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That's why I posted that specific pic.Originally Posted by EnEyeKayEe
my comment was referring to a certain NTer with a certain sig btw
I'll put it in a spoiler...
ahh ok im just making sure
Offical 2009-10 NBA Season Thread
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by mateen cleaves,
- Start date
I'll put it in a spoiler...
ahh ok im just making sure
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WOW nike
i was eating
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Not to be bias, but i honestly don't see how the cavs are a lock to come out the east???? Orlando is just as talented and just as deep they are. In fact im sure everyone in this forum would agree that in order for the magic or cavs to get to the finals they will have to go thru each other. I dont see atlanta nor boston as any kind threat for there not to be a rematch of last years ECF.
2009-10 Power Rankings: Week 19 RK (LW) TEAM REC COMMENT 1 (3) Magic 44-20 Could it be that this whole title chase is more up for grabs than everybody thought? The undisputed biggest threat to Cleveland in the East just dropped the mighty Lakers to 5-8 against the other five division leaders. 2 (5) Mavericks 43-21 Combined winning percentage of Dallas' next three opponents: .226. In other words? Something is really wrong if the Mavs don't tote a 14-game winning streak into next Monday's rankings. Even with Terry sidelined. 3 (2) Cavaliers 49-15 You think we're overly panicky? That's fine. The view here remains that LeBron has to be back on the floor before we can restore the Cavs to their rightful spot in the top two. No matter how minor LBJ's ailments might seem. 4 (1) Lakers 46-18 The Lakers had gone a whopping 185 games without enduring a three-game losing skid before Sunday's loss in Orlando. The new longest active streak? Denver has played a mere 30 games without a three-game skid. 5 (4) Nuggets 42-21 One reason this loss is such a biggie: K-Mart is quietly having what might be his best season, with 21 double-doubles in 55 games. His single-season best is 27 ... and he hasn't had 20 in a season since 2004-05. 6 (6) Jazz 40-22 So what does winning 21 of your past 26 games get you? Not quite enough in Utah's case. The Jazz awoke on this lovely Monday at No. 4 in the West, which would keep them in the Lakers' bracket for the playoffs. 7 (7) Suns 40-25 The Suns have been targeting these next four days off as a chance to get Nash recharged. Not that you'd say they're dragging as a team, at a tidy 14-4 since Jan. 26, with the havoc Stoudemire has been wreaking. 8 (9) Thunder 38-24 Take it as a compliment, young Mr. Durant, that you're being pestered by media gnats about your OKC future all the time now. That annoyance is yet another sign that you've crashed the game's uppermost stratosphere. 9 ( 
Hawks 40-22 Legitimate question for Hawks folks: Given all the trouble your lads have had with Orlando this season, wouldn't you not-so-secretly prefer finishing with the No. 4 seed? Even if that means dealing with LeBron in Round 2? 10 (13) Celtics 40-21 The Celts will be just the third team ever to field four players with 1,000 career games when Finley makes his debut. Didn't get a sense, during my weekend in Boston, that the locals are too geeked about that distinction. 11 (14) Bucks 33-29 We still can't name him, but the advance scout who tabbed the Bucks as his surprise team of the season in the Weekend Dime isn't looking any less enlightened after the weekend. They're now 9-2 since the All-Star break. 12 (11) Spurs 36-24 One of the most optimistic things we can say about the Spurs' Parker-less plight: New Orleans is generally considered the team most likely to make a run at their playoff spot ... but CP3 is out at least two more weeks. 13 (10) Trail Blazers 37-28 We could obviously delve into the Blazers' latest injury nightmare. Or we could give them a rare break and focus on that 4-1 road trip, which made them one of only three teams to win four games on two separate trips. 14 (1 Bobcats 30-31 Funny old game, huh? Charlotte just took its record against Dallas to 0-12 lifetime ... and 7-2 against the Lakers since February 2006. Cleveland is the only other team with a winning record against L.A. in that span. 15 (20) Heat 32-31 If you're just looking at rosters, wouldn't Miami have to be the team you'd pinpoint to finish fifth in the four-team race for the bottom four playoff spots in the East? But who would dare suggest D-Wade won't find a way? 16 (17) Grizzlies 32-31 The 1-8 start when they were still trying to get used to life with Iverson is one thing. Good luck explaining/rationalizing how the Grizz have managed to lose eight straight home games ... while winning six roadies in a row. 17 (12) Bulls 31-31 It's not our style to be hyperbolic (yeah, right) but everyone sees it: Noah is the second-to-last player D-Rose's Bulls can afford to lose at a time when the fifth through ninth seeds in the East are so tightly bunched. 18 (16) Raptors 32-29 The post-Olympics euphoria is going to wear off eventually. Good thing, then, that Bosh is finally back after a seven-game absence that saw the Raps lose all their mojo under the cover of Canada winning hockey gold. 19 (15) Hornets 31-32 This is already Chris Paul's most painful season yet in terms of games lost to injury, easily topping the 18 games he lost -- mostly to a bad ankle -- in the 2006-07 season. The '09-10 Hornets are 10-15 without him. 20 (19) Rockets 31-31 All Scola has to do is keep this up -- 21.3 points and 18.0 boards over his past three games -- and Houstonians will (eventually) get over the fact that their Rockets had to surrender Landry in the Kevin Martin deal. 21 (23) 76ers 23-39 Probably not the advised path if you're angling to secure the public's support in demanding Philly: Eddie Jordan's beleaguered crew has been strangely more competitive on the road (13-20) than at home (10-19). 22 (21) Clippers 25-38 Why were the Mavs and other contenders so hopeful that the Clips would buy out Drew Gooden after facilitating the three-way deal that landed Jamison in Cleveland? Since landing in L.A., Gooden is averaging 16 and 10. 23 (22) Wizards 21-39 It's been that kind of season in the nation's capital: Gilbert Arenas has played in a mere 32 of 59 games, last suited up for the Wiz on Jan. 5 ... and still leads this not-so-pass-happy squad in total assists with 230. 24 (26) Kings 21-42 Our beloved Casspi was back in Dallas on Friday night for the last time as a rookie, while the committee [of one] was on a plane bound for Dorkapalooza. Which is the only bad thing we can say about the weekend. 25 (25) Pistons 22-41 This week's guest taunt, er, tweet comes from the Power Rankings-loving Sports Guy: "Have the Pistons supplanted the Lions as the most depressing team in Detroit? I can't believe that team was intentionally assembled." 26 (24) Pacers 20-43 Any Pacer People out there remember that 5-3 start? Or shall we rephrase the question: Any Pacer People out there prepared to raise your hands? Tough times unless you happen to be watching the new Reggie Miller doc. 27 (27) Warriors 17-45 Interesting wrinkle in what looks like a two-rook ROY race between the Dubs' Steph Curry and the Kings' Tyreke Evans: Records don't really factor in when the two teams are on pace for 23 and 27 wins, respectively. 28 (2 Knicks 21-41 That groan you just heard came from New Yorkers who don't want to read or hear a word about how tough the No. 6 Jazz have it. Every ugly loss that the Knicks pile up only sweetens that first-round pick bound for Utah. 29 (29) Timberwolves 14-49 Hard to see our man K-Love making a real push in the Sixth Man Award race with the Wolves getting thumped anew, but it is worth noting he's tops in the league in double-doubles off the bench with a solid 14. 30 (30) Nets 7-55 Extending Memphis' home losing skid to nine would give the Nets their first back-to-back wins of the season. Which would also somehow give them four straight Ws on the road. Which is why our tone is so skeptical.
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eneye...i didnt even realize what your sn meant till now
doo be doowned
doo be doowned
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Wouldn't even have to be monumental. Spurs would have to play above their abilities to play over .500 ball with their remaining schedule/no Parker. I don't see them doing too well after this week. (bad start already with loss to Cle)
Grizz would have to play much better than they've been lately, though.
I'm sure CP will thoroughly enjoy this fine article:
[h1]
[h1]
[/h1][h1]Greatest shooters ever[/h1][h3]PER Diem: March 9, 2010[/h3]
By John Hollinger
ESPN.com
Nathaniel S. Butler/Getty ImagesSteve Nash is known more for his passing prowess, but his shooting ability might be his best skill.
You'll often hear casual basketball fans lament the lack of shooting in today's game, especially from the free throw line. But actually, we have the opposite problem: The current NBA is littered with great shooters. In fact, several of the best shooters of all time are currently on NBA rosters, and most of them are more or less in their prime.
Without leaving the top half of the Western Conference standings, for instance, I can point out names like Steve Nash, Dirk Nowitzki, Peja Stojakovic, Kevin Martin and Chauncey Billups, all of whom have put together multiple seasons that rank among the best shooting performances in history. That's to say nothing of the other great shooters in the league -- Ray Allen, Jason Kapono, free throw-record holder Jose Calderon, Ben Gordon, Kyle Korver … the list goes on and on.
But which one is the best of the best? Aye, there's the rub. We've never had a clear metric for ranking the game's best shooters … well, at least until today's ill-advised endeavor. That's right -- we're going to try ranking the best shooters in the game's history.
First, a caveat: By "history," we're limiting ourselves to the 3-point era. There were plenty of great shooters who played prior to that point, but we have no way to verify their cases statistically. In particular, it appears Calvin Murphy and Rick Barry -- two players from the 1970s who were renowned for their shooting range and rank among the top six free throw shooters of all time -- are slighted by today's methodology. Bill Sharman, Mike Newlin and Fred Brown also get my apologies.
OK, now for the method. My first step is to require players pass through a couple of fairly low "gates:" shooting 85 percent from the line with at least a 45 percent mark on 3s, or shooting 87.5 percent from the line with at least 42.5 percent made on 3s, or shooting 90 percent from the stripe with at least 40 percent made on 3s.
The point at this stage isn't to determine the best shooter of all time but to eliminate all the players we know darn well aren't the best shooter of all time. This does an efficient job, narrowing our list to 44 players.
From there, I set about creating a formula to rank the best shooters. I thought I'd have to dream up something very complex to adjust for all the variables involved, but it turned out a simple formula worked far better than any of my more exotic concoctions. I simply added a player's 2-point, 3-point and free throw percentages. We'll call this "Combined Shooting Rating," or CSR for short.
CSR works for a few reasons. First, the free throw is a pretty fair arbiter of shooting ability. It's the only true apples-to-apples measurement we have, because it's always 15 feet from the hoop and unguarded, regardless of what system the team runs or how the player is used. It's only one shot among many that need to be in a player's arsenal, but it's an important one.
Second, the yin and yang of 2-point and 3-point ability balance each other out. Some players are more effective midrange shooters than long-range marksmen, while others are more comfortable bombing away. And using this method makes the system more fair to players from the 1980s and early '90s, when teams didn't utilize the 3 as often or as effectively.
The one thing I left out was frequency. Obviously, players who pick their spots get higher-percentage looks than those who are the focal point of the offense on play after play. On the other hand, it's extremely difficult for players in the former group to shoot well enough from the line to crack the elite on this list, simply because of the lack of in-game repetition. Several snipers with great numbers from the floor (Brent Barry, for instance, or Hubert Davis) couldn't get into the top 10 because of free throw percentage, and even the second-ranked player on our list (one of the all-time snipers) has the worst free throw percentage of anybody in the top 10.
Also, I did set two minimum standards: 10,000 career minutes and 250 made 3-pointers. I didn't want anybody getting onto the list with a lengthy career sparsely populated with 3-point attempts; that seemed counter to the point of the exercise. While arbitrary, 250 nicely separated the truly deadly long-range shooters from the guys who merely hit midrange J's and made their free throws.
So now that our rather simple CSR method is clear, let's get to our list of the top 10 shooters, which also apparently doubles as a great predictor of post-career broadcasting, coaching and front-office opportunities. According to CSR, they are:
[h4]Top All-Time Shooters By CSR[/h4]Min. 10,000 career minutes[th=""]Player[/th][th=""]2-Pt%[/th][th=""]3-Pt%[/th][th=""]FT%[/th][th=""]CSR[/th]
Steve Nash .515 .431 .903 1.849 Steve Kerr .494 .454 .864 1.812 Reggie Miller .525 .395 .888 1.807 Mark Price .501 .402 .904 1.807 Jeff Hornacek .515 .403 .877 1.795 Chris Mullin .533 .384 .865 1.783 Peja Stojakovic .485 .400 .895 1.779 Larry Bird .509 .376 .886 1.770 Ray Allen .482 .396 .893 1.770 Dana Barros .488 .411 .858 1.757
That's right: Steve Nash. By a mile.
I've always written that his shooting is his most underappreciated skill, but even so, this blows me away.
It makes sense, though -- run through the numbers, and Nash crushes every possible competitor. And it becomes even more impressive when one considers nearly all his shots from the field have come off the dribble. Nash and the fourth-ranked player on this list, Mark Price, are the only two players in history to shoot better than 50 percent on 2s, 40 percent on 3s and 90 percent from the line for their careers. And as it happens, Nash's general manager in Phoenix, Steve Kerr, is second on the list.
One strong point of this list is that it acknowledges a few of the game's great midrange shooters. Neither Chris Mullin nor Jeff Hornacek shot the 3 with great frequency, for instance, but both were deadly accurate when they did, and they were exceptional from 2-point range.
Fans of "Larry Legend" undoubtedly will be disappointed to see him ninth on this list and to see one player of his own size -- Stojakovic -- rank just ahead of him. But Bird's greatest asset was his ability to make high-difficulty shots, which would need to be part of a different list entirely -- a list that would include different players. (Kobe Bryant, for one obvious example, is nowhere close on the above list but would have to rank high on any list of tough-shot makers.)
If you're wondering about Nowitzki, he is 13th, and easily the best among players 6-foot-10 or taller. Players 11 to 20 on this list are Barry, Hersey Hawkins, Nowitzki, Davis, Korver, Mo Williams, Danny Ainge, Allan Houston, Scott Skiles and Glen Rice.
Before I exit, some players who didn't make my list warrant mentioning.
The first is Drazen Petrovic, who just missed my minutes cut-off because of his untimely death in 1993. Petro's rating of 1.799 would have put him fifth on the list, a fact that becomes even more impressive when one considers he was only 28 when he died -- most players improve their numbers on the above criteria well into their 30s.
The second is Calderon, who needs only 779 more minutes to crack the list; his 1.805 career mark would place him fifth. Calderon also has only 238 made 3s on his career and needs to make 12 more of those. You might think his free throw percentage carries him into the top 10, but actually it's his amazing 2-point field goal percentage that does it. Calderon has shot 53.4 percent for his career on 2-point shots, the best mark of any of the 44 players in this study.
Finally, two young players on the Golden State Warriors have established a great chance of finishing their careers near the top of this list. Rookie Stephen Curry is at 1.770 thus far in his brief career, and should that number hold up, he'll finish his career in the top 10. Since players' shooting often improves dramatically in their second through fifth seasons, he could finish as one of the top-ranked players of all time.
Then again, he also might finish second among current Warriors. Curry's teammate, Anthony Morrow, has played two NBA seasons as a part-time starter, and posted career marks of 48.8 percent on 2s, 45.9 percent on 3s and 87.6 percent from the line. That's good for a CSR of 1.822, which is better than every other player in history except Nash.
Obviously we're dealing with smaller sample sizes with those two, and it's possible they'll regress in future seasons. But when we discuss the great all-time shooters, those two are worth tracking in future seasons to see if they warrant a spot in the conversation.
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^^ CP rolled over his grave
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I don't think CP has a problem admitting that Steve is one of the best shooters ever to play.
ESPECIALLY for his position.
ESPECIALLY for his position.
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You know bigmike can't admit to anything the Grizz could do.
I still think our chances are slim, but our schedule is a little easier than the Spurs going to the end of March to April.
They have NYK, Minny, LAC, @Mia, @Orl, @Atl, @OKC, LAL twice, Cle, @Bos, Hou. Orl, @Pho, Mem, @Den and @Dal.
Memphis got Chicago, Denver, Knicks, Boston, GSW twice, @Sac, @Mil, Dal twice, NOH, @Orl, Hou twice, @Sas, Philly, @Den, @OKC.
Only 4 1/2 games back, so it could happen. It doesn't really take a major collapse. Just for the Grizz to win 2 or 3 straight and the Spurs to lose 2 or 3 straight. With their schedule and how they lost to Cleveland without Lebron, makes it seem like they could collapse. I know Portland is gone though. They have an easy schedule and they aren't losing.
do be doo
Banned
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Steve Nash is a really good shooter. No doubt.
Calling him the greatest of all time is, well, dumb. But, he did mention the degree of difficulty and all that, shooters such as Allen and Reggie comin off screens with dudes chasin em catchin and shooting all net is better then anything Nash has ever done.
Although, Nash does hit some tough @#$ shots every once in a while. I think Holinger should have posted attempts in his rankings as well. But that's probably a TON of research to put together.
Mike wasn't just whistlin dixie, that Durant thread is crack.
Glad I stayed outta that one.
Why Duncan don't get the ball the last 4 minutes of the game last night? Manu and Mason were jackin shots up left and right, all Duncan was doing was setting moving screens the whole time. Why?
Calling him the greatest of all time is, well, dumb. But, he did mention the degree of difficulty and all that, shooters such as Allen and Reggie comin off screens with dudes chasin em catchin and shooting all net is better then anything Nash has ever done.
Although, Nash does hit some tough @#$ shots every once in a while. I think Holinger should have posted attempts in his rankings as well. But that's probably a TON of research to put together.
Mike wasn't just whistlin dixie, that Durant thread is crack.
Why Duncan don't get the ball the last 4 minutes of the game last night? Manu and Mason were jackin shots up left and right, all Duncan was doing was setting moving screens the whole time. Why?
do be doo
Banned
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CP1708 wrote:
Why Duncan don't get the ball the last 4 minutes of the game last night? Manu and Mason were jackin shots up left and right, all Duncan was doing was setting moving screens the whole time. Why?
I really don't know why Duncan didn't wanted the ball...
Manu gets a pass..
but MASON...0-8 from the 3 point line...
Mason wanted more playing and got his chance since parker is out....and blows it....
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I don't it is ludicrious at all to say Nash is the greatest shooter of all time. His jump shot is perfect and the percentages don't lie.
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Because he should be taking over the league by storm like Lebron is.Originally Posted by CP1708
Man, just seen the Pip on D12 thread. Is it me, or do a LOT of people hate on poor Dwight?
I mean, what's the need to constantly speak out on this kid and beat on him a little? People not buyin his nice guy act or somethin?
Yeah you can give him the "he doesn't get that many plays ran for him" argument, but there's no reason he shouldn't be averaging 25, 15 and 4. He's been in the league 6 years, so he should get some fire in him and play ball like he suppose to. Shaq averaged around 28, 12 and 3 in his 4 years in Orlando around the same age as Dwight. Sure Dwight isn't as potent as Shaq offensively, but he should be there by now. I honestly don't know how often he works on his post game.
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Like I said in the other thread... Hearing dudes continually spout the "He cannot carry a team to a championship without another star" crap makes my stomach hurt.
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The problem with the Pippen / Dwight thread is Pippen wasn't "hating" on him. Everything he said was the truth. Just because he wasn't praising him, doesn't mean he's "hating." Dwight has faults in his game, & Pippen commented on it... Something negative doesn't always = hate. The truth is the truth.
& No, Im not a hater...
& No, Im not a hater...
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I agree it is ******ed...But one can't deny that it is offensive improvement over the years has at the least been underwhelming.
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(Ridnour falls down and loses the ball out of bounds.)
Tommy Heinsohn:
"Ridnour had to really turn on the jets to get around the corner against Nate. The problem was he couldn't stop. Kind of like a Toyota."
Tommy Heinsohn:
"Ridnour had to really turn on the jets to get around the corner against Nate. The problem was he couldn't stop. Kind of like a Toyota."
Clippers doing something right:
http://twitter.com/STEIN_LINE_HQ
http://twitter.com/STEIN_LINE_HQ
@STEIN_LINE_HQ TheClippers just announced that they've parted company with Mike Dunleavy.Neil Olshey assumes front-office control from Dunleavy
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Originally Posted by CP1708
Man, just seen the Pip on D12 thread. Is it me, or do a LOT of people hate on poor Dwight?
I mean, what's the need to constantly speak out on this kid and beat on him a little? People not buyin his nice guy act or somethin?
i don't like wasted potential. that's why i stopped buying eminem cd's 5 years ago. I have nothing against him as a person. i mean i know we never really know these guys through the television, but he seems like a very nice guy from what i've seen.
with that said *larry david*...... I don't want a nice guy being the "leader" of my squad. i was a straight up prick on the court just like kobe and MJ.
It's a bigger problem than that though. the media force feeds us who is a star and who isn't. we see lebron get more attention than he probably should, maybe d wade too. meanwhile plaers like duncan, deron williams, melo and durant are kind of left to the side. not getting exposure. they throw dwight into the category of lebron and wade and force feed us that he is the greatest center in the league. But they know, and we know, and you kniw, and he knows that it is by DEFAULT.
i want the insults and criticisms to hype him up. a lot of the knicks future may depend on the magic beating the cavs up in the playoffs. so when i talk bad about him, it's just that i feel like he can be SO much better
mjshoefanatic
Banned
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Originally Posted by LazyJ10
Clippers doing something right:
http://twitter.com/STEIN_LINE_HQ
