NFL Discussion Thread: Pats win SB XLIX. Offseason begins

[licensed to ball]

I think that fantasy football and box scores have really ruined a lot of football discussion, especially when talking about top players at their positions.

"Numbers don't lie" and "check the stats" are easy things to say, but in reality, football is a sport that needs to be watched. If all you care about is numbers, go watch baseball. They've got loads of numbers that mean jack ****. While high numbers definitely play a part, writing a guy off because of a bad year happens way too often. Watch the games.

Calvin had a less successful regular season than Golden Tate... does that mean he's washed? Is he overrated? **** no, the dude had a down year. He's still a walking mismatch and the best WR in the game.

Stats are cool, but don't use THIS NUMBER BIGGER > SMALL PUNY NUMBER for every discussion. They have their time and place.

/endrant

Thank you.

Everytime dudes fall back on the whole "show me the numbers to prove it" argument I just cringe.

Sure, stats are a factor in discussing production and value to a team... But they aren't the biggest aspect of judging players overall skill sets. you gotta watch more than just 30 second highlights on NFL.com to understand how great some of these players are, and no I ain't just talkin about Jordy.

I'm talkin about AJ. He's still a top 5 WR but dudes think he's washed because he had a "bad" statistical year (to his standards.) there are so many factors that go into his "slow" year statistically. Same goes with Megatron. Both dealt with a lot of changes both in health and in offensive schemes this season. But according to fantasy stat nerds both are washed now...

 

[stillin729]

Kurt Warner is 100% a first ballot HoFer. He did more in a six year span than some people did in their entire careers.

agree 1000000% with this

Kurt is one of the best QB's I ever watched IMO

 

[mister friendly]

Kurt Warner was nice for like 4 seasons

 

[Chester McFloppy]

Kurt Warner was nice for like 4 seasons

He was more than "nice for 4 seasons" -- he was one of the best QBs I've ever seen.

The accuracy that man possessed. :x

 

[stillin729]

although if Kurt Warner gets in it's a travesty that Terrell Davis isn't in

 

[licensed to ball]

I'm legit sad Kurt and Fitz didn't win that Super Bowl. They played exceptionally throughout that entire playoff run.

I know in this world no one "deserves" anything, and you gotta earn what you want.

But I genuinely thought they deserved that chip.

**** Santonio Holmes and **** lucky *** Big Ben with his closed eye Eli Manning looking throw into the end zone.

 

[stillin729]

How is it a "travesty" if TD doesn't get in?

Dude didn't play long enough and played in a system that pumped out 1000 yard rushers like nothing.

you gonna base getting in the hall off a short span then TD should get in

TD didn't just have "1000 yard" seasons, be serious with that

 

[mister friendly]

We've went over this before

TD was arguably one of greatest running backs ever for a short time like Kurt Warner was to quarterbacks

Remember Marc Bulger, he put pretty damn good numbers with those same Rams weapons

 

[Chester McFloppy]

Marc Bulger? The guy that never threw for over 24 touchdowns? The guy that had a 122:93 TD to INT ratio? The guy that went 41-54?

 

[Chester McFloppy]

Matt Cassel won 10 games when Tom Brady went down, I guess we can ignore Tom Brady's numbers.

#DatLogic

 

[gunna get it]

[emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji]

Mannnnn

 

[captainsneakerhead23]

TD was a beast, I think he would've put those numbers up or close to it anywhere else IMO.

Kurt is a HOF.

 

[proshares]

Do they have a max on how many players they can vote in?

I'm looking at the list and there are a lot of elite names on there.

I think I already said my piece in that thread. Kurt should be first ballot.

Where do you draw the line when a reason you're nixing someone is because they came from a system? Do Bruce and Holt lose votes because of the way they played with Warner and the Martz system for how many years?

 

[IATT]

While I agree with your point.. At least people are following football a little more than just their team and can have discussions beyond just that little bubble

But there are a ton of people who just don't REALLY know football on the whole.. Look at the convo couple weeks ago about jj watt and someone trying to discredit his MVP chances by using the season michael strahan had when he broke the sack record

Not realizing the basic responsiblities of a 4-3 DE and a 5 tech in the 3-4.. obviously we don't know what exactly a guy is asked to do on a given play, since none of us are in the huddle

But with everything, there has to be an understanding of the basic context before you get to the larger conversation.. A lot of football fans just go sheepishly with what they hear on these studio shows not realizing that they are dumbing it down to make it relatible to the average joe who can barely run let alone play organized team sports

 

[buc em]

I'm legit sad Kurt and Fitz didn't win that Super Bowl. They played exceptionally throughout that entire playoff run.

I know in this world no one "deserves" anything, and you gotta earn what you want.

But I genuinely thought they deserved that chip.

**** Santonio Holmes and **** lucky *** Big Ben with his closed eye Eli Manning looking throw into the end zone.

I think this pissed me off more than any Super Bowl. They deserved that **** and they deserved to have that one last play to throw Fitz a Hail Mary dude was so unstoppable that year that you just knew he would come down with it.

 

[Chester McFloppy]

I'm legit sad Kurt and Fitz didn't win that Super Bowl. They played exceptionally throughout that entire playoff run.

I know in this world no one "deserves" anything, and you gotta earn what you want.

But I genuinely thought they deserved that chip.

**** Santonio Holmes and **** lucky *** Big Ben with his closed eye Eli Manning looking throw into the end zone.

uuuuuggggghhhhhh

Kurt to Fitz was unstoppable that entire run.

 

[fraij da 5 11]

 

I think that fantasy football and box scores have really ruined a lot of football discussion, especially when talking about top players at their positions.

"Numbers don't lie" and "check the stats" are easy things to say, but in reality, football is a sport that needs to be watched. If all you care about is numbers, go watch baseball. They've got loads of numbers that mean jack ****. While high numbers definitely play a part, writing a guy off because of a bad year happens way too often. Watch the games.

Calvin had a less successful regular season than Golden Tate... does that mean he's washed? Is he overrated? **** no, the dude had a down year. He's still a walking mismatch and the best WR in the game.

Stats are cool, but don't use THIS NUMBER BIGGER > SMALL PUNY NUMBER for every discussion. They have their time and place.

/endrant

Thank you.

Everytime dudes fall back on the whole "show me the numbers to prove it" argument I just cringe.

Sure, stats are a factor in discussing production and value to a team... But they aren't the biggest aspect of judging players overall skill sets. you gotta watch more than just 30 second highlights on NFL.com to understand how great some of these players are, and no I ain't just talkin about Jordy.

I'm talkin about AJ. He's still a top 5 WR but dudes think he's washed because he had a "bad" statistical year (to his standards.) there are so many factors that go into his "slow" year statistically. Same goes with Megatron. Both dealt with a lot of changes both in health and in offensive schemes this season. But according to fantasy stat nerds both are washed now...

"who are the best _____?"

vs

"who are playing the best _____?" 

are 2 completely different questions and seperate from each other.

 

[fraij da 5 11]

Shoes needed to peep all 32 teams "all 22" film to figure out that Fitz route running was stupid good.

 

[S4L]

Shoes needed to peep all 32 teams "all 22" film to figure out that Fitz route running was stupid good.

I would need it to quantify it into some clown stat ranking every WR like you did.

LOL.

 

[Chester McFloppy]

What stats do you use Shoes?

 

[fraij da 5 11]

I'd ask you to tell me who's routes were better at that time in your opinion but then again you don't think a WR's ability to run routes translates to their numbers in other areas or getting open in general.

 

[stillin729]

if running routes didn't matter Percy Harvin would be world class

 

[stillin729]

What stats do you use Shoes?

only the ones that help make Tony Romo the MVP

 

[sb]

Kurt Warner is 100% a first ballot HoFer. He did more in six years than some people did in their entire careers.

Kurt Warner is 100% a first ballot HoFer. He did more in a six year span than some people did in their entire careers.

agree 1000000% with this

Kurt is one of the best QB's I ever watched IMO

so based on that though process, TD should also be in the hof

How is it a "travesty" if TD doesn't get in?

Dude didn't play long enough and played in a system that pumped out 1000 yard rushers like nothing.

jj your by boy but that has to be one of the dumbest posts you have ever posted on this site. you watch enough football to know that those 1000 yard rushers denver had were nowhere near what TD was in his 1st 4 years in the nfl. infact in those 4 years, TD accomplished what some players dont even sniff in a full career.

 

[pacificnorsewst]

Well said back there, Ches. I've always gone by the adage "stats don't lie, but they don't tell the whole story."

Also couldn't agree more about Kurt. We've been fighting that battle about once every year.