Man opens fire on White House vol. God told me to do it

[mo matik]

[h1][/h1]

[h1]White House gunfire suspect 'obsessed by Obama'[/h1]

Oscar Ortega-Hernandez was initially stopped by police in Virginia on Friday, but was not arrested

The man supected of shooting at the White House last Friday had become obsessed with President Barack Obama, officials have told US media.

It is thought Oscar Ortega-Hernandez, 21, believed God had given him a personal mission to attack the White House, said law enforcement sources.

A US Park Police bulletin said he was "unstable with violent tendencies".

Mr Ortega is scheduled to appear in court in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, on Thursday afternoon.

He was arrested in that state on Wednesday after authorities were tipped by someone who recognised him.

Gunfire was heard between the White House and the Washington Monument on Friday evening.

Police later discovered an abandoned car with an assault rifle inside.

Two bullets were found on the south side of the the executive mansion on Tuesday, the part of the building where the president's bedroom is located.

One bullet broke a "historic" outside pane of glass but was stopped by a protective inner panel of ballistic glass. The second bullet hit the exterior of the building.

The president and first lady were not in Washington at the time, but it is not known if their two daughters, Sasha and Malia, were at home.

Secret Service officials told reporters the bullets had not yet been conclusively linked to Friday's gunfire.

Originally from the US state of Idaho, Mr Ortega was reported missing by his family on 31 October. It is thought that he had been living in the Washington DC area.

He has a history of arrests in Texas, Utah and Idaho but police say he has not been linked with any radical organisations.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-15768558

So this is back-page news in America, relegated to the footnotes of today's papers.
[h6] What frustrates us as Muslims is that had this loon been Muslim, and had he said 'Allah commanded me to wage jihad' the response would have been completely different.
[/h6]

 

[Mound Raised]

Sillyputty gon have a field day with this one.......

 

[rico x hood]

Man attacks the White House and your upset about a hypothetical situation in which the dude was Muslim. Get off your high horse

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

 

[al audi]

Thank God he wasn't a Brotha.

 

[curbyourenthusiasm]

true

but on the other hand, why glorify this lunatic?

itll just give all these disgrunted slack jawed hillbillies the motivation to try it out too

let this lame die and never be spoken of again

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Man attacks the White House and your upset about a hypothetical situation in which the dude was Muslim. Get off your high horse

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

I could not have said it better.
OP stays on his "Woe is Me!" tip.

I don't see what the problem is here. This country has a LONG history of christian domestic terrorism.

Look at how even this country's representatives act:

 

[Pathos]

Rico x Hood wrote:

---

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

shut the !@#$ up

 

[foxdawg2000]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Man attacks the White House and your upset about a hypothetical situation in which the dude was Muslim. Get off your high horse

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

I could not have said it better.
OP stays on his "Woe is Me!" tip.�

I don't see what the problem is here. This country has a LONG history of christian domestic terrorism.�

Look at how even this country's representatives act:

Largest and most notorious terrorist group in this country was and is the KKK.. I repeat it every time... But they get a pass over and over..Because it was such a large part of this country and at one point membership was in the millions... Wiki "Birth of a Nation"� They were also a Christian Based group and the media tends to forget that when  terrorism talk gets heavy..

 

[mo matik]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Man attacks the White House and your upset about a hypothetical situation in which the dude was Muslim. Get off your high horse

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

I could not have said it better.
OP stays on his "Woe is Me!" tip.

I care about the bias in the media that allows the government to do what they like in the Middle East, which mostly includes senseless killing and defending apartheid.

I'm a crybaby for caring about these things.

 

[doublejs07]

Embarrassing that he actually got away on FOOT

Glad he got caught tho

 

[rico x hood]

Originally Posted by Mo Matik

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Man attacks the White House and your upset about a hypothetical situation in which the dude was Muslim. Get off your high horse

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

I could not have said it better.
OP stays on his "Woe is Me!" tip.

I care about the bias in the media that allows the government to do what they like in the Middle East, which mostly includes senseless killing and defending apartheid.

I'm a crybaby for caring about these things.

Yea, and I care about a poverty in America but I still acknowledge that there are some people that take advantage of the system. You complaining about media bias but ignoring Muslims that are out there killing people. You're the epitome of the bias, that you're railing against.

 

[antonlavey]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Man attacks the White House and your upset about a hypothetical situation in which the dude was Muslim. Get off your high horse

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

I could not have said it better.
OP stays on his "Woe is Me!" tip.

I don't see what the problem is here. This country has a LONG history of christian domestic terrorism.

Preach!!!!!

The KKK-The most notorious terrorist organization in American history is christian-based

lol @ the gif

 

[curbyourenthusiasm]

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Originally Posted by Mo Matik

which mostly includes senseless killing and defending apartheid.

I'm a crybaby for caring about these things.

Yea, and I care about a poverty in America

  

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by Mo Matik

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Man attacks the White House and your upset about a hypothetical situation in which the dude was Muslim. Get off your high horse

An don't get mad at the media, blame the terrorists of your religion that do stupid %!+*.

I could not have said it better.
OP stays on his "Woe is Me!" tip.

I care about the bias in the media that allows the government to do what they like in the Middle East, which mostly includes senseless killing and defending apartheid.

I'm a crybaby for caring about these things.

IMO, your stance falls apart because ultimately you still believe in a god(s). Sorry, it just does for me. Because your attempt to discredit their religious stance does nothing for yours.  Its called the no-true-scotsman fallacy. I suggest you look it up. You can't invalidate them as christians because of their association to christianity. 
Should it have gotten more media attention?
Yeah it should have...

but then again, I haven't watched TV in like 4 days...I've been following this story online so I don't know how "mainstream" this story has gotten...I've just seen it on every major blog

...and CNN even sent me an email alert about it so I know it was that big of a deal.

But again, your hypothetical question about being a muslim might be true considering how american media is blind many christian transgressions, but the media is moving towards being much more secular over time...public opinion IS changing. But we can still look at the refusal of conservative networks like Fox to call Anders Brevik a christian terrorist for example. 

I think theres a difference between talking about our media's bias towards islam and our government's bias to affairs in the middle east...its two separate issues that people like to conflagrate. Arabs aren't always muslims. And muslims don't only live in the middle east. I get your point...but ultimately, using your hypothetical stance with the lack of evidence that this was actually done in this instance, doesn't support your case. 

 

[mo matik]

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Originally Posted by Mo Matik


I care about the bias in the media that allows the government to do what they like in the Middle East, which mostly includes senseless killing and defending apartheid.

I'm a crybaby for caring about these things.

Yea, and I care about a poverty in America but I still acknowledge that there are some people that take advantage of the system. You complaining about media bias but ignoring Muslims that are out there killing people. You're the epitome of the bias, that you're railing against.

Epitome of bias? When did I not acknowledge Islamic terrorism? Even then, so I should simply accept that there should be a media bias against all Muslims because the actions of a few? Since when is that acceptable?

You say blame the terrorists, but with that you ignore the root causes of their actions. Which is mainly the US support for violent dictators and apartheid. For this reason the comparison you make doesn't work.

edit:
My stance falls apart because I believe in God? Well I'm not discrediting anyone's religious stance here. I'm talking about media bias.

As for the strength of my argument, it's a hypothetical so take it for what it's worth. But there have been multiple scholarly studies media bias against Muslims that present strong evidence. Like this recent study for example on the New York Times from 2000-2008:

http://etd.fcla.edu/CF/CF...p_Autumn_M_201008_MA.pdf

This thread is really simply a documentation of the on going media bias as I came across it.

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by Mo Matik

Originally Posted by Rico x Hood

Originally Posted by Mo Matik


I care about the bias in the media that allows the government to do what they like in the Middle East, which mostly includes senseless killing and defending apartheid.

I'm a crybaby for caring about these things.

Yea, and I care about a poverty in America but I still acknowledge that there are some people that take advantage of the system. You complaining about media bias but ignoring Muslims that are out there killing people. You're the epitome of the bias, that you're railing against.

Epitome of bias? When did I not acknowledge Islamic terrorism? Even then, so I should simply accept that there should be a media bias against all Muslims because the actions of a few? Since when is that acceptable?

You say blame the terrorists, but with that you ignore the root causes of their actions. Which is mainly the US support for violent dictators and apartheid. For this reason the comparison you make doesn't work.

edit:
My stance falls apart because I believe in God? Well I'm not discrediting anyone's religious stance here. I'm talking about media bias.

As for the strength of my argument, it's a hypothetical so take it for what it's worth. But there have been multiple scholarly studies media bias against Muslims that present strong evidence. Like this recent study for example on the New York Times from 2000-2008:

http://etd.fcla.edu/CF/CF...p_Autumn_M_201008_MA.pdf

This thread is really simply a documentation of the on going media bias as I came across it.

Like I said...while I will admit that muslim terrorists in this country get more of a bad rap because of the amount of christians here...ultimately, to me as an atheist, you are BOTH one in the same. 
A terrorist attack by one is the same as an attack by the other. 

I think it sucks that christians don't realize that people in their "faith" commit terrorist attacks but it doesn't make the attacks themselves any better. 

 

[supermanblue79]

The guy obviously has symptoms of schizophrenia. 
I'm glad that no one was hurt.

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by Supermanblue79

The guy obviously has symptoms of schizophrenia. 
I'm glad that no one was hurt.

This point could open a can of worms...
Its funny that we are reluctant to apply mental disorders to people who "believe god talks to them" 

But we all know what that would mean... 

 

[antonlavey]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Supermanblue79

The guy obviously has symptoms of schizophrenia. 
I'm glad that no one was hurt.

This point could open a can of worms...
Its funny that we are reluctant to apply mental disorders to people who "believe god talks to them" 

But we all know what that would mean... 

Word, how do we make the distinction between people who really do talk to god and those that are having active delusions? Are people in scriptures who spoke to God and saw burning bushes exempt because they lived thousands of years ago?

 

[supermanblue79]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Supermanblue79

The guy obviously has symptoms of schizophrenia. 
I'm glad that no one was hurt.

This point could open a can of worms...
Its funny that we are reluctant to apply mental disorders to people who "believe god talks to them" 

But we all know what that would mean... 

Get off your campaign against all things religious..I'll getting a little old.
And Anton, stand on your own two instead of sac chasing this guy in every thread.

 

[bruce negro]

The issue is that their has not been a recent Christian terrorist attack of the scale of 9/11 that was committed directly towards America as a whole. There has been no militant Christian group that has declared a "holy war" on the US and then backed it up with a vicious attack of 9/11 scale. Although Muslims as a whole didn't declare this holy war, a group that was capable of carrying one out did just that and committed the terrorist attacks of 9/11. Although fear of muslims existed before 9/11, that event was what really put everything over the top. When you see an attack like this and the man is Muslim, it really makes you wonder if he's a part of an organization that's able to pull something like 9/11 off again, and that's an association that we really only comes with the Islamic religion, not Christianity. If a Christian, or Hindu group had done 9/11, I think the same media bias would be geared towards them.

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by Supermanblue79

The guy obviously has symptoms of schizophrenia. 
I'm glad that no one was hurt.

This point could open a can of worms...
Its funny that we are reluctant to apply mental disorders to people who "believe god talks to them" 

But we all know what that would mean... 

Word, how do we make the distinction between people who really do talk to god and those that are having active delusions? Are people in scriptures who spoke to God and saw burning bushes exempt because they lived thousands of years ago?

This is why I feel grateful to be scientifically literate and yet sad at the same time...ignorance is bliss it seems
People just ignore the cognitive dissonance that leads them to these very conclusions. 

And its funny how people used to get "revelations" for instance, witches were known to take hallucinogens and the "Oracle at Delphi" was said to get wisdom from a fissure in the earth and by sitting on a stool over the crack...come to find out that it was a natural gas leak and dude was just getting high and rambling. 

The Forer Effect also debunks most of what people think happens to them with their horoscopes and predictions that "psychics" make. 




This is my point to Mo Matik...how does he really know a "god" didn't actually tell this guy to start shooting? 




God has done much more "mysterious" things. Wouldn't we agree based on whatever book you're reading? God has in the bible and koran condoned murder and other (based on modern morality) heinous acts for various purposes and events.




The fact of the matter is, when you think you're ready to assert that god did NOT tell this man to take a gun and shoot at the white house you are doing two things.




1. speaking on behalf of a god you think exists by way of "knowing" how that god would act so as to be in line with your own personal expectations for that god.




2. invalidating your OWN god because in as much as you assert that this man's god wouldn't tell him to shoot at the president, you really don't know if god could actually speak to people.




Here we have substantial proof that god spoke to someone...




yet no one believes it...obviously Mo Matik doesn't believe it because hes a muslim...but even people of the same faith/religion dont believe it. I wonder why... 




See how important evidence is?




 Even religious people want evidence that god spoke to this person...but yet they don't ask for evidence to suggest that their god even exists. 




So why is it so wrong to think that god maybe did tell this guy to start shooting?




Only thinking that god is responsible for "good" or things you like is unfair and just illogical. It speaks to your own narcissism. If this god does things you like, its good, if it doesn't then its bad. 




How do you know god was only talking to him and decided to leave you out of the message? 




Maybe you weren't invited to the killing spree and god meant to leave you out of the fun...but of course you don't believe that. You know better. 




For all we know this is how god could have felt like acting:

Or MAYBE...we can admit that his "god" only exists in his head and acts as an enabler for him to offload his guilt of doing something to harm other people. That would make him crazy...as well as religious. 




Whats so hard about accepting this conclusion? 




Its his own twisted form of solipsism... narcissism. Its all about the suspect. His god told him to do things that he wanted to do. Him, Himself, and You. 







This is the problem with tough questions, no one wants to work hard on them. These are easy questions to ask but no one wants to address them because they're scared to know the answer. 

Originally Posted by bruce negro

The issue is that their has not been a recent Christian terrorist attack of the scale of 9/11 that was committed directly towards America as a whole. There has been no militant Christian group that has declared a "holy war" on the US and then backed it up with a vicious attack of 9/11 scale. Although Muslims as a whole didn't declare this holy war, a group that was capable of carrying one out did just that and committed the terrorist attacks of 9/11. Although fear of muslims existed before 9/11, that event was what really put everything over the top. When you see an attack like this and the man is Muslim, it really makes you wonder if he's a part of an organization that's able to pull something like 9/11 off again, and that's an association that we really only comes with the Islamic religion, not Christianity. If a Christian, or Hindu group had done 9/11, I think the same media bias would be geared towards them.

I wonder what they're telling you high schoolers these days...

We can talk about "scale" if you want but an attack is an attack.

One life lost is just as bad as One Thousand. Neither amount of people are coming back. If those planes had only killed 1 person, would it make the attack any better or worse, ultimately?

And yes there have been dozens of christian terrorist attacks. A simple google search would reveal this. 

I guess these aren't considered christian motivated attacks either, huh?

[*]1993: Operation Rescue, a Christian organization, got one of the targets on its "Wanted Posters."  Dr. David Gunn is dead because of Christian terrorists.[*]1994: Dr. John Britton and James Barrett became victims of Christian terrorist Reverend Paul Jennings Hill.[*]1994: Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols were killed by Christian terrorist John Salvi.[*]1996-98: Christian Terrorist Eric Rudolph killed at least two and injured more than 150 in a series of bombings, including Atlanta's Olympic Centennial Park. [*]1998: Christian terrorist James Kopp killed at least one and went on a series of anti-abortion shooting sprees, both in the U.S. and Canada.[*]2009: Christian terrorist Scott Roeder killed Dr. George Tiller in Kansas.
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[jd214]

Someone explain this to me though, His gun was only suppose to shoot 200 feet and the bullet went 800 feet. Is he still getting in trouble for it, or can he plead his case with this?

Just wondering...

@ dude though.

 

[mo matik]

I have class but I'll respond later today.

 

[rashi]

This is a none issue. People open fire on public housing everyday and nobody says anything.