MODS PLEASE LOCK | The Oakland Raiders 2015 Season Thread: Week 17 @ Kansas City / 7-8

How many wins will the Raiders have this season?

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  • 3-5

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  • 6-8

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  • 9-11

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  • 12+

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Merry Christmas to all. Know what Christmas spirit is? Its making your in-laws turn off the music and turn on the game to be one of only 3 other people wanting the Raiders to win.
 
Keep an eye on Raiders’ Carr, he watches it all
By Vic Tafur December 25, 2015 Updated: December 25, 2015 8:59pm

View media item 1843987Oakland Raiders' Derek Carr bows after his 3rd quarter touchdown pass to Lee Smith during Kansas City Chiefs' 34-20 win during NFL game at O.co Coliseum in Oakland, Calif., on Sunday, December 6, 2015. Photo: Scott Strazzante, The Chronicle Photo: Scott Strazzante, The Chronicle Oakland Raiders' Derek Carr bows after his 3rd quarter touchdown pass to Lee Smith during Kansas City Chiefs' 34-20 win during NFL game at O.co Coliseum in Oakland, Calif., on Sunday, December 6, 2015.

The good, the bad and the ugly. Derek Carr watches it all.

“Whatever play is on there,” he said of his game video review. “There are always things to learn from, even on the good ones. Even throwing touchdowns you’re like, ‘Oh, I could’ve got it out a little bit earlier, or maybe I could’ve put the ball here or maybe there.’

“And that, to me, is what separates people. You have to be able to look at every single play and be able to pick yourself apart. You have to be your own worst critic. I overload myself with that kind of stuff.”

That’s why Carr is himself one to watch in 2016. There has been a lot more good than bad — he has 31 touchdown passes and is a Pro Bowl alternate. His total of 52 TD passes through two seasons is the second-best in NFL history, behind Dan Marino (68) and tied with Peyton Manning (52) and Russell Wilson (52).

But there has been some ugly — with six of his 12 interceptions coming in the last four games — and what the second-year quarterback does with that knowledge will determine whether he is the next Aaron Rodgers, like some think.

“Oh, man, don’t throw it to the other team,” he said, laughing. “Especially in this league, it’s going to happen … especially with as much as we throw it, it’s going to happen every now and then. But it’s definitely something I hate.”

Armchair quarterbacks may be surprised that it’s not easy to not throw interceptions in the NFL.

View media item 1843991Quarterback Derek Carr #4 of the Oakland Raiders celebrates a 2-point conversion in the fourth quarter against the San Diego Chargers at O.co Coliseum on December 24, 2015. Photo: Lachlan Cunningham, Getty Images

“I do take chances sometimes,” Carr said. “I do try and fit things in tight windows. Either it’s going to turn out great, or it’s going to be their ball. I just have to be smarter there and put our team in a better situation. I don’t have to make every play.

“I want to win so bad, and I’m not doing it on purpose, but any interception is ugly.”

After he had two in the first quarter of the Dec. 20 loss to the Packers, Raiders head coach Jack Del Rio pulled Carr aside.

“He said after the second one, ‘Just keep playing your game,’” Carr said. “‘Those kind of things are going to happen. They get paid, too, to do this.’”

Del Rio was asked by one reporter what he can do to keep Carr from turning the ball over.

“Do the things where it leads to the 30 touchdowns that he has,” Del Rio said. “He’s a good player. Nobody is mistake-free, nobody is perfect. I think what you’ll find is our football team will grow into one that plays complementary football more frequently.

“When I say complementary football, I’m talking about all three phases — special teams, offense, defense — complementing each other.”

View media item 1843997Derek Carr (4) rushes out to greet Charles Woodson (24) after the Oakland Raiders defeated the San Diego Chargers at O.Co Coliseum in Oakland, Calif., on Thursday, December 24, 2015. Photo: Carlos Avila Gonzalez, The Chronicle Photo: Carlos Avila Gonzalez, The Chronicle Derek Carr (4) rushes out to greet Charles Woodson (24) after the Oakland Raiders defeated the San Diego Chargers at O.Co Coliseum in Oakland, Calif., on Thursday, December 24, 2015.

The Raiders are definitely a pass-first team this season, with shiny new receivers and an inconsistent run game. Carr needs 207 yards to become the third Raiders quarterback with 4,000 passing yards in a season, joining Rich Gannon (2002) and Carson Palmer (2012).

Defenses have adjusted, dropping both safeties back more often.

Offensive coordinator Bill Musgrave says Carr just needs more experience — to readjust, if you will. He’s already gone from 21 touchdown passes his rookie year to 31 this season — just three shy of Daryle Lamonica’s 1969 team record of 34.

“I think it’s part of the process,” Musgrave said. “It’s not a fun part of the process, but he has to just keep working through it like he is. Really proud of him for battling back the other day and getting us the lead there in the second half” against the Packers.

There is no question that Carr has established himself as a leader on the Raiders and as their franchise quarterback. The fact that he, running back Latavius Murray and receiver Amari Cooper are Pro Bowl alternates — at the respective ages of 24, 25 and 21 — is a scary proposition for the AFC West. Oakland (7-8) is a team on the rise.

“Three very talented football players who are only going to get better with time,” Chargers coach Mike McCoy said. “You’ve seen the success they’ve had early in their careers already together. The more you play together, the more comfortable you get. You learn systems, you learn more about one and other.

“They are three very talented players that have a bright future for a very long time in this league.”

Vic Tafur is a San Francisco Chronicle staff writer. E-mail: [email protected] Twitter: @VicTafur
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Musgraves HAS to go this offseason. A neutered dog has more nutsack.

I swear half of our offensive snaps are straight up wasted with his conservative ***** footing. :smh:

I'll give him props though he's good for that one brilliant play call every couple hundreds snaps or so. :rolleyes
 
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I'm not a Musgrave fan either but no way he gets fired in the offseason, what we really do need is another RB to get something going when Murray's 1 and 2 yard runs get zero momentum going.
 
Th3RealF0lkBlu3s said:
Musgrave isn't the problem. He easily gets another year in my mind.
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I don't know what is then. It sure as hell isn't Carr. It sure as hell isn't the OL. Collectively our skill guys produced fairly consistently all season.

Musgraves, predictable, timid play calling held us back so many times this year. Sooooooooo many completely wasted snaps.

We're fortunate individual talent was able to overcome as often as it did.

KhalilMack52 said:
So we're gonna keep bringing in new OC's? :lol:
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If our OC is inadequate why not? We've got a good to potentially very good head coach in Del Rio. Same with Norton. If we can upgrade at OC we definitely should. If we can't maybe all that talk of poor coaching thst goes on in the NFL thread is true.
 
you don't just fire OC's every year and expect to be a good football team





They've improved as an offense this year
 
A second back and depth on OL would make a difference, almost as much as Cooper improving on his catching and Carr keeping his feet set when the pocket collapses, which he usually does but more recently he's gotten away from.
 
KhalilMack52 said:
you don't just fire OC's every year and expect to be a good football team





They've improved as an offense this year
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Please I was using that same rhetoric when people were going at McKenzie's neck 2 years ago. :lol:

Far from similar situations and Musgraves is far from irreplaceable. He's not the crux of stability. Our offense is improved in spite of Musgraves not because of him.

A second back to complement the AFC's leading rusher would be a welcomed luxury. Growth from our rookies and second year players is to be expected.

An OC with actual stones who doesn't waste multi snaps every series is a far pressing need to me.
 
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Off. Rushing - 23rd, Passing 13th.
Def. Rushing - 11th, Passing - 28th.

Musgrave - in retrospect - has gotten winning seasons out of Ponder, M.Ryan (who's career stock is trending in the wrong way), getting gaudy #s out of Derek Carr now. I think Crabtree/Cooper have a lot to do with that. And Walford looks functional, even good. Second-best TE coming out I thought. Hard to evaluate the offense but I don't think Musgrave is a problem but don't know if he'll ever be regarded as one of the best OC's or ever be that. Maybe Cooper/Carr naturally progress and by 2018 it's on.

The fifth-worst pass defense though might just be a DC problem though.

I will say - Stop hiring and firing people all the time (which is the case for Tampa, Cleveland, Bills, etc right now). There's work ... like a person can do ... once dudes feel 'secure' in a place they go to work to every. day. Obviously time doesn't orchestrate competence in every case but if you can't ever find a coach and you're still out there cutting ankles 1-2 years after the person's been hired ... after all these years of doing it/pattern ... maybe that's the problem, only saying. Let somebody breathe and you wouldn't be firing both the right and wrong guys - and instead the right guy can flourish in that nice and ideal 3-4 year window you've assured him of. It's a business - obviously there are extreme rarities where you have to fire a guy after a year if he's proven with enough certainty that he's a deplorable trainwreck with no hope. But that's not a card you use habitually.

Only offering my thoughts, best of luck to the Oakland Raiders as it relates to football and LA.

\_o_/
 
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I dont really care for Musgrave either way. His play calling really lacks flow, hopefully he'll give Carr more freedom next year especially changing plays at the line.

One look that was really pissing me off this past thursday, he kept having someone line up out wide but they were like 10 yards behind the line of scrimage? I thought maybe a wide receiver screen but they were behind carr and the only person lined up on that side

I would love to pick up a running back whos also a good pass catcher, for all **** I talked about DMC for being hurt all the time, dude was legit at running routes out of the back field. Seems like we got to always bring in Reece to throw it, and his hands aint really all that.

Beastmode is running back goals but would love if we went after Lamar Miller.
 
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KhalilMack52 said:
Ok let's fire OC's until we find perfect playcallers







Anybody else find that unrealistic?
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Wrong. I didn't say we need a perfect playcaller. I did say Muskgraves play calling is softer than vagina. You should have just gone with that. 
 
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JPZx said:
I will say - Stop hiring and firing people all the time (which is the case for Tampa, Cleveland, Bills, etc right now). There's work ... like a person can do ... once dudes feel 'secure' in a place they go to work to every. day. Obviously time doesn't orchestrate competence in every case but if you can't ever find a coach and you're still out there cutting ankles 1-2 years after the person's been hired ... after all these years of doing it/pattern ... maybe that's the problem, only saying. Let somebody breathe and you wouldn't be firing both the right and wrong guys - and instead the right guy can flourish in that nice and ideal 3-4 year window you've assured him of. It's a business - obviously there are extreme rarities where you have to fire a guy after a year if he's proven with enough certainty that he's a deplorable trainwreck with no hope. But that's not a card you use habitually.

Only offering my thoughts, best of luck to the Oakland Raiders as it relates to football and LA.

\_o_/
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Believe me when I say you're preaching to the choir. I argued the importance of stability when we let Cable go. I argued it when we let Hue go. I argued it's importance when people were impatient with McKenzie. 

Placing a premium on stability still doesnt mean you ride with under performance. 
 
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KhalilMack52 said:
 
NorthOaklandFC said:
Wrong. I didn't say we need a perfect playcaller. I did say Muskgraves play calling is softer than vagina. You should have just gone with that. 
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My point is you can't keep firing OC's and have it not slow down your up and coming QB.
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My point is Musgraves is already slowing us down. Carr's individual talent and ability is going to prevail regardless.  If there's a better option at OC we certainly shouldn't stick with Musgraves for the sake of stability. 
 
NorthOaklandFC said:
My point is Musgraves is already slowing us down. Carr's individual talent and ability is going to prevail regardless.  If there's a better option at OC we certainly shouldn't stick with Musgraves for the sake of stability. 
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We're going to have to agree to disagree
 
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