[[ NEW YORK METS 2009 OFFSEASON POST: Beltran ahead of schedule ]]

[mez 0ne]

Halladay is 32 years old, why give up a majority of our prospects for a guy who will be here 1 yr and a half? Knowing our luck he'll get hurt next season.

Who's going to play 1st? re-sign Gado if its cheap?

Who's playing 2nd?

Who's playing LF. C? Red Sox will re-sign Jason Bay. Halladay is over-rated, Crawford is ehhhh (but young).

I'm kinda of over signing old free agents this teams needs to start building from within. Halladay is nice and would solidify our rotation, but the lineupout there lacks fundamentals.

 

[vc3fan]

We will still have Ike Davis Mez. (Finally remembered his name) He plays first. Murph may be the stop gap till he is ready.


2nd, LF, and Catcher are probably free agent pick ups. (Although Brian has done well since coming back from his injury early in the year and I hate him so thatis a lot coming from me.)



We have to give a Murph the opportunity especially since he was thrown into first base on the fly and with winter league and spring training hopefully there hewill learn to play like a first baseman

 

[johnnyredstorm]

I'm sorry, but not trading for Halladay because you want to keep Parnell, Niese and Martinez is asinine. Martinez is an OF, arguably the easiest positionto replace. Niese is a starter who will never be as good as Doc. Parnell is a good reliever, and I like him, but what good is a reliever when you have a weakrotation. Getting Doc, plus keeping Reyes, Wright and Beltran healthy next year equals a World Series contender. It'll be a weak offense but if you signeither Hudson or Freddy Sanchez you're getting consistent .300 hitters. Only real question marks imo would then be either LF and 1B. You can't doubtthat Murph has talent and if he figures it out he won't burn you at first. LF might be weak, but if you can just get somebody that bats .260 hits 20 hrsand drives in 75 80 run we'll be good. Just gotta play small ball.

Any GM that passes on Doc without giving a sure thing is a moron. And lets face it, Niese, Parnell and Martinez are not sure things. Especially when Fern isthe 2nd coming of Jay Payton. (his health will determine if he reaches his peak)

 

[vc3fan]

^ Agree and on Metsblog, 75% said they would do the deal.

 

[mez 0ne]

Yeah but Ike was just drafted these guys are not Major League ready yet, and I like Ike but dude may end up pitching.

Brian is just on a little hot streak, enjoy the ride while it lasts.

Murphy was in a tough spot since he had to learn new positions on the fly and has held his own, he's still adjusting to the inside pitch but therewon't be any room for him except in the minors next season.

So who's realistic for LF and C? Molina and who?

2nd the Mets will def make an offer at Hudson.

Who's going to play 1st who can hit for power?

LF and 1st base our the positions we need pop.

 

[bobby1109]

Oh man I def have to chime in to this discussion in the AM.

 

[vc3fan]

Hey at least we will not deal Redding..........

 

[johnnyredstorm]

I personally don't want him, but you could stick Laroche at first. He'll give us 25+ homeruns a year.
David losing his power swing really hurts.
If Hank Blalock could stay healthy he would be a nice addition at first.
Hell, Huff isn't that bad of a choice either.
Holliday probably isn't worth the money, but we're gonna have to go after him since we're so desperate for a bat.

 

[vc3fan]

Huff is a DH now full time Johnny while playing first from time to time.



I do not think he can field at either first or LF any more for 120 games in the national league.

 

[shuges]

On the real, I would gladly substitute power for average this off-season.

So if we brought in a bunch of guys who consistently hit .300, I'd be more than happy.

 

[proshares]

Halladay is 32 years old, why give up a majority of our prospects for a guy who will be here 1 yr and a half? Knowing our luck he'll get hurt next season.

Who's going to play 1st? re-sign Gado if its cheap?

Who's playing 2nd?

Who's playing LF. C? Red Sox will re-sign Jason Bay. Halladay is over-rated, Crawford is ehhhh (but young).

I'm kinda of over signing old free agents this teams needs to start building from within. Halladay is nice and would solidify our rotation, but the lineup out there lacks fundamentals.

Mez, those four prospects you're giving up are not top end I'm sorry. You have a golden opportunity to basically steal away the best pitcher inthe AL (arguable in the entire league) and move him to the NL? That's basically another Santana who will dominate in the NL. You can't pass that dealup. You looking for cheapies to fill out your rotation? Start with Bedard, his up and down year will net him an incentive filled deal next year. Justin Dfrom Oakland will command some decent amount of money but to have that rotation 1-2-3 it's worth it. There's so many cheap options from Backe toJennings even Marquis. A year and a half of Halladay isn't worth it? If you come back healthy next year with him and Johan at the front of your rotationyou're winning that division.

1B forget Delgado and forget Nick Johnson. I don't mean to repeat my last post but go after LaRoche you know damn well the Pirates won't resign himand he's only 30. Hits for good power and decent average and is a good contact hitter.

2B...Castillo isn't THAT bad. I don't think LA will let O-Dog walk he's an important piece to the top of that line-up. Sanchez isn't badbut you NEED to have some power hitters in the middle of that line-up because he's strictly a contact hitter.

You've got a ton of options out there for LF. Ankiel could move, Abreu could move, Dye could move, Guerrero, Nady, Mags. It all depends on how muchyou want to spend and being smart with your money. Crawford is way more than ehhhh, he's one of the better players in this league IMO. Having him andReyes at the top of that lineup would be trouble.

How do you figure Halladay is overrated? He's the best or 2nd best pitcher in the Majors IMO. He's only 32 and still has a solid few years left inhim.

 

[mez 0ne]

When did I ever say those prospects are top-end? They are some of the better ones the Mets have along with Meija but not TOP-END. Parnell is already MajorLeague ready (being over-used but has been effective at times), Neise will be a solid guy when ready he has done a lot better lately in AAA, and FernandoMartinez has a very high ceiling who is still very raw (although Wilmer Flores is much younger and is doing what fernando did in AA right now). That is toomuch for a Mets team trying to build up more talent in their farm to give up.

I don't need power from 2B, you can bet the Mets will try their hand at Sanchez or O-Dog to bat 2nd in this lineup.

LaRoche is

When did I also ever say Halladay is over-rated? He is a top pitcher in baseball but he is 32, and what if the Mets won't resign him after 2010, that meansthey have a 1 yr window with him. If the Mets were contending right now, do that trade, but they are not so the trade would be pointless. Smart to put peoplein the seats, but we are still left with a team full of backups who lack fundamentals.

I'd rather see the Mets plug in those few holes, draft some more talent, and look for a starter elsewhere (#2 or 3).

 

[airmaxpenny1]

Victor Martinez is a free agent. We haven't had anybody with pop behind the plate since Mike

 

[proshares]

Who's playing LF. C? Red Sox will re-sign Jason Bay. Halladay is over-rated, Crawford is ehhhh (but young).
In that context I should have known you were talking about Matt Holliday but the spelling sidetracked me, I apologize.

I wasn't saying that you said that they're top end, I'm just stating that they're not top-end and with what JP has been demanding from Phillythat's a steal to get Roy for that.

If the Mets were contending right now, do that trade, but they are not so the trade would be pointless.

that's what I said in my first post after the storybroke!

LaRoche may be

to you but he's a much more reliable than NickJohnson (durability wise) and you don't know which Delgado you'll be getting back next season.

If you could pick up two SP's besides Roy out of that group who would you be taking?

 

[addictedtofreshkicks]

Going after Halladay will be the dumbest thing this organization can do... Even with 5 Roy Halladays in our rotation, the Mets still have major issues theyhave to take care of.


Roy Halladay will not make us a contender.

 

[mez 0ne]

Halladay WOULD make us a contender if he stays here past 2010 (say 5+ years or so alongside Santana), which would be a rotation of Santana, Halladay, Pelfrey(where he belongs), Maine, and Ollie.......that is sick.

But him staying here past 2010 is not guaranteed so if he ditches the Mets after his contract is up the Mets are left looking like idiots.

In the end all of these guys, whether its the Mets farm, Phillies, Yankees, whatever, they are all over-rated by their teams. You can only go by how well theyare doing in the minors and, BA rankings, etc......you don't know who will be successful and who won't be in the majors.

If the Phils will only offer 1 or 2 of their top guys, how is the Mets offer not better when you think about it?



realistically though, I can see the Mets going hard after Halladay (outfielder), Benji Molina (who is horrendous defensively but he can hit), and a # 3 typestarter.

2nd base and 1st base is a toss up, maybe Murphy found a home at 1st if he continues to improve defensively. I'm not the type to give up instantly on youngguys, some athletes need extra time to develop.

 

[shuges]

Heads up: Omar is in the booth right now.


Recap for those who are curious:

- Omar is happy that Ollie has shown consistency since his return from the dl
- says the thing that jumps out at him with this team is the lack of homers.
- says that the positives he sees in the team are the fact that they are a cohesive unit and that they are always battling
- points out Castillo's resurgence and the addition of Cora as other positives
- says the organization has chips to be buyers OR sellers and that he is very happy with the state of the minors
- specifically mentions 2 17yr olds in the south atlantic league, F-Mart, Niese, Holt, Mejia as solid prospects
- says he is a big believer of bringing up guys from within
- says he doesn't listen to the criticisms of the farm system because it's not coming from pro scouts
- brushes off the criticisms of the medical staff
- says David Wright is having a peculiar season but heaped praise upon him

 

[proshares]

Mez, spell Holliday right you confuse me

 

[jaysfordays]

Lannan owns the Mets once again.

 

[scarsorscabs]

Basically, forget about this year. Other teams' fans will laugh at the Mets and talk about payroll, having a losing record and all that. That's finebut when you've got injuries to 3 of your top 4 position players for what'll be the majority of the season, your #2 or 3 pitcher, setup man and Godknows who else, it just wasn't meant to be. Like MezOne said, Halladay would not be worth it because of the fact that it would only be for 1 season, 2010.For a contending team, he'd put you in position to make a run at a World Series this year for sure and next, so you make that deal without question. IF youknew he'd re-sign with the Mets...no doubt. Otherwise just see if you can sign him after 2010.

Castillo is our 2nd baseman next year too, I think we can forget about Hudson. I'd have no problem with LaRoche considering what's out there at 1B infree agency. I'd like to see Crawford in the outfield (the Rays will probably pick up the option though) and if Manny chooses to try free agency again, gofor him. I don't care about defense, steroids, money at this point. He'd give the lineup some power and put people in the seats. I would like to see usmake a move at catcher.

Main problem I see is leadership.

 

[mez 0ne]

i dont think leadsership has been an issue whatsoever this season, Beltran
made a lot of strides this season and has shown more emotion, more vocal, etc

as weird (or bad) this season has been for David, he has taken huge strides
in becoming the leader of this team and its quite obvious. David is getting
zero pitches to hit the past month and that sure hasn't helped

Halladay Holliday whatever

 

[shuges]

Originally Posted by ScarsOrScabs

and if Manny chooses to try free agency again, go for him. I don't care about defense, steroids, money at this point. He'd give the lineup some power and put people in the seats.

They shoulda went after him (or any big bat for that matter) before the year started in the first damn place.

 

[scarsorscabs]

I don't know, I appreciated it but Beltran's leadership seemed a little forced to me. I guess if he stayed healthy we might've seen more of it fromhim though. I love Beltran as a player, I never really got on his case since he's been with the Mets and I always understood what he brings to the field interms of his ability, I just don't think it's part of his personality to be a leader.
I think Wright can be more of a natural leader and I like how he kind of took Pelfrey on as a project to motivate him.

From MetsBlog:
Perez has now walked 17 batters in 17 innings since returning from the disabled list, and on the year he has earned $155,454.55 per walk so far.

Since being acquired from Atlanta, Jeff Francoeur is hitting .364 with 1 home run and 7 RBI in eight games.

Luis Castillo has hit in 13 out of 15 games in July, and he has hit .362 with 17 hits over that span.

 

[shuges]

Well here is an interesting tidbit in regards to Ollie's regression:

The Mets miss Rick Peterson. A person with ties to Peterson's successful tenure in Oakland called him "one of the best fixers of pitchers in the big leagues," and said he didn't think it was coincidence that the careers of Maine and Perez have hit the skids since he was fired.
"Maine had a very complicated delivery, and Peterson's drills and off-field work put him in position to succeed," the person said. "Perez didn't like Rick because Rick demanded he do things a certain way, but don't forget Perez was considered a lost cause when the Mets got him from the Pirates, and Rick turned him around.

"Dan Warthen is a respected pitching coach, and I know Rick wears on people sometimes, but I think the Mets took a lot for granted when it came to what he did with those two guys. I don't know if Maine's injury is related to (Petersen) leaving, but if he didn't stick to Rick's program, I wouldn't be surprised."

Coincidence?
Maybe.
But it sure makes sense to me.

And one last thing:

http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Tony+Bernazard

Tony Bernazard is an issue again. Bernazard, VP of player development, was widely fingered as playing a significant role in the firings of both Randolph and Peterson, and baseball people say his intimidating style of managing has an adverse affect on player development people doing the scouting and drafting.
"When you draft relievers in the first round," one person said, referring to the Mets' drafting of Eddie Kunz two years ago, "that means you're afraid for your job. You take him because he's a guy you think you can get to the big leagues, not because he's the best player available."

Regardless, there's clearly dysfunction in the organization. One recent example: The scouting community has been abuzz with an account of Mets VP Tony Bernazard going into a profanity-laced tirade directed at the organization's manager of baseball operations at Citi Field, which left witnesses in the section behind home plate aghast. According to two sources, scouts had settled in a row behind the plate during a recent game. Bernazard arrived and found a Diamondbacks scout sitting in the seat he wanted. When Bernazard's underling suggested that the Mets VP wait until the end of the half-inning to change the seating arrangement in order to minimize the disruption, Bernazard went ballistic in a rant against his Ivy League-educated deputy.

 

[bobby1109]

Refresh my memory, did the Mets pass on Vlad the same year they signed Beltran?