?

Is the question a little clearer now?

It's my opinion, just how I could see what kinda softy Brox is / was and will always be.

JMac is young but I wouldn't be surprised if the organizations patience runs thin with him.

Elbert just seems like a bullpen arm to me.

Like I said, starting pitching is our biggest need why let two young kids duke it out when we can obviously upgrade during FA.

"I want Blake DeWitt to be the Los Angeles Dodgers second baseman next year." This statement is either
a) stupid.
b) ignorant
c) foolish
d) all of the above.
Fixed.

 

[in yo nostril]

so, anyone bought spring training tickets yet?

 

[p mac one]

DeWitt was a very effective 2B in 2008 especially considering that he was rushed to the big leagues and hadn't played 2B in the minors all of 2007 (whichhe split between A and AA.

So you have a first round pick who was called the best pure HS hitter of his class, who makes absolutely nothing, who was slated to be the starter going intothe year as it was, who improved his BB% rate this year(and his low AAA numbers can be attributed to his BABIP), and most importantly is a favorite of JoeTorre.

If someone asked you at the beginning of the year if you would take a repeat of DeWitt in 2008 for $350,000 or Hudson for $8 Mil what would you have said?

 

[Los Angeles]

Look, this is where you and I are different.

You love prospects and the kids in the minors and its really hard for you to let go of some of them.

That's our issue.

SMH, I should be making my flashcards for anatomy right now and look what we're doing.

Originally Posted by In Yo Nostril

so, anyone bought spring training tickets yet?

 

[in yo nostril]

i get where p mac is coming from. i just think that being the dodgers in this era we should be trying harder to buy championships. we arent the devil rays,time to pay for good players instead of hoping for the best from kids in the minors.

 

[p mac one]

Originally Posted by bright nikes

Originally Posted by P MAC ONE

What exactly does that even mean?

Los Angeles Sports -

Lakers, as much as people hate them they get it done.

I hate to put the Angels in there, but they've been more relevant as far as winning in over 2 decades.

That's what I mean.

The Angels are not in Los Angeles. The Lakers are in a different league, you simply can't compare apples and oranges. Expecting the Dodgers toperform like the Lakers is absolutely ridiculous.

I meant - You expressed that you feel McDonald and Elbert are not viable starting rotation options. Considering the fact that numerous minor league experts project them as such, and the Dodger brass is clearly grooming them for such roles, what about their performance this year caused you to believe that they have no place in being given a shot at those roles?

Is the question a little clearer now?

It's my opinion, just how I could see what kinda softy Brox is / was and will always be.
Oh ok. It's your opinion.
I guess that's all we need.

JMac is young but I wouldn't be surprised if the organizations patience runs thin with him.
Huh? He was Torre's go-to guy in tie games.
Anyone remember the last really skinny pitcher we had with a great curveball who came up as a starter but spend his whole first season as a reliever?

Elbert just seems like a bullpen arm to me.
Elbert was one of the top pitching prospects in baseball before he got hurt. His stuff is better than Kuo's and 10X better thanSherrill's. He'd be a great asset in the bullpen if he can't make it in the rotation, but to suggest that he shouldn't be a starter because heseems like a bullpen arm to you is downright silly.

Like I said, starting pitching is our biggest need why let two young kids duke it out when we can obviously upgrade during FA.
Why?
We have to pay a lot of guys who are due huge raises.
I think we need to upgrade our pitching, but not unless that upgrade is better than Billingsley (when he's right) and Kershaw. That person I have in mindis due $15 mil next year, so any 5th starter money is chewed up if you make that move.

"I want Blake DeWitt to be the Los Angeles Dodgers second baseman next year." This statement is either
a) stupid.
b) ignorant
c) foolish
d) all of the above.
Fixed.

Great comeback. I provided stats, thoughts, analysis, etc. You came back with that.

Common theme in all of our arguments.

 

[in yo nostril]

i was kind of serious about the spring training though. im gonna do it right this year and go with a bunch of people for like 5-6 days and see if we cant rentout a house or something. get my golf on and everything. im going to try to stay near the stadium this time too. maybe.

 

[Los Angeles]

Thank you.

 

[p mac one]

Originally Posted by In Yo Nostril

i just think that being the dodgers in this era we should be trying harder to buy championships.

You just can't do that though.

It doesn't matter how good your team is, if you face an offense like the Phillies and they hit .400 with RISP you just aren't going to win.

It may be clutchiness or dirt on the uniform or some other intangible that makes them better. It may be experience, who knows.

The Dodgers had a very good team this year, and the team (minus Dre) underperformed horribly in the playoffs. I'm alllll for spending Frank's money,but it needs to be in the right situation and for the right guy. Is John Lackey at 5 years 80 million that guy? I highly doubt it.

i was kind of serious about the spring training though. im gonna do it right this year and go with a bunch of people for like 5-6 days and see if we cant rent out a house or something. get my golf on and everything. im going to try to stay near the stadium this time too. maybe.
I stayed at the Wigwam Resort which was like 5 minutes from Camelback. Had 3 golf courses and a good practice area. The restaurant was dope too.Even saw Josh Hamilton out there on the course. Me and pops said we're gonna make it a yearly tradition, even though this will be my last year driving upfrom Tucson. And I shot like a 78 after not playing in 6 months, so I love that course

 

[ooiron manoo]

There was never a deal for Adrian Gonzales on the table. Just an unverified rumor.

We have to see what this perceived "value" for Uggla. The Marlins even when dumping salary do not get duped into making bad deals. IfUggla's value is too high, I have no problem giving DeWitt a shot. He has a solid glove and his bat showed that it belonged in the bigs. He was rushed in2008 and performed admirably.

Their 2002 World Series title aside, the Angels have been just as "mediocre" as us.

Making the NLCS is not a sign of mediocrity. There is more work to be done, and we are just a step away, but it is definitely not a sign of mediocrity.

The Lakers are succesful because they are the Lakers. They have deep pockets and that Pau Gasol deal,

.

It's the equivalent of getting Roy Halladay for Claudio Vargas. FYI, the Grizzlies exec who pushed the trade will receive a ring during the LakersOpening Night ring ceremony.

 

[p mac one]

This team is good because of former Dodger prospects ... Bills, Kershaw, Brox, Kuo, Kemp, Loney, Ethier (sorta), Martin. I can't tell you how many timesPlaschke clamored for them to be traded, but now everybody applauds Colletti for holding on to them.

The Dodgers as a franchise historically have been great because of our player development.

I seriously don't get it. We develop one of the best young cores in baseball because Logan White is possibly the best in the business at what he does, yetpeople say, "*%%% prospects, let's buy a championship." We've seen what that's done for the Yanks in the past few years, and if they loseagain then my point will be illustrated perfectly.

 

[in yo nostril]

Originally Posted by P MAC ONE

Originally Posted by In Yo Nostril

i just think that being the dodgers in this era we should be trying harder to buy championships.

You just can't do that though.

It doesn't matter how good your team is, if you face an offense like the Phillies and they hit .400 with RISP you just aren't going to win.

It may be clutchiness or dirt on the uniform or some other intangible that makes them better. It may be experience, who knows.

The Dodgers had a very good team this year, and the team (minus Dre) underperformed horribly in the playoffs. I'm alllll for spending Frank's money, but it needs to be in the right situation and for the right guy. Is John Lackey at 5 years 80 million that guy? I highly doubt it.

i was kind of serious about the spring training though. im gonna do it right this year and go with a bunch of people for like 5-6 days and see if we cant rent out a house or something. get my golf on and everything. im going to try to stay near the stadium this time too. maybe.

I stayed at the Wigwam Resort which was like 5 minutes from Camelback. Had 3 golf courses and a good practice area. The restaurant was dope too. Even saw Josh Hamilton out there on the course. Me and pops said we're gonna make it a yearly tradition, even though this will be my last year driving up from Tucson.


i know we just cant do it outright and i dont want mccourt to turn into steinbrenner but i think there are players that the team could go after and just payhuge sums of money to. i understand hes cheap and probably gunshy after andruw jones but it would make this team better in certain areas.

i remember your pics from spring training and the wigwam. i just like scottsdale better because there are things to do at night whereas glendale isnt exactlypopping. but if we get a big group it wont matter much. we are getting old and can just get drunk at the hotel/rental and wake up and golf anyway. next timeyou are out there in the spring check out raven at verrado. its maybe 10 minutes from the wigwam on the other side of the 10 freeway. course is legit and a lotcloser than the courses in scottsdale.

 

[in yo nostril]

we can get into the prospect/buying titles thing forever. the yankees dont win every year but at least you know they are going to be contending every year.they just OD with the superstar players without regard for team chemistry/cohesion. this dodger organization developed a ton of great players in the 90s aswell and we have 0 to show for it, not even 1 playoff win. neither way is completely right but in my opinion this team should at least be going after a couplemore proven players, high priced or not

 

[mr jordan04]

IYN, all I know is that seymore said we're going to the playoffs!

 

[Los Angeles]

Josh hamilton huh? That must have been when the whole bar / picture incident occurred?

If I recall wasn't he rehabbing in az and went to a local bar over there cause those *%%+%@ def look like az chicks.

It should be an interesting off-season, hope the best with frank & jamie.

nice example with the Lakers ironman, but if you really wanna bring up Gasol to the Lakeshow for change then the same could be said with Manny going tothe Dodgers for LaRoche.

Btw well said iyn.

 

[jordan vs magic]

We'll be back next year stronger then ever. Go Dogers!

Now its time to focus on the repeat. Go Lakers!

 

[beermann2]

I would like to say it was a good year. And wouldn't you know that just a couple of years ago these guys just came out of triple A and look at them now.Maybe this year under there belts will do the trick, a WS Chip is coming.

I leave all the trade/player talk to you guys. Just play nice fellas.

I would like to say maybe we do need an ace pitcher, uggla at 2nd base sounds good, Brox, a set up man, always was and always will be(that's what I think).
Whoever we acquire or trade I'll still be rooting for the Dodgers.

I'll be lurking and maybe comment here and there. But I'm done with baseball til spring. Peace out fellas, cool talking to some of yall.

Oh yea, I hate that can't stop believing song too.

 

[pr0phecy718]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

Damn, sorry to all you Dodger fans.

Beginning the playoffs, I really, really REALLY wanted a Freeway Dodgers vs Yankees Series.

Just to see Joe Torre in the Bronx for a possible final time in the World Series

 

[pdouly33]

Originally Posted by P MAC ONE

This team is good because of former Dodger prospects ... Bills, Kershaw, Brox, Kuo, Kemp, Loney, Ethier (sorta), Martin. I can't tell you how many times Plaschke clamored for them to be traded, but now everybody applauds Colletti for holding on to them.

The Dodgers as a franchise historically have been great because of our player development.

I seriously don't get it. We develop one of the best young cores in baseball because Logan White is possibly the best in the business at what he does, yet people say, "*%%% prospects, let's buy a championship." We've seen what that's done for the Yanks in the past few years, and if they lose again then my point will be illustrated perfectly.

Amen. These guys are still very, very young. The Phillies developed their core in 2006 and 2007 and are now staring at a potential repeat.

Look at our big long-term free agent acquisitions in recent years -

J.D. Drew?
Andruw Jones?
Jason Schmidt?

Besides the four-year deal we gave to Derek Lowe, I can't remember many contracts I felt great about.

Man, I miss D-Lowe on this team...

We have to remember how many guys UNDERPERFORMED this year. The ace of the staff didn't even start a game in thepostseason....

 

[pdouly33]

Also, I've seen some people continue to harp on Torre's mismanagement of the bullpen, but that comes back to the starting pitching not giving theDodgers any innings this year.

Besides Randy Wolf, no one was pitching deep into games consistently.

Colletti needs to acquire some solid pitchers who can eat innings. I'd be all for bringing back Jon Garland, for example.

 

[lazy b]

Christ, they never even showed up for this series. The Dodgers rotation

, horrible this NLCS.

 

[westcoastsfinest]

...damn man

its funny how the sf giants fans were the one talking %%* to me all day last night via FB and texts

 

[Los Angeles]

Damn, Victorina and Werthless did work on us.

Combined for 5 hrs and what 12rbis?

 

[mr jordan04]

Originally Posted by bright nikes

Damn, Victorina and Werthless did work on us.

Combined for 5 hrs and what 12rbis?

Them+howard had 20 rbi's together. Dodgers only scored 16 runs

 

[frenchblue23]

Originally Posted by P MAC ONE

This team is good because of former Dodger prospects ... Bills, Kershaw, Brox, Kuo, Kemp, Loney, Ethier (sorta), Martin. I can't tell you how many times Plaschke clamored for them to be traded, but now everybody applauds Colletti for holding on to them.

The Dodgers as a franchise historically have been great because of our player development.

I seriously don't get it. We develop one of the best young cores in baseball because Logan White is possibly the best in the business at what he does, yet people say, "*%%% prospects, let's buy a championship." We've seen what that's done for the Yanks in the past few years, and if they lose again then my point will be illustrated perfectly.

I agree here.
But. the Kids are all grown up now, they've have enough experience now to get over the hump,but they lack discipline, a clubhouse leader, someone who will tell them what they are doing wrong. This team is full of knuckleheads

Dan Uggla would be a beast at Dodger Stadium.

John Lackey will be a Free agent, I don't know you guys feel about him.

Halladay, Halladay, Halladay.