Eddie Johnson: "Kobe is the best offensive player ever."

[5am6oody72]

While I don't think Kobe is as good of a player as MJ, I'm tired of people saying MJ was a better teammate/leader and how he made all his teammatesbetter, and that's the deciding factor. Jordan was a pretty harsh teammate and trashed his guys numerous times in the press, we've all seen the quotes(they're pretty hilarious

) posted on here many times before. Not to mention he punched his own teammate in practice.

Also, he was playing with Scottie Pippen(lots of people were calling him the most complete player in the league besides MJ), Rodman(one of the best pound forpound rebounders ever), Steve Kerr (great outside shooter) and Toni Kukoc. Not exactly scrubs that Jordan turned into stars. Kukoc was considered to be thebest player in the world not in the NBA at one point, so he was established before he came to the Bulls. Not to mention the Bulls went 55-27 and still made itto the 2nd round of the playoffs (I believe, maybe they got knocked out in the first round, the point is there was only a couple game drop off from the yearbefore when Mike played). If there's one thing I will give him extra credit for it's that he did it without a great big man, which is hard to do in anyera.

While I do view MJ as the greatest all around player ever, he was also a marketing creation the likes of which we've never seen. I remember seeing SI forKids polls that showed MJ as the consensus favorite athlete years after he'd retired. He became such a hero that people forget that he WAS flawed. My postwasn't meant to characterize him as a bad teammate or anything, but to kind of bring him back down to earth.

 

[sohi 23]

Originally Posted by 5am6oody72

While I don't think Kobe is as good of a player as MJ, I'm tired of people saying MJ was a better teammate/leader and how he made all his teammates better, and that's the deciding factor. Jordan was a pretty harsh teammate and trashed his guys numerous times in the press, we've all seen the quotes (they're pretty hilarious

) posted on here many times before. Not to mention he punched his own teammate in practice.

Also, he was playing with Scottie Pippen(lots of people were calling him the most complete player in the league besides MJ), Rodman(one of the best pound for pound rebounders ever), Steve Kerr (great outside shooter) and Toni Kukoc. Not exactly scrubs that Jordan turned into stars. Kukoc was considered to be the best player in the world not in the NBA at one point, so he was established before he came to the Bulls. Not to mention the Bulls went 55-27 and still made it to the 2nd round of the playoffs (I believe, maybe they got knocked out in the first round, the point is there was only a couple game drop off from the year before when Mike played). If there's one thing I will give him extra credit for it's that he did it without a great big man, which is hard to do in any era.

While I do view MJ as the greatest all around player ever, he was also a marketing creation the likes of which we've never seen. I remember seeing SI for Kids polls that showed MJ as the consensus favorite athlete years after he'd retired. He became such a hero that people forget that he WAS flawed. My post wasn't meant to characterize him as a bad teammate or anything, but to kind of bring him back down to earth.

Good post
Nobody in the NBA can win a title by themselves.
That was a very good Bulls team with or without Jordan.
Jordan just took them to another level

 

[sw33nskill]

Kobe is the best offensive player. But Jordan was better overall.

 

[thehealthinspector]

forreal??? (peep the sig)

 

[thehealthinspector]

Originally Posted by Mw2889

I would never choose a guard as the best offensive player ever.
Centers getting points in the paint and kicking the ball out > Jumpshooting and distributing off the dribble
Shaq is the best offensive player ever, regardless of his arsenal or finesse.
Kobe might be the best offensive guard of all time, not the best offensive player.

id have to disagree with u there, i think it was either kenny or charles that said it but they said "centers play cause their big, guards play causetheir good - and i think theres some truth to that, im not gonna say that u dont have to have talent to be a center or even a good center cause thats juststupid but if u are a tall center with decent/average skills, u can have a place in the league and its true that to be the best u gotta be better than everyoneelse. - with that said, when it comes to basketball, i do think that players under 6'10 really need more skills and talent and physical attributes inorder to separate themselves from the pack, im not gonna badmouth greg oden but the guy obviously had an easier time separting himself from all the othercenters out there where as a guard, someone like mayo really has to prove through his play that he's above the rest

 

[g00nie goo goo]

Alright guys, the great thing about professional or college sports is that it always progresses. Every generation has produced its share of GREAT players.Before Michael Jordan took over the NBA, we're forgetting that there were once players that were considered as the "Greatest of All Time."

George Mikan was one of the first superstars of the NBA, then came the Celtics stars such as Russell, Havlicek, and Cousy who dominated the 60's. WiltChamberlain was a juggernaut in the 60's and 70's and is regarded as one of the greatest offensive players in the history of the league. Kareem thentook the reins from him, followed by Dr. J, Magic Johnson, Bird, and then came Michael Jordan.

I grew up watching Jordan, I'm in my mid-20's and I witnessed his greatness in the 90's. I can see why a lot of people from my generation regardhim as the greatest of all time. He has six rings, all these individual honors, the swagger, and the commercial appeal. But I'm sure that when thegeneration that watched Magic and Bird were witnessing the rise of Jordan, there was this same type of chaos and debate regarding who is better.

We have our sentimental feelings toward Jordan. Our childhood and teen years consisted of watching him play for the Bulls and rising to the top. We bought hisshoes (and we still do), his jersey, his trading card, and basically made him into an almost religious figure. Nobody is better than the other. Kobe is asuperstar and dominant player in this generation as Jordan was during his time. Comparing these two players can be fun and interesting at times, but in realitywe really shouldn't.

MJ will be MJ. His legacy is untouchable. Just as the young kids right now should NOT be saying that Kobe is better than Jordan (frankly, I don't thinkthey've even seen MJ at his prime), I think the older cats should NOT be so stubborn and refuse to give Kobe Bryant his props. Just as Magic and Birdhanded the reins of the NBA to MJ, it's just right that Kobe should have his place in history as well.

That's all I gotta say about that. I'm bored in class

 

[vezon]

OH MY GOD!!!111 HOW COULD THEY?!?!

 

[bullsrepeat3peat]

Originally Posted by G00NIE GOO GOO

Alright guys, the great thing about professional or college sports is that it always progresses. Every generation has produced its share of GREAT players. Before Michael Jordan took over the NBA, we're forgetting that there were once players that were considered as the "Greatest of All Time."

George Mikan was one of the first superstars of the NBA, then came the Celtics stars such as Russell, Havlicek, and Cousy who dominated the 60's. Wilt Chamberlain was a juggernaut in the 60's and 70's and is regarded as one of the greatest offensive players in the history of the league. Kareem then took the reins from him, followed by Dr. J, Magic Johnson, Bird, and then came Michael Jordan.

I grew up watching Jordan, I'm in my mid-20's and I witnessed his greatness in the 90's. I can see why a lot of people from my generation regard him as the greatest of all time. He has six rings, all these individual honors, the swagger, and the commercial appeal. But I'm sure that when the generation that watched Magic and Bird were witnessing the rise of Jordan, there was this same type of chaos and debate regarding who is better.

We have our sentimental feelings toward Jordan. Our childhood and teen years consisted of watching him play for the Bulls and rising to the top. We bought his shoes (and we still do), his jersey, his trading card, and basically made him into an almost religious figure. Nobody is better than the other. Kobe is a superstar and dominant player in this generation as Jordan was during his time. Comparing these two players can be fun and interesting at times, but in reality we really shouldn't.

MJ will be MJ. His legacy is untouchable. Just as the young kids right now should NOT be saying that Kobe is better than Jordan (frankly, I don't think they've even seen MJ at his prime), I think the older cats should NOT be so stubborn and refuse to give Kobe Bryant his props. Just as Magic and Bird handed the reins of the NBA to MJ, it's just right that Kobe should have his place in history as well.

That's all I gotta say about that. I'm bored in class

yup.... couldn't agree more......

I just hate all the hype surrounding all these players these days compared to back then.... At least I know I can compare two players from an unbias point ofview without letting my opinion get in the way, unlike most NT'ers who jump to quick conclusions to defend their favorite player... Are there aspects ofthe game that Kobe is better than Jordan in? Of course... While I'd personally say he might have more ways to score from the perimeter, he isn't asefficient a scorer as Jordan was.........

I also don't think that Mike is necessarily the "clear cut" GOAT... I do believe a legitimate case canbe made for Bird, EJ, Jordan, Wilt, Kareem, & Russell.... Maybe even the Big O....

 

[thehealthinspector]

Originally Posted by G00NIE GOO GOO

Alright guys, the great thing about professional or college sports is that it always progresses. Every generation has produced its share of GREAT players. Before Michael Jordan took over the NBA, we're forgetting that there were once players that were considered as the "Greatest of All Time."

George Mikan was one of the first superstars of the NBA, then came the Celtics stars such as Russell, Havlicek, and Cousy who dominated the 60's. Wilt Chamberlain was a juggernaut in the 60's and 70's and is regarded as one of the greatest offensive players in the history of the league. Kareem then took the reins from him, followed by Dr. J, Magic Johnson, Bird, and then came Michael Jordan.

I grew up watching Jordan, I'm in my mid-20's and I witnessed his greatness in the 90's. I can see why a lot of people from my generation regard him as the greatest of all time. He has six rings, all these individual honors, the swagger, and the commercial appeal. But I'm sure that when the generation that watched Magic and Bird were witnessing the rise of Jordan, there was this same type of chaos and debate regarding who is better.

We have our sentimental feelings toward Jordan. Our childhood and teen years consisted of watching him play for the Bulls and rising to the top. We bought his shoes (and we still do), his jersey, his trading card, and basically made him into an almost religious figure. Nobody is better than the other. Kobe is a superstar and dominant player in this generation as Jordan was during his time. Comparing these two players can be fun and interesting at times, but in reality we really shouldn't.

MJ will be MJ. His legacy is untouchable. Just as the young kids right now should NOT be saying that Kobe is better than Jordan (frankly, I don't think they've even seen MJ at his prime), I think the older cats should NOT be so stubborn and refuse to give Kobe Bryant his props. Just as Magic and Bird handed the reins of the NBA to MJ, it's just right that Kobe should have his place in history as well.

That's all I gotta say about that. I'm bored in class

- goin off of what this guy said - im also in my mid 20s and i also remeber watching jordan in his prime, especially the early 90s and 96-98, im too youngto remember his late 80s, i witnessed jordan play while i was growing up, especially his finals series against seattle

, and ive always been an fan of his game
- what im saying is that i do accept michael jordan as the greatest basketball player ever above everyone - BUT, when i grow up, something tells me thatI'm going to remember kobe bryant more than MJ, maybe its cause i watched MJ when i was young and Im watching KB currently and im a lot smarter now BUTtheres something about kobe's game that im going to remember, a lot of people may not notice it, some may deny it, but i really do think that kobe plays ASIF he wants to be remembered as the greatest, something jordan never really did, and that even he knows it himself that it may be an impossible mountain toclimb with some of the ignorant doubters out there as G00Nie posted but yet he's confident enough to still want it

 

[AIR J XIII]

Mike is my all-time favorite player, and Kobe is my second...

but until one of them averages 50 for a season and cause the league to make some changes so they cant dominate as much, my vote for greatest offensive playergoes to...

Wilt Chaimberlain.

 

[nycknicks105]

Originally Posted by Xtapolapacetl

This moron isn't the first guy to disrespect Jordan like this. Kenny Smith said that George Gervin and Kobe Bryant were both better scorers than Jordan. I guess it's just them trying to keep their jobs and keep the ratings high, people are bored with hearing that MJ was the greatest over the past couple of decades so they have to come with some outrageous claims, no matter how wrong they are.

Anyway, the only thing Kobe has on Jordan offensively is 3 point shooting.

That is very true.

The only aspect of the game that Kobe has over MJ is his 3 pt game.

 

[marsiv]

The only aspect of the game that Kobe has over MJ is his 3 pt game




Not 3 pt game, range.


Ive watched both them play numerous occations, and MJ never saw double and triple teams like Kobe did, and still hit the shots Kobe hit. You always see Jordanwith great finishes around the rim. How many fade away three points with his left hand have we seen Kobe hit? Or dude just pulling up with 3 guys in his face.Jordan was better overall and is the GOAT imo, but Kobe is the better offensive player. I mean, KB is still in his prime and has another 3-5 years left in it.IMO he's having the best year of his career.




I'll leave this up to Phil Jackson, who as their coach, has the best judgement call out of anyone...


" Kobe is better with the ball, Jordan was better without it"

 

[downtown43]

Kobe probably is better than MJ OFFENSIVELY, i dont understand why people are getting worked up over that statement

some people just interpret everything as people saying Kobe > MJ. he didn't say Kobe was better than MJ, he's basically just saying Kobe has a morecomplete and polished offensive game, that's all.

 

[SneakerProSr.]

I need to know why Kobe is better than MJ offensively.

Jordan scored more points more efficiently.

Kobe has more range but whoopty damn doo.

 

[marsiv]

I need to know why Kobe is better than MJ offensively.




http://www.nba.com/games/20060122/TORLAL/boxscore.html

http://www.nba.com/games/20051220/DALLAL/boxscore.html


Theres 2 examples. He only scored 81, then 62 points in 30 minutes, out scoring the entire Dallas team, than sat out the 4th quarter. But whoopty damn doo.

 

[bullsrepeat3peat]

[color= rgb(255, 0, 0)]Mars[/color], that's a good point.....

I agree, but do you think that Mike couldn't have even got close to 81 pts with 46 field goal attempts & 20 free throw attempts?....... Also I look atFG % and efficiency when evaluating scorers... MJ was more efficient.. Like I said my opinion is that Kobe is a more complete or physically offensive player(meaning he has more moves on the perimeter), but not more efficient. He's never topped 46% shooting from the field for a season in his career.. MJ hastopped 53%... but I guess it' depends on how you evaluate a scorer or maybe its the fact that MJ didn't attempt as many 3 pt shots.... who knows...


edit

Originally Posted by Three6mafia2007


so true...

and

at the thread starter

Originally Posted by E3LAL

at the thread starter

I just find it funny that if I had posted this and cosigned without any objection your reactions would probably be different

.............

 

[three6mafia2007]

man, people can't have opinions anymore?

it's not like he said Danny Granger (no offense) was the best ever. Kobe is AT LEAST in the discussion. sheesh.

so true...

and

at the thread starter

 

[s dizzel]

who cares? everyone has their opinions on whos the best ever... I dont think anyone will ever agree on whos the best ever

 

[marsiv]

I agree, but do you think that Mike couldn't have even got close to 81 pts with 46 field goal attempts & 20 free throw attempts?.......




I agree. There's dozens of guys in NBA history that could have gotten close with 46 shots and 20 free throws. But the fact is that Kobe did it any no oneelse did.

 

[rhugghed114]

Originally Posted by I NaSmatic I

Originally Posted by illmaticsoulchild

Eddie Johnson: "Kobe is the best offensive player ever."

Eddie is an idiot. If he wants to know who the best offensive player is, all he has to do is look down the Phoenix Suns' bench and look for number fifty-two.

clippers legend eric piatkowski

Piatkowski is freaking

in NBA Live 2005!

 

[downtown43]

Like I said my opinion is that Kobe is a more complete or physically offensive player (meaning he has more moves on the perimeter), but not more efficient.

okay then. i'm pretty sure thats what the discussion is about.

no one is saying that Kobe has been a more efficient/reliable scorer. Tim Duncan is a more efficient scorer than the both of those guys if you go by FG%. ithink people are just saying that after we have seen the two of them play, Kobe appears to have the superior offensive game. thats all.

its like if someone said AI is a better scoring PG than Magic. we all know Magic is the GOAT overall PG, but most people will agree that the scoring aspect ofAI 's game is superior to Magic.

 

[acbboyz84]

Kobe > Jordan.

 

[arog27]

Kobe is awesome, and I've grown to love his game, but MJ is still the G.O.A. time.

 

[bullsrepeat3peat]

[color= rgb(255, 0, 0)]DOWNTOWN[/color], I guess I misunderstood it then... I just can't judge players purely off ofphysical abilities though.... if that was the case then Vince would still be a top 5 player in the league..... I guess he meant that Kobe is a more skilledscorer, which I can agree with... but more physically skilled scorer doesn't necessarily mean a better scorer...

but regardless KB is still one of the greatest scorers and players of all time... there's no denying that..

 

[the pga tour]

Originally Posted by BullsRepeat3Peat

[color= rgb(255, 0, 0)]DOWNTOWN[/color], I guess I misunderstood it then... I just can't judge players purely off of physical abilities though.... if that was the case then Vince would still be a top 5 player in the league..... I guess he meant that Kobe is a more skilled scorer, which I can agree with... but more physically skilled scorer doesn't necessarily mean a better scorer...

but regardless KB is still one of the greatest scorers and players of all time... there's no denying that..

not to nitpick, because everyone already has..but if you thought that highly of KB, why did you make this post in such disgust, in the first place?