and we're done

Shump for Dudley makes no sense for us. We lose our perimeter defender and get another Novak that can shoot off the dribble. Not to mention, Dudley get's paid more (a lot more) and he's up for a new deal sooner than Shumpert. This makes absolutely NO sense for us.

If anything a deal for Shumpert and Dudley straight up favors the Suns a lot more than it does for us. We'd be foolish to pull on this deal.

This is all BS to me and I think the Knicks are "listening" to offers to get Shumpert motivated. We should know how Woodson gets in his players heads by now. This has to be a wake up call for Shumpert.

And for the people saying, "Whatever gets us closer to a championship", How does that make any sense?

To get to a championship--We'll need perimeter defenders to guard wing players and Dudley doesn't do that for us. It'll hurt us more than helps us.
 
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nycknicks105 said:
Shump for Dudley makes no sense for us. We lose our perimeter defender and get another Novak that can shoot off the dribble. Not to mention, Dudley get's paid more (a lot more) and he's up for a new deal sooner than Shumpert. This makes absolutely NO sense for us.

If anything a deal for Shumpert and Dudley straight up favors the Suns a lot more than it does for us. We'd be foolish to pull on this deal.

This is all BS to me and I think the Knicks are "listening" to offers to get Shumpert motivated. We should know how Woodson gets in his players heads by now. This has to be a wake up call for Shumpert.

And for the people saying, "Whatever gets us closer to a championship", How does that make any sense?

To get to a championship--We'll need perimeter defenders to guard wing players and Dudley doesn't do that for us. It'll hurt us more than helps us.
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You're underselling Dudley a bit. I love Iman but last year he shot 40% from the field and 30% from 3. This year he's shooting 35% from the field and a good 39% from 3. With Kidd and JR playing a lot of SG, you're CRAZY if you don't think Dudley is better than Iman this year. Probably a better defender on SFs, a much better shooter, and someone who's a lot more comfortable playing off the ball. No, he doesn't bring that lockdown D Iman might bring on PGs and SGs and he doesn't bring the athleticism or potential he does - but it's definitely something for the Knicks to think about.
 
We don't need another shooter though. We need a good perimeter defender. Dudley is not a better defender than Shump.

What is Dudley bringing to the table that a current Knick doesn't already provide us?

I'd much rather hear rumors of us signing a big man for the rest of the season. Not some sideways deal.
 
Master Zik said:
We don't need another shooter though. We need a good perimeter defender. Dudley is not a better defender than Shump.

What is Dudley bringing to the table that a current Knick doesn't already provide us?

I'd much rather hear rumors of us signing a big man for the rest of the season. Not some sideways deal.
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This.

I'm dumbfounded by how some of us are cool with trading our best perimeter defender and youngest/most athletic player for Jared Dudley. An older scoring G/F getting paid more money for a shorter period. I don't even see how that move makes us better in the short term. Do we really need more scoring at the 3?

I'll take Shump's defense and athleticism over Jared Dudely's dime-a-dozen offensive 'prowess.'
 
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Thank goodness Knicks fans aren't drinking any of this Dudley Kool Aid. There's nothing about this trade that benefits the Knicks. If we have a chance at a championship, you know defense will get you there. That means Shumpert & Chandler need to return to form.

I think his return might have been rushed, but not by much.
 
7thAve btn 31stN33rd St said:
DubA169 said:
Only if he returns to form. His defense so far has been terrible. It's sad to watch him like this
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From what I understand, majority of athletes who have ACL reconstruction are way better on their second year. Their knee hasnt quite caught up with the body yet i guess.
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I don't understand how his jumpshot didn't vastly improve though.

I remember when I tore my ACL, I couldn't do anythng but shoot. I became so much of a better shooter because that's all I could do :lol:

He's ten games in. i'll give him some more time.
 
I'd have to know what the protection on that pick is before I'd definitely say yes or no - but Jared Dudley is a pretty good defender. Is he a lock down defender? No, but we're sure Iman will be in a position to be this year? Dudley makes Melo playing the 4 easier, and would fit in seamlessly on offense when Felton and Chandler have the PNR game rolling.

To play devil's advocate, I think of it like this - if he's absolutely vital to have on the floor in a series vs Chicago - it comes at an expense elsewhere. We're all in agreement that JR is this teams best SG, right? So, to get Iman on the floor, I think you have to go either Felton/Iman/JR/Melo/Chandler OR Felton/Iman/Melo/Amare/Chandler. The first lineup is too small to play Chicago, will get murdered on the boards + on the block. 2nd lineup, Bulls are elite defensively and defending PNR, and you're asking Iman to be the guy spacing the floor. This takes away what we've been great and forcing things back to isolation with Melo IMO. If we are committed to the 'Big 3' playing together, I just do not see it happening with Iman. Personally, I'd let Felton and JR take their chances with Rose and let him shoot 25 times off surgery. I don't even think playing smaller vs Chicago is possible but if were to be, Dudley/Melo pairing at 3/4 gives you a slightly better chance.

Necessary match-up #2 seems to be Miami:

You can go small here with either the 2 PG's + Iman or PG +Iman/JR at 2/3. The problem is, you're asking Carmelo to guard LeBron. As this roster stands right now, we have nobody outside of Carmelo that can guard him. There's no insurance if LeBron picks up quick fouls on him other than sending JR to the slaughter like last year. This is a match-up where I think Dudley helps. He fits in terrifically as a spot up shooter off of PNR (his best asset on offense) and is someone who can give Melo a breather and wear on LeBron, or try to. If you go with the 'Big 3' together in this series, it's the same problem...how can you justify Iman over JR on the offensive end? Again, I'll take my chances with JR defending. And on the Carmelo being the only guy matching up with LeBron thing - if you're goal is to really win a title, if we somehow get out of the East - there's more than likely another once-in-a-generation SF waiting for us.

Other match-ups - Rondo is gone (Dudley as extra defender vs Pierce would be nice(r) - back court defense is needed for who? Bradley? Lee? Terry?). Brooklyn - They stink. Atlanta - they stink. Milwaukee- sure, I see Iman's value in that series, but if we can't beat them it's not meant to be. Indiana - you almost have to play big like vs Chi. JR is better option at SG.

I like Iman, he has a bright future but I lean to taking that trade MOSTLY because this teams window is pretty small - and there is a chance Shumpert just isn't ready for the role of 'stopper' this season and can't find himself on the floor that much. I think Dudley is at least as good of a player right now and adds value on offense with how this team operates when they're moving the ball and working off of Felton/Chandler. It's also not sacrificing a ton defensively when you take into account LeBron and Paul Pierce. JR is better, and even with Kidd slowing down lately the 2 PG lineup has been this team's best lineup (next to a small sample size of Felton/JR/Big 3). I've just thought for a while Iman is an odd-man out this year and relegated to 15-20 minutes when it counts.

Why I would say no - have to be sure we can re-sign JR this summer. If not, then I wouldn't do it because there's not much left of Kidd and it'd make the back court of awfully thin. Don't need to add an extra SF for long-term. And if the pick is protected, you're out of luck finding a back court player to fill in easily. (If the pick is say, the Lakers that the Suns own this year and it's 14th or 15th - you can find a back court defensive guy pretty easily in theory - Franklin, Oladipo, McCollum, etc). It's a short-sighted move, for sure. So I see both ends of it.

Other reason, Woodson may really want to forge ahead with the 'Big 3' together and then Dudley would be rendered useless and JR/Iman can be swapped in and out depending on match up/flow.
 
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pr0phecy718 said:
HarlemToTheBronx said:
It's been like 10 games since returning from a devastating ACL injury. Talk about knee jerk.
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This was the same case with Stoudemire when he returned. Dudes are impatient.
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hey man i admitted i was wrong. stop rubbing it in 
mad.gif
 
Tired of hearin Stephen A. Smith saying Knicks aren't a threat to the Heat this season. Just bc Bron and Wade have a pretty efficient game against the Clippers he feels like the Heat are invincible.

We didn't beat Miami twice by 20 points or anything...
 
nycknicks105 said:
I don't understand how his jumpshot didn't vastly improve though.

I remember when I tore my ACL, I couldn't do anythng but shoot. I became so much of a better shooter because that's all I could do :lol:

He's ten games in. i'll give him some more time.
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Serious? I see a GREAT improvement in Shumps jump shot.


Aside from Shump being an Overall better player then Dudley while also being younger, this kid LOVES being a Knicks.

Grunwald BETTER not drop the ball.
 
I don't want us to trade Iman for this dude, Dudley.

I know we don't have shooters, but selling low on Shump now ain't the way to go imo.
 
I wouldn't mind this deal honestly. A short term move for a run at the title...it's the type of move constantly made by teams in contention
 
After that spanking the Heat gave these dudes a couple days ago they might try to come out with a vengeance :lol:

Lets pull out that W though
 
I feel good about this game. CP3 is coming off an injury and they need Beldsoe to beat us today. Only he'll penetrate into the paint. Billups is a toss us, considering it's his 2nd game back, but it's against the Knicks. You know how much he wants to stick to us for dropping him to get Tyson.

If we can contain the penetration and shooting--we'll be in good shape to win this game. Matt Barnes isn't going to stop Melo and neither is Blake.
 
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