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UF hasn't scheduled an OOC opponent outside of the state of Florida in 20 years.
Goodbye, 2010 COLLEGE FOOTBALL SEASON - twas a great year,
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by gunna get it,
- Start date
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Last year wasn't all on Brantley, far from it actually. He does deserve some blame though. It's mostly mental (see Falco's speech about quicksand from the Replacements).
As a fan base we need to be patient. No need to crucify him before he takes a snap this year.
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I think you guys need to involve Deonte Thompson in your offense more. He is the key to a NC.
And where is Andre Debose transferring to?
And where is Andre Debose transferring to?
MVP
Supporter
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Fam, I watched this clown in the spring game and he still can't hit open receivers and the D can't even hit him (pause).
We should have paid for Russ Wilson to come down here
We should have paid for Russ Wilson to come down here
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Tebow is a benevolent God.
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Originally Posted by Dade B0Y
UF hasn't scheduled an OOC opponent outside of the state of Florida in 20 years.
Is that.. is that mangina I smell?
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Originally Posted by Dade B0Y
UF hasn't scheduled an OOC opponent outside of the state of Florida in 20 years.
http://insider.espn.go.co...man_bruce%26id%3d6742490
thanks
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We all discussing moot points, Florida did play Miami last year.
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I can't remember if I mentioned it already or not (maybe IYE did)...but Mike Vrabel is set to become the new LB coach at Ohio State.
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?
We played Miami (OH) not Cocaine U
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Occasionally, I get some emails from folks wanting to hear more about non-FBS football. The subject doesn't usually get much time in the spotlight, outside of a little coverage during the FCS playoffs in December or when there's a rising prospect flashing on the NFL radar come draft time.
So this week's list is dedicated to the subject: the top 10 non-BCS players (at four-year schools) that college football fans should know about in 2011:
[h3]1. Janoris Jenkins, CB, North Alabama[/h3]
Terry Bowden's latest pickup transferred to the D-2 school after getting dismissed from the Florida Gators in April, following his arrest on misdemeanor marijuana charges. Jenkins' run of off-field problems have been well-documented, but his on-field skills will give the NFL a whole lot to think about. The All-SEC pick in 2010 has been touted by many as a future first-round talent.
[h3]2. Charles Deas, DT, Shaw (N.C.)[/h3]
The former Top-100 recruit from Fort Lauderdale, Fla. -- who some may recall from a few years back for his spectacular lavender ensemble that, quite frankly, merited four-star status on its own -- has resurfaced at CIAA powerhouse Shaw in Raleigh, N.C. The 6-foot-4, 313-pound Deas was dominant at times, earning first-team all-league honors, making 56 tackles and 11.5 TFLs. Shaw DC Robert Massey, the former Saints defensive back from NC Central who knows a thing or two about making the jump to the NFL, expects Deas to get a long look from the pros.
"He has those small ankles, long arms and has that basketball background," says Massey. "He'll do pretty well in the weight room, but he's more country strong, where he's really more powerful than that. He has an engaging personality off the field, and a nastiness and a mean streak on the field, but it's controlled."
In the spring, NFL scouts came to Shaw and clocked Deas around a 5.1-5.2 in the 40, Massey says, adding that the big lineman is now a few pounds lighter than he was back then. "He's raw, but he's a good kid with a lot of untapped talent."
[h3]3. Brad Sorensen, QB, Southern Utah[/h3]
After high school, the California native served a two-year LDS mission in Spain before beginning his college career at BYU. The 6-foot-4, 225-pounder redshirted in 2009, then transferred to San Bernardino Valley College and started to blossom. He completed 60 percent of his passes and had a 17:4 TD-to-INT ratio.
But it's been at Southern Utah where Sorensen has started to turn some heads, as he made big strides over the final six games of the season for the Thunderbirds, connecting on over 76 percent of his passes and recording a 14:3 TD-to-INT mark while throwing for a school-record 3,231 yards for the Great West Conference champs. Southern Utah offensive coordinator Paul Peterson has a pretty interesting perspective on the quarterback after having started ahead of a similarly sized quarterback at Boston College: Matt Ryan.
"They're actually very similar," says Peterson. "Brad's got terrific arm strength and the same quick release and he's probably a little bit better athlete." Peterson said the key for his protege is to continue to get better at taking what the defense gives him.
[h3]4. Brian Quick, WR, Appalachian State[/h3]
A former prep basketball star, Quick has good speed to go with great size at 6-foot-5, 220 pounds. For a guy who plays on a team that doesn't throw the ball around too much, Quick sure does make a ton of plays. He's caught 108 passes over the past two seasons. In 2010, he averaged 18 yards a catch and had nine TD receptions. Not bad for a guy who only played one season of high school football. Quick is a lethal kick blocker as well.
[h3]5. Trumain Johnson, CB, Montana[/h3]
At 6-foot-3, 198 pounds, Johnson has intriguing size for a corner. The former high school QB also has displayed some uncanny playmaking skills as evidenced by his 13 career INTs. In 2010, he had four INTs and took two of those back for touchdowns.
[h3]6. Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern[/h3]
This guy sure looks like he could play in the Big 12, at 6-foot-3, 325 pounds. He had a breakout season in 2010, notching nine sacks and 17 TFLs and winning All-American honors in just his second collegiate season of action. The former high school basketball player also displayed some of the explosiveness that enabled him to finish fifth in the state of Missouri in the discus in 2006.
Williams was a nonqualifier coming out of high school and spent a year at prep school. He could've opted for the junior college route, but instead signed with Missouri Southern, and that program is thrilled that he did. "I've coached a lot of D-2 guys who have had shots at the NFL and played in the NFL, and he's as good as any of them," says Missouri Southern coach Bart Tatum. "He's just so tough and strong. He's a 500-pound bencher and broke every weight room record we have here."
[h3]7. Brent Russell, DT, Georgia Southern[/h3]
Even though he was just a sophomore in 2010, most of the folks who played against the 6-foot-2, 291-pounder are convinced he was the best defensive tackle they played all season. Russell's stats would back that up, as 71 tackles, 18.5 TFLs and eight sacks are a mouthful for any interior D-lineman. "He has tremendous strength and leverage," says one rival coach.
Some of those attributes were honed back in his days as a Georgia state heavyweight wrestling champ, when he posted a 56-1 record. He also led his high school, Madison County, to back-to-back state playoff appearances for the first time in 20 years.
[h3]8. Rishaw Johnson, OG, Cal (Penn.) University[/h3]
As some of you may remember, I covered Johnson's heatbreaking childhood story in Meat Market. He picked the Ole Miss Rebels and had more than his share of off-field issues in Oxford. He flashed some freakish athleticism on occasion -- he once set a team record in the power clean by hoisting 372 pounds -- but Johnson eventually got booted from the team last September for a "violation of team rules." He left Mississippi and opted to resume his playing career for the D-2 Cal Vulcans after considering Abilene Christian.
Credit former Vulcans QB Josh Portis for the recruiting job in convincing Johnson how good their coaches were at dealing with transfers. So far the move is going well for the 6-foot-4, 310-pound Johnson, who reports that he made the Dean's List for the first time in college and he'll graduate in December. He's spending part of the summer back home in Louisiana training with some New Orleans Saints, including former Alabama star Mark Ingram. He's also trying to convince his friend Robby Green, the former Crimson Tide safety, to join him at Cal U.
Johnson is confident he can catch the eyes of some NFL scouts now, too, after a few pro personnel people dropped by the Pennsylvania State Athletic Conference school in the spring. Asked what he tells people who are skeptical after the way things went for him at Ole Miss, he says, "If I had to do it all over again, I would've listened to all of the good people in my life who were trying to help me," says Johnson. "I was young and just didn't listen. Being here, I've realized it's crunch time. Time to grow up and be a man."
[h3]9. Asa Jackson, CB, Cal Poly[/h3]
A four-year starter whose 4.40 40-time at Cal Poly's NFL Junior Day in the spring was the fastest time on the team, Jackson is one of those guys that makes you wonder how the bigger schools missed on him.
He was an outstanding quarterback in high school at Christian Brothers High in Sacramento. He had legit speed, having qualified for the state in the 400-meter and 4x400-meter relay. Grades? He made the honor roll seven times. Background? Both of his parents are doctors and, according to his bio, he nurses abandoned and injured penguins back to health through the Arctic ASPCA.
Umm, OK.
He took a visit to Notre Dame and Georgetown, but both trips were for track. He reportedly thought about walking on at those schools for track before a Cal Poly assistant sold him on their football program. That's worked out pretty well for the Mustangs. His coach at Cal Poly, Tim Walsh, has told reporters that Jackson is the best cornerback he's ever had in 25 years. The 5-foot-11, 189-pounder is also a terrific punt returner, averaging almost 13 yards per return in 2010.
[h3]10 (tie). Andrew Pierce, RB, Delaware[/h3]
This guy was a revelation for the Blue Hens in 2010. Pierce is a former walk-on who came to the 1-AA powerhouse after a prolific prep career in New Jersey both as a runner and as a javelin thrower. Some college scouts, though, were skeptical if the 5-11, 200-pound back was a bit too stiff. Pierce, who has wowed his coaches with his instincts, certainly didn't look stiff as he ran all over the CAA, slashing his way to 1,655 rushing yards and 14 touchdowns. And don't expect him to slow down in 2011 since the Blue Hens have four starting O-linemen back as well as their tight end.
[h3]10 (tie). Bo Levi Mitchell, QB, Eastern Washington[/h3]
The former SMU QB no longer has standout running back Taiwan Jones in the backfield, but he still has a good offensive line and three very big wideouts, led by 6-foot-5 Brandon Kaufman, to pile up some big offensive numbers. The 6-foot-2 Texan had a strong first season at EWU, throwing for almost 3,500 yards to go with 37 TDs. His team will get tested early with three consecutive road games to start the year, including the opener at the Washington Huskies.
So this week's list is dedicated to the subject: the top 10 non-BCS players (at four-year schools) that college football fans should know about in 2011:
[h3]1. Janoris Jenkins, CB, North Alabama[/h3]
Terry Bowden's latest pickup transferred to the D-2 school after getting dismissed from the Florida Gators in April, following his arrest on misdemeanor marijuana charges. Jenkins' run of off-field problems have been well-documented, but his on-field skills will give the NFL a whole lot to think about. The All-SEC pick in 2010 has been touted by many as a future first-round talent.
[h3]2. Charles Deas, DT, Shaw (N.C.)[/h3]
The former Top-100 recruit from Fort Lauderdale, Fla. -- who some may recall from a few years back for his spectacular lavender ensemble that, quite frankly, merited four-star status on its own -- has resurfaced at CIAA powerhouse Shaw in Raleigh, N.C. The 6-foot-4, 313-pound Deas was dominant at times, earning first-team all-league honors, making 56 tackles and 11.5 TFLs. Shaw DC Robert Massey, the former Saints defensive back from NC Central who knows a thing or two about making the jump to the NFL, expects Deas to get a long look from the pros.
"He has those small ankles, long arms and has that basketball background," says Massey. "He'll do pretty well in the weight room, but he's more country strong, where he's really more powerful than that. He has an engaging personality off the field, and a nastiness and a mean streak on the field, but it's controlled."
In the spring, NFL scouts came to Shaw and clocked Deas around a 5.1-5.2 in the 40, Massey says, adding that the big lineman is now a few pounds lighter than he was back then. "He's raw, but he's a good kid with a lot of untapped talent."
[h3]3. Brad Sorensen, QB, Southern Utah[/h3]
After high school, the California native served a two-year LDS mission in Spain before beginning his college career at BYU. The 6-foot-4, 225-pounder redshirted in 2009, then transferred to San Bernardino Valley College and started to blossom. He completed 60 percent of his passes and had a 17:4 TD-to-INT ratio.
But it's been at Southern Utah where Sorensen has started to turn some heads, as he made big strides over the final six games of the season for the Thunderbirds, connecting on over 76 percent of his passes and recording a 14:3 TD-to-INT mark while throwing for a school-record 3,231 yards for the Great West Conference champs. Southern Utah offensive coordinator Paul Peterson has a pretty interesting perspective on the quarterback after having started ahead of a similarly sized quarterback at Boston College: Matt Ryan.
"They're actually very similar," says Peterson. "Brad's got terrific arm strength and the same quick release and he's probably a little bit better athlete." Peterson said the key for his protege is to continue to get better at taking what the defense gives him.
[h3]4. Brian Quick, WR, Appalachian State[/h3]
A former prep basketball star, Quick has good speed to go with great size at 6-foot-5, 220 pounds. For a guy who plays on a team that doesn't throw the ball around too much, Quick sure does make a ton of plays. He's caught 108 passes over the past two seasons. In 2010, he averaged 18 yards a catch and had nine TD receptions. Not bad for a guy who only played one season of high school football. Quick is a lethal kick blocker as well.
[h3]5. Trumain Johnson, CB, Montana[/h3]
At 6-foot-3, 198 pounds, Johnson has intriguing size for a corner. The former high school QB also has displayed some uncanny playmaking skills as evidenced by his 13 career INTs. In 2010, he had four INTs and took two of those back for touchdowns.
[h3]6. Brandon Williams, DT, Missouri Southern[/h3]
This guy sure looks like he could play in the Big 12, at 6-foot-3, 325 pounds. He had a breakout season in 2010, notching nine sacks and 17 TFLs and winning All-American honors in just his second collegiate season of action. The former high school basketball player also displayed some of the explosiveness that enabled him to finish fifth in the state of Missouri in the discus in 2006.
Williams was a nonqualifier coming out of high school and spent a year at prep school. He could've opted for the junior college route, but instead signed with Missouri Southern, and that program is thrilled that he did. "I've coached a lot of D-2 guys who have had shots at the NFL and played in the NFL, and he's as good as any of them," says Missouri Southern coach Bart Tatum. "He's just so tough and strong. He's a 500-pound bencher and broke every weight room record we have here."
[h3]7. Brent Russell, DT, Georgia Southern[/h3]
Even though he was just a sophomore in 2010, most of the folks who played against the 6-foot-2, 291-pounder are convinced he was the best defensive tackle they played all season. Russell's stats would back that up, as 71 tackles, 18.5 TFLs and eight sacks are a mouthful for any interior D-lineman. "He has tremendous strength and leverage," says one rival coach.
Some of those attributes were honed back in his days as a Georgia state heavyweight wrestling champ, when he posted a 56-1 record. He also led his high school, Madison County, to back-to-back state playoff appearances for the first time in 20 years.
[h3]8. Rishaw Johnson, OG, Cal (Penn.) University[/h3]
As some of you may remember, I covered Johnson's heatbreaking childhood story in Meat Market. He picked the Ole Miss Rebels and had more than his share of off-field issues in Oxford. He flashed some freakish athleticism on occasion -- he once set a team record in the power clean by hoisting 372 pounds -- but Johnson eventually got booted from the team last September for a "violation of team rules." He left Mississippi and opted to resume his playing career for the D-2 Cal Vulcans after considering Abilene Christian.
Credit former Vulcans QB Josh Portis for the recruiting job in convincing Johnson how good their coaches were at dealing with transfers. So far the move is going well for the 6-foot-4, 310-pound Johnson, who reports that he made the Dean's List for the first time in college and he'll graduate in December. He's spending part of the summer back home in Louisiana training with some New Orleans Saints, including former Alabama star Mark Ingram. He's also trying to convince his friend Robby Green, the former Crimson Tide safety, to join him at Cal U.
Johnson is confident he can catch the eyes of some NFL scouts now, too, after a few pro personnel people dropped by the Pennsylvania State Athletic Conference school in the spring. Asked what he tells people who are skeptical after the way things went for him at Ole Miss, he says, "If I had to do it all over again, I would've listened to all of the good people in my life who were trying to help me," says Johnson. "I was young and just didn't listen. Being here, I've realized it's crunch time. Time to grow up and be a man."
[h3]9. Asa Jackson, CB, Cal Poly[/h3]
A four-year starter whose 4.40 40-time at Cal Poly's NFL Junior Day in the spring was the fastest time on the team, Jackson is one of those guys that makes you wonder how the bigger schools missed on him.
He was an outstanding quarterback in high school at Christian Brothers High in Sacramento. He had legit speed, having qualified for the state in the 400-meter and 4x400-meter relay. Grades? He made the honor roll seven times. Background? Both of his parents are doctors and, according to his bio, he nurses abandoned and injured penguins back to health through the Arctic ASPCA.
Umm, OK.
He took a visit to Notre Dame and Georgetown, but both trips were for track. He reportedly thought about walking on at those schools for track before a Cal Poly assistant sold him on their football program. That's worked out pretty well for the Mustangs. His coach at Cal Poly, Tim Walsh, has told reporters that Jackson is the best cornerback he's ever had in 25 years. The 5-foot-11, 189-pounder is also a terrific punt returner, averaging almost 13 yards per return in 2010.
[h3]10 (tie). Andrew Pierce, RB, Delaware[/h3]
This guy was a revelation for the Blue Hens in 2010. Pierce is a former walk-on who came to the 1-AA powerhouse after a prolific prep career in New Jersey both as a runner and as a javelin thrower. Some college scouts, though, were skeptical if the 5-11, 200-pound back was a bit too stiff. Pierce, who has wowed his coaches with his instincts, certainly didn't look stiff as he ran all over the CAA, slashing his way to 1,655 rushing yards and 14 touchdowns. And don't expect him to slow down in 2011 since the Blue Hens have four starting O-linemen back as well as their tight end.
[h3]10 (tie). Bo Levi Mitchell, QB, Eastern Washington[/h3]
The former SMU QB no longer has standout running back Taiwan Jones in the backfield, but he still has a good offensive line and three very big wideouts, led by 6-foot-5 Brandon Kaufman, to pile up some big offensive numbers. The 6-foot-2 Texan had a strong first season at EWU, throwing for almost 3,500 yards to go with 37 TDs. His team will get tested early with three consecutive road games to start the year, including the opener at the Washington Huskies.
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Originally Posted by 10508 Cardo Jr Ln
Originally Posted by Dade B0Y
UF hasn't scheduled an OOC opponent outside of the state of Florida in 20 years.
Is that.. is that mangina I smell?
just like till 2008 it was Georgia 1st time playing west of the mississippi river for a OOC game in over 40 years i think it was?
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Originally Posted by 10508 Cardo Jr Ln
Originally Posted by Dade B0Y
UF hasn't scheduled an OOC opponent outside of the state of Florida in 20 years.
Is that.. is that mangina I smell?
Yep. The manginas won multiple MNCs and SEC championships while dominating all of our rivals in the 00's. I'll take it.
Oh and 18 of 21
Fall back
Damn Yuku
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This is what I was thinking too. Don't know much about his recruitment but I read we were recruiting him as a DB. I'd just tell him he'll get a shot at QB.
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Kinda off topic but I never noticed until the NCAA demo came out how many sick uniform combinations the Noles have.
Gold helmet+white top+black pants=
Can't wait for the game to drop so I can actually use all of Oregon's combos as well.
Gold helmet+white top+black pants=
Can't wait for the game to drop so I can actually use all of Oregon's combos as well.
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Convenient how you left out of your bolded for emphasis text, "She is adding the citations, grammar, formatting." Which, when you look at the statement in its entirety, says that he completed everything on the paper but the grammatical corrections and the formatting of the citations to APA format. I'm also glad to see you jump to the conclusion that the paper is plagiarized. You probably read that off of packpride or whatever VTs rivals/scout board you frequent. The NCAA didn't even make this determination as they said he committed academic fraud because the tutor formatted the works cited page for him and made grammatical corrections to his paper.Originally Posted by 5am6oody72
You're right in that he wasn't found guilty of multiple fraud violations over several semesters by the honor court. Happy? However, I doubt he can say he has much of a case when:Originally Posted by Juicy J 32
You have no idea what you are talking about.Originally Posted by 5am6oody72
aasckwjef McAdoo sonned himself with that lawsuit. I definitely thought he had a case until I saw today that a good bit of his paper is plagiarized; 10 paragraphs straight copy and pasted. The honor court didn't catch that but grimey NC State fans did.
Clearly he either didn't know you couldn't do that or he didn't write the paper, cus he'd be a damn fool to file this lawsuit otherwise
In our NOA letter the NCAA cited MM being out for multiple academic fraud violations over several semesters. UNC honor court found him not guilty on one paper, the student attorney general didn't even review one case because there was no evidence of academic misconduct, and he was found guilty by the honor court and suspended for spring 2011 semester because he e-mailed the tutor his paper for review and she reformatted his works cited page into APA format. Being found guilty once does not equal multiple times. He's got a strong case. I can see the NCAA revisiting their decision based on the new evidence and reinstating him for this season, while "saving face" by blaming their original decision on UNC as they failed to provide the facts/results from his cases with the honor court.
NC State fans and VT fans want our program to get the death penalty and Butch to get the can in the worst way, but that $!*@ isn't going to happen.
A) Just because the honor court didn't find him guilty, doesn't mean he didn't do anything wrong. The NCAA is not a criminal court; they don't have to prove he was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. They are also not obligated to go on the ruling of a student-led honor court. BTW, the difference in one of the cases that the honor court found insufficient evidence for was that the tutor said in her email something like, "Great job Mike! I added your citations and bibliography." The honor court said that because she said "your" instead of "my" that it was reasonable to conclude that he could have done the citations and bibliography, but she just put them all together in one document for him.In the case he was found guilty her language in the email was entirely clear that she had done the work for him. He also admitted to reaching out to this tutor after she graduated and he had been assigned another one because he was used to her providing help with the citations, so it's pretty obvious that it happened more than just once. I honestly don't give a $%$$ if the tutor did all that for him, but if the NCAA reviewed that evidence it is entirely reasonable for them to conclude on their own that she did the work for him in those three instances, despite what the honor court said.
B) If you bother to actually read the paper and look at all the examples that have been cited, he's clearly guilty of plagiarism so he would have to be pretty audacious to claim that the NCAA was negligible in overstating his academic misconduct when it was in reality worse than UNC or the NCAA even alleged. If he hadn't plagiarized the paper I agree with you that he might have had a case(which I said in my first post) because having somebody format a works cited page is pretty minor.
In the original appeal to the NCAA, UNC's legal counsel said "We understand that the AMA suggests this is academic fraud; we are not arguing that. We have two main reasons to litigate. The first one is the nature of the assistance. THIS WORK REFLECTS HIS IDEAS EXCLUSIVELY. IT IS NOT A RIP OFF. THIS REALLY IS HIS WORK."
Except it's not. McAdoo also stated to NCAA officials that he personally wrote the entire paper and found and identified all his sources, and his work with the tutor was an honest effort to properly cite everything and avoid plagiarism. Either he was saying that to save his own $!%, he has no idea what plagiarism is, or he knows what it is but didn't write the paper and didn't know that whoever put it together simply copied and pasted entire paragraphs from books/websites. Either way, do you expect the NCAA to revisit its ruling when everything he told them in the appeal can either be proven to be a lie and/or expose even more severe academic fraud?
It would be like if I got fired from my job because they told me I failed 3 consecutive drug tests and tested positive for marijuana. I come back with the drug tests and say, "I was wrongfully terminated because I only tested positive for marijuana once, I only should have been warned/suspended." Then they look at the results and say, "Yea, but now that we look at these tests again you also tested positive for heroine, so shut up."
If it were up to me I would reinstate McAdoo, because he stands a lot more of a chance at succeeding in life if he's able to play next year and make it to the league somehow. Nobody's ever going to ask him to write a paper on Swahili in the real world. But I can't feel sorry for him or think his lawsuit has merit if he ripped off somebody else in the assignment.
All this academic stuff is whatever; it happens at every university and IMO doesn't make the player a bad person at all; perhaps lazy, dishonest, or too willing to take shortcuts at worst. None of it leads to an advantage in recruiting or on the field so I don't really care, I just found it funny that he would sue the NCAA for damages knowing that his paper, which he plagiarized, would be evidence in court, and had to respond when you so arrogantly told me I had no idea what I was talking about.
I don't want UNC to get the death penalty, but I would like to see Butch get canned. It's just funny to me to see so many people staunchly defend him as if he's innocent in all of this despite a mountain of evidence to the contrary (big shock that he hired this same tutor afterwards, and she was the same one that paid $1700 worth of a player's parking tickets. I'm sure that's just a coincidence though). I don't know if they are just THAT big of a homer fanbase that they can't see it, or they just don't care since Butch is the only one that capable of leading them to those Meineke Car Care Bowl victories
The fact is that the NCAA declared him ineligible for play because of academic fraud over multiple semesters and three assignments in addition to $110 in improper benefits. When basing their decision on his eligibility, all factual disputes must be resolved prior to the committees review of the matter. The honor courts decisions, which found him guilty of committing academic fraud on one paper, not guilty on the other, and a no case on the last were not even taken into consideration by the NCAA. The version of events that the NCAA based their decision off of were inconsistent and not in line with the facts of his case as found by the undergraduate honor court and student attorney general. Herein lies the problem. He was ruled ineligible with unresolved factual disputes.
He bolded sections of his paper and wrote a corresponding number to a list of websites he sent to her to reformat for him. She then added in paper citations and a works cited document for him. There's no arguing that she was not his assigned tutor at the time. Even McAdoo himself explains his reasoning in this by saying her tutoring style, in breaking down and explaining the information to him, helped him learn. "She cared about my success so much that I didn't feel like I had to cut her off just because she wasn't assigned to me and even when she was not on staff. I never even knew exactly why she left so I had no reason not to trust working with her." But what makes this any different from a normal student going to the writing center and asking for assistance or having a friend review a paper and mark corrections for them? I routinely brought my papers to the TA or professors before they were due to improve the quality of my work. For those actions and corrections she made for him, he was found guilty by the honor court and suspended for the Spring 2011 semester and deemed eligible to play football again in Fall 2011 after time served and a failing grade on the paper.
But you are missing the main point of his lawsuit, which isn't about if you believe a paper he wrote was plagiarized. The NCAA already made their decision on his eligibility and nowhere claimed that the body of the paper was copied/plagiarized, just that the citations the tutor wrote and formatted for him were impermissible and worthy of academic fraud. His lawsuit is because he was "improperly and unjustly declared ineligible" last fall and that the "punishment is grossly disproportionate to the facts of McAdoo’s case, and is inconsistent with the NCAA’s own guidelines and the punishments meted out by the NCAA in other cases with similar facts.
november33rd
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Eighth-grader hangs with high school elite
Brian Perroni
Recruiting Analyst
DALLAS - A dozen of the best high school 7-on-7 travel teams competed for the New Level/BadgerSport national championship tournament last weekend at SMU, but there was one particular matchup everyone wanted to see: Southern California squads Team 1925 and Team B2G, and the two dozen Division I prospects between them.
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[/td][/tr][tr][td]Trenton Irwin proved he shouldn't be overlooked.[/td][/tr][/table]But part of that game's starting lineup did not quite look as if he belonged among the future college talent. Lining up alongside these seemingly grown men was a baby-faced, a 155-pound 14-year-old named Trenton Irwin. The opposing team, as well as most observers, paid him little attention.
At least, not heading into the game.
But on the first play of the game, Irwin made a move at the line and ran a deep go route. Team B2G quarterback Marc Evans hit him in stride for a touchdown. The defensive backs weren't quite sure what to make of the kid.
Did he really just score a 40-yard touchdown on the first snap of the contest?
Irwin is used to those looks by now. After all, he is just a kid. However, nobody realizes just how young he is. This past fall, Irwin suited up for the Santa Clarita Indians of the Pacific Youth Football League. He did so because he was not yet in high school.
"It's definitely different being out here and being so much younger than everybody else," said Irwin, who will be a freshman this fall at Newhall (Calif.) Hall. "These are guys who have already committed to play for colleges and I haven't even taken a class in high school yet."
While Irwin's prowess on the field surprises most of his opponents, not all of them overlooked the young kid lined up on the outside.
"I know who he is," Team 1925 cornerback and Rivals100 prospect Ishmael Adams said. "We've played against (B2G) enough times and seen what he can do enough times that we all know who he is. He's good - he's real good. It's not just some kid that they brought along for the show of it. He's one of their best receivers. He's good."
Irwin lined up against cornerbacks such as four-star prospects Tee Shepard, Richard Smith and Darion Monroe, and holds his own.
"He catches 1,500 balls a lot of weekends," his father, Craig Irwin, said. "We take him out to work with..quarterback gurus in L.A. He catches balls from all those quarterbacks that work out with those guys. He gets to work out for free with them. It's a good deal for him.
"He was telling me that, going against (Shepard), he used three moves in the first three plays and then was like, 'I've got nothing left. I don't know what else to do to get open.' He still has to work on things like that but, I can tell you one thing, he's not going to drop any balls. We've got that part down."
[table][tr][td]
[/td][td]
[/td][/tr][tr][td]
[/td][/tr][tr][td]Trenton Irwin catches 1,500 passes on many weekends.[/td][/tr][/table]With most other players in the tournament trying to decide which college to attend, Irwin has also recently been faced with a decision about his future school: What high school to attend.
"We've been looking at a bunch of different (high) schools," Craig Irwin said. "We really have been looking at all the options. He was looking at going to St. Bonaventure to play with Marc (Evans). We also looked at Oaks Christian and some others as well.
"He decided he wanted to play at Hart (in Newhall, Calif.) though. We really did it to play with the same quarterback. He has a really good QB on his youth team that is going to be one of the better players in California and he had already decided to go to Hart. ? Trenton is actually going to be the first freshman to start on varsity there."
His B2G team did not win the tournament, as Irwin was forced to watch rival Team 1925 take the crown. However, he sees playing against elite competition that is at least three years older as a great experience.
"How many other guys my age can say they have played with and against players like this?" he asked. "I've read about these guys for years and I'm playing on the same team with a lot of them. A guy like Tee Shepard, he's going to Notre Dameand I'm lining up against him. I'm basically just an eighth-grader still."
Though Irwin's skills on the field belie his age, he still shows flashes of being a kid. Asked about his height and weight, he is embarrassed to admit that he is actually a bit lighter than the advertised 160 pounds. He sees many big and strong opponents, and realizes he is not there yet.
"It's actually around 150 or 155," he admitted. "I'm skinny, I know. I need to put on some weight."
Last January, Irwin was named the offensive MVP of the Eastbay Youth All-American Bowl in conjunction with the U.S. Army All-American Bowl in San Antonio. He wants to follow in the footsteps of fellow tournament participants Shepard, Shaq Thompson and Deontay Greenberry.
"That would be awesome, to play in the Army game like those guys," Irwin said. "I've gotten to see it in person and there are all kinds of big-name guys there. I would love to be one of those guys someday."
Of course for Irwin, he'll have to wait until January 2015 for that "someday" to become reality.
Brian Perroni
Recruiting Analyst
DALLAS - A dozen of the best high school 7-on-7 travel teams competed for the New Level/BadgerSport national championship tournament last weekend at SMU, but there was one particular matchup everyone wanted to see: Southern California squads Team 1925 and Team B2G, and the two dozen Division I prospects between them.
[table][tr][td]
At least, not heading into the game.
But on the first play of the game, Irwin made a move at the line and ran a deep go route. Team B2G quarterback Marc Evans hit him in stride for a touchdown. The defensive backs weren't quite sure what to make of the kid.
Did he really just score a 40-yard touchdown on the first snap of the contest?
Irwin is used to those looks by now. After all, he is just a kid. However, nobody realizes just how young he is. This past fall, Irwin suited up for the Santa Clarita Indians of the Pacific Youth Football League. He did so because he was not yet in high school.
"It's definitely different being out here and being so much younger than everybody else," said Irwin, who will be a freshman this fall at Newhall (Calif.) Hall. "These are guys who have already committed to play for colleges and I haven't even taken a class in high school yet."
While Irwin's prowess on the field surprises most of his opponents, not all of them overlooked the young kid lined up on the outside.
"I know who he is," Team 1925 cornerback and Rivals100 prospect Ishmael Adams said. "We've played against (B2G) enough times and seen what he can do enough times that we all know who he is. He's good - he's real good. It's not just some kid that they brought along for the show of it. He's one of their best receivers. He's good."
Irwin lined up against cornerbacks such as four-star prospects Tee Shepard, Richard Smith and Darion Monroe, and holds his own.
"He catches 1,500 balls a lot of weekends," his father, Craig Irwin, said. "We take him out to work with..quarterback gurus in L.A. He catches balls from all those quarterbacks that work out with those guys. He gets to work out for free with them. It's a good deal for him.
"He was telling me that, going against (Shepard), he used three moves in the first three plays and then was like, 'I've got nothing left. I don't know what else to do to get open.' He still has to work on things like that but, I can tell you one thing, he's not going to drop any balls. We've got that part down."
[table][tr][td]
"We've been looking at a bunch of different (high) schools," Craig Irwin said. "We really have been looking at all the options. He was looking at going to St. Bonaventure to play with Marc (Evans). We also looked at Oaks Christian and some others as well.
"He decided he wanted to play at Hart (in Newhall, Calif.) though. We really did it to play with the same quarterback. He has a really good QB on his youth team that is going to be one of the better players in California and he had already decided to go to Hart. ? Trenton is actually going to be the first freshman to start on varsity there."
His B2G team did not win the tournament, as Irwin was forced to watch rival Team 1925 take the crown. However, he sees playing against elite competition that is at least three years older as a great experience.
"How many other guys my age can say they have played with and against players like this?" he asked. "I've read about these guys for years and I'm playing on the same team with a lot of them. A guy like Tee Shepard, he's going to Notre Dameand I'm lining up against him. I'm basically just an eighth-grader still."
Though Irwin's skills on the field belie his age, he still shows flashes of being a kid. Asked about his height and weight, he is embarrassed to admit that he is actually a bit lighter than the advertised 160 pounds. He sees many big and strong opponents, and realizes he is not there yet.
"It's actually around 150 or 155," he admitted. "I'm skinny, I know. I need to put on some weight."
Last January, Irwin was named the offensive MVP of the Eastbay Youth All-American Bowl in conjunction with the U.S. Army All-American Bowl in San Antonio. He wants to follow in the footsteps of fellow tournament participants Shepard, Shaq Thompson and Deontay Greenberry.
"That would be awesome, to play in the Army game like those guys," Irwin said. "I've gotten to see it in person and there are all kinds of big-name guys there. I would love to be one of those guys someday."
Of course for Irwin, he'll have to wait until January 2015 for that "someday" to become reality.
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Originally Posted by November33rd
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Originally Posted by AirMaxBuckeye
Eighth-grader hangs with high school elite
Brian Perroni
Recruiting Analyst
DALLAS - A dozen of the best high school 7-on-7 travel teams competed for the New Level/BadgerSport national championship tournament last weekend at SMU, but there was one particular matchup everyone wanted to see: Southern California squads Team 1925 and Team B2G, and the two dozen Division I prospects between them.
[table][tr][td][/td][td][/td][/tr][tr][td][/td][/tr][tr][td]Trenton Irwin proved he shouldn't be overlooked.[/td][/tr][/table]But part of that game's starting lineup did not quite look as if he belonged among the future college talent. Lining up alongside these seemingly grown men was a baby-faced, a 155-pound 14-year-old named Trenton Irwin. The opposing team, as well as most observers, paid him little attention.
At least, not heading into the game.
But on the first play of the game, Irwin made a move at the line and ran a deep go route. Team B2G quarterback Marc Evans hit him in stride for a touchdown. The defensive backs weren't quite sure what to make of the kid.
Did he really just score a 40-yard touchdown on the first snap of the contest?
Irwin is used to those looks by now. After all, he is just a kid. However, nobody realizes just how young he is. This past fall, Irwin suited up for the Santa Clarita Indians of the Pacific Youth Football League. He did so because he was not yet in high school.
"It's definitely different being out here and being so much younger than everybody else," said Irwin, who will be a freshman this fall at Newhall (Calif.) Hall. "These are guys who have already committed to play for colleges and I haven't even taken a class in high school yet."
While Irwin's prowess on the field surprises most of his opponents, not all of them overlooked the young kid lined up on the outside.
"I know who he is," Team 1925 cornerback and Rivals100 prospect Ishmael Adams said. "We've played against (B2G) enough times and seen what he can do enough times that we all know who he is. He's good - he's real good. It's not just some kid that they brought along for the show of it. He's one of their best receivers. He's good."
Irwin lined up against cornerbacks such as four-star prospects Tee Shepard, Richard Smith and Darion Monroe, and holds his own.
"He catches 1,500 balls a lot of weekends," his father, Craig Irwin, said. "We take him out to work with..quarterback gurus in L.A. He catches balls from all those quarterbacks that work out with those guys. He gets to work out for free with them. It's a good deal for him.
"He was telling me that, going against (Shepard), he used three moves in the first three plays and then was like, 'I've got nothing left. I don't know what else to do to get open.' He still has to work on things like that but, I can tell you one thing, he's not going to drop any balls. We've got that part down."
[table][tr][td][/td][td][/td][/tr][tr][td][/td][/tr][tr][td]Trenton Irwin catches 1,500 passes on many weekends.[/td][/tr][/table]With most other players in the tournament trying to decide which college to attend, Irwin has also recently been faced with a decision about his future school: What high school to attend.
"We've been looking at a bunch of different (high) schools," Craig Irwin said. "We really have been looking at all the options. He was looking at going to St. Bonaventure to play with Marc (Evans). We also looked at Oaks Christian and some others as well.
"He decided he wanted to play at Hart (in Newhall, Calif.) though. We really did it to play with the same quarterback. He has a really good QB on his youth team that is going to be one of the better players in California and he had already decided to go to Hart. ? Trenton is actually going to be the first freshman to start on varsity there."
His B2G team did not win the tournament, as Irwin was forced to watch rival Team 1925 take the crown. However, he sees playing against elite competition that is at least three years older as a great experience.
"How many other guys my age can say they have played with and against players like this?" he asked. "I've read about these guys for years and I'm playing on the same team with a lot of them. A guy like Tee Shepard, he's going to Notre Dameand I'm lining up against him. I'm basically just an eighth-grader still."
Though Irwin's skills on the field belie his age, he still shows flashes of being a kid. Asked about his height and weight, he is embarrassed to admit that he is actually a bit lighter than the advertised 160 pounds. He sees many big and strong opponents, and realizes he is not there yet.
"It's actually around 150 or 155," he admitted. "I'm skinny, I know. I need to put on some weight."
Last January, Irwin was named the offensive MVP of the Eastbay Youth All-American Bowl in conjunction with the U.S. Army All-American Bowl in San Antonio. He wants to follow in the footsteps of fellow tournament participants Shepard, Shaq Thompson and Deontay Greenberry.
"That would be awesome, to play in the Army game like those guys," Irwin said. "I've gotten to see it in person and there are all kinds of big-name guys there. I would love to be one of those guys someday."
Of course for Irwin, he'll have to wait until January 2015 for that "someday" to become reality.
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- Sep 24, 2002
I typed out another unnecessarily long response, but I'll just put that in the spoiler. This is probably all that needs to be seen:
http://www.sportsbybrooks.com/unc-ad-defends-players-stolen-work-to-ncaa-29775
Spoiler [+]
LOL @ "Jumped to the conclusion" that it was plagiarized and "reading your message boards ignoring the facts." I have the 189 page pdf of the review the NCAA did, including the interviews during his appeal and the UNC honor court documents, as well as the paper in question. I actually went and read for myself what was being alleged before I posted in here. I don't just blindly read biased messageboards and assume it's all true with my head in the sand like you seem to be doing.
Like I said, if you bothered to read the paper it's clearly plagiarized. It's funny that you didn't do that and still came in here accusing me of jumping to conclusions. How are you gonna call me out for assuming that it's plagiarized (when I actually read it and saw it was) when in fact you're jumping to the conclusion that it's not (when you didn't even read it)?
The main point of the lawsuit (which I understood perfectly fine) should not hold up in court because the NCAA can find him guilty of academic fraud without the honor court finding him guilty of academic fraud. They could have already reviewed every piece of evidence in the case for themselves sans the honor court preceedings. If the NCAA was beholden only to the UNC honor court rulings, it would be entirely too easy for athletes to get away with anything they wanted. You think a student led honor court is going to be unbiased and leave no stone unturned when a Heisman candidate's eligibility is on the line?
I agree with you that having the tutor review his paper and fix formatting and citation errors is not a big deal, and even though that constituted academic fraud by the rules and they admitted to that, I think that's a dumb rule. It is also true that the NCAA was not as responsive as they should have been when UNC tried to inform them of the honor court's findings. But that doesn't change the fact that the NCAA can ignore those findings and say that the honor court was negligent in their rulings.
And as I said previously, if McAdoo brings this against the NCAA, they can now point to the paper and the statements he made to them and say that he was lying when he claimed the paper was his own work and he was making an honest effort not to plagiarize. Even if the NCAA had to admit they screwed up, that wouldn't do McAdoo any good because they'd still punish him for lying during questioning and for plagiarizing the paper, which would be worse than what he originally was accused of.
Like I said, if you bothered to read the paper it's clearly plagiarized. It's funny that you didn't do that and still came in here accusing me of jumping to conclusions. How are you gonna call me out for assuming that it's plagiarized (when I actually read it and saw it was) when in fact you're jumping to the conclusion that it's not (when you didn't even read it)?
The main point of the lawsuit (which I understood perfectly fine) should not hold up in court because the NCAA can find him guilty of academic fraud without the honor court finding him guilty of academic fraud. They could have already reviewed every piece of evidence in the case for themselves sans the honor court preceedings. If the NCAA was beholden only to the UNC honor court rulings, it would be entirely too easy for athletes to get away with anything they wanted. You think a student led honor court is going to be unbiased and leave no stone unturned when a Heisman candidate's eligibility is on the line?
I agree with you that having the tutor review his paper and fix formatting and citation errors is not a big deal, and even though that constituted academic fraud by the rules and they admitted to that, I think that's a dumb rule. It is also true that the NCAA was not as responsive as they should have been when UNC tried to inform them of the honor court's findings. But that doesn't change the fact that the NCAA can ignore those findings and say that the honor court was negligent in their rulings.
And as I said previously, if McAdoo brings this against the NCAA, they can now point to the paper and the statements he made to them and say that he was lying when he claimed the paper was his own work and he was making an honest effort not to plagiarize. Even if the NCAA had to admit they screwed up, that wouldn't do McAdoo any good because they'd still punish him for lying during questioning and for plagiarizing the paper, which would be worse than what he originally was accused of.
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We've officially hit rock bottom. Lock this thread up and start a new one, Gunna. I'm disgusted. 189 pages?! 189!!??
