***Official Political Discussion Thread***

as Rusty so astutely noted, this syncs up very conveniently with a necessity for mail-in ballots this year.

I wonder more and more if there will be a legitimate 2020 election.

Yep. You can already see the play Trump and his cronies lining up. Complaining about the validity of mail in voting, question the important of USPS, talks about them losing money, threatening to veto if it benefits USPS.

In a couple months we shouldn't be shocked if we see talks of "cutbacks" on USPS that will somehow coincidentally be in places that don't vote republican.
 
postalserv.png
So kill it by not funding it for the macro group, then revive it and fund it for micro group? Got it.
 
as Rusty so astutely noted, this syncs up very conveniently with a necessity for mail-in ballots this year.

I wonder more and more if there will be a legitimate 2020 election.

spoiler: there will not be

faulty election + increased surveillance and reduction of rights (think Patriot Act) are on the plate for 2020

another war on an invisible enemy that capitalism is somehow supposed to save us from
 
The same way it worked on NT. We got fed up with Methodical Management or Meth as I call him, and we held an impeachment inquiry. jrose5 jrose5 was installed as our new ADMINISTRATOR ELECT and da rest is history.

I am catching up on General after a roughly two-week hiatus and I’ve seen the Meth impeachment thing twice. Going to have to look into the origins and outcomes of this one :lol:

Is The Official Political Discussion Thread In-House Council and Fry Cook still around?
 
if this country actually held politicians accountable, Trump would be forced to resign by the summer.

see, but the thing about this guy in particular is that he is completely impervious to political pressure.

¨Teflon¨ seems to characterize him perfectly...I´d be lying if I said I understood, but I can observe.

this is a man who, in the midst of addressing a nation as chief executive during a major global crisis, consistently finds time to talk about the ratings...like, ratings? we talkin bout ratings? not the plague...ratings?

he is blatantly politicizing a PANDEMIC and is still the favorite to win this year´s election.

gonna take a smarter man than me to untangle that knot.
 
if this country actually held politicians accountable, Trump would be forced to resign by the summer.

politicians are not afraid of the people or of consequences anymore 🤷🏽‍♂️

they don’t really have any incentive at all to function in a way that benefits us, particularly republicans as they’ve turned the sliders all the way up and put the game on rookie
 
I am catching up on General after a roughly two-week hiatus and I’ve seen the Meth impeachment thing twice. Going to have to look into the origins and outcomes of this one :lol:

Is The Official Political Discussion Thread In-House Council and Fry Cook still around?

Fry cook is still around but you hit him with his support of Republican Pedos and he flees.
 
where there is a profit, there’s a way.

I am really liking the timbre of this thread lately.

politicians are not afraid of the people or of consequences anymore 🤷🏽‍♂️

they don’t really have any incentive at all to function in a way that benefits us, particularly republicans as they’ve turned the sliders all the way up and put the game on rookie

it is not a coincidence that many European nations have governments very focused on people-pleasing.

it´s not because they´re disproportionately swell human beings, it´s that there have been...consequences.

I want to believe we´re past all that, and still hope this crisis leads to some high-level changes of heart.
 
it is not a coincidence that many European nations have governments very focused on people-pleasing.

it´s not because they´re disproportionately swell human beings, it´s that there have been...consequences.

I want to believe we´re past all that, and still hope this crisis leads to some high-level changes of heart.

they’ve seen what happens and that was never really a reality in the US. until there is some sort of fear of consequences this is probably what we’ll get.

like think about it. you and your already powerful rich friends control the US. you sway laws, enrich yourself, and suppress your opponents. Hell sometimes you even make it so your opponents supporters can’t vote for them efficiently and you draw districts in a way that benefit you and your buddies.

and your supporters eat it up because even though your ideas are bad for them too, you’ve convinced them the other side is their enemy on all fronts or that if you throw them some pennies, they’re doing fine

the other side can’t even agree on who to support, and might not even get off the couch to challenge you

what on earth would you willingly change any of that for?
 
I am really liking the timbre of this thread lately.



it is not a coincidence that many European nations have governments very focused on people-pleasing.

it´s not because they´re disproportionately swell human beings, it´s that there have been...consequences.

I want to believe we´re past all that, and still hope this crisis leads to some high-level changes of heart.
The parliamentary system also plays a role. Though as you can see in Belgium's case, a parliamentary system can also cause complete gridlock in attempts to form a coalition government. We hold the Guinness world record for longest time without a functioning federal government. A whole 542 days and we beat a war-torn Iraq on our way to that record.

In my country's case I think our government is just used to a different moral standard. For example, our Minister of Defense was dodging questions about the process of purchasing new fighter jets and that became a significant scandal. It didn't end his career but he was reportedly pretty close to resigning.

In another major scandal, our Minister of Immigration and Asylum had lied to our Prime Minister about whether or not he deported unqualified refugees back to an area where it turned out that torture etc was taking place.
The Minister ultimately withered the storm but he was forced to apologize, both to the public and to parliament. He was seen as a rising star in the conservative party (NVA) but that scandal appeared to shrink his ambitions.

An example from my regional government (the Flemish government), the Minister of Environment was forced to resign after she falsely claimed that one of our intel agencies told her that part of the climate protests were the work of an unspecified sinister group.
Essentially she just lied about climate protesters and that ended her career.
 
see, but the thing about this guy in particular is that he is completely impervious to political pressure.

¨Teflon¨ seems to characterize him perfectly...I´d be lying if I said I understood, but I can observe.

this is a man who, in the midst of addressing a nation as chief executive during a major global crisis, consistently finds time to talk about the ratings...like, ratings? we talkin bout ratings? not the plague...ratings?

he is blatantly politicizing a PANDEMIC and is still the favorite to win this year´s election.

gonna take a smarter man than me to untangle that knot.
Obama's elections and successful terms unveiled the rot at the heart of American society. For Trump to be so impervious to scandals and for him to openly misuse of the power of the office, he HAS to have the backing of his entire party and its base.

GOPers often justify their unpopular actions by saying a version of the following: "I represent my constituents and defend their wishes." So many of these people have not moved past the early 20th century, and they have passed down that mentality to their offspring and their neighbors' offspring.

The reality is that America's ideals do not match what's in way too many American hearts, and those folks have gained power because the remaining Americans can't see the forest for the trees and stop bickering about niche issues.
 
Obama's elections and successful terms unveiled the rot at the heart of American society. For Trump to be so impervious to scandals and for him to openly misuse of the power of the office, he HAS to have the backing of his entire party and its base.

GOPers often justify their unpopular actions by saying a version of the following: "I represent my constituents and defend their wishes." So many of these people have not moved past the early 20th century, and they have passed down that mentality to their offspring and their neighbors' offspring.

The reality is that America's ideals do not match what's in way too many American hearts, and those folks have gained power because the remaining Americans can't see the forest for the trees and stop bickering about niche issues.

oh I said even back in 2016 that this dude was emblematic of the worst American values. I can pull receipts.

hell, my dumb *** knew **** was super duper sideways ever since the Zimmerman saga.

strangely, I believe this crisis is the country´s best shot at fixing its internal issues...it´s EVERYBODY¨S PROBLEM!


The parliamentary system also plays a role. Though as you can see in Belgium's case, a parliamentary system can also cause complete gridlock in attempts to form a coalition government. We hold the Guinness world record for longest time without a functioning federal government. A whole 542 days and we beat a war-torn Iraq on our way to that record.

In my country's case I think our government is just used to a different moral standard. For example, our Minister of Defense was dodging questions about the process of purchasing new fighter jets and that became a significant scandal. It didn't end his career but he was reportedly pretty close to resigning.

In another major scandal, our Minister of Immigration and Asylum had lied to our Prime Minister about whether or not he deported unqualified refugees back to an area where it turned out that torture etc was taking place.
The Minister ultimately withered the storm but he was forced to apologize, both to the public and to parliament. He was seen as a rising star in the conservative party (NVA) but that scandal appeared to shrink his ambitions.

An example from my regional government (the Flemish government), the Minister of Environment was forced to resign after she falsely claimed that one of our intel agencies told her that part of the climate protests were the work of an unspecified sinister group.
Essentially she just lied about climate protesters and that ended her career.

man, imagine demanding this level of integrity from American politicians.

yeah tho I´m not super well-studied on Belgian history, but iirc it was not ruled by nice people last century.

the Congo Free State thing is the only place I have ever read the phrase ¨basket of hands¨ used in a rubbermaking operation, and the WW2 king was suspected of colluding with actual no-******** Hitler.

I imagine there was some serious people power involved in your transition to the modern structure, yeah?




also, fun fact that you may be the only man on NT to appreciate: I am somehow drinking a Martens in Mexico.
 
@rexanglorum, I tagged you because you're evidently one of if not the biggest Bernie supporter in here so I'd like to hear your thoughts.
RustyShackleford RustyShackleford , Your posts are often long and you've had a bit of a love/hate relationship with Bernie so I'd like to hear your thoughts as well.

In light of Bernie’s second defeat, I have a theory. I could be completely off the mark of course.

What my theory comes down to is that I believe US progressive voters tend to vastly overstate the electability of their candidates in elections in general.

I underlined those 2 words because I make a vital distinction in this theory. I do believe that progressive idea(l)s generally tend to be popular throughout the country, as seen in polls where the ideas are presented without being attached to a politician or political ideology. The idea of ‘Medicare for all’ is a quite popular for example.

According to my theory however, the popularity of those ideas and ideals are often detached from the electability of a candidate pushing those ideas and policies. There is a gap there, and Bernie is a prime example of it. If you want to win, vote for a progressive, is often said.
Politicians all tend to have low approval ratings but Bernie was amongst the most popular, at some points the most popular.
Yet when the strongest progressive candidate sought the Democratic nomination, Bernie was resoundingly defeated both times. In the first instance by a universally strongly disliked candidate who was perceived as more of a moderate and had decades of baggage on top of that. In the second instance, Bernie's campaign was once again wiped out convincingly. This time by a candidate often perceived as weak and whose campaign's coffin was already prepared before South Carolina. Super Tuesday ended up becoming a complete blowout for Joe Biden.

To summarize, I believe it is clear that the popularity of progressive ideas and the electability of self-described progressive candidates only intersect and boost eachother to a small extent. If anything, it is the progressive candidate that boosts the popularity of those ideas, not the other way around for the most part.
Some progressives tend to ignore that clear gap and thus have a view of a progressive's electability that does not match with reality.

I have not given a whole lot of thought on what explains this clear gap but I presume it mainly has to do with how a progressive candidate is perceived by voters. The stigma of the word 'socialist' is still alive and well, including anything perceived to be related to that term.
For voters, there is a disconnect between the ideas and the candidate, and I presume what lies at the heart of that disconnect is general tribalism, the stigmatization of 'socialism' and trying to conduct effective messaging with that stigma hanging over one's head.
I will respond to this later, famb. Haven't forgotten, just so tied up with doing other stuff on the computer that I haven't had the time to read and response in detail to anything lenghty.
 
Back
Top Bottom