*'11-'12 LAKERS Thread; 41-25* 1st Rd: DEN (go to 1st Rd. Thread)

[mr j 858]

Puke's best career game EVER was in Game 2 of the 2004 Finals.

He helped lead the comeback with his hustle & effort and Kobe's game tying 3 over RIP Hamilton in the 4th was the only reason why the Lakers didn't get swept in the Finals that year.

 

[kobe8is]

Originally Posted by laker4lifeman

If it weren't for Kobe, Gasol and Barnes we would have lost this game. Who thought it was a great idea to have 9 games in 13 days.

Fixed

 

[zk1mpls]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

Title change.

thachosen123:

---

Drew better not play no more than 20mins on Sunday

Fixed.

Still have flashbacks from that game against the Grizz.

 

[licensed to ball]

Luke's best play of his life was the ugly jump ball he accidently tipped to Kobe to give him the game winning buzzer shot against the Suns. 
You all know which game.

I thank him for that, and nothing else.

 

[pmatic]

Because I feel like we haven't talked about this enough.

STATSCUBE: DOES KOBE SHOOT TOO MUCH?

News flash: Kobe Bryant takes a lot of shots.
Through the first 13 days of the season, Bryant leads the league in both field goal attempts per game (23.1) and per minute (0.65), despite playing with a torn ligament in his right wrist that he numbs with an injection before every game, and despite having some pretty talented teammates.

ESPN’s Rick Reilly is clearly fascinated with the rate at which Bryant shoots…

He’s always been an unrepentant gunner, but he’s practically melting the barrel this season. He’s taken 71 more shots than his next shootingest teammate, Pau Gasol. He’s averaging almost 30 shots a game this month. Bryant believes in shot selection. He selects them all.

Unfortunately, he’s making fewer of them. He went 6-for-28 the other night. For the season, he’s hit only 41.7 percent. Entering Thursday, that tied him for 214th in the league.

And he doesn’t care.


Through Friday, Bryant leads the league with a usage rate (percentage of his team’s possessions that he uses when he’s on the floor) of 36.1 percent. And though Bryant is now 33 years old, his usage rate has climbed in each of the last four seasons. Last season, he led the league at 33.0 percent.

But that doesn’t mean that Bryant’s a total ball hog. Assists count toward usage rate, and Bryant is averaging almost six assists per game, the third-highest mark of his 16 seasons. Among the top 10 players in usage rate, four have a lower assist rate than Bryant, who has recorded assists on 15.8 percent of his possessions. Kevin Durant and Carmelo Anthony are among the four.

Highest usage rate through Friday
[table][tr][td]Player[/td][td]MIN[/td][td]FGM[/td][td]FGA[/td][td]FG%[/td][td]eFG%[/td][td]TS%[/td][td]Usage Rate[/td][td]ASTRatio[/td][/tr][tr][td]Kobe Bryant[/td][td]322[/td][td]91[/td][td]208[/td][td]43.8%[/td][td]45.7%[/td][td]52.1%[/td][td]36.1%[/td][td]15.8[/td][/tr][tr][td]Carmelo Anthony[/td][td]251[/td][td]68[/td][td]147[/td][td]46.3%[/td][td]51.0%[/td][td]57.9%[/td][td]32.4%[/td][td]12.0[/td][/tr][tr][td]Deron Williams[/td][td]238[/td][td]40[/td][td]111[/td][td]36.0%[/td][td]40.5%[/td][td]48.9%[/td][td]30.2%[/td][td]21.9[/td][/tr][tr][td]Russell Westbrook[/td][td]257[/td][td]52[/td][td]130[/td][td]40.0%[/td][td]40.8%[/td][td]46.3%[/td][td]29.6%[/td][td]18.8[/td][/tr][tr][td]LeBron James[/td][td]253[/td][td]78[/td][td]131[/td][td]59.5%[/td][td]59.5%[/td][td]65.1%[/td][td]29.4%[/td][td]22.4[/td][/tr][tr][td]Monta Ellis[/td][td]239[/td][td]53[/td][td]124[/td][td]42.7%[/td][td]46.0%[/td][td]49.8%[/td][td]29.0%[/td][td]24.7[/td][/tr][tr][td]Kevin Durant[/td][td]290[/td][td]75[/td][td]149[/td][td]50.3%[/td][td]55.4%[/td][td]59.7%[/td][td]28.5%[/td][td]11.5[/td][/tr][tr][td]Blake Griffin[/td][td]180[/td][td]50[/td][td]88[/td][td]56.8%[/td][td]56.8%[/td][td]59.4%[/td][td]28.1%[/td][td]9.8[/td][/tr][tr][td]Jamal Crawford[/td][td]172[/td][td]31[/td][td]88[/td][td]35.2%[/td][td]39.2%[/td][td]48.2%[/td][td]28.1%[/td][td]15.8[/td][/tr][tr][td]Kyrie Irving[/td][td]185[/td][td]36[/td][td]86[/td][td]41.9%[/td][td]45.9%[/td][td]51.5%[/td][td]27.4%[/td][td]24.2[/td][/tr][/table]
eFG% = (FGM + (0.5 * 3PM)) / FGA
TS% = Points / (2*(FGA + (0.44 * FTA)))
ASTRatio = Assists per 100 possessions used

The problem is that, as Bryant’s usage rate has risen over the last five seasons, his scoring efficiency has dropped. He ranks fifth in true shooting percentage among the group above, but just 77th among the 151 players who have attempted at least 50 shots this season. Among the 76 guys ahead of him are teammates Pau Gasol (61.0 percent) and Andrew Bynum (57.4 percent).

And this season, Bryant’s effective field goal percentage and true shooting percentage are the lowest of his career.

Kobe Bryant’s last five seasons
[table][tr][td]Season[/td][td]MIN[/td][td]FGM[/td][td]FGA[/td][td]FG%[/td][td]eFG%[/td][td]TS%[/td][td]Usage Rate[/td][td]ASTRatio[/td][/tr][tr][td]2007-08[/td][td]3192[/td][td]775[/td][td]1690[/td][td]45.9%[/td][td]50.3%[/td][td]57.6%[/td][td]29.2%[/td][td]16.2[/td][/tr][tr][td]2008-09[/td][td]2961[/td][td]800[/td][td]1712[/td][td]46.7%[/td][td]50.2%[/td][td]56.1%[/td][td]30.2%[/td][td]15.5[/td][/tr][tr][td]2009-10[/td][td]2836[/td][td]716[/td][td]1569[/td][td]45.6%[/td][td]48.8%[/td][td]54.5%[/td][td]30.3%[/td][td]15.2[/td][/tr][tr][td]2010-11[/td][td]2778[/td][td]740[/td][td]1639[/td][td]45.1%[/td][td]48.7%[/td][td]54.8%[/td][td]33.0%[/td][td]15.4[/td][/tr][tr][td]2011-12[/td][td]322[/td][td]91[/td][td]208[/td][td]43.8%[/td][td]45.7%[/td][td]52.1%[/td][td]36.1%[/td][td]15.8[/td][/tr][/table]
A look at the shots Bryant is taking reveals that he’s getting to the rim less and less as the years go by. His free throw rate has remained pretty constant (about 35 free throw attempts for every 100 shots from the field) and he’s getting into the paint, but just not all the way to the basket.

Kobe Bryant’s shooting, last five seasons
[table][tr][td]
[/td][td]Restricted area[/td][td]In The Paint (Non-RA)[/td][td]Mid-Range[/td][td]3-point range[/td][/tr][tr][td]Season[/td][td]FG%[/td][td]%FGA[/td][td]FG%[/td][td]%FGA[/td][td]FG%[/td][td]%FGA[/td][td]FG%[/td][td]%FGA[/td][/tr][tr][td]2007-08[/td][td]63.5%[/td][td]25.9%[/td][td]51.4%[/td][td]10.5%[/td][td]38.8%[/td][td]39.1%[/td][td]36.1%[/td][td]24.6%[/td][/tr][tr][td]2008-09[/td][td]65.7%[/td][td]21.3%[/td][td]48.8%[/td][td]14.8%[/td][td]42.1%[/td][td]44.3%[/td][td]35.1%[/td][td]19.6%[/td][/tr][tr][td]2009-10[/td][td]57.5%[/td][td]22.4%[/td][td]45.5%[/td][td]17.1%[/td][td]45.1%[/td][td]41.4%[/td][td]32.9%[/td][td]19.2%[/td][/tr][tr][td]2010-11[/td][td]59.8%[/td][td]19.7%[/td][td]51.7%[/td][td]19.5%[/td][td]41.7%[/td][td]39.1%[/td][td]32.3%[/td][td]21.7%[/td][/tr][tr][td]2011-12[/td][td]66.7%[/td][td]17.3%[/td][td]38.5%[/td][td]25.0%[/td][td]48.8%[/td][td]38.5%[/td][td]20.0%[/td][td]19.2%[/td][/tr][/table]
%FGA = percent of total field goal attempts from this range

• StatsCube: Kobe Bryant’s shooting

With Bryant’s decreased efficiency, it’s valid to wonder if the Lakers should be running their new offense more through their big men. But Bryant is still the franchise player in L.A. and he isn’t changing his stripes.

“I’ll try to make the good play, the good pass, kick it out when my teammates are open, but I’m a scorer first,

 

[grittyman20]

Luke has a guaranteed contract. And zero trade value. Plus the Lakers have far more terrible contracts to consider using their anmesty clause on.

 

[moe fab]

Those stats are misleading. The four players ahead of him are Bron, KD, Melo, and Griffin. Griffin don't count because he usually just dunks, but Bron stays in the paint, Melo's a nice shooter, and KD is KD. Also, look at Kobe's mid-range and restricted area percentages; they're highest this year and those are the shots I'd rather see him take. Also, as far as the offensive stats are concerned, we just lost Odom, have a gang of new faces, more games in less days, less practice, a new coach, a new system, Bynum out for four games, and Kobe's wrist is ######. So yeah we might be a little off for a while.




























#### Puke

 

[mrdieselfuel09]

Sunday game? White jersey? Uh-oh.

 

[xsalvioutlawx]

Those stats are misleading.

1. Because without that one bad shooting game where Kobe shot 6 or 28 or w.e, his shooting percentage is pretty damn high. That one game alone brought him down and he's shot well for the most part every game besides that game.

2. It's early in the season and there's no way his usage rate will be that high through 66 games. If he even makes it to 66 games on that wrist.

3. Because Pau Gasol is not an All-Star or Superstar at this point anymore. The guy doesn't even post up anymore, he makes his points shooting outside the paint. So the media needs to stop acting like it's Kobe Bryant's fault that Pau Gasol is playing the way he is.



We wouldn't have won yesterday without Kobe and Matt Barnes energy off the bench. Pau played well for the most part, but he's just not being effective like he should be. He doesn't post anymore, he doesn't pull any of his moves that he used to do.

It bothers me that everyone is saying Kobe is shooting too much and outside that one bad shooting game, he's actually shooting well.

This is NOT the same team we had last year. We traded our best rebounder and spark off the bench in Lamar Odom for what? Nothing. Nothing that will help us NOW which is what is most important.

Who replaced him? MWP....And as you can see MWP is garbage.

So even if Kobe, Pau, Bynum play well together like they did against Portland, we still lose because our bench is non existent.

Barnes came to play yesterday, but he's not the player we can depend on every single game to bring that kind of production.

We traded Lamar Odom for nothing. As inconsistent as he is in the playoffs, we replaced him with nothing and now our bench is worse than it's ever been.

Not only are we still garbage from the PG position with Fisher STILL starting, but our bench that has always needed to get better has gotten worse.

That's something ESPN, NBA etc need to focus more on. The lack of production we get from our PG's and bench because that's what's really killing our team.

 

[MVP]

41% isn't misleading...fact is Kobe is shooting a lot, but at many points it's needed just because no one else can create their own offense or any for others. We might as well stop complaining about it though because as long as Mike Brown is here and Dwight is still on the Magic, Kobe's going to have the green light to do what the hell he wants, for better or worse.

 

[kenji714]

Automatic L this Sunday. Lakers playing on Sunday= automatic L

Bynum should find a way to miss the game. I don't want the curse to strike again

 

[ag 47]

Bryant believes in shot selection. He selects them all.


This made me laugh a lot.

 

[darthska]

^ Same here.

Joint cracked me up as soon as I read it.

 

[dontsteponmyshoes]

Any way we can get Brandon Jennings?

 

[essential1]

Originally Posted by DontStepOnMyShoes

Any way we can get Brandon Jennings?

Not a very good passer.. Just a scoring PG..

DWill is an option we need to pursue.. Who can score just as well but can pass...

 

[mr j 858]

Originally Posted by Essential1

Originally Posted by DontStepOnMyShoes

Any way we can get Brandon Jennings?

Not a very good passer.. Just a scoring PG..

DWill is an option we need to pursue.. Who can score just as well but can pass...

Mikhail Prokhorov & Jay-Z would not accept a trade package built around Pau Gasol and expiring contracts. Trust me all the GM's around the league see & know Pau is getting older is on the decline and is basically no longer the player he was during 2009 & 2010 championships runs. He's also due $19 million each for the next 2 seasons.
They would probably want Bynum, Ebanks, and a couple future #1 draft picks.

Way to much to give up for DWill.

Also the way Bynum has been playing lately I don't think Jim Buss is going to trade Bynum for anyone except Dwight Howard now.

 

[kash55]

Do you guys think Kobe is going to get shutdown at any point in the season? No saying for the year, but for a week or two?

I can't see this guy playing 3 games in 4 nights over and over again, then the grind of playoffs....he's gonna need to take a break.

 

[mr j 858]

Originally Posted by kash55

Do you guys think Kobe is going to get shutdown at any point in the season? No saying for the year, but for a week or two?

I can't see this guy playing 3 games in 4 nights over and over again, then the grind of playoffs....he's gonna need to take a break.

Nope.
Remember dude played a full 82 game season with a broken finger.

Also it would hurt the team chemistry wise right now since a new coach & coaching staff is in place right now and everyone is getting use to the new offense & defensive sets.

Mamba just played 3 games in 5 nights including a road back to back and dropped 30+ points in all games.

 

[kobe8is]

Originally Posted by DontStepOnMyShoes

Any way we can get Brandon Jennings?

Let's hope not!!!
  

 

[essential1]

Originally Posted by MR J 858

Originally Posted by Essential1

Originally Posted by DontStepOnMyShoes

Any way we can get Brandon Jennings?

Not a very good passer.. Just a scoring PG..

DWill is an option we need to pursue.. Who can score just as well but can pass...

Mikhail Prokhorov & Jay-Z would not accept a trade package built around Pau Gasol and expiring contracts. Trust me all the GM's around the league see & know Pau is getting older is on the decline and is basically no longer the player he was during 2009 & 2010 championships runs. He's also due $19 million each for the next 2 seasons.
They would probably want Bynum, Ebanks, and a couple future #1 draft picks.

Way to much to give up for DWill.

Also the way Bynum has been playing lately I don't think Jim Buss is going to trade Bynum for anyone except Dwight Howard now.

All in the timing my man... All in the timing...

Nets & Magic will both see the writing on the wall come sometime February/March  and will be looking to shop both players for the best deal they can get.

Best deal the Nets will find:  Pau + fillers + 1 pick
Best deal the Magic will find: Bynum + fillers + 2 picks

It isn't always whether a deal is fair or optimal.. It is mainly what is the best deal I can get as opposed to nothing... And that is the situation that both the Nets & Magic find themselves in.. There is no way both teams let them leave without dealing them.. Gilbert legitimately thought Lebron was staying in Cleveland that is why he never dealt him. Had he known Lebron was leaving or if Lebron made that public before the 2010 trade deadline, I think Gilbert may have traded him.  Another example Stanley Kroenke knew Melo was either going to leave in Free Agency or want to be traded. Knowing that nothing Denver does will keep Melo it was in his best decision to trade his franchise player for the entire Knicks core (minus Amare).. These teams knowing their franchise players are ready to walk at season's end will realize as much as it hurts to trade them, they have to because they can't do nothing and lose a Dwight Howard or Deron Williams for NOTHING.. These owners know that their revenue will take a hit if they trade them.. But know their revenue is hit a lot worse if they are 15-67 teams for 5 years because they were too prideful to trade a guy who didn't want to be there.

Now that is not to say the Nets won't be looking for deals to get D12 and keep DWill or the Magic won't look for a deal to keep D12.. Ironically they both want to make deals with each other to acquire their best player to keep their current best player

.. But who can the Magic realistically offer to get talent to Orlando and bring in 1-2 great players to make D12 stay.. As well who can the Nets acquire to get DWill to stay (Brook Lopez is no longer a possibility to trade for D12)..  The Nets lack the talent outside DWill & Brook Lopez, Kris Humphries is the best trade asset.. The Magic lack good contracts..Outside of D12, Ryan Anderson & JJ Reddick are the Magic best trade assets.

And Jay-Z has 0 input on trades.. As much as I like Jay-Z he is there to make the franchise look cool and hopefully entice players to play for New Jersey/Brooklyn because he is Jay-Z

The reason the deals work and why they have great legitimacy to happen is because no one wants to unload an all-star for DWill unless it is a PG.. As great as DWill is teams want to pair him with someone.. Not deal him with someone.. And the trades also have to do with if DWill will sign with the team.. And he has had interest in 2 teams: Dallas & Lakers.

Dallas can only offer up expiring contracts, or overpaid older guys & role players.. It is almost exactly like giving up DWill for nothing...  The Mavericks could offer up LO & Shawn Marion.. But that leaves the Nets with the same cap structure as before and who wants to sign on a team with Shawn Marion, Lamar Odom, Kris Humphries & Brook Lopez.. Now don't get me wrong that is actually a very good starting point for a team.. But will not entice anyone to come to the Nets. But remember Brook Lopez & Kris Humphries could or will be free agents after the year is up.

Lakers on the other hand can offer up Pau Gasol.. Who will be an All-Star again this year.. Even if he is slowing down in terms of play. Brook Lopez & Pau would be one of the better front courts in the league. Not to mention the Lakers can offer up young PG's who may develop into solid players (possibly).

The Nets are backed into a corner.. They could lose DWill... Brook Lopez... Kris Humphries.. Their 3 best players in free agency... They almost have to trade DWill... On January 8th their asking price will be far more than it is worth.. I 100% agree with you.. But come Late February.. Early March that asking price will be so low the Lakers COULD come in and steal DWill for Pau Gasol, Goudelock and/or Morris and a 1st round pick (2014). (and if we are lucky.. Kris Humphries would be thrown in because his effectiveness as a bench player is nonexistent as compared to the 12-10 he is as a starter).. This would trigger the Lakers having to throw in World Peace so the deal can work..

The Magic know Dwight Howard is leaving.. 2 signs. 1. They recently lifted their 3 team destination (Nets, Lakers, Mavs) for Howard and are allowing every team to put in offers for D12, but for every other team it will be for Rental because Howard wants to play for one of 4 teams: Magic, Lakers, Nets & Mavericks. He would love to stay in Orlando, but it comes down to the second sign who can the Magic trade for that will keep D12 in Orlando.. The answer is nobody. There are just no trades Orlando can do with the contracts they have. Hedo $11 million.. Jameer $8 million..  Their best trading asset is Ryan Anderson who is a very good PF. And JJ Reddick.. No one wants to trade their superstar to the Magic to rent him for a season that almost certainly would end in failure. There was talk about trading Monta Ellis for D12. That is all fine and good but 1. You lose D12 as GSW so you traded Monta for nothing because that team still won't win a title. And on the other side no one wants to trade their superstar to Orlando for Ryan Anderson & JJ Redick by themselves.
 
Here's where the Lakers come in... Not only can they offer the 2nd best Center in the NBA for the 1st best.. They can take on Hedo's contract (which was extremely important to the Magic)... And if the Magic so choose they can just get rid of Bynum if they want at the end of the year.  Or the year after God Forbid anything happens... No other team in the NBA can offer up the 2nd best player in any position in the NBA. And still have the means to take Hedo Turkoglu's contract.. Once again on January 8th the asking price for Dwight Howard is far too high... But come Late February/Early March when the heat is on and they couldn't find a suitable second option to keep D12 they will take any offer as opposed to losing everything for nothing...  And the team with the best trade option is the Lakers.
The deal will most likely be Bynum + Ebanks + Blake + Trade Exception + 2 first rounders (2012 & 2016) for   Dwight Howard + Hedo Turkoglu (and if we are lucky... Ryan Anderson would be part of the trade) (assuming we didn't rob Nets blind and get Humphries in the deal as well.. Who would either be thrown in and Anderson would be part of the deal to the Lakers or we keep Humphries and forget about Anderson).. Now the Bynum part is plausible that Buss may not want to trade him.. But if the Magic say we'll give you Howard for Bynum (Pau doesn't need to be included).. And we will swap less significant players to make the money work Buss will change his mind... Also I wouldn't rule out that the 3 teams will work together to make it happen if  the situation is dire enough (It happens far more in the NBA than we are led to believe where multiple teams work with each other to make a deal happen).

Once again it is all in timing.. Unless the teams try to pull the early trigger instead of waiting... Today both deals seem very unlikely... But come March the Lakers offer the best deals to both teams...

 

[pmatic]

Stop it.

 

[hybridsoldier23]

Originally Posted by Essential1

P4L

 

[cole world 22]

Originally Posted by KenJi714

Cole World , Hansumm , etc are ghost now lol

Dude, shutup.

I'm not gonna come in here after every game.


Kobe Bryant is the most overrated athlete EVER.

Kobe Bryant is the luckiest athlete EVER.

Kobe Bryant is not clutch... AT ALL.

Kobe Bryant has never made any teammate better.

Kobe Bryant shoots WAY TOO MUCH.

The Lakers are not doing ANYTHING with Kobe Bryant shooting 25-30 shots per game.

Kobe Bryant has never shot 47% for a season... EVER. And he NEVER will.



None of those things are gonna change, whether I visit this thread after every game or not.


Dude scored 39 points on 28 shots, including a bunch of phantom fouls, against a Warriors' team that is mediocre when healthy. They were missing two starters, and the Lakers got a every call, including a bunch of BS calls. And I'm supposed to give him props? Please.

 

[illoquent aka dsk]

This dude Essential1 always has these fantasy trade proposals that only he could explain.

You typing out your dreams, bruh.

 

[myjaysgetrocked]

Originally Posted by Essential1

Originally Posted by MR J 858

Originally Posted by Essential1


Not a very good passer.. Just a scoring PG..

DWill is an option we need to pursue.. Who can score just as well but can pass...

Mikhail Prokhorov & Jay-Z would not accept a trade package built around Pau Gasol and expiring contracts. Trust me all the GM's around the league see & know Pau is getting older is on the decline and is basically no longer the player he was during 2009 & 2010 championships runs. He's also due $19 million each for the next 2 seasons.
They would probably want Bynum, Ebanks, and a couple future #1 draft picks.

Way to much to give up for DWill.

Also the way Bynum has been playing lately I don't think Jim Buss is going to trade Bynum for anyone except Dwight Howard now.

The deal will most likely be Bynum + Ebanks + Blake + Trade Exception + 2 first rounders (2012 & 2016) for   Dwight Howard + Hedo Turkoglu (and if we are lucky... Ryan Anderson would be part of the trade) (assuming we didn't rob Nets blind and get Humphries in the deal as well.. Who would either be thrown in and Anderson would be part of the deal to the Lakers or we keep Humphries and forget about Anderson).. Now the Bynum part is plausible that Buss may not want to trade him.. But if the Magic say we'll give you Howard for Bynum (Pau doesn't need to be included).. And we will swap less significant players to make the money work Buss will change his mind... Also I wouldn't rule out that the 3 teams will work together to make it happen if  the situation is dire enough (It happens far more in the NBA than we are led to believe where multiple teams work with each other to make a deal happen).

Once again it is all in timing.. Unless the teams try to pull the early trigger instead of waiting... Today both deals seem very unlikely... But come March the Lakers offer the best deals to both teams...

...I'm sorry but that's just hilarious. The Magic trade Howard for a guy who's always hurt half the season. I understand that their leverage might not be as strong as the trading deadlines approaches, but that's honestly the worst case scenario. The magic have already mentioned, they don't want young talent, they want proven players.