SHOTS FIRED! Police fatally shoot Guy with a crowbar outside of Carl's Jr. vol. 10 shots though?!?

[wade187]

Something else to think of. If these mistakes had been made and the dude would have actually swung that (which he hadn't yet). That was definitely long enough, to affect the shooting officers one shooting hand, cause he wasn't using both. Had this happened and anyone around been hit with a stray, weather it be man, woman, or child but someone other than this man who "deserved" it would this still be acceptable? Cause when looking at it slowed down you can see that this easily could have happened. Is the fact that police officers left this possibility open acceptable?Would these mistakes still be ok then? Innocent person shot, and the only guns busting were the ones of those protecting us. You are suppose to do whatever it takes to protect lives even if it means losing yours, yet it's ok to make a few mistakes, put your life in danger then bail yourselves out by shooting in the open close enough that strays can possibly hit pedestrians. Cause when "there's not much time to think" it's acceptable to do whatever you have to, to save your life despite the fact that putting your life on the line is part of your job description. Makes perfect sense

 

[ualreadyknow23]

^ Bruh, you're seriously over analyzing the situation and making all these hypothetical assumptions.

Like I said earlier, you CANNOT advance at a cop in a threatening manner with a weapon in your hand and expect not to be shot. Period.

I don't care what the lead up to the situation was. Yeah taser cop made some mistakes on how he handled the situation but the perp made the critical mistake when he raised that weapon, and it cost him his life.

You have to understand man in high stress situations like these where seconds count and lives could be at stake, many people react on instinct, not training. If you wanna get hypothetical, for all we know, it coulda been taser cop's second week on the job. We just don't have enough info about the situation at this point. But no amount of simulated training can prepare you for the real deal. Just like alot of people SAY what they would and wouldn't do if someone pulled a gun out on em or whatnot. But let you be staring down the barrel of a .45. All that "what you WOULD do" goes out the window for most.
 
Anyway, I'm off topic but yes, I do believe the first 5 were completely justified. The second 5 from taser cop, not so much. But again like I said earlier, how do we know WHICH BULLET actually KILLED the guy?



- Preciate it.

 

[antonlavey]

LOL @ this Rex Ryan dude comparing actual innocent people like Amadou Dialo without weapons getting shot to this idiot with a crowbar, its one thing if cops shoot you unprovoked but if you have a weapon ANY weapon you brought it on yourself

 

[kc24688]

Without looking it seems like nothing is wrong here. What if the cop takes 2 shots, the guy doesn't get phased, and makes the cop brain dead with a hit? Kids take note this is why you're parents worry about you getting messed up. You think it would never happen to you but if you were unaware of what you're doing (like a bar) you might charge a cop or you might hit someone that runs in the middle of the road and now you have to get a manslaughter instead of walking away free.
REX! You're a fool dude.. don't take your self seriously please.  If a cop pulled a gun you most likely did not follow his instructions.  For that moment in time you are their woman and you have to listen.  The reason your point falls miserably short is because there is no better alternative than to trust an officer who underwent a tough screening process.  Nothing will ever be perfect dude.

 

[tim teufel]

I'm sorry but if you put yourself anywhere near this kind of situation you already know what's gonna happen. Also a lot of suicidal people wanna go out getting shot by police

 

[rex ryan]

At the end of the day the sad thing is the lack of regard for the guy with the crowbars life.

Could he have been subdued without being murdered in cold blood? The answer to that is yes.

If he had a gun I could be more understanding but a crowbar. Just taze him, $%%@ below the belt where he'll be subdued but not killed. This could've been handled way better.

 

[noblekane]

best believe if some dude has a crowbar coming at me or a family member and i have a gun on me, im shooting that sucker onsite... and i aint no cop. +*$@ waiting around to see what he gonna do with it.

especially in a cops situation? they dont pay them enough to basically give their life to some ****** with a crowbar who was probably high as a kite on that crack head strength.... just so some hipster can be satisfied he did it right... you crazy

 

[rex ryan]

Originally Posted by kc24688

Without looking it seems like nothing is wrong here. What if the cop takes 2 shots, the guy doesn't get phased, and makes the cop brain dead with a hit? Kids take note this is why you're parents worry about you getting messed up. You think it would never happen to you but if you were unaware of what you're doing (like a bar) you might charge a cop or you might hit someone that runs in the middle of the road and now you have to get a manslaughter instead of walking away free.
REX! You're a fool dude.. don't take your self seriously please.  If a cop pulled a gun you most likely did not follow his instructions.  For that moment in time you are their woman and you have to listen.  The reason your point falls miserably short is because there is no better alternative than to trust an officer who underwent a tough screening process.  Nothing will ever be perfect dude.

So cops are always correct? I've had guns pulled on me by cops when I did nothing wrong. I'm a rational person but I felt violated. If I did something wrong I'd have no hard feelings but apparently walking home at 3am is a reason to put a gun to an innocent person.Bottom line is when you hire uneducated unintelligent people and give them power their not qualified to handle and don't give them proper training problems happen. There's good cops out there but that shoot first ask questions later mindset is problematic most of the time and people will get killed who could be subdued without being killed. The lack of regard for their lives disgusts me. What makes a cops life more valuable then a regular persons?

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by Rex Ryan

At the end of the day the sad thing is the lack of regard for the guy with the crowbars life.

Could he have been subdued without being murdered in cold blood? The answer to that is yes.

If he had a gun I could be more understanding but a crowbar. Just taze him, $%%@ below the belt where he'll be subdued but not killed. This could've been handled way better.

 A crowbar or whatever he had is a weapon that could do some SERIOUS damage.  He should have NEVER stepped to the cop.  Period. 

Some of yall watch too many movies.  Thinking that folks who aren't right in the head will just be ready to hand over their weapon after a discussion w. the police. 

  

 

[rex ryan]

And cops take the job knowing that might be the case.

How many cops were there? There was k9 dogs too right?

My question is this could he have been subdued without being killed?
The answer is yes, and that's where my problem lies. The excessive shots are a problem as well.

He's outnumbered, you find a way to subdue him and throw the book at him afterwards.

If a regular person ran up on me with a crowbar even though I have a firearm license, certain things would be deemed excessive by law if I did them.

 

[rex ryan]

And honestly there's been situations where I've defended the cops actions. If the person pulls a firearm out on them, all being rational and their life goes out the window as I can understand in that instance it's kill or be killed but there's a lot of other situations where the cops lack of regard for human life is sickening.

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by Rex Ryan

And cops take the job knowing that might be the case.

How many cops were there? There was k9 dogs too right?

My question is this could he have been subdued without being killed?
The answer is yes, and that's where my problem lies. The excessive shots are a problem as well.

He's outnumbered, you find a way to subdue him and throw the book at him afterwards.

If a regular person ran up on me with a crowbar even though I have a firearm license, certain things would be deemed excessive by law if I did them.

But, how do you know this?  We had a CURRENT police officer on the other page tell you exactly what they're supposed to do in a situation like that.  He's going off of what he was taught in the academy.  How the hell do you know he could have been subdued?  %*+$, I was just watching a video on another site where some dude got in a tussle w/ officers and ended up coming close to choking one out.  He didn't have a weapon, but you get the point.  In a situation like what we saw in the vid, the man had a weapon...he stepped to another officer WHILE guns were drawn, and ultimately got shot.  If he drops the weapon, then yes...you can tackle his #!# and try to subdue him.  That wasn't the case tho. 
  

 

[rex ryan]

I can respect your argument but I just feel they could handle things better at times.

I sympathize with cops to an extent as their in some tough situations but in general not just this situation I disagree with their handling in a lot of instances.

 

[seasoned vet]

Originally Posted by KayGeeDaGr8

Oh man I just saw the video that suspect is good to go!!! John Sterling- you are correct we are taught to shoot "two in the chest and one in the head". In this day and age the police really dont have the power they once had except in places where Republicans reside.

....so 3 shots? not 10? hmm.
 
 
 

 

[john sterling]

Originally Posted by Rex Ryan

I can respect your argument but I just feel they could handle things better at times.

I sympathize with cops to an extent as their in some tough situations but in general not just this situation I disagree with their handling in a lot of instances.

In all honesty what did you want to cop to do in this situation? Retreat from the guy with the crowbar? Go in for the spear and take him down? Cop told the guy to drop the weapon, guy refused then approached him with it. He had no choice but to shoot at that point. You keep saying the cop put himself in that situation when in reality the guy with crowbar put the cop there. He forced the officers hand. What people don't realize about the 10 shots is police are taught to shoot in bursts. Not one shot not ever.

 

[kaygeedagr8]

Rex Ryan- Good thing your not a cop because if you think tooooo much on the job we would be holding a memorial service for you in no time!!! But for reals you step to a cop like that with a weapon in hand you are getting handled. I had a dude pull a katana blade on me but I didnt shoot him because he was a distance away from me but let him be close to me I would probably would have shot him.

 

[dropten]

Originally Posted by KayGeeDaGr8

Rex Ryan- Good thing your not a cop because if you think tooooo much on the job we would be holding a memorial service for you in no time!!! But for reals you step to a cop like that with a weapon in hand you are getting handled. I had a dude pull a katana blade on me but I didnt shoot him because he was a distance away from me but let him be close to me I would probably would have shot him.

yep

 

[wade187]

Originally Posted by KayGeeDaGr8

Rex Ryan- Good thing your not a cop because if you think tooooo much on the job we would be holding a memorial service for you in no time!!! But for reals you step to a cop like that with a weapon in hand you are getting handled. I had a dude pull a katana blade on me but I didnt shoot him because he was a distance away from me but let him be close to me I would probably would have shot him.

So you didn't go towards the guy with the katana? DoubleJs fumbling around is something I'm sure they weren't taught, cause that can put many peoples lives in danger. They also aren't taught to have their eyes away from the suspect or to allow there selves to be distracted. Your going hard as hell when this is clearly the reasoning behind that man being shot. 

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by Wade187

Originally Posted by KayGeeDaGr8

Rex Ryan- Good thing your not a cop because if you think tooooo much on the job we would be holding a memorial service for you in no time!!! But for reals you step to a cop like that with a weapon in hand you are getting handled. I had a dude pull a katana blade on me but I didnt shoot him because he was a distance away from me but let him be close to me I would probably would have shot him.

So you didn't go towards the guy with the katana? DoubleJs fumbling around is something I'm sure they weren't taught, cause that can put many peoples lives in danger. They also aren't taught to have their eyes away from the suspect or to allow there selves to be distracted. Your going hard as hell when this is clearly the reasoning behind that man being shot. 

The man was shot because he STEPPED to the officer w/ a weapon in hand.  Excuse me...not just stepped, but actually motioned that he was going to STRIKE the officer.  You really seem to have a hard time understanding this. 

 

[wade187]

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

Originally Posted by Wade187

Originally Posted by KayGeeDaGr8

Rex Ryan- Good thing your not a cop because if you think tooooo much on the job we would be holding a memorial service for you in no time!!! But for reals you step to a cop like that with a weapon in hand you are getting handled. I had a dude pull a katana blade on me but I didnt shoot him because he was a distance away from me but let him be close to me I would probably would have shot him.

So you didn't go towards the guy with the katana? DoubleJs fumbling around is something I'm sure they weren't taught, cause that can put many peoples lives in danger. They also aren't taught to have their eyes away from the suspect or to allow there selves to be distracted. Your going hard as hell when this is clearly the reasoning behind that man being shot. 

The man was shot because he STEPPED to the officer w/ a weapon in hand.  Excuse me...not just stepped, but actually motioned that he was going to STRIKE the officer.  You really seem to have a hard time understanding this.

If I swing a golf club out of reach of an officer I'm not getting shot. The man was a threat because the cop was sloppy, you seem to have a hard time understanding that. 

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by pookieman

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

Originally Posted by Rex Ryan

so if a cop pulls a gun on me what makes him so special that i can't shoot him for endangering my life?

if i were to pull a gun on a person i have a problem with i'll get in trouble but why do cops get a free pass for pulling guns on innocent people?

Possibly the dumbest thing I've ever read on NT. 

Seriously. 

I understand what Rex Ryan is saying....



Case in point...that shooting by the transit officer in the bay area 2 years ago....if we can't trust the police to keep the lives of the innocent(until proven guilty) safe, then what use are they?  If they are just going to blast everything/one that moves then they are useless and deserve the same treatment right? We put those that can take/save lives under extreme microscopes....doctors, lawyers, judges, etc...why don't we properly train and test these officers? The excuse that "people make mistakes" can't always fly when a life is on the line...

This is what it comes down to for me.
There needs to be stiffer penalties for this stuff.

Just like in finance. High risk; High reward.

To assert that cops get adequately punished for this sort of negligence (not ascribing any judgement on this particular incident) is asinine. 

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by Wade187

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

Originally Posted by Wade187

So you didn't go towards the guy with the katana? DoubleJs fumbling around is something I'm sure they weren't taught, cause that can put many peoples lives in danger. They also aren't taught to have their eyes away from the suspect or to allow there selves to be distracted. Your going hard as hell when this is clearly the reasoning behind that man being shot. 

The man was shot because he STEPPED to the officer w/ a weapon in hand.  Excuse me...not just stepped, but actually motioned that he was going to STRIKE the officer.  You really seem to have a hard time understanding this.

If I swing a golf club out of reach of an officer I'm not getting shot. The man was a threat because the cop was sloppy, you seem to have a hard time understanding that. 

Maybe we watched different videos.  The one I saw CLEARLY was showing a man in a close proximity to an officer, with a weapon in hand.  Not only w/ a weapon in hand, but he flexed like he was going to strike the cop.  How is this hard for you to grasp?  He deserved to be shot. 

*And if you're swinging a golf club in the direction of a cop, even if you THINK you aren't in reach...you'd deserve a slug as well.  You're trying your hardest to make a foolish point.  If you're swinging a golf club in that fashion, you're trying to do some damage.  I'm sorry, but I don't buy anything you're saying or trying to prove.  I'll trust KayGee's words, because he's actually had academy training. 

 

[rex ryan]

i wouldn't be a cop in the first place. i wouldn't take a job like that knowing the risks involved.

he came at the guy with a crowbar, not a gun, but a crowbar.

1 guy with a crowbar vs a bunch of cops and k9's. how hard is it to shot the guy below the belt when he's coming at them so that he's subdued without being murdered.

what makes a cops life more valuable then the crowbar guys life though?

if a cop draws a gun on an innocent person for no reason (it happens at times) do they deserve a slug as well?

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by Rex Ryan

i wouldn't be a cop in the first place. i wouldn't take a job like that knowing the risks involved.

he came at the guy with a crowbar, not a gun, but a crowbar.

1 guy with a crowbar vs a bunch of cops and k9's. how hard is it to shot the guy below the belt when he's coming at them so that he's subdued without being murdered.

what makes a cops life more valuable then the crowbar guys life though?

if a cop draws a gun on an innocent person for no reason (it happens at times) do they deserve a slug as well?

@ you marginalizing the %+#% outta a crowbar like it can't do some serious damage.  C'mon now. 

Do you even think before you type?  Honestly?  What makes the cop's life in this situation more valuable than the high/crazy dude with the WEAPON???  Gee, I dunno...

 

[rex ryan]

im talkin in general, not just this situation but what makes a cops life more important then any other regular persons?


cops kill innocent people and they get assigned desk work. someone kills a cop and it's all over the news like it's some huge deal and when the cops get them they enforce their type of justice. either way it's a tragedy.

a crowbar can do damage but a gun can do way more. cops take the job knowing they may get hurt in the line of duty, that's a risk their willing to take. how hard would it be for the cop to backstep while the other cop shoots him in the leg.

i hope the victims family sues and gets a nice settlement check.