how do rappers afford chains Vol. taxes

[PRIME]

They say gold worth 1600 an ounce
So with no diamonds, my bracelet worth a townhouse

Son.. Thats a hook... Make a song. Real life.

I always found it interesting how rap fans are so immersed in the business of music themselves compared to other genres. 

No idea why, but it seems like rap fans get caught up in so much stuff outside of music, that nobody stands back and says "A lot of this music sucks, maybe we should put more effort into the music"

A lot of rap fans care more about the culture than the music. And the music is what unifies the culture. But when you have so many dudes worried more about beef, chains, and public image/perception rather than the music itself, we get the **** of a genre called hip hop that is floating around now.

There are so many blogs, youtube channels, etc on things that have nothing to do with the music, but rather the culture. That the music is being overshadowed by a bunch of BS. So a lot of BS artists are coming out slipping through the cracks because nobody cares most about the music anymore.

sad.

 

[xxpizzo]

Don't be mad at me because you made a baseless claim homes

I can pinpoint reputable jewelers that make jewelry for rappers, it's as simple as a google search

"The majority of these cats chains are fake'

"How do you know that?"

"I don't I know I just have a feeling"

You can easily navigate and find the jewelry thread and get some insight yourself fam

im far from mad first off and secondly i made a claim just like you did fam except you used google as a search engine when i clearly asked you if YOU knew in person whose chain is real or not ? and you couldnt give me one answer besides jewelry thread/google. So therefor you yourself dont exactly know whose chain is real or not your just reading off of the internet

 

[cj863]

"the majority of mainstream artists I know I can easily tell you which reputable jeweler made their piece and how much it hit for"

Is exactly what I said... and is exactly what I can prove. Not going to go back & forth, and as I said previously wanna know more about how makes the jewels and what's possibly bang bang or not? Hit the jewelry thread or a google search. Lots of info there

Carry on with your childplay.

 

[kermitthefloer]

I think back in the days some chains were fake, but now I more think they are all real. It is just that as others had said quality is a major factor in everything. And yes you can get some great deals on jewelry.

I do believe most artists, especially lower rate ones rent there jewelry, and also those that love to change up there chain plenty.

 

[pharelfor3]

I lik the tax ramifications more as a thread. surprised so much money goes untaxed/

 

[ricky409]

I lik the tax ramifications more as a thread. surprised so much money goes untaxed/

thread rerailment request seconded...

i care more about taxes than how these cats afford hollowed out, fake chains...

 

[41239]

show money...


its UN taxed, so its easy to spend it on crazie stuff that cant be tracked... Jewels, clothes blah...

like drake said... Throw the checks in the bank and spend the cash in gucci...

its untaxed but they have to pay taxes for that money, the entertainment business is a slippery slope because when you get checks, the government doesnt take their money out like they would if you worked at footlocker, i was a model for a little bit, we had to wait like 60 days to even see the check, but when we got paid taxes werent taken out, BUT YOU DO HAVE TO PAY TAXES ON THAT MONEY, which is why you get actors/artists/athletes fleeing the country, because they werent linkin up with an accountant and paying taxes on their money, they would just spend it

 

[budlongtaco]

its untaxed but they have to pay taxes for that money, the entertainment business is a slippery slope because when you get checks, the government doesnt take their money out like they would if you worked at footlocker, i was a model for a little bit, we had to wait like 60 days to even see the check, but when we got paid taxes werent taken out, BUT YOU DO HAVE TO PAY TAXES ON THAT MONEY, which is why you get actors/artists/athletes fleeing the country, because they werent linkin up with an accountant and paying taxes on their money, they would just spend it

Promoters/Club owners keep records too. Most these fly by night rappers who start getting money are plain dumb. IRS is going to get their money one way or another. They'll let you acquire all the chains and cars you want then hit you with that seizure notice and take it all.

Tax man wont go away. Lil Wayne is a current example. He hasn't paid his taxes on show money, etc. and I read somewhere that they will begin garnishing all his earnings if he doesn't make payments soon.

 

[apthekid]

thread rerailment request seconded...
i care more about taxes than how these cats afford hollowed out, fake chains...

Well...let's get it poppin...

 

[apthekid]

Son.. Thats a hook... Make a song. Real life.
No idea why, but it seems like rap fans get caught up in so much stuff outside of music, that nobody stands back and says "A lot of this music sucks, maybe we should put more effort into the music"
A lot of rap fans care more about the culture than the music. And the music is what unifies the culture. But when you have so many dudes worried more about beef, chains, and public image/perception rather than the music itself, we get the **** of a genre called hip hop that is floating around now.
There are so many blogs, youtube channels, etc on things that have nothing to do with the music, but rather the culture. That the music is being overshadowed by a bunch of BS. So a lot of BS artists are coming out slipping through the cracks because nobody cares most about the music anymore.
sad.

hol up...

One of the things that differentiates Hip Hop from other music forms is the fact that hip hop IS a culture...A culture that includes emceeing, djing, b-boying, and graffiti. I'm not sure how you can separate the two...To care about the culture IS to care about the music.

The "culture" that I think you are referring to is actually the "image" that "rap stars" portray. And if that is your argument, I completely agree. But that image...the beef, chains, etc...aren't exclusive to rappers. It's the same image that athletes portray...the same image that many young entertainers portray. There's a HUGE socio-economic argument that we can get into about this, but that's for another thread.

Also...I used to be one of those guys that bashed today's hip hop...truthfully, I pretty much still am. BUT, there are good rappers out there! It's definitely not what's on the radio, and you have to be proactive a lot of the time, but they're out there.

With all that said, my biggest point is that I think you are misusing the word "culture" here...

 

[apthekid]

what's stopping the IRS from taxing one of you if you have 10 pairs of South Beach's or Yeezy's you bought for around $200 and re-sold for $1000? well, the absence of being made aware of those transactions would certainly stop them. unless you tell the irs that you've earned income, how would they ever know to begin to tax it?

someone selling sneakers on niketalk is MUCH different than someone selling sneakers on a big cartel site. you're asking the difference btwn private salesmanship and a licensed merchandise vendor and the owner of flight club, but i'm pretty sure you already know the difference. yes, all of it can be taxed, but most likely private sales would go unnoticed to the irs unless reported. a licensed merchandise vendor most likely has an llc and c-corporation. the owner of flight club definitely has a c-corporation but may receive income through incentives, benefits, stock options, etc. taxed through an s-corporation rather than receive it as earned income through his c-corporation filings (lower rates).

it goes w/o saying, the richer you are, the easier it is to receive tax deductions and exemptions for your income.

Sorry for the triple post fellas...

If you make under $2,000 (i'm pretty sure that's the number), it's considered a hobby and isn't taxed. If you make more than that, you are suppose to report is as income. Most people wouldn't. And most of those people would never run into any problems. That doesn't mean it's legal...If you have an ebay account, and have sold a lot, you will receive a tax form.

 

[champcruthik]

I believe in enjoying life fully, but how many entertainers are broke by the end of their careers?

 

[freakydestroyer]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned before. But I read somewhere that rappers can write off chains as tax write offs if it is used as a form of advertisement i.e. their record label logo.

 

[gangsta grillz]

the same way they can afford mansions and lambos.

 

[mt3130]

its simple. the rappers are self-employed. the promoter/club owner/whoever sends the rapper (and the IRS) a 1099 for nonemployee compensation. the payer (the promoter in this case) is not responsible for withholding taxes because the person they are paying is not an employee.

the rapper gets the full amount agreed to for performing and is fully responsible for withholding income taxes. because he/she is self-employed, they are responsible for both employer and employee income taxes and can take a deduction for half of the amount paid to the IRS.

basically rappers get in trouble when they report less income than what is reported by the people that pay them to the IRS. once you open the box to an audit on a situation like that you're toast. then they will start looking into previous years and add penalties and interest. next thing you know, you owe the government everything you own.

 

[dauldierce]

fake? ur crazy. u must not have seen any rapper in person. you'll know when a chain is real. These rappers don't get jumped/robbed for no reason for there chains. Its real.

 

[gangsta grillz]

lol at people thinking the irs can trace cash transactions

fake? ur crazy. u must not have seen any rapper in person. you'll know when a chain is real. These rappers don't get jumped/robbed for no reason for there chains. Its real.

realtalk. i went to see mobb and prodigy chains was sooooooooo glimery dawg

 

[cj863]

Most of Prodigy's new stuff came from Avianne's, they do a lot of garbage pieces. It's really not that hard to see why these dudes get hit with tax evasion frequently, Uncle Sam wants a piece of all the pie.

 

[41239]

its untaxed but they have to pay taxes for that money, the entertainment business is a slippery slope because when you get checks, the government doesnt take their money out like they would if you worked at footlocker, i was a model for a little bit, we had to wait like 60 days to even see the check, but when we got paid taxes werent taken out, BUT YOU DO HAVE TO PAY TAXES ON THAT MONEY, which is why you get actors/artists/athletes fleeing the country, because they werent linkin up with an accountant and paying taxes on their money, they would just spend it

Promoters/Club owners keep records too. Most these fly by night rappers who start getting money are plain dumb. IRS is going to get their money one way or another. They'll let you acquire all the chains and cars you want then hit you with that seizure notice and take it all.

Tax man wont go away. Lil Wayne is a current example. He hasn't paid his taxes on show money, etc. and I read somewhere that they will begin garnishing all his earnings if he doesn't make payments soon.

i figured club owners, but do promoters really make a living off of promoting?, i know thats mad ignorant but i thought most were like managers in the entertainment industry and promoting was like a perky side-hustle, go figure

had no idea about lil wayne, but that guy is stupid if thats the truth, good thing young money is doing so well right now

but theres a bunch of stuff/rumors circling ymcm, i read somewhere that baby had that landaulet maybach repoed because he never made one payment on it, but dude be stuntin like he pay for everything cash, idk man, i think i would just get a place in LA/Miami and stunt like i had it but barely buy new stuff

 

[ricky409]

i figured club owners, but do promoters really make a living off of promoting?, i know thats mad ignorant but i thought most were like managers in the entertainment industry and promoting was like a perky side-hustle, go figure
had no idea about lil wayne, but that guy is stupid if thats the truth, good thing young money is doing so well right now
but theres a bunch of stuff/rumors circling ymcm, i read somewhere that baby had that landaulet maybach repoed because he never made one payment on it, but dude be stuntin like he pay for everything cash, idk man, i think i would just get a place in LA/Miami and stunt like i had it but barely buy new stuff

I know PLENTY of folks that are waiting for the day ymcmb Dallas due to not managing their money, cuz people get salty when they see the way they spend money.

I hope its not true. Not a fan, but you hate to see brothers getting got like that...

I wish my people worried more about making money than flossing it

 

[villansfinest]

somebody made a good point earlier about whether or not the irs would "waste" a revenue agent's time in pursuing an audit of an entertainer. yes, most of the audits do get run through cost benefit criteria before it actually happens.

but...

all it takes is one link in the "chain" to be reporting, and the rest is capable of being mapped out by computers with formulas that predict the probability of things like income and deductions.

here's an example.


(government requirement to report... things like insurance, permits, property taxes, licenses, fees, utility billing, holding accounts, etc.)
V
V
V
V
building owner
V
V
V
venue administration
V
V
promoter
V
rapper/performer

so here's an example, somebody like carl carlson owns a building somewhere. carl carlson is required to have insurance on that property if it is designated to be used as a live performance venue (let alone, it has to be zoned as such). there will be utilities to provide the services needed to pull off the show. (not like you can steal electricity, right? ... bonus points for prior thread reference!) and there will be plenty of other employees or contractors that put on the show. my point at this level is that it generally takes a large bank roll to get all of this started, and when you have a lot to start off with, you have a lot to LOSE! so the people at the top generally play by the book. meaning everything they do is usually reported on some form somewhere that an auditor can get access to in order to make sure the rest of the numbers work out... DOWN the chain. see, they start at the top, but because the folks at the top are usually so compliant, it gets them a lot of leads down stream for not a whole lot of cost.

so the carl carlson has all sorts of people dealing with these day to day details of the actual venue because your favorite rapper might play there once a year, but they are trying to make money 365 days a year, so there's usually other folks trying to set everything else up for next week/month etc. these people generally don't see any sort of 'cut' of cash transactions, so they usually have nothing to hide on their forms, so they usually end up filing and reporting their info also. just another way to confirm some more info that you would get by looking into carl carlson's activities.

if there's an arrangement between carl carlson's venue management team and a promoter, that could be a bit tricky, but the carl carlson's generally don't risk everything else they're doing just to hide $20K for doing a show for one night, so it's usually reported all the way down to the promoter level. and promoters do their thing! they promote! meaning, let's pretend that your favorite rapper is doing one of these shows... well they need people to pay to go to it, right? that generally involves advertising and generally involves the internet. so there's another source for tracking down the 'talent' at the bottom of the chain.

so let's pretend your favorite rapper did the show, skated with $20K, and did not voluntarily disclose their income by filing a tax return form. (or severely under reported it) if you get any link in the chain above to report their part of the arrangement, you are able to find the links above and below through fiscal forensics. as the payout for the performer increases, the likelihood of any of those previous links in the chain already being reporting their part increases. do this once, and you decrease the likelihood of anything being reported, but do this 20x a year, and you are now 20x as likely to have your activities reported in that chain.

the more money you make the more you have to lose. wesley snipes thought he could play this game too, and he ended up being caught for undereporting.

you're right, cost benefit usually shows that it's not profitable to go after the little fish... but if you only do one show for 10k, you're probably not going to blow the whole 10k on some jewelry.


how does it make you feel that performers that earn their income this way and do not report their income to pay taxes on it are not helping to contribute to things that national and state budgets go to support? infrastructure, social programs, etc?


underground economy is going to become an increasingly more important issue in the coming years. the tax gap on unreported/underground income has been steadily increasing, and taxing authorities are paying more and more attention to it.

where is tax thread? too big of a topic? not enough interest in general tax discussion, but scattered interest in how taxes relate to other issues as they come up. that's my guess.

 

[sawyer]

how does it make you feel that performers that earn their income this way and do not report their income to pay taxes on it are not helping to contribute to things that national and state budgets go to support? infrastructure, social programs, etc?

i couldn't care less whether entertainers report their full income.

also, there are more ways to collect taxes than just through the federal income tax.

 

[gangsta grillz]

and a lot of these dudes are selling dope. why wouldnt they be?

from the hood + having large sums of money + gettin it for the low = more money that the feds cant trace

 

[futuremd]

I don't want to be "that guy" but I always found it so crazy that hip-hop fans will DEBATE each other on a celebrities finances.

I don't even think you see this sort of thing on Wall Street Oasis. 

I agree with the other guy that maybe a tax or general finance thread might be necessary.