2022 NBA Offseason Thread: Preseason kicks off; Things are fine in Los Angeles, Draymond beats the charges

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DCAllAfrican said:
1. I didn't know the 4th quarter was the only quarter that mattered. Sure Kobe was the go-to but the logic in using head to head when one player had the luxury of playing 4 of those years with another Top 15 talent while the other didn't is just wild to me. I am sure you understand that but we can pretend it doesn't matter. Fine.

2. Also, it's interesting that you found a way to use him being the 4th quarter go to man as a way to pretend that made him the #1 player on those teams is also wild as hell. Again, unreasonable metric to use when comparing TD vs. Kobe.

But I know it's a tough subject for folks to objectively discuss so I tap out.

I don't mean any disrespect but the points made and evidence used are just illogical.
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Question when evaluating players who played with other all time greats why is it Bean that always gets a demerit when clearly his play on the floor more than warrants his own credit. It isn't done for Magic even know he played with Kareem, Bron even though he played with Wade, Kyrie, AD or Wardell & KD when they played with each other.

You say it's illogical to compare what Bean and Duncan did b/c he had Shaq, yet when evidence is presented particularly to say hey he did perform as the #1 guy from 2001 on it's well yea that doesn't count?

Just cause Duncan didn't have Shaq doesn't mean you can summarily dismiss what Bean did vs him on the court. Especially when he outperformed Shaq and Duncan as well pretty much in every series.
 
DCAllAfrican said:
1. I didn't know the 4th quarter was the only quarter that mattered. Sure Kobe was the go-to but the logic in using head to head when one player had the luxury of playing 4 of those years with another Top 15 talent while the other didn't is just wild to me. I am sure you understand that but we can pretend it doesn't matter. Fine.

2. Also, it's interesting that you found a way to use him being the 4th quarter go to man as a way to pretend that made him the #1 player on those teams is also wild as hell. Again, unreasonable metric to use when comparing TD vs. Kobe.

But I know it's a tough subject for folks to objectively discuss so I tap out.

I don't mean any disrespect but the points made and evidence used are just illogical.
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MVP MVP gave you the head to head stats. That's just one example of many.

Agree to disagree if you think Duncan is the Player of the Decade over Kobe from 00-10. I just think most people and certainly most GM's would disagree with you
 
Bron definitely gets knocked for playing with Bosh/Wade.

Kareem wasn't KAREEM when Magic was the leader of the LAL.

KD definitely gets it daily for playing with Steph.

This idea of Kobe being the only person that gets his accomplishments reevaluated because of his days playing with Shaq is nonsense.

Surprised you would even attempt that move man.
 
Brosizzlew30.23 said:
MVP MVP gave you the head to head stats. That's just one example of many.

Agree to disagree if you think Duncan is the Player of the Decade over Kobe from 00-10. I just think most people and certainly most GM's would disagree with you
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Kobe is loved. I agree that most people would also call him the player of that decade.

Whether GMs would agree is a different story.

As I mentioned, you could just go back and refer to the GM surveys of that era. They exist. No need to play the guessing game.
 
DCAllAfrican said:
What he does would catch the eye over Duncan.
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It's not about whose game looks prettier or more flashy. It's about who got more individual and team leadership skills on the court that translated to so much championship success in a decade that it made that star stand heads above his competition.

Duncan got about 3 moves or go to shots on offense. Kobe got too many to count. As we all know, Bryant got just about as many moves as Jordan ntm he bit some of Hakeem's moves as well.

Duncan got the low post turnaround or face up bank shot, the jump hook in the lane, and the drop step. Kobe got all that and then some. And he can beat you with his left hand lol. Bottom line is Kobe is greater than Tim overall.

It ain't about how each player catches the eye of the beholder, it's about how many more weapons Kobe got than Timmy thus making him the better overall player during the prime of their careers (00-10).

Again, per the eye test, if you watchin' you know.
 
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DCAllAfrican said:
Bron definitely gets knocked for playing with Bosh/Wade.

Kareem wasn't KAREEM when Magic was the leader of the LAL.

KD definitely gets it daily for playing with Steph.

This idea of Kobe being the only person that gets his accomplishments reevaluated because of his days playing with Shaq is nonsense.

Surprised you would even attempt that move man.
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We're talking about 2 ppl as an era though.

Bron ain't getting knocked as best of the 2010s post+ cause of all the elite talent he played with. Neither is Steph cause he played with KD they get their due. I mean ppl were in here no brainier saying the modern era is Bron-Steph.

The domination that the Lakers had over the Spurs in the 2000s isn't disputable. Neither is Bean's performances. You can try and twist it however you want. There's yet to be an argument saying why Tim should be over him.
 
Brosizzlew30.23 said:
It's not about whose game looks prettier or more flashy. It's about who got more individual and team leadership skills on the court that translated to so much championship success in a decade that it made that star stand heads above his competition.

Duncan got about 3 moves or go to shots on offense. Kobe got too many to count. As we all know, Bryant got just about as many moves as Jordan ntm he bit some of Hakeem's moves as well.

Duncan got the low post turnaround or face up bank shot, the jump hook in the lane, and the drop step. Kobe got all that and then some. And he can beat you with his left hand lol. Bottom line is Kobe is greater than Tim overall.

It ain't about how each player catches the eye of the beholder, it's about how many more weapons Kobe got than Timmy thus making him the better overall player during the prime of their careers (00-10).

Again, per the eye test, if you watchin' you know.
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Kobe's footwork is some of the best we've ever seen.

EYE wouldn't question him vs. TD in that department.

So yes, he passes THAT eye test.
 
MVP said:
We're talking about 2 ppl as an era though.

Bron ain't getting knocked as best of the 2010s post+ cause of all the elite talent he played with. Neither is Steph cause he played with KD they get their due. I mean ppl were in here no brainier saying the modern era is Bron-Steph.

The domination that the Lakers had over the Spurs in the 2000s isn't disputable. Neither is Bean's performances. You can try and twist it however you want. There's yet to be an argument saying why Tim should be over him.
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Bron isn't getting questioned because he is clear cut above the second best player of that era

Steph doesn't get the KD slander because he won before And after KD. KD MAD the move to GSW, Steph didn't go to him.

However, Both players benefitted from playing with high level all-timers.

My only issue with using head to head numbers with Kobe vs TD is it ignores it wasn't JUST Kobe vs. TD. I just found Using THAT as being illogical.

I think that is a fair criticism of using head to head with THOSE 2.
 
Brosizzlew30.23 said:
It's not about whose game looks prettier or more flashy. It's about who got more individual and team leadership skills on the court that translated to so much championship success in a decade that it made that star stand heads above his competition.

Duncan got about 3 moves or go to shots on offense. Kobe got too many to count. As we all know, Bryant got just about as many moves as Jordan ntm he bit some of Hakeem's moves as well.

Duncan got the low post turnaround or face up bank shot, the jump hook in the lane, and the drop step. Kobe got all that and then some. And he can beat you with his left hand lol. Bottom line is Kobe is greater than Tim overall.

It ain't about how each player catches the eye of the beholder, it's about how many more weapons Kobe got than Timmy thus making him the better overall player during the prime of their careers (00-10).

Again, per the eye test, if you watchin' you know.
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You say this (which is a glowing endorsement for TD btw...) and then go on to talk about Kobe's bag at length :lol:
 
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