QB THREAD - 2x quarterbacky award winner: Lamar Jackson

[rolaholic]

Here we go

 

[CP1708]

Luck has 1900 attempts in 50 games
Russ has 1323

Luck has 20 more INT's in almost 600 more passes.

That equates to basically a full season worth of more passes, in the exact same number of games, same era.

 

[Chester McFloppy]

 

[CP1708]

It isn't about Luck, or Russ, it's any QB, attempts vs INT's.

To add to Luck/Russ at 50, Tannehill has same 50 games, he's at 1740 passes, with 42 INT's.

 

[air spider 777]

C CP1708

 

[Chester McFloppy]

 

[CP1708]

I get why MF is trying to break down possession/turnovers, but again, layers.

If you throw pick on first drive, and don't allow a score, or throw pick on final drive, needing a score, they are not the same, right?

Russ throws 4, but D holds and they win.
Luck throws 2, D folds, they get blown out.
Tanne had 2 in first half vs GB last year. Then had 3 80+ yard drives in 2nd half, took the lead, but D couldn't hold on final drive.

It's not cut and dry 1 = 1 with turnovers, its when.

Romo had like 500+ and 4-5 TD's vs Denver, then throws INT last possession. Had he thrown that on first possession, whole situation changes on his overall game.

 

[mister friendly]

Yeah @Jay02 a turnover is a turnover.

They are possessions and a chance to score points and win the game.

We dont say "hey this running back has more carries so excuse his fumbles"

NFL teams only average 12 possessions a game, you cant give the other team between 1-2 more possessions a game when most NFL games are decided by less than a touchdown.

ehh yes and no. not when all possessions aren't equal. to CPs point, those guys can handoff more on drives cutting down attempts, but luck has more opportunity to throw picks because they have to throw more in general

Yes only get 12 possessions a game, they are pretty important.

He doesn't have awesome running back but that doesn't excuse turnovers.Andrew Luck isnt the first quarterback without an awesome running game and he wont be the last.

Instead of forcing it all the time, take a sack or throw it away and punt, turn the field over and make the opposing offense go 75-80 yards instead of 40-50 yards off a change of possession.



Turnovers the worst thing are basically the worse thing an offensive player can do in terms of playing winning Football.

 

[Chester McFloppy]

View media item 1723880

 

[CP1708]

Good thing Luck turns it over less than all those other QB's. Right?

 

[Chester McFloppy]

Turnovers the worst thing are basically the worse thing an offensive player can do in terms of playing winning Football.

Touchdowns are basically the best thing a player can do in football and Andrew Luck has more than anyone since the start of last season.

 

[CP1708]

Montana, Young, Elway, Favre, Kelly, Marino, Ben, Eli, Aikman

All turn it over more than Luck.

"Winning football"

 

[nooera]

If the team around Luck is so bad I'm wondering why people had him as their MVP and Indy making the Super Bowl. He can't do it all by himself.

 

[Chester McFloppy]

If the team around Luck is so bad I'm wondering why people had him as their MVP and Indy making the Super Bowl. He can't do it all by himself.

No idea why anyone chose the Colts to win the Super Bowl but plenty of people have won MVP by putting up gaudy stats.

 

[skurrtskurrt29]

Except when you are in the NFCCG and you can throw 4 INT's and have a fumble on a kickoff, and still win.........by less than a TD.

On fewer throws than Luck usually throws in a game.
And with a better RB.
Against the league MVP.

But hey.

In other words, woe is Andrew Luck.

This man's own head ******* coach said enough is enough. But yet here we are, continuing to make excuses for a 4th year quarterback who still continues to make mistakes.

Nobody said he's not great. We all can pretty much agree on that fact.

We all can also agree on the fact that the talent around him isn't the greatest.

All people are saying is that if he has a ****** team, he's not helping by fumbling the ball and throwing picks at a once per game rate. Which is problematic for a quarterback.

Point to all the advanced stats you want, speaking about the Steelers, there hasn't been a point in Ben's career where I'm like "wow, this guy turns the ball over too much." So you can miss me with that "those guys turn the ball over too!" *******t.

 

[fraij da 5 11]

I can't  name more than 2 players on that Colts Defense... Seriously. 

 

[rolaholic]

If the team around Luck is so bad I'm wondering why people had him as their MVP and Indy making the Super Bowl. He can't do it all by himself.

People swore that Gore and Johnson would put them over the top during the preseason . No matter the non existent D

 

[Chester McFloppy]

This man's own head ******* coach said enough is enough.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...comments-were-praise-andrew-luck-team-improve

About that.

Point to all the advanced stats you want, speaking about the Steelers, there hasn't been a point in Ben's career where I'm like "wow, this guy turns the ball over too much." So you can miss me with that "those guys turn the ball over too!" *******t.

Even the year he led the league in interceptions with 23?

Good to see you're unbiased.

 

[skurrtskurrt29]

So I'm just supposed to forget that he said it at all?

Ok

You mean the year after his almost fatal motorcycle crash six weeks before training camp? Or are excuses only reserved for Andrew Luck?

 

[nooera]

People swore that Gore and Johnson would put them over the top during the preseason . No matter the non existent D

LOL

 

[rolaholic]

Yea I'm not buying that back pedal . Especially since his *** is on the hot seat these next few weeks

 

[CP1708]

Coach said it after a 4 TO game, in other words, a one game reaction. Hot take if you will.

Pagano doesn't say anything when Luck goes for 400+ with 4 TD's and one INT, but he has to say it when there are multiple TO's. And Luck took it on himself as well.

Doesn't change the FACT that he turns it over less than all those elite QB's.

 

[mister friendly]

Why is Russell Wilson in this discussion?

Is Russell Wilson=Andrew Luck, I don't believe I've said that?

Russell Wilson has GREAT defense...Andrew Luck does NOT.

Instead of wishing Andrew Luck had a defense like Russ, how about not turning the ball over as much and giving your average defense a larger margin for error?

No those guys have a higher chance of throwing an interception when they threw the ball than Andrew Luck does( for a variety of reasons) but I'd be willing to guess that they didn't turn the ball over more than Andrew Luck does.

Just roughing looking over the numbers....Andrew Luck has thrown 48 interceptions in 50 games which is about .96 interceptions a game....Steve Young threw 107 interceptions in 169 games which is about .63 interceptions a game

Which over a season that is about 10 interceptions vs 15 interceptions, that may not sound like much but in today's NFL could be the difference between a 1 seed and 4 seed.

We aren't talking about fantasy stats, we talking about winning NFL championships and turning the ball over a lot isn't constructive towards that goal.

 

[dland24]

Yeah @Jay02 a turnover is a turnover.

They are possessions and a chance to score points and win the game.

I wholeheartedly disagree with this.  All turnovers are not created equal.  Are you going to sit there and tell me that all 3 of these QB turnovers are the same:

1) Team is driving down the field and the QB throws a pass from the 15 yard line that is intercepted in the endzone.

2) Team is deep in their own territory and the QB holds the ball too long and fumbles on his own 10 yard line.

3) Team is on their own 20 yard line and on 3rd down and long the QB throws the ball 50 yards in the air and the cornerback intercepts the ball and is tackled on the 30 yard line.

You are really going to sit there and tell me with a straight face that all 3 of these turnovers are equal?

 

[dmxfury]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...comments-were-praise-andrew-luck-team-improve

About that.
Even the year he led the league in interceptions with 23?

Good to see you're unbiased.

Yeah 2006 he definitely had too many turnovers, fumbles and INTs

I wholeheartedly disagree with this.  All turnovers are not created equal.  Are you going to sit there and tell me that all 3 of these QB turnovers are the same:

1) Team is driving down the field and the QB throws a pass from the 15 yard line that is intercepted in the endzone.
2) Team is deep in their own territory and the QB holds the ball too long and fumbles on his own 10 yard line.
3) Team is on their own 20 yard line and on 3rd down and long the QB throws the ball 50 yards in the air and the cornerback intercepts the ball and is tackled on the 30 yard line.

You are really going to sit there and tell me with a straight face that all 3 of these turnovers are equal?

Agree

Same as baseball, not all hits are qual either (Ichiro discussion)




With Luck, IMO the discussion is that he throws too often (due to necessity in most cases). This is what leads to his higher INT numbers overall since his % is low