Kobe/Lebron Title question vol I need help!

Originally Posted by mogzz04


  
What's your definition of "carry a team"?

Because Scottie was playing at an MVP level in 93-94, and was probably a Hue Hollins call away from the ECF that season.

IMO, Scottie was a great player in his own right regardless of MJ.

Also, Pau was an All-Star before Kobe/Lakers. And he led those Hubie coached Grizz teams to 50 win seasons and playoff appearances...not his fault he was playing in such a small market like Memphis...I mean look at OJ Mayo, hyped as hell in HS and college but dude hardly getting any buzz even though he's performing really well for a 2 year pro.
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being the known primary man on the team.  scottie was great, but i don't think he could have carried those bulls to a chip without michael.  larry legend played with a couple other HoFers, but everyone knew who was supposed to have the ball when it counted.  shaquille carried the lakers through those first three even though kobe was great in his own right and kobe is carrying the lakers now even though pau is becoming great in his own right.  scottie and pau would not be considered this great if they never played with jordan and bryant respectively.

  
 
Originally Posted by peks03

Originally Posted by al3x89


i don't really like lebron (i don't hate him as a basketball player, just as a person), but i disagree here.

last season he averaged 8.6APG while scoring 29.7PPG... that's pretty incredible.

he gets his team involved as much as he can...
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i didn't mean that LBJ doesn't get assists, because he obviously does.  he has great all-around offensive/defensive individual stats.  he needs to get his teammates involved with the intangibles like getting good players to be great and role players to win a game here and there in a series when LBJ has an off night. 

kareem and magic made each other great along with worthy later on, but magic also inspired role players like byron scott, jamaal wilkes, kurt rambis to play above their level.  larry legend did the same with dennis johnson, danny ainge, etc.  i'm pretty sure scottie couldn't ever carry a team, but playing alongside jordan and now he's considered great.  shaq made kobe so great in those first 3 championships that now kobe is leading his own teams.  nobody had even heard of pao until he started playing with kobe and now there are some people that want to hand pao a finals mvp.  an eternal role player d-fish won game 3 of this last boston series and a few other games here and there and i could argue that another role player in artest was game 7's mvp.  greatness inspires greatness...or others to play to their full potential at least.
tongue.gif


LBJ will most likely win a couple chips, but he needs to learn the intangibles of how to win.  he's undoubtedly a great individual player, but if i had to pick between LBJ and kobe right now i would take kobe.  i think kobe finally has a grasp on what it takes to be a champion (...he can hit a clutch free-throw) and he can actually will his team to win with whatever it takes.

  
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What the hell?

- Pau was an all-star putting up nice numbers before heading to LA

- greatness inspires greatness? what is there some kind of spirit that great players are armed with that they can hand to other players on any given possession?

I think you're underestimating the firepower, effort and talent those players you mentioned were and are capable of.

you can't teach height, effort, and agility to an extent.
 
Originally Posted by peks03

Originally Posted by al3x89


i don't really like lebron (i don't hate him as a basketball player, just as a person), but i disagree here.

last season he averaged 8.6APG while scoring 29.7PPG... that's pretty incredible.

he gets his team involved as much as he can...
Click to expand...
i didn't mean that LBJ doesn't get assists, because he obviously does.  he has great all-around offensive/defensive individual stats.  he needs to get his teammates involved with the intangibles like getting good players to be great and role players to win a game here and there in a series when LBJ has an off night. 

kareem and magic made each other great along with worthy later on, but magic also inspired role players like byron scott, jamaal wilkes, kurt rambis to play above their level.  larry legend did the same with dennis johnson, danny ainge, etc.  i'm pretty sure scottie couldn't ever carry a team, but playing alongside jordan and now he's considered great.  shaq made kobe so great in those first 3 championships that now kobe is leading his own teams.  nobody had even heard of pao until he started playing with kobe and now there are some people that want to hand pao a finals mvp.  an eternal role player d-fish won game 3 of this last boston series and a few other games here and there and i could argue that another role player in artest was game 7's mvp.  greatness inspires greatness...or others to play to their full potential at least.
tongue.gif


LBJ will most likely win a couple chips, but he needs to learn the intangibles of how to win.  he's undoubtedly a great individual player, but if i had to pick between LBJ and kobe right now i would take kobe.  i think kobe finally has a grasp on what it takes to be a champion (...he can hit a clutch free-throw) and he can actually will his team to win with whatever it takes.

  
Click to expand...
What the hell?

- Pau was an all-star putting up nice numbers before heading to LA

- greatness inspires greatness? what is there some kind of spirit that great players are armed with that they can hand to other players on any given possession?

I think you're underestimating the firepower, effort and talent those players you mentioned were and are capable of.

you can't teach height, effort, and agility to an extent.
 
Pao tho?

This will turn into another Kobe vs LeBron thread. Might as well just bump the one about LeBron being stopped by the Celtics defense thread...
 
Pao tho?

This will turn into another Kobe vs LeBron thread. Might as well just bump the one about LeBron being stopped by the Celtics defense thread...
 
Originally Posted by peks03

Originally Posted by mogzz04


  
What's your definition of "carry a team"?

Because Scottie was playing at an MVP level in 93-94, and was probably a Hue Hollins call away from the ECF that season.

IMO, Scottie was a great player in his own right regardless of MJ.

Also, Pau was an All-Star before Kobe/Lakers. And he led those Hubie coached Grizz teams to 50 win seasons and playoff appearances...not his fault he was playing in such a small market like Memphis...I mean look at OJ Mayo, hyped as hell in HS and college but dude hardly getting any buzz even though he's performing really well for a 2 year pro.
Click to expand...
being the known primary man on the team.  scottie was great, but i don't think he could have carried those bulls to a chip without michael.  larry legend played with a couple other HoFers, but everyone knew who was supposed to have the ball when it counted.  shaquille carried the lakers through those first three even though kobe was great in his own right and kobe is carrying the lakers now even though pau is becoming great in his own right.  scottie and pau would not be considered this great if they never played with jordan and bryant respectively.

  
Click to expand...
MJ was retired then...


edit: im definately not sayin they would be the Rockets tho.
    
 
Originally Posted by peks03

Originally Posted by mogzz04


  
What's your definition of "carry a team"?

Because Scottie was playing at an MVP level in 93-94, and was probably a Hue Hollins call away from the ECF that season.

IMO, Scottie was a great player in his own right regardless of MJ.

Also, Pau was an All-Star before Kobe/Lakers. And he led those Hubie coached Grizz teams to 50 win seasons and playoff appearances...not his fault he was playing in such a small market like Memphis...I mean look at OJ Mayo, hyped as hell in HS and college but dude hardly getting any buzz even though he's performing really well for a 2 year pro.
Click to expand...
being the known primary man on the team.  scottie was great, but i don't think he could have carried those bulls to a chip without michael.  larry legend played with a couple other HoFers, but everyone knew who was supposed to have the ball when it counted.  shaquille carried the lakers through those first three even though kobe was great in his own right and kobe is carrying the lakers now even though pau is becoming great in his own right.  scottie and pau would not be considered this great if they never played with jordan and bryant respectively.

  
Click to expand...
MJ was retired then...


edit: im definately not sayin they would be the Rockets tho.
    
 
Just funny/sad how most threads end up being about the same stuff. Do you all ever get tired of talking about KObe vs Jordan vs JOrdan vs LeBron with a hint of SHaq?
 
Just funny/sad how most threads end up being about the same stuff. Do you all ever get tired of talking about KObe vs Jordan vs JOrdan vs LeBron with a hint of SHaq?
 
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