NFL Discussion Thread - Hall of Fame Game: August 3rd

[mertonhanks]

that's like saying drew brees isn't a top tier quarterback because the system he's in dictates throwing the ball all over the field. good players put up numbers, no matter the system. quit using that stupid argument to detract from arian foster.
and notice earlier i said yards from scrimmage. meaning he catches out of the backfield and makes plays there too. or is that a product of the zone blocking scheme too?

Spoiler

Did I say Foster wasnt a good or top RB? Hes in my top 10, just not in my top 3. Your pencil breaks too easy when I talk about Foster.

 

[mmg]

^ Foster does have all that. Agreed. But you just gave all the same attributes of Frank Gore as well. Most people wont consider him a top 5 back.
But not every back is a product of the system they are in. AP has one of the worst o-lines in the NFL but still puts up monster numbers. Guy is just on another level. AP, MJD, and Steven Jack are 3 RBs that defenses consistently stack 8+ in the box against and still put up numbers.

Gore doesnt have top end speed, gore doesnt make you miss in space, Gore to my knowledge runs you over....

your entitled to your opinion, but when you Make Rice a top 3 RB and dont include Shady / Foster theres something wrong.

Houston also lost 2 starters from that right side and thats the side we run too most often.

 

[do work son]

that's like saying drew brees isn't a top tier quarterback because the system he's in dictates throwing the ball all over the field. good players put up numbers, no matter the system. quit using that stupid argument to detract from arian foster.
and notice earlier i said yards from scrimmage. meaning he catches out of the backfield and makes plays there too. or is that a product of the zone blocking scheme too?

Spoiler

Did I say Foster wasnt a good or top RB? Hes in my top 10, just not in my top 3. Your pencil breaks too easy when I talk about Foster.

you're attributing all of his success to the zone blocking system, and using that as his crutch. that makes ZERO sense. he's been tops in the league as far as production goes, and you completely look past that because of system. if it was "just a system" we would've tossed his *** to the curb instead of resigning him and just inserted ben tate

 

[ag 47]

Gore doesn't make you miss in space!?!!??? Gore would be one of the ALL-TIME greats if he hadn't suffered both those knee injuries in his career.

 

[mmg]

Gore doesn't make you miss in space!?!!??? Gore would be one of the ALL-TIME greats if he hadn't suffered both those knee injuries in his career.

Gore can make you miss in space like Shady / Rice / Foster?

 

[mertonhanks]

you're attributing all of his success to the zone blocking system, and using that as his crutch. that makes ZERO sense. he's been tops in the league as far as production goes, and you completely look past that because of system. if it was "just a system" we would've tossed his *** to the curb instead of resigning him and just inserted ben tate

Stop putting words in my mouth. Why would he be in my top 10 if he was just a product of his environment? So because hes not in my top 3, im attributing all his success to the zone blocking system?

I know you dont give houstons offensive system any credit at all to Fosters success. They had a great system for backs before Foster got there. Ben Tate had nearly a rack as the back up last season averaging more yards per carry than foster but I didnt put him in my top 10.

 

[ag 47]

Gore can make you miss in space like Shady / Rice / Foster?

Shady is on a level of his own imo, even separate from Rice & Foster. However, I do believe the initial comment was that Gore does not make people miss in space, but basically trucks people. He definitely does both. Now is like those three guys? No. But he's very elusive and the first guy usually never makes that tackle on Frank.

 

[do work son]

you're attributing all of his success to the zone blocking system, and using that as his crutch. that makes ZERO sense. he's been tops in the league as far as production goes, and you completely look past that because of system. if it was "just a system" we would've tossed his *** to the curb instead of resigning him and just inserted ben tate

Stop putting words in my mouth. Why would he be in my top 10 if he was just a product of his environment? So because hes not in my top 3, im attributing all his success to the zone blocking system?

I know you dont give houstons offensive system any credit at all to Fosters success. They had a great system for backs before Foster got there. Ben Tate had nearly a rack as the back up last season averaging more yards per carry than foster but I didnt put him in my top 10.

right, we had a great system for backs before foster. steve slaton, wali lundy, ron dayne etc ect were all soooooooo good.

in all honesty, how many texans games have you actually watched? the reason ben tate went for damn near a rack last year is because he's strictly a one cut and go back. got 175 carries last year.

foster is exponentially a better back than tate, and a lot of other NFL backs for things he does other than the numbers. if you actually watch the games, you'd see his vision, ability to cut on a dime, and his elusiveness. not to mention that he legitimately looks like he's gliding. never looks like he's fully running, but he moves.

 

[mertonhanks]

Gore doesnt have top end speed, gore doesnt make you miss in space, Gore to my knowledge runs you over....
your entitled to your opinion, but when you Make Rice a top 3 RB and dont include Shady / Foster theres something wrong.
Houston also lost 2 starters from that right side and thats the side we run too most often.

Trust me bro, Gore is all that. Hes patient, incredible stop and go, makes you miss in small and open spaces, downhill runner. He had a crummy line for most of his career. I put Rice over Foster because hes more elusive, quicker and basically was the entire Raven offense prior in prior seasons.

 

[mez 0ne]

Shady is on a level of his own imo, even separate from Rice & Foster. However, I do believe the initial comment was that Gore does not make people miss in space, but basically trucks people. He definitely does both. Now is like those three guys? No. But he's very elusive and the first guy usually never makes that tackle on Frank.

He's elusive but not as elusive as Shady or AP at all.

I prefer Rice over Shady just because he IS the Ravens on offense and is used to the workload. Eagles never run consistently so I'm not sure if Shady could handle the same kind of workload Rice could.

I love his breed of RB, guys like Lynch as well who go for those extra yards and look to initiate contact, running out of bounds is never his initial reaction.

Its all preference, can't go wrong with any of em.

 

[mmg]

Shady is on a level of his own imo, even separate from Rice & Foster. However, I do believe the initial comment was that Gore does not make people miss in space, but basically trucks people. He definitely does both. Now is like those three guys? No. But he's very elusive and the first guy usually never makes that tackle on Frank.

i apologize.


he said something about gore being top 5 and i brought up the space thing in comparison to Shady / Foster / Rice


IMO the top tier of backs are Foster / Shady / Rice / AD / Skittles / MJD


CJK hasnt been consistent.

S-Jax isnt being used for what ever reason

Forte is made of Glass

 

[Peep Game]

Ugggh, Wali Lundy May as well add Tony Hollings and Stacy "It's 3rd & 1, now it's 4th and 6" Mack.

 

[mmg]

Tony Hollings 2nd round pick


Dominick Davis though

 

[mertonhanks]

right, we had a great system for backs before foster. steve slaton, wali lundy, ron dayne etc ect were all soooooooo good.
in all honesty, how many texans games have you actually watched? the reason ben tate went for damn near a rack last year is because he's strictly a one cut and go back. got 175 carries last year.
foster is exponentially a better back than tate, and a lot of other NFL backs for things he does other than the numbers. if you actually watch the games, you'd see his vision, ability to cut on a dime, and his elusiveness. not to mention that he legitimately looks like he's gliding. never looks like he's fully running, but he moves.

You made my point when you brought up Steve Slaton. That guy put up 1200+ yards i believe a few seasons ago before Foster got there. Not sure if hes in the NFL anymore. Obviously Slaton isnt the same level as Foster. And neither is Tate. But even you have to admit the holes that Foster runs through are huge. Yeah, Foster has the patience, vision and ability to cut through those holes. The holes remind me of the ones Shaun Alexander use to run through on the Seahawks.

 

[ag 47]

Its all preference, can't go wrong with any of em.

You really can't.

I agree with you on not being sold on Shady being able to carry the ball on the level of Ray Rice. And it's just because we'll never know. Which is why I held off on putting Jamaal Charles in my Top 5. Charles has the highest YPC avg in NFL for his amount carries. That's also pretty crazy, but can he carry the full load?

And I absolutely love the way Marshawn runs. But it's bittersweet watching him and backs with his style simply because you know that style isn't sustainable. I was just telling my buddy the other day how I feel like Marshawn will be done after 3 more years similar to Marion "The Barbarian."

 

[do work son]

man... i miss marion barber. i loved the way he played, and got rewarded nothing for it. they let him run himself into the ground and tossed him out like old trash

 

[mmg]

man... i miss marion barber. i loved the way he played, and got rewarded nothing for it. they let him run himself into the ground and tossed him out like old trash

dude did work and wasted his year on the cowgirls


skittles is the goods though

 

[ag 47]

i apologize.
he said something about gore being top 5 and i brought up the space thing in comparison to Shady / Foster / Rice
IMO the top tier of backs are Foster / Shady / Rice / AD / Skittles / MJD
CJK hasnt been consistent.
S-Jax isnt being used for what ever reason
Forte is made of Glass

I think you have to include Forte in there. I'm not sure you can label him injury prone...only because how many games due to injury did Forte miss before last year? I can't remember many, if any. At one point, Forte was the Bears offense similar to Ray for the Ravens. And because of his versatility in the passing game. As far as a complete Running Back, there aren't many more than Matt Forte.

 

[mastamind033]

Hate to see Burleson end up like that. He put some pretty good years in with the Vikes and Hawks, and was a very reliable complement to Megatron. Forgot this would be his 2nd major leg injury too

No doubt, I would love him to stay but he's gonna have to take a pay cut. It would suck for the locker room to lose one of it's leaders. The pre-game speech below that he gave before the Cowboys game last year is still one of my all time favorites...

 

[checks grossman]

Happy to see my son Ryan Broyles make his debut last night ttt

 

[do work son]

Hate to see Burleson end up like that. He put some pretty good years in with the Vikes and Hawks, and was a very reliable complement to Megatron. Forgot this would be his 2nd major leg injury too

No doubt, I would love him to stay but he's gonna have to take a pay cut. It would suck for the locker room to lose one of it's leaders. The pre-game speech below that he gave before the Cowboys game last year is still one of my all time favorites...

"we gon bust they *** from sideline to sideline, from goalpost to goalpost, for 4 quarters"

 

[flyerthandelta]

You still running your mouth in here son..

 

[blackxme]

Mario Willimas might get season-ending wrist surgery. I have no ill will towards the dude, I thought he was relatively good for the Texans. He's just never going to live up to what some people expect him to be at this rate.
link

 

[Peep Game]

Hate to see Burleson end up like that. He put some pretty good years in with the Vikes and Hawks, and was a very reliable complement to Megatron. Forgot this would be his 2nd major leg injury too

No doubt, I would love him to stay but he's gonna have to take a pay cut. It would suck for the locker room to lose one of it's leaders. The pre-game speech below that he gave before the Cowboys game last year is still one of my all time favorites...

Maaaaaaan

 

[MON5T3R]

I was just messing around with the 'name your top 10 RBs' talk because of what always happens when the 'name your top 10 WRs' debate pops up.