***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[RustyShackleford]

Let me explain this once and for all.


3rd parties are doomed, ALWAYS.



1. The current parties have zero incentive to allow 3rd parties to exist.

2. The more successful a 3rd party is, the less likely people are to vote for it in the next election cycle. Why?

Spoiler effect that's why.

The people who vote for a 3rd party are essentially insuring victory for the party they like least, the better a 3rd party does the more obvious this becomes the voting populace.



Even in non two party system we see the winners curse happen to 3rd parties.

Example

In Canada the far left wing "NDP party". (the biggest 3rd party) two elections ago won an unprecedented amount of seats, out performing the tradition left wing "Liberal Party" and insuring the "Conservative party" victory, and giving the conservative's a majority.


What happens next election? Did the NDP build on that momentum?

NOPE.

They got crushed. Why? Because it became clear to left wing people voting NDP is essentially a spoiler vote.


This happened in a country where 3rd parties have ballot access and get to go to debates, this winners curse effect would be 100 times more powerful in a two party system,


Voting 3rd party is ALWAYS stupid.

We had a viable third party in the United States called the Reform Party, which form in 1996. I took one election for them to be at each others throats and be irrelevant in 2000 because they elected a far right winger in what was suppose to be a moderate party.

That same year, Ralph Nader cost Gore the election, and the Green Party was seen toxic to the left 4 years later. Btw, they are constantly at each others throats in that party too.

We have had modern third parties in America, they have all been trash, and it has nothing to do with the DNC or GOP sabotaging them.

All the people wanting a third party, should go look up Paul LePage. He is a straight up racist that got elected twice with under 40% of the voter because a independent liberal and his rabid followers played spoiler twice.

Forming coalitions within the two main party's is a smarter way to go.

 

[oh you mad]

Voting 3rd party is stupid and will never not be stupid.


Voting 3rd party in a traditional blue state like California isn't stupid. More than enough votes to secure BLUE. 3rd parties need to make some noise and I have no problem supporting em.

However if you're in Florida, PA, Michigan, or any of these hick battleground States.. .YES no doubt I agree, you're wasting your vote because every blue vote is crucial in these states!

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/apps-trade-votes-clinton-swing-states/

 

[everysingletime]

Lol imagine traveling back in time when that Simpson episode premiered. Ppl be laughing and then I turn to them all wild eyed, 'Don't laugh. This is real. This is your future.'

 

[ninjahood]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

 

[RustyShackleford]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

He has never been in office before, you constantly reminded us of that fact.

So what previous history are you going on?

 

[sundoobie]

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/apps-trade-votes-clinton-swing-states/

Wow didn't even know

https://trumptraders.org/trade/about.html

2016:
You've traded 5,000 Hillary votes to Florida and given 3rd-parties a voice in safe states! Thanks everyone!

https://www.facebook.com/trumptraders

 

[ninjahood]

Building a fortress of solitude at Trump Plaza NY.. vetting all guests and residents. Laughing @ Trump being afraid of Americans now. Let's make his 4 years a living hell for him and his businesses

this what liberal expected from Trump supporters

 

[Xennial]

@ninjahood If Bush was a Neocon and Obama was a Corporatist, than what is Trump?

 

[ninjahood]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

He has never been in office before, you constantly reminded us of that fact.

So what previous history are you going on?

guess u missed how he ran his campaign

da political ethos is changed forever.

political correctness is relegated to da dustbin of society

 

[ayotayo]

Eh, that's just the official way of wasting your vote and having it documented.

Until there is a viable and legitmate 3rd party and 3rd party candidate, ppl are just making it easier for one of the 2 party candidates who is the underdog to have a chance to win.

And given the political climate of the past 10 years up to now and just the unrest and dissatisfaction of the ppl, it's pathetic that a 3rd party can't be formed that appeals to enough Americans to gain 15% or win one state.

My take on voting 3rd party is beyond the current election results. Its about taking the initiative to vote in the first place.

So are we saying that not voting at all is just as bad as voting 3rd party?

I know that voting for any party is absolute but for future election those that at least voted 3rd party can be swayed to vote for a different party.

I can't say the same to those that choose not to vote at all.

 

[sundoobie]

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

He's gonna nominate all Republicans in his cabinet though. What do you think his Republican cronies gonna do? Same ol overturn Roe Vs Wade and marriage equality... same tax cuts to the rich.. same Bush foreign policy doctrine... same less regulation to banks ensuring lending fraud.. and lastly same White power bull crap.

Truthfully, based on all you know about the man... you really think Trump is gonna be Trump the Entrepreneur or Trump the Republican? I really hope he has the heart to not break up immigrant families, destroy gay marriages, and oppress Muslims! All that doesn't put money in America's pockets!

 

[RustyShackleford]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

He has never been in office before, you constantly reminded us of that fact.

So what previous history are you going on?

guess u missed how he ran his campaign

da political ethos is changed forever.

political correctness is relegated to da dustbin of society

Running a campaign and running a country are different.

He doesn't need he majority of the House and 60 votes in the Senate to make moves in this campaign.

 

[ninjahood]

@ninjahood
If Bush was a Neocon and Obama was a Corporatist, than what is Trump?

a nationalist populist business man.

he's Murica' plated in Gold.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Political correctness is one of thee dumbest thing people argue about.

The people sitting around hyper ventilating about political correctness are the most politically correct people on the planet.



They just subscribe to a different politics.

 

[ninjahood]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

He has never been in office before, you constantly reminded us of that fact.

So what previous history are you going on?

guess u missed how he ran his campaign

da political ethos is changed forever.

political correctness is relegated to da dustbin of society

Running a campaign and running a country are different.

He doesn't need he majority of the House and 60 votes in the Senate to make moves in this campaign.

and yet he's gonna enter da white House with da strongest GOP congress since da 20's...

i hope he implements that tax reform QUICK so you can be shown what happens with da return to businesses to America.

 

[RustyShackleford]

If you harp about political correctness and support the GOP or Trump, you're a hypocrite

When Trump was on tape talking about grabbing yambs, he didn't go on TV and say "Yep, so what", he went on TV and said "It is just locker room talk guys, I didn't mean it seriously"

And

Remember Freedom fries?

Remember Enhance interrogation techniques?

Everyone sugar coats their ****.

 

[RustyShackleford]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

He has never been in office before, you constantly reminded us of that fact.

So what previous history are you going on?

guess u missed how he ran his campaign

da political ethos is changed forever.

political correctness is relegated to da dustbin of society

Running a campaign and running a country are different.

He doesn't need he majority of the House and 60 votes in the Senate to make moves in this campaign.

and yet he's gonna enter da white House with da strongest GOP congress since da 20's...

i hope he implements that tax reform QUICK so you can be shown what happens with da return to businesses to America.

How is Trump gonna beat the filibuster?

And how would he explain this......

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...51-single-parents-see-taxes-rise-under-donal/

It seems like you're in to get a master class in civics and economics real soon.

 

[MVP]

I'll give it a until January 2018 before they are begging for Obama to come back.

 

[AEA18]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

Lawyers and accountants

 

[AEA18]

@ninjahood
If Bush was a Neocon and Obama was a Corporatist, than what is Trump?

a nationalist populist business man.

he's Murica' plated in Gold.

Gold plated excrement is still excrement

 

[Master Zik]

how long before these folks call for a mulligan? say 'we made a mistake, we goofed, we sawwry'

Too late for that now. This is von a be more of a one year later thing when all the ppl that voted for him are no longer in denial and are in just as bad situations or worse off.

Eh, that's just the official way of wasting your vote and having it documented.

Until there is a viable and legitmate 3rd party and 3rd party candidate, ppl are just making it easier for one of the 2 party candidates who is the underdog to have a chance to win.

And given the political climate of the past 10 years up to now and just the unrest and dissatisfaction of the ppl, it's pathetic that a 3rd party can't be formed that appeals to enough Americans to gain 15% or win one state.

My take on voting 3rd party is beyond the current election results.

Mine is based on American history.

Its about taking the initiative to vote in the first place.

This sounds good but there's no point in taking initiative to vote of you don't understand the voting process or the consequences of your vote. I mean q6 years later and it happens again and ppl are still out in the streets complaining about the popular vote vs. electoral college.

So are we saying that not voting at all is just as bad as voting 3rd party?

Essentially.

I said it before but you're just making it easier for pollsters to dock.ent who wasted their vote compared trying to figure out the amount of ppl who didn't vot and their information (age, sex, race/ethnicity, etc.).

I mean just look at the swing states not finished tallied when it was 218 to 244 where Donald was leading by a few hundred or thousand votes in each state. Then look at the info now of the ppl who didn't vote compared to 2012 or 2008 and then the ppl in those states that voted 3rd party.

I know that voting for any party is absolute but for future election those that at least voted 3rd party can be swayed to vote for a different party.

I can't say the same to those that choose not to vote at all.

To me swaying those that voted 3rd party really isn't that much harder to sway those who didn't.

 

[EddieDoyers]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

So you're saying that he's not going to listen to the likes of John Bolton, Newt Gingrich, Steven Mnuchin, and the Republican establishment that just became the majority of Congress?
Ninja you are starting to sound like you're in denial that Trump is backing off his populist campaign and is enlisting people that are from the establishment
I got to say, Trump is like a great used car sales man
He can sell anything

 

[Master Zik]

It's funny
Trump isn't a neocon
But his staff is going to be filled with them
TREMENDOUS

when was da last time Trump listened to his "experts" on things they wanna do vs what he wants to do?

He has never been in office before, you constantly reminded us of that fact.

So what previous history are you going on?

guess u missed how he ran his campaign

da political ethos is changed forever.

political correctness is relegated to da dustbin of society

Running a campaign and running a country are different.

He doesn't need he majority of the House and 60 votes in the Senate to make moves in this campaign.

and yet he's gonna enter da white House with da strongest GOP congress since da 20's...

i hope he implements that tax reform QUICK so you can be shown what happens with da return to businesses to America.

How is Trump gonna beat the filibuster?

And how would he explain this......

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...51-single-parents-see-taxes-rise-under-donal/

It seems like you're in to get a master class in civics and economics real soon.

Last night in an interview on the DS the guest who was a journalist I think for buzzfeed or gawker was talking about the possibility of Donald getting rid of that check and balance by repealing the filibuster which he said would be unprecedented.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Mitch McConnell would never do that. In four years, they might be ****** without a veto.

-BTW, if i were Obama, I would send TPP to Congress right now. Even though I'm against it.

Start the GOP infighting early.

 

[everysingletime]

Racists everywhere emboldened. Just sad, man.

Just ****** sad

I'm going down south for vacation too. Visiting my cousin in South Carolina. *sigh