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No but they went to the Finals in Penny's second season and Shaq's third.
Great accomplishment.
Great accomplishment.
Let's talk about Kobe's legacy......try your hardest to be objective...
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by doublejs07,
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i don't watch wrestling, but did you just say Kobe will not go down as one of the greatest players to touch the court? are you dumb?
Kobe has already carved out a pretty legendary legacy WITHOUT Shaq. in the 5 years of Kobe's career without Shaq, he's averaging 30ppg, has an MVP, hasa Finals appearance, and posted an epic 35ppg season that is #8 all-time. just off of that, he will be remembered as an all-time great. leading his team to achampionship + Finals MVP would just be the clincher.
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Originally Posted by Mamba MVP
I have a question, if he DOES win another ring, where will he rack in the pantheon of all time greats? And what will the haters be able to say then?
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Focus my man. Kobe has done the same...It's not quite what we're trying to pinpoint exactly.
mjshoefanatic
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3rd best after MJ and Lebron
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Kobe also went to the Finals... and he had no Penny Hardaway or Shaq on his team.
edit: dude below me vvvvvv
you seriously think the all-time ranking is
1) Jordan
2) Lebron
3) Kobe
???
don't ever post about basketball again
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I just included the Orlando team in the convo to show that Shaq has had success everywhere that he has gone. Simmer down.
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It looks like that COULD happen, but right now he plays second fiddle to MJ and he's got to be ahead of Lebron. Lebron stil lhas a lot to PROVE. Potentialdoesn't buy championships. It's bringing that potential to fruition. And until Lebron wins nobody can say anything that differs.
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One of da best, But is a cry baby....
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Considering we're in the S&T forum of Niketalk...that's asking for too much from most here.
To answer your question, a lot of people have a tendency to remember what you did last instead of the entire span of a career...so him not winning again would have his name linked with Shaq as one of the NBA's greatest duos and Kobe as a great player in his own right (took the throne after MJ), but he'd also be remembered for not winning one "on his own".
But I think there's still too many years left in his career and unforseen events that will either help/hurt his legacy...in my opinion, in order to separate himself from Shaq and Phil's image from the Laker 3 peat, he has to win at least one more 'chip before his career is over. Maybe two.
He didn't win a title with Penny though...
It's not because of Shaq leaving that the Heat haven't won any more rings...they were just an old team. I hope people don't assume that.
But I feel what you're sayin', we're both on the same page.
Illoquent, I hear what you're saying...however, I totally disagree w. your thought on him having many years left in his career. He'sgoing to be starting his 14th NBA season come Novemeber. He's played a lot of basketball, and IMO it's on a matter of time before his body reallystarts breaking down. I'd say he'll give it another 2-3 seasons then weigh his options. Remember all that speculation about him potentially finishinghis career in Europe? Kobe goes to the beat of his own drum, so I wouldn't be totally shocked to see him "retire" early from the NBA and explorehis options elsewhere *cough* Italy *cough*
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Agreed
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My dude said Kobe is like Stevie Ray...ouch.
When it's all said and done, Kobe's individual accomplishments > Shaq's...but that might not mean much if he doesn't win at least one morechampionship from here on out.
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Originally Posted by mjshoefanatic
3rd best after MJ and Lebron
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I'm going with the assumption that he plays in the NBA until 38-42, which is around the age when most of the greats of any sport bow out at.If he goes to Italy, that would be an unforeseen event that would REALLY hurt his legacy IMO...it doesn't matter if he wins 8 championships in a row overthere, he's only going to be judged on what he did in the NBA vs. his peers.
ghenges
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I think the rape errrrr adultery issue affected him more than people would like to believe. As good as he is now, I think he lost something after thathappened.
During the three-peat, you can argue just how important he was to that team until you are blue in the face. However, after you analyze everyone's role onthe team, I think it's clear that Shaq was most important during that era.
No let's look at things after the Jordan era - no counting the lock out season* (sorry Knick fans).
From 2000-2002, Shaq was the best player on the planet. FORGET that it was all just brute force and size. That doesn't matter. He was the best and mostvaluable player on the planet for those 3 years. From 2003-2007, I would give the nod to Tim Duncan. 3 championships in 5 years and playing strong every yearearns you that honor. Then in 2007 to present, I think the nod goes to Lebron.
So where is Kobe in all of this? You can argue that he was the second best player next to Shaq, Duncan and Lebron in each of their respected eras.
So what is Kobe's legacy?
He's been the second best player in the league for the last 9 years.
During the three-peat, you can argue just how important he was to that team until you are blue in the face. However, after you analyze everyone's role onthe team, I think it's clear that Shaq was most important during that era.
No let's look at things after the Jordan era - no counting the lock out season* (sorry Knick fans).
From 2000-2002, Shaq was the best player on the planet. FORGET that it was all just brute force and size. That doesn't matter. He was the best and mostvaluable player on the planet for those 3 years. From 2003-2007, I would give the nod to Tim Duncan. 3 championships in 5 years and playing strong every yearearns you that honor. Then in 2007 to present, I think the nod goes to Lebron.
So where is Kobe in all of this? You can argue that he was the second best player next to Shaq, Duncan and Lebron in each of their respected eras.
So what is Kobe's legacy?
He's been the second best player in the league for the last 9 years.
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I THINK PEOPLE ARE UNDERESTIMATING HOW GOOD D-WADE IS & PENNY WAS..
WADE CARRIED THAT HEAT TEAM ON HIS BACK THAT YEAR IN THE FINALS..
ITS NOT LIKE SHAQ GOT ANOTHER RING WITH THE CURRENT KNICKS ROSTER..
SHAQ GETS WAAY 2 MUCH CREDIT FOR A VERY DEEP HEAT TEAM..
IF PENNY NEVER GOT HURT I THINK HE WOULDVE BEEN A HOF'er..
SHAQ-DIESEL HIMSELF CALLED KOBE THE GREATEST EVER, THAT TELLS YOU SOMETHING RIGHT THERE..
*for the record MJ= G.O.A.T*
WADE CARRIED THAT HEAT TEAM ON HIS BACK THAT YEAR IN THE FINALS..
ITS NOT LIKE SHAQ GOT ANOTHER RING WITH THE CURRENT KNICKS ROSTER..
SHAQ GETS WAAY 2 MUCH CREDIT FOR A VERY DEEP HEAT TEAM..
IF PENNY NEVER GOT HURT I THINK HE WOULDVE BEEN A HOF'er..
SHAQ-DIESEL HIMSELF CALLED KOBE THE GREATEST EVER, THAT TELLS YOU SOMETHING RIGHT THERE..
*for the record MJ= G.O.A.T*
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Wade > LeBron
lol
lol
mjshoefanatic
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Wade is only 1-up on Lebron. I'm sure that won't be for much longer though.
Plus, Wade never been a reg season MVP.
Plus, Wade never been a reg season MVP.
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I stand by my statement.
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It's too hard to see the future...but I do believe he needs to win without Shaq or he'll never get due credit.
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You can't be serious
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He makes a good point. The Lebron part hasnt been decided yet unless he gets a ring but everything else is spot on.
mjshoefanatic
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I like the way you think Ghenges
herman818
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As a Lakers fan first, and Bryant fan 2nd, it's not how you start. It's how you finish.
