So...how about them Somali Pirates?

[kicksfiend]

Originally Posted by In Yo Nostril

Originally Posted by Lrrr

Biggie62 wrote:

---

kicksfiend wrote:

---

Wait a minute, let me get this straight...




The increase in fish stocks makes it okay for the pirates to interrupt international transport?




Insurance premiums on shipping through that area is up 1000%. It costs an extra 7-8 million to go around the Cape of Good Hope (to avoid pirates).
We're in a global recession where there are ships being docked in random bodies of water because they're being unused. Adding to the costs of
transports only worsens this problem and prevents any real recovery in shipping.




Do I feel sorry for Somalians and others that have it tough? Yes. Do I think it's okay to disrupt international trade because they have it tough? No. I
don't care if the fish stocks go up, piracy should not be tolerated. If they wants boats to go further away from the coast to avoid disrupting fish
stocks, there are better ways to go about it.

Agreed.

They're also pirating because foreign vessels are using their waters to dump waste.





and instead of using those millions of dollars to help their people they care so much about, they use it to bang hookers and do lines all day until they find another boat. someone give these guys the nobel peace prize for protecting their homeland



A lot of you guys are acting like these pirates are committing selfless acts for their people. They aren't. Have any you guys wondered where they get thefunds they use to buy guns and whatever other materials they need? I've read that they've received financing from as far as London. Those"financiers" aren't doing it for free. They're taking more than half the money the pirates steal as their cut.

I've also read about the dumping of waste. If the UN didn't take them seriously when they first brought it up, what makes them think piracy will helptheir cause? The piracy takes away from any credibility their cause has and it sets the Somalian people back even further. These pirates aren't helpingtheir country, they're making it worst.

Originally Posted by spsfinest212

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

Wait a minute, let me get this straight...




The increase in fish stocks makes it okay for the pirates to interrupt international transport?




Insurance premiums on shipping through that area is up 1000%. It costs an extra 7-8 million to go around the Cape of Good Hope (to avoid pirates). We're in
a global recession where there are ships being docked in random bodies of water because they're being unused. Adding to the costs of transports only
worsens this problem and prevents any real recovery in shipping.




Do I feel sorry for Somalians and others that have it tough? Yes. Do I think it's okay to disrupt international trade because they have it tough? No. I
don't care if the fish stocks go up, piracy should not be tolerated. If they wants boats to go further away from the coast to avoid disrupting fish stocks,
there are better ways to go about it.

I bet your white....

I'm not white. I'm not sure how race even matters to this anyway. I'm not saying the Somalians aren't justified and I'm surely notdefending the people who dump waste on their coast. I'm just saying that piracy is the wrong solution. That's all.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

These people are literally starving to death...they can't grow crops because their soil is polluted, they can't drink water because their water istoxic, they are surrounded by water yet can't fish because rich Europeans are stealing all of their aquaculture ..... YOU THINK THEY GIVE A DAMN ABOUTCREDIBILITY IN THE UN or you only being able to buy 5 PS3 games instead of 10 this month due to a "recession".


Please...

Y'all cats are disgusting.

 

[sundoobie]

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

Wait a minute, let me get this straight...

The increase in fish stocks makes it okay for the pirates to interrupt international transport?

Insurance premiums on shipping through that area is up 1000%. It costs an extra 7-8 million to go around the Cape of Good Hope (to avoid pirates). We're in a global recession where there are ships being docked in random bodies of water because they're being unused. Adding to the costs of transports only worsens this problem and prevents any real recovery in shipping.

Do I feel sorry for Somalians and others that have it tough? Yes. Do I think it's okay to disrupt international trade because they have it tough? No. I don't care if the fish stocks go up, piracy should not be tolerated. If they wants boats to go further away from the coast to avoid disrupting fish stocks, there are better ways to go about it.

Exactly. My boy works for Evergreen and he said the additional transport cost for the premiums and security measurements gets passed on to theircustomers like Wal-Mart, Toyota, Etc. The extra cost gets passed on to the consumer. So bottom line, we are the ones paying more for our everyday goods.


Plus the people that are targeted and held for ransom are mariners whom have no objective in Somali waters except to sail through to their destination. Youthink a majority of huge transatlantic cargo ships give a damn about Somali fish or dumping toxic waste in their waters. How can it ever be justifiable to betaken hostage, deprived of freedom, threatened with death, and kept away from friends and families for days, weeks, and months. Pirates do all this just sothat they can make money from companies that have absolutely nothing to do with the suffering in Somalia.

Bottom line what is more profitable for a group of people that have little or nothing? Selling fish or holding international hostages and requesting milliondollar ransoms?

 

[the fame]

In agreement to what is being said...
European ships also have been looting Somalia waters of seafood,
one of its greatest resources.

More than $300 million worth of tuna, shrimp, and lobster are being stolen every year by illegal trawlers.

So what does that leave them to sale?

And we expect these people not to try and fight back?

I mean the image of pirates as an whole is made to be an huge stereotype, but I guess that is another discussion.

 

[blazersfan]

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

Originally Posted by In Yo Nostril

Originally Posted by Lrrr

Biggie62 wrote:

---

kicksfiend wrote:

---

Wait a minute, let me get this straight...




The increase in fish stocks makes it okay for the pirates to interrupt international transport?




Insurance premiums on shipping through that area is up 1000%. It costs an extra 7-8 million to go around the Cape of Good Hope (to avoid pirates).
We're in a global recession where there are ships being docked in random bodies of water because they're being unused. Adding to the costs of
transports only worsens this problem and prevents any real recovery in shipping.




Do I feel sorry for Somalians and others that have it tough? Yes. Do I think it's okay to disrupt international trade because they have it tough? No. I
don't care if the fish stocks go up, piracy should not be tolerated. If they wants boats to go further away from the coast to avoid disrupting fish
stocks, there are better ways to go about it.

Agreed.

They're also pirating because foreign vessels are using their waters to dump waste.

and instead of using those millions of dollars to help their people they care so much about, they use it to bang hookers and do lines all day until they find another boat. someone give these guys the nobel peace prize for protecting their homeland



A lot of you guys are acting like these pirates are committing selfless acts for their people. They aren't. Have any you guys wondered where they get the funds they use to buy guns and whatever other materials they need? I've read that they've received financing from as far as London. Those "financiers" aren't doing it for free. They're taking more than half the money the pirates steal as their cut.

I've also read about the dumping of waste. If the UN didn't take them seriously when they first brought it up, what makes them think piracy will help their cause? The piracy takes away from any credibility their cause has and it sets the Somalian people back even further. These pirates aren't helping their country, they're making it worst.

Originally Posted by spsfinest212

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

Wait a minute, let me get this straight...




The increase in fish stocks makes it okay for the pirates to interrupt international transport?




Insurance premiums on shipping through that area is up 1000%. It costs an extra 7-8 million to go around the Cape of Good Hope (to avoid pirates). We're in
a global recession where there are ships being docked in random bodies of water because they're being unused. Adding to the costs of transports only
worsens this problem and prevents any real recovery in shipping.




Do I feel sorry for Somalians and others that have it tough? Yes. Do I think it's okay to disrupt international trade because they have it tough? No. I
don't care if the fish stocks go up, piracy should not be tolerated. If they wants boats to go further away from the coast to avoid disrupting fish stocks,
there are better ways to go about it.

I bet your white....

I'm not white. I'm not sure how race even matters to this anyway. I'm not saying the Somalians aren't justified and I'm surely not defending the people who dump waste on their coast. I'm just saying that piracy is the wrong solution. That's all.
Wrong Solution? Cmon , they have nothing to lose. What do you propose they do?

 

[kicksfiend]

Originally Posted by HueyP in LouieV

These people are literally starving to death...they can't grow crops because their soil is polluted, they can't drink water because their water is toxic, they are surrounded by water yet can't fish because rich Europeans are stealing all of their aquaculture ..... YOU THINK THEY GIVE A DAMN ABOUT CREDIBILITY IN THE UN or you only being able to buy 5 PS3 games instead of 10 this month due to a "recession".


Please...

Y'all cats are disgusting.

So what's your solution? Letting the piracy continue? What will that solve? If the "rich Europeans" continue to have to pay huge shipping costs,they WILL do something about the piracy. Which means they'll probably end up doing things that makes it even worst for the starving kids in Somalia. Whatwill the pirates do if a foreign government's navy sets up off the coast to prevent pirates from attacking ships? They'll stop hijacking ships and NONEof Somalia's problems will get addressed.

I also like how you wrote "recession" like there really isnt one. I know it seems like the recessions over because Obama's claiming it is and BenBernanke's monetizing debt (and killing the dollar) so the stock market can hit 10,000 (on the DOW). But it's not over yet and images like this showyou how bad it really is.

That's hundreds of ships docked near Singapore because NO ONE is shipping. Add in insurance premiums due to Somalian Pirates and watch more ships getdocked. Then we can really talk about starving people.

 

[nyota de la star]

Originally Posted by HueyP in LouieV

Originally Posted by ItsGettinHot

Ok. I'll admit it. I'm uninformed.

Somebody school me on the pirates.

What exactly do they do and why?

Big European corporations began dumping toxic waste in the waters surrounding the horn of Africa, causing infant deaths, spread of infectious diseases, tremendous pollution and terrible deformities among the local population. They also stripped the waters of valuable seafood, which served as the lifeblood of the residents.

The local men grew fed up of the exploitation and took to patrolling the waters with weapons. They ran off the waste dumpers and kept away the illegal fishers. Some of the more desperate and "criminal" elements of an unstable Somalian nation began hijacking ships and holding them for ransom. Our media tried painting all of the "pirates" with the same broad brush, calling them pirates, thugs and criminals, even though those "criminals" were bring pursued and punished by the other pirates, who only wanted to protect the well being of their nation and people...not to become rich off of ransom demands.

Our CIA is currently in Somalia doing the devilish things that they do in our names and the name of "democracy".

So when you see the Rupert Murdoch propaganda machine start spinning around this topic again...just know that there is always two sides to a story...and you have just seen the other side.

The CIA is always helping to screw up other countries. When will it stop?

 

[antonlavey]

�

 

[lrrr]

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

Originally Posted by HueyP in LouieV

These people are literally starving to death...they can't grow crops because their soil is polluted, they can't drink water because their water is toxic, they are surrounded by water yet can't fish because rich Europeans are stealing all of their aquaculture ..... YOU THINK THEY GIVE A DAMN ABOUT CREDIBILITY IN THE UN or you only being able to buy 5 PS3 games instead of 10 this month due to a "recession".


Please...

Y'all cats are disgusting.

So what's your solution? Letting the piracy continue? What will that solve? If the "rich Europeans" continue to have to pay huge shipping costs, they WILL do something about the piracy. Which means they'll probably end up doing things that makes it even worst for the starving kids in Somalia. What will the pirates do if a foreign government's navy sets up off the coast to prevent pirates from attacking ships? They'll stop hijacking ships and NONE of Somalia's problems will get addressed.

I also like how you wrote "recession" like there really isnt one. I know it seems like the recessions over because Obama's claiming it is and Ben Bernanke's monetizing debt (and killing the dollar) so the stock market can hit 10,000 (on the DOW). But it's not over yet and images like this show you how bad it really is.

That's hundreds of ships docked near Singapore because NO ONE is shipping. Add in insurance premiums due to Somalian Pirates and watch more ships get docked. Then we can really talk about starving people.

Excuse my ignorance. Why would an insurance company in China raise premiums because of whats going on all the way in Somalia?

 

[spsfinest212]

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

Originally Posted by HueyP in LouieV

These people are literally starving to death...they can't grow crops because their soil is polluted, they can't drink water because their water is toxic, they are surrounded by water yet can't fish because rich Europeans are stealing all of their aquaculture ..... YOU THINK THEY GIVE A DAMN ABOUT CREDIBILITY IN THE UN or you only being able to buy 5 PS3 games instead of 10 this month due to a "recession".


Please...

Y'all cats are disgusting.

So what's your solution? Letting the piracy continue? What will that solve? If the "rich Europeans" continue to have to pay huge shipping costs, they WILL do something about the piracy. Which means they'll probably end up doing things that makes it even worst for the starving kids in Somalia. What will the pirates do if a foreign government's navy sets up off the coast to prevent pirates from attacking ships? They'll stop hijacking ships and NONE of Somalia's problems will get addressed.

I also like how you wrote "recession" like there really isnt one. I know it seems like the recessions over because Obama's claiming it is and Ben Bernanke's monetizing debt (and killing the dollar) so the stock market can hit 10,000 (on the DOW). But it's not over yet and images like this show you how bad it really is.

That's hundreds of ships docked near Singapore because NO ONE is shipping. Add in insurance premiums due to Somalian Pirates and watch more ships get docked. Then we can really talk about starving people.

Who the hell cares about your precious corporations. If they want to ship they need to exploit somewhere else instead of Africa god knowscorporations have exploited it enough.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

Your'e talking about the stock market and dollar deflation like that really means something in the grand scope of things. Bringing in your conservativecynicism about the Obama administrations press releases and Fed monetary policy into a discussion about basic foreign survival....get over your self.

These people would kill in a heartbeat to have the condtions that Americans faced in the "Great Depression"

Stop being a stereotypical arrogant, spoiled and selfish American.

I could care less about the added costs that these pirates bring...the fraudulent American taxation system and the far reaching implications of our own corrupteconomic and political culture adds a MUCH GREATER tax on the products that you and I buy, than these small band of people struggling to stay alive in theircorner of the globe.

You can't have everything all at once. You can only push and push and push so much....until the victims push back.

And if the European community decides to take some real action in the horn, then so be it....then they can't turn a blind eye to the criminal behavior oftheir own members. These peoples situations can't get any worse than it already is. At least they would be forced to bring some aide and see that it getsdistributed.

And like I said the CIA is already in Somalia attempting to determine their destiny and prop up a puppet government as we speak...so foreign governmentsaren't standing pat...but you won't hear much about that on CNN.

 

[solezonfroze]

Originally Posted by THE FAME


In terms of violation...


Pirate Bay Torrents > Somali Pirates

@ the minds we have on NT

I don't support them, but I don't knock them. They're trynna get theirs damn it. Aren't we all trynna get ours? It's life. It's notalways gonna be fair. And it's more and more prevalent by the day. At least in the state our country is in now.

 

[kicksfiend]

Originally Posted by Lrrr

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

HueyP in LouieV wrote:

---

These people are literally starving to death...they can't grow crops because their soil is polluted, they can't drink water because their water is
toxic, they are surrounded by water yet can't fish because rich Europeans are stealing all of their aquaculture ..... YOU THINK THEY GIVE A DAMN ABOUT
CREDIBILITY IN THE UN or you only being able to buy 5 PS3 games instead of 10 this month due to a "recession".






Please...




Y'all cats are disgusting.

So what's your solution? Letting the piracy continue? What will that solve? If the "rich Europeans" continue to have to pay huge shipping costs,
they WILL do something about the piracy. Which means they'll probably end up doing things that makes it even worst for the starving kids in Somalia. What
will the pirates do if a foreign government's navy sets up off the coast to prevent pirates from attacking ships? They'll stop hijacking ships and NONE
of Somalia's problems will get addressed.




I also like how you wrote "recession" like there really isnt one. I know it seems like the recessions over because Obama's claiming it is and Ben
Bernanke's monetizing debt (and killing the dollar) so the stock market can hit 10,000 (on the DOW). But it's not over yet and images like this show
you how bad it really is.

That's hundreds of ships docked near Singapore because NO ONE is shipping. Add in insurance premiums due to Somalian Pirates and watch more ships get
docked. Then we can really talk about starving people.

Excuse my ignorance. Why would an insurance company in China raise premiums because of whats going on all the way in Somalia?



They wouldn't unless the boats were trying to get through the Gulf of Aden (the last part was about the "recession" comment he made). The pointwas that these insurance premiums on ships moving through the Gulf of Aden is going to create problems for international companies. If a foreign governmentsets its navy up in the Gulf, the piracy will end and NONE of Somalia's problems will get addresses. HueyP in LouisV said they don't give a damn aboutthe UN and sure, you can argue that the UN has failed in the past to acknowledge the problems in less developed nation but piracy is not going to help Somaliawith any of it's problems. Somalia's isolating itself with no support from foreign nations it's pirates have stolen from and no real solution toending the dumping of waste and the problems with fishing stocks.

It's like walking into a room with a grenade. The best case scenario is you leave the room with the grenade but the worst case is you use it and bloweveryone up (including yourself). There's no upside to the piracy in the long term and it will do nothing to help the starving people in Somalia.

 

[lesfamilia]

If there's nothing I've learned as a communications student, I know that you can never totally trust a media source, in as much as you should alwaysrecognize how partisan a source may be or what it may be biased towards.

There was a thought-provoking article on Real Clear World a few months back talking about how the Somali pirates are basically defending their part of theAfrican coastline after numerous international governments have violated their waters and virtually looted their land. While I can't justify theSomali's actions, I can definitely understand the rationale behind their antics.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

Did you not watch that video?

How aren't they helping the starving people of Somalia?

They just cleared the corruption that was stopping up their economic pipeline. Hundreds of families are benefiting from the restoration of their aquaculture.

They have undoubtedly saved many children from dying of starvation and disease without taking 1 life themselves.

 

[fantastic4our]

Is there an article where I can read more about this issue?

cause it seems like the UN really doesn't care about their situation. why not take things into your own hands?

 

[gd87]

I may be a little biased on this subject because I come from somali descent but.....

Basically I see good and bad in these pirates. It began with good intentions... fishermen stopping the illegal duping of toxic waste and illegal fishing offtheir coasts (which no country wants to admit to this day

) and turnedall bad when the wrong people got involved. The good "pirates" who were fisherman just protecting their people got replaced by former warlords(who's fighting led to the governments collapse in the first place) when they found out they can get multi million dollar ransoms for these ships passingoff the coast.

So like I said there's good "pirates" out there off the coast and there's some really bad ones... I think if the problems with the illegalfishing and dumping of toxic waste were to be eliminated, it would be a lot easier to weed the bad guys out of the good guys.

 

[kicksfiend]

Originally Posted by HueyP in LouieV

Did you not watch that video?

How aren't they helping the starving people of Somalia?

They just cleared the corruption that was stopping up their economic pipeline. Hundreds of families are benefiting from the restoration of their aquaculture.

They have undoubtedly saved many children from dying of starvation and disease without taking 1 life themselves.

Let's get something straight. Policing the waters and stopping illegal fishing activity DOES NOT EQUAL piracy. Hijacking ships for ransom is piracy.

I'm against piracy. I'm not against helping Somalia.

The Western media portrays those policing the coastlines and those pirating international ships as the same thing. You, yourself made the argument they are notthe same. Somehow I feel like you're confusing my views. I'm against PIRACY because of the reasons I've mentioned in the past few posts, thebiggest reason is it detracts from any type of progression Somalia can make.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

Originally Posted by kicksfiend

Originally Posted by HueyP in LouieV

Did you not watch that video?

How aren't they helping the starving people of Somalia?

They just cleared the corruption that was stopping up their economic pipeline. Hundreds of families are benefiting from the restoration of their aquaculture.

They have undoubtedly saved many children from dying of starvation and disease without taking 1 life themselves.

Let's get something straight. Policing the waters and stopping illegal fishing activity DOES NOT EQUAL piracy. Hijacking ships for ransom is piracy.

I'm against piracy. I'm not against helping Somalia.

The Western media portrays those policing the coastlines and those pirating international ships as the same thing. You, yourself made the argument they are not the same. Somehow I feel like you're confusing my views. I'm against PIRACY because of the reasons I've mentioned in the past few posts, the biggest reason is it detracts from any type of progression Somalia can make.

That much I can agree with but the term "pirate" is being used to encapsulate all of the independent armed seafarers of the region.

There is no distinction being drawn, similar to the "terrorist" tag.

 

[itsgettinhot]

OK. So this is what I got.

There's people in Somalia with guns and boats.

Some are attacking ships that dump and fish illegally, and some rob and hijack other ships. Everyone gets called a pirate.

As a side effect, Somalian fishers are doing better.

Wouldn't the simple solution be to give the ones patrolling for a good reason an official title?

 

[solezonfroze]

Originally Posted by ItsGettinHot

OK. So this is what I got.

There's people in Somalia with guns and boats.

Some are attacking ships that dump and fish illegally, and some rob and hijack other ships. Everyone gets called a pirate.

As a side effect, Somalian fishers are doing better.

Wouldn't the simple solution be to give the ones patrolling for a good reason an official title?

Rent-A-Pirate

Now, I've actually been reading close even tho I haven't said much. Cuz I don't see how much more I can say. HueyP, IMO, is droppin facts. There's not one thing this dude is saying that I can disagree with.

 

[illionaire]

Originally Posted by THE FAME


In terms of violation...


Pirate Bay Torrents > Somali Pirates

Dead.

 

[13saldana13]

Yes, the pirates have done bad stuff, but they didn't start doing them for no reason. The situation they're put in makes them do it and since itinterferes with societies way of life they're painted in a bad light. Some of them aren't even pirates, they're just keeping the dumpers away.

Imagine living in poverty, real poverty, not having to buy from payless poor, but the stuff you read about and see on tv. You grow up living in a dump andthings are never going good, your family is constantly ill and so are your friends, and death occurs all around you. Put yourself in those shoes. Now yourfamily has a little fishing business, little bit of income from it, and most of your meals come from that. Then some foreign rich guys decide they can makesome serious money if they bring in big ships to do what your doing, hey take what your doing, but big time. The reason why conditions are so bad in the firstplace is because of these rich guys and their people, now they come and take your only way of living? What would you do? Personally, I'd do whatever ittakes to survive and some of you forget to think about it like this. Sure some companies have been affected by the pirating, but he majority of them deserveit.

 

[julius wrek]

Hey_

http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1http://www.youtube.com/v/UTxJLlQCe4U&rel=1

Julius F. Wrek

 

[superantigen]

Originally Posted by King Beef

Originally Posted by blazersfan

I supported them then, and still do.

Props to them!

Indeed.

...