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The Official NBA Season Thread: SFA Prevails
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by pmatic,
- Start date
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As load managing ain’t slowing down this last season eitherBurt I thought the play-in would prevent this
Mister Meaner
formerly super producer j
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*
elpablo21
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I fully expect the play in week to be dead in here based off the last few pages
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This. Even if it is just 10 seconds. Get it over with and assess a couple techs. Too much jawing backa and forth leading to a hold me backs
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So ridiculous.
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nvm play in
elpablo21
Supporter
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More halftime load managing incoming
Kawhi a trendsetter
Kawhi a trendsetter
jpzx
Supporter
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Shorten the MVP requirements to 65 games
Then shorten the regular season to 65 games without telling anyone.
If you miss one game, you're out, DONE. Medieval survival. Adapt or die.
Then shorten the regular season to 65 games without telling anyone.
If you miss one game, you're out, DONE. Medieval survival. Adapt or die.
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Mavs are cowards
MVP
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My guess is two of the players about whom I’m going to get the most pushback in terms of what slot they’re in are Jayson Tatum (Tier 2A, or seventh to ninth top player in the league) and Joel Embiid (1B, fifth or sixth), especially given both having seasons that will place them in the top five, and in Embiid’s case, possibly at the top of the MVP voting.
go-deeper
GO DEEPER
NBA Pre-Postseason Player Tiers 2023: Donovan Mitchell levels up, LeBron still shows flashes of greatness
And I’m here to tell you there is literally (well, almost literally, but nobody is going ’61 Wilt or anything) nothing they could have done this regular season to move any higher. Because the questions they have to answer, and the tests they have to pass, happen in May and June, not January and February.
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I’m not even saying either player has shirked or shrunk in playoffs past. But they haven’t quite overcome either.
Somehow, a narrative has developed that last season’s NBA Finals weren’t actually that close, but with a chance to go up 3-1 at home, Boston had a five-point lead with 6:30 left in Game 4. And the Celtics couldn’t close it out and didn’t win another game from there. A big reason was the degree to which the Warriors had seemingly (and finally) figured out Tatum, turning him into much more of an isolation scorer than the playmaking offensive engine who helps the Celtics purr. Over the final two games, he made only 16 of 38 shots, with nine turnovers against only 11 assists.
To put a point on it, the title was there to be won, but Boston’s offense bogged down. With Tatum the primary driver of that offense, he takes a good chunk of the blame. Maybe if the late-game offensive foibles hadn’t plagued the Celtics earlier in the postseason — they made harder work of the series against the Bucks and Heat as a result of similar breakdowns — or across the regular season wherein the Celtics were one of the worst-performing teams in the clutch of the last few decades, the disappointment would stick to him less.
Meanwhile for Embiid, there is nothing particular he hasn’t done. Other than win.
The second-round loss in 2019 to Toronto (and all the bounces of Kawhi Leonard’s jumper that it required) was a credible defeat in a hard-fought series in which there had to be a loser. The bubble sweep at the hands of the Celtics was more the result of the support on his team collapsing once Ben Simmons went down with an injury just before the playoffs. Embiid was a little banged up against the Hawks in 2021, while missing the first two games against the Heat last year.
Over the past few years, I’ve come to see reliability as a more and more important trait the higher up the Tiers we travel. And while there are explanations and extenuating circumstances for all of those losses (including series the Sixers should have won on paper in the last two playoff runs), it’s always something with Embiid and Philadelphia.
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For me, the Hawks series sticks in my craw as the one a 1A player doesn’t drop. This isn’t to say that’s a permanent status, but reaching the conference finals (at least) last year would have helped!
If the above sounds nitpicky about either Embiid or Tatum, it is intended to be. The Tiers are explicitly about drawing fine distinctions between top players because, as we see every year, those little differences matter a great deal at this level. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if either Tatum or Embiid showed that those small edges are actually in their favor over the next few months. But unlike players above them, they haven’t quite proved it. Yet.
I supposed I can’t close without addressing the inevitable “But what about Nikola Jokić?” retort to the critique of Embiid. To which I would respond: Show me the series Denver (and Jokić) has lost in which they were favored? Show me where he hasn’t performed at an exemplary level across his entire playoff career, aside from a few ugly moments of poor discipline resulting in ejections.
Getting the to conference finals in the bubble, winning a series without Jamal Murray in 2021 and performing well at least on an individual level despite being the sole focus of Golden State’s game planning last year has been “proving it” relative to circumstances.
But heading into the playoffs as the top seed does put Jokić at risk. An early exit where his defensive limitations play a key part will mean at this point next year, Jokić will be the subject of this demand for proof either alongside or instead of Embiid.
Pre-Postseason Tiers: Tier 1 (and 2A)
PLAYER TEAM 23 MIDSEASON 22 TIER 21 TIER 2020 TIER
Giannis Antetokounmpo
MIL
1A
1A
1A
1A
Kevin Durant
PHX
1A
1A
1A
1B
Stephen Curry
GSW
1A
1A
1B
1B
Nikola Jokic
DEN
1A
1A
1B
2A
Luka Doncic
DAL
1B
1B
2A
2A
Joel Embiid
PHI
1B
1B
2A
2B
LeBron James
LAL
2A
1C
1A
1A
Kawhi Leonard
LAC
2A
1C
1B
1A
Jayson Tatum
BOS
2A
2A
2C
2C
Related reading
Player Tiers, 2023: LeBron James still shows flashes of greatness
Player Tiers, 2023: Jaylen Brown’s, Anthony Edwards’ stock rises
Player Tiers, 2023: De’Aaron Fox, Aaron Gordon climb the ranks
Player Tiers, 2023: Klay Thompson, Karl-Anthony Towns among top 75
Player Tiers: 2022 | 2021 | 2020
(Illustration: Eamonn Dalton / The Athletic; Photos: Mitchell Leff / Rob Carr/ Dustin Bradford / Getty Images)
go-deeper
GO DEEPER
NBA Pre-Postseason Player Tiers 2023: Donovan Mitchell levels up, LeBron still shows flashes of greatness
And I’m here to tell you there is literally (well, almost literally, but nobody is going ’61 Wilt or anything) nothing they could have done this regular season to move any higher. Because the questions they have to answer, and the tests they have to pass, happen in May and June, not January and February.
ADVERTISEMENT
I’m not even saying either player has shirked or shrunk in playoffs past. But they haven’t quite overcome either.
Somehow, a narrative has developed that last season’s NBA Finals weren’t actually that close, but with a chance to go up 3-1 at home, Boston had a five-point lead with 6:30 left in Game 4. And the Celtics couldn’t close it out and didn’t win another game from there. A big reason was the degree to which the Warriors had seemingly (and finally) figured out Tatum, turning him into much more of an isolation scorer than the playmaking offensive engine who helps the Celtics purr. Over the final two games, he made only 16 of 38 shots, with nine turnovers against only 11 assists.
To put a point on it, the title was there to be won, but Boston’s offense bogged down. With Tatum the primary driver of that offense, he takes a good chunk of the blame. Maybe if the late-game offensive foibles hadn’t plagued the Celtics earlier in the postseason — they made harder work of the series against the Bucks and Heat as a result of similar breakdowns — or across the regular season wherein the Celtics were one of the worst-performing teams in the clutch of the last few decades, the disappointment would stick to him less.
Meanwhile for Embiid, there is nothing particular he hasn’t done. Other than win.
The second-round loss in 2019 to Toronto (and all the bounces of Kawhi Leonard’s jumper that it required) was a credible defeat in a hard-fought series in which there had to be a loser. The bubble sweep at the hands of the Celtics was more the result of the support on his team collapsing once Ben Simmons went down with an injury just before the playoffs. Embiid was a little banged up against the Hawks in 2021, while missing the first two games against the Heat last year.
Over the past few years, I’ve come to see reliability as a more and more important trait the higher up the Tiers we travel. And while there are explanations and extenuating circumstances for all of those losses (including series the Sixers should have won on paper in the last two playoff runs), it’s always something with Embiid and Philadelphia.
ADVERTISEMENT
For me, the Hawks series sticks in my craw as the one a 1A player doesn’t drop. This isn’t to say that’s a permanent status, but reaching the conference finals (at least) last year would have helped!
If the above sounds nitpicky about either Embiid or Tatum, it is intended to be. The Tiers are explicitly about drawing fine distinctions between top players because, as we see every year, those little differences matter a great deal at this level. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if either Tatum or Embiid showed that those small edges are actually in their favor over the next few months. But unlike players above them, they haven’t quite proved it. Yet.
I supposed I can’t close without addressing the inevitable “But what about Nikola Jokić?” retort to the critique of Embiid. To which I would respond: Show me the series Denver (and Jokić) has lost in which they were favored? Show me where he hasn’t performed at an exemplary level across his entire playoff career, aside from a few ugly moments of poor discipline resulting in ejections.
Getting the to conference finals in the bubble, winning a series without Jamal Murray in 2021 and performing well at least on an individual level despite being the sole focus of Golden State’s game planning last year has been “proving it” relative to circumstances.
But heading into the playoffs as the top seed does put Jokić at risk. An early exit where his defensive limitations play a key part will mean at this point next year, Jokić will be the subject of this demand for proof either alongside or instead of Embiid.
Pre-Postseason Tiers: Tier 1 (and 2A)
PLAYER TEAM 23 MIDSEASON 22 TIER 21 TIER 2020 TIER
Giannis Antetokounmpo
MIL
1A
1A
1A
1A
Kevin Durant
PHX
1A
1A
1A
1B
Stephen Curry
GSW
1A
1A
1B
1B
Nikola Jokic
DEN
1A
1A
1B
2A
Luka Doncic
DAL
1B
1B
2A
2A
Joel Embiid
PHI
1B
1B
2A
2B
LeBron James
LAL
2A
1C
1A
1A
Kawhi Leonard
LAC
2A
1C
1B
1A
Jayson Tatum
BOS
2A
2A
2C
2C
Related reading
Player Tiers, 2023: LeBron James still shows flashes of greatness
Player Tiers, 2023: Jaylen Brown’s, Anthony Edwards’ stock rises
Player Tiers, 2023: De’Aaron Fox, Aaron Gordon climb the ranks
Player Tiers, 2023: Klay Thompson, Karl-Anthony Towns among top 75
Player Tiers: 2022 | 2021 | 2020
(Illustration: Eamonn Dalton / The Athletic; Photos: Mitchell Leff / Rob Carr/ Dustin Bradford / Getty Images)
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KD played 41 minutes to barely beat the nuggets bench 0_o
CP0 and SHOOKer played 37 minutes each too
Crazy, wonder how long they’re playing tonight in LA
CP0 and SHOOKer played 37 minutes each too
Crazy, wonder how long they’re playing tonight in LA
MVP
Supporter
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MVP
Supporter
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We may never see Bron vs KD again
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Really don't want to drive an hour so they would rather take a 20 minute flight? 
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big j 33
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this is one of my favorite things I've ever seen
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This is all Poppovich’s fault.
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antidope
Supporter
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I am not against the Play In. I don't think the 7th seed should be in it.
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Agreed
lawdog1
Supporter
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Knew the shenanigan levels would be high with line ups these last couple games.
kdawg
Staff member
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It’s crazy that the east is settled - except for the final playoff or play-in spot between 2 teams - and the west is undecided from 5-11.
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Embiid but I’ll let you cook
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Is it too early to start the playoff thread?
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