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one thing to keep in mind about Will Lyles: dude has been used by other programs, including Cal and LSU. Willing to bet money that the Ore/LSU game will be dubbed the Willie Lyles Bowl
Goodbye, 2010 COLLEGE FOOTBALL SEASON - twas a great year,
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by gunna get it,
- Start date
- Mar 1, 2011
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I just hope that he didn't give Cal and LSU the same outdated crap that he gave Oregon.
Cheating my university out of their hard earned money.
Cheating my university out of their hard earned money.
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University released two emails with i guess some pretty hefty spreadsheets tonight. BTW, this info has been known to the NCAA for what, three months? #oldnews to themOriginally Posted by University of Nike
I just hope that he didn't give Cal and LSU the same outdated crap that he gave Oregon.
Cheating my university out of their hard earned money.
- Apr 24, 2005
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Cheaters @ L$U have been cheating long enough to know to get updated info to make it @ least look kinda legit. Oregon been %+*%$@# up left and right trying to swim w/ the sharks
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*cough*A&M*cough*
- Apr 19, 2006
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lol no wonder lache visited campus
- Jan 17, 2005
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Newbs, I hear Danny Obrien showed out at UM camp.
whats with Pipkins and him?
if one commits, you guys turn away the other?
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LaMichael and Chip are cool with him tho
- Apr 12, 2010
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I'm going to assume Dunn isn't far behind.
- Nov 4, 2003
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Originally Posted by JayGunnA
Lyles
Newbs, I hear Danny Obrien showed out at UM camp.
whats with Pipkins and him?
if one commits, you guys turn away the other?
I was told to be on the lookout for a commit from him but it didn't happen. Family loves Michigan but was wondering where his recruitment was. Dominated and was being recruited heavily for the next hours.
No clue if they turn away Pipkins. Pipkins is supposed to be up at Michigan around late July/early August so we will see what happens there.
I would take both if I was the staff. Need to build up those lines even if it means dedicating half the class to it.
Love the Kalis news.
Love the Dunn news that is sounding like it will come out soon.
- Jun 8, 2005
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No LOIC or postseason bans. Probably a loss of 5 schollys/year max over 3 years, vacated wins, and probation. I would be thrilled if we could get loss of scholarships down to 3/yr for 3 years, but I'm not expecting that. Vacated wins are a huge joke and probation is a slap on the wrist.
Not a bad "death penalty" so many people were so positive we would get. Holding all the players out that we did last year was a punishment in itself and I think us bending over backwards for the NCAA prevented the LOIC tag. I'm glad we are finally getting some closure. I'm sure we will have an agreement with the NCAA before the October hearing date.
I still fully expect Butch to be our coach going forward. His name wasn't mentioned once in the 42 page NOA and he has had support from the AD and Chancellor from the very beginning. People will call for his head when the final sanctions/punishments are announced, but in the end I think he's going to be our coach for the long haul.
Not a bad "death penalty" so many people were so positive we would get. Holding all the players out that we did last year was a punishment in itself and I think us bending over backwards for the NCAA prevented the LOIC tag. I'm glad we are finally getting some closure. I'm sure we will have an agreement with the NCAA before the October hearing date.
I still fully expect Butch to be our coach going forward. His name wasn't mentioned once in the 42 page NOA and he has had support from the AD and Chancellor from the very beginning. People will call for his head when the final sanctions/punishments are announced, but in the end I think he's going to be our coach for the long haul.
- Apr 24, 2005
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2013 CB Sojurn Shelton has committed to FSU. Will/Should be one of the better DB's in the state, up there w/ Nick Washington and vernon Hargreaves jr
And UNC avoided the severe punishment? Hmmmmmm......
And UNC avoided the severe punishment? Hmmmmmm......
- Sep 24, 2002
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^Punishment won't be doled out til like October though...so nobody really knows til then.
EDIT:
@ Breaking News + the Ronde article.
EDIT:
- Feb 19, 2006
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No LOIC or postseason bans. Probably a loss of 5 schollys/year max over 3 years, vacated wins, and probation. I would be thrilled if we could get loss of scholarships down to 3/yr for 3 years, but I'm not expecting that. Vacated wins are a huge joke and probation is a slap on the wrist.
This is overly optimistic.
• Improper benefits (Agent Division). During 2009 and 2010, seven football players are accused of accepting more than $27,000 in improper benefits from three agents, five former Tar Heel players, a jeweler, "various financial advisers" and a guy named Willie [last name unknown]. Specifically, the cash and prizes break down like so:
• $7,216.20 from Todd Stewart, "financial advisor" with Pro Sports Financial.
• $5,082.37 from Gary Wichard, now-deceased NFL agent.
• $5,000 from A.J. Mosciato, South Beach jeweler.
• $3,189.20 from Hakeem Nicks, former UNC wide receiver and current New York Giant.
• $2,000 from Kentwan Balmer, former UNC defensive lineman and current Seattle Seahawk.
• $1,826.29 from Omar Brown, former UNC defensive back.
• $816 from Chris Hawkins, former UNC defensive back and alleged "runner" for various agents, also notable for purchasing the Independence Bowl jersey that helped land Georgia receiver A.J. Green on a four-game suspension last summer.
• $398 from Michael Katz, agent with Rosenhaus Sports.
• $323.92 from Willie.
• $200 from Mahlon Carey, former UNC defensive back.
• $120 from Various financial advisors.
• Employing an assistant coach who partnered with an agent. Ex-defensive line coach John Blake's relationship with Wichard has been well-chronicled by Yahoo! Sports on multiple occasions, leading to Blake's resignation last September. From the formal allegation:
It is alleged that from 2007 to 2010, then assistant football coach John Blake partnered with Gary Wichard, National Football League Players Association (NFLPA) certified agent, and Pro Tect Management to represent individuals in the marketing of their athletic abilities in violation of NCAA legislation. Specifically, Blake was employed and compensated by Pro Tect Management to influence football student-athletes to hire Wichard to represent them in marketing their athletic abilities and reputations.
The partnership is backed up by a second allegation that Blake failed to report $31,000 in outside income from Wichard's agency, Pro Tect Management, which Blake allegedly received in seven separate wire transfers from May 2007 to October 15. Blake also reportedly withheld information regarding a $45,000 he allegedly received from Wichard's agency on Dec. 27, 2007, and provided investigators with "false and misleading information" during interviews last year.
Please stop for a moment to allow the fact to sink in that the NCAA believes a major program was employing an assistant coach who was acting as a runner for an agent. The NFLPA seems to have been suitably convinced of the arrangement between Blake and Wichard, as well, having slapped the latter with a nine-month suspension last December prior to Wichard's death from cancer.
• Academic Fraud. An academic support center tutor and at least two unnamed football players "engaged in academic fraud" when the tutor wrote portions of papers and works-cited pages, conducted research and sent players significantly revised drafts of papers on multiple occasions in 2008 and 2009.
• Improper benefits (Academic Division). A former university tutor, Jennifer Wiley, is accused of supplying improper benefits to players in 2009 and 2010 by a) Providing 142 hours of free tutoring (valued at $1,562) to nine student-athletes throughout the 2009-10 term, when she was no longer employed by university, and b) Paying $150 for an airline ticket in May 2010 and a whopping $1,789 in parking fines in August 2010 for a then-football player. (At least three UNC players — Marvin Austin, draft-bound receiver Greg Little and running back Ryan Houston — may have owed that amount in fines at a given time, according to documents released last week that the university had fought to keep under wraps.)
Wiley is also accused of intentionally eluding the university's efforts to contact her for months after her name was drawn into the fray last fall, before finally responding (via attorney) in January that she wouldn't be responding to any further interview requests from the university or NCAA.
• Obstructing an investigation. An unnamed player is accused of "providing false and misleading information" about who paid for airfare and lodging on multiple trips he took in 2009 and 2010. This section is heavily redacted to omit all names and locations, but given the previous reporting in this case and the dates provided in the allegation, the player is almost certainly Marvin Austin, and the trips in question almost certainly include his well-chronicled visits to California in 2009 and South Beach in 2010.
I'm surprised as hell they didn't get the LOIC, but according to sources they couldn't link Davis or the UNC AD to knowing all about this stuff (No "they should've known" for UNC).
15 scholarships over 3 years, that is downright laughable. That's almost no punishment at all, yeah they tanked the 2010 season, doesn't change the fact they've been doing this since 2007. You're talking players getting paid, academic fraud, a runner being paid by an Agent on the staff, etc.
It will be interesting to see the sanctions handed down, they set a major precedent.
We'll see if UNC folks are singing the same tune in October.
- Sep 1, 2004
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LOIC?
how would they know already if they will get a postseason ban or not?
how would they know already if they will get a postseason ban or not?
- Apr 24, 2005
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Loss/Lack Of Institutional Control
- Feb 9, 2009
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If someone within the program would have known about what was going on then postseason bans would have come into play, which in UNC's situation, doesn't look like the case.
- Feb 19, 2006
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So John Blake, an official assistant coach, doesn't count as someone "within the program"? Lol
- Sep 24, 2002
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Apparently a player alerted them about Chris Hawkins, but they didn't do anything about it. Also in USC's case McNair was the only one who was deemed by the NCAA to KNOW about the violations; Blake was the one COMMITTING all the violations.
And I would think they'd have to do a double take at the fact that Butch hired the tutor after she was distanced from the university for being too involved; and she paid $1700 in player parking tickets and bought them an airline ticket even after the investigation started (August 2010). If they can't figure that one out I feel sorry for them, but maybe they have and just can't prove anything.
Let's say Butch is a complete doofus and didn't know about any of this; it's still his fault because all of these infractions came about as a result of people that he hired. One of them was associate HC and he had known him for 30 years, the other was a tutor who he "hired" despite her being basically kicked out by the university. Let's be real, anybody who knows anything about CFB recruiting knew about John Blake already; he was a big recruiter/coach for two programs who got slammed for violations. I think somebody who had known him for 30 years and considered him a close friend would know exactly what type of guy he was. And if not, he could have just looked at his resume.
I can't help but think the penalties will be worse than what Juicy posted just by looking at all the infractions, otherwise USC fans have a right to be upset. At the same time though it sucks for all the recruits that went there who will suffer because of it. Not to mention the ACC can't afford to have another team be irrelevant
- Jan 28, 2003
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Didn't know UNC was relevant.Originally Posted by 5am6oody72
Not to mention the ACC can't afford to have another team be irrelevant
- Feb 9, 2009
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I've always stated that USC got a raw deal, but just because I said they won't get hit with LOIC doesn't mean they still won't get hit hard. a lot of that stuff is damning to UNC and they should be punished rightfully so.
In then end they may very well get hit with a postseason ban for a year and Butch Davis could end up losing his job. Failure to monitor is still a big charge.
In then end they may very well get hit with a postseason ban for a year and Butch Davis could end up losing his job. Failure to monitor is still a big charge.
- Oct 22, 2004
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I bet UNC doesn't get harsh treatment because of those players that were kept out of games last fall. It doesn't make any sense but none of the NCAA's arbitrary rules do, it's pretty clear that between academic issues, agent issues, lying, covering up, that UNC did not truly have control of its football program.
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- Feb 22, 2006
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sorry newbs
from detnews and espn...obvs both free content so i think its kosh to post
"The biggest thing about going to Michigan would be going against Tom (Strobel) and Chris Wormley every day (in practice)," Kalis told Bill Kurelic of Bucknuts.com. "I've pretty much come to the conclusion that Wormley is going to Michigan."
Kalis' comments were reported by ESPN.
from detnews and espn...obvs both free content so i think its kosh to post
"The biggest thing about going to Michigan would be going against Tom (Strobel) and Chris Wormley every day (in practice)," Kalis told Bill Kurelic of Bucknuts.com. "I've pretty much come to the conclusion that Wormley is going to Michigan."
Kalis' comments were reported by ESPN.
- Jun 8, 2005
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Tweets from that Charles Robinson dude who always posts stories/scoops on NCAA investigations:
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Ok...crawling out of my hole to answer all the questions I'm getting about why UNC wasn't hit with lack of institutional control today.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
The NCAA sees LOIC as a catastrophic breakdown and/or disregard for oversight on the part of a school's compliance efforts
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Appears UNC avoided LOIC by painting a picture of a rogue assistant (Blake) and a rogue tutor (Wiley) who acted and concealed on their own.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
UNC likely would have gotten LOIC if NCAA could prove that Butch Davis or others in oversight had knowledge of Blake & Wiley's actions.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
UNC also could have gotten LOIC if the NCAA could show there was not ample oversight in the program. Apparently the NCAA could not.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
So at the end of the day, you have the NCAA hanging everything on Blake, Wiley and others who allegedly concealed their deceit from all.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
NCAA's argument on Blake/Davis friendship will B that friendship doesn't prove Davis knew Blake's actions. NCAA clearly needed more evidence
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Bank on it: UNC will argue its oversight didn't fail. It was simply deceived by a coach, tutor and some players. NCAA appears to agree.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Furthermore, UNC will argue it actually exhibited institutional control when it cooperated w/ NCAA probe and suspended multiple players.
-------------
[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The number and extent of the violations we had have led many people to believe we are going to get crushed and should get crushed by the NCAA, but I think that our level of cooperation with them has certainly mitigated the severity of the violations that occurred and could set a precedent going forward. John Blake "resigned" from the staff following the LSU game last year, Marvin Austin was suspended, the tutor was no longer working for the program (and she was employed by the College of Arts and Sciences not the Athletic Department anyways), and all players who were suspected of wrongdoing were withheld from any games until they were completely cleared by the NCAA. I'll be very interested to see what our final outcome is in comparison to tO$U as they covered up the violations that were occurring to keep players eligible and had a head coach who knew all of this was going on. In our case, Butch's name wasn't even mentioned in the 42 page Notice of Allegations. All of this leads me to believe we will just lose a handful of scholarships over a three year period, get probation, and vacated wins while tO$U will get hit with LOIC and much harsher penalties. [/font]
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Ok...crawling out of my hole to answer all the questions I'm getting about why UNC wasn't hit with lack of institutional control today.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
The NCAA sees LOIC as a catastrophic breakdown and/or disregard for oversight on the part of a school's compliance efforts
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Appears UNC avoided LOIC by painting a picture of a rogue assistant (Blake) and a rogue tutor (Wiley) who acted and concealed on their own.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
UNC likely would have gotten LOIC if NCAA could prove that Butch Davis or others in oversight had knowledge of Blake & Wiley's actions.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
UNC also could have gotten LOIC if the NCAA could show there was not ample oversight in the program. Apparently the NCAA could not.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
So at the end of the day, you have the NCAA hanging everything on Blake, Wiley and others who allegedly concealed their deceit from all.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
NCAA's argument on Blake/Davis friendship will B that friendship doesn't prove Davis knew Blake's actions. NCAA clearly needed more evidence
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Bank on it: UNC will argue its oversight didn't fail. It was simply deceived by a coach, tutor and some players. NCAA appears to agree.
YahooSportsNFL Charles Robinson
Furthermore, UNC will argue it actually exhibited institutional control when it cooperated w/ NCAA probe and suspended multiple players.
-------------
[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The number and extent of the violations we had have led many people to believe we are going to get crushed and should get crushed by the NCAA, but I think that our level of cooperation with them has certainly mitigated the severity of the violations that occurred and could set a precedent going forward. John Blake "resigned" from the staff following the LSU game last year, Marvin Austin was suspended, the tutor was no longer working for the program (and she was employed by the College of Arts and Sciences not the Athletic Department anyways), and all players who were suspected of wrongdoing were withheld from any games until they were completely cleared by the NCAA. I'll be very interested to see what our final outcome is in comparison to tO$U as they covered up the violations that were occurring to keep players eligible and had a head coach who knew all of this was going on. In our case, Butch's name wasn't even mentioned in the 42 page Notice of Allegations. All of this leads me to believe we will just lose a handful of scholarships over a three year period, get probation, and vacated wins while tO$U will get hit with LOIC and much harsher penalties. [/font]
