***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[DADDYFATSACKS]

Trump can't pardon state crimes and I think he has to tell the judge what he is pleading guilty to.

This. Hes pleading to state crimes.

 

[dwalk31]

Trump can't pardon state crimes and I think he has to tell the judge what he is pleading guilty to.

This. Hes pleading to state crimes.

These are federal charges

 

[the natural mystic]

These are federal charges

Yep, you're right but wouldn't he still have to spill the beans even with a pardon?

 

[dwalk31]

Yep, you're right but wouldn't he still have to spill the beans even with a pardon?

I mean he would have to state what he is pleading guilty to. But, without implicating President Trump, there really isn't much exposure as it relates to the White House.

So far, all reporting suggests that he is pleading guilty without cooperating. Which honestly doesn't make much sense to me. We will see soon enough.

 

[RIP sleazyy]

Deal said he doesn't have to coop with NY investigation. He could still talk to Mueller if he chooses.

Judge can also reject the plea deal IIRC.

 

[elpablo21]

Co-conspirators pardoning co-conspirators, WATTBA

 

[the natural mystic]

His cooperation might not be necessary, Mueller might have all the evidence he needs.

 

[getback]

There has to be some sort of conflict of interest law that would prevent him from pardoning his own damn attorney

Then again there's nothing just about our justice system, so there's probably not.

If Cohen were to be charged on the federal level, a Presidential Pardon would be applicable. However, it would also remove the ability to invoke the Fifth Amendment. Put bluntly, the Fifth protects you from being compelled to answer if doing so might incriminate you and place you at risk of prosecution. A pardon removes that risk, and therefore enables you to be compelled to testify. Cohen’s acceptance of a Presidential Pardon in that instance would guarantee that he’d be called up for testimony in any investigation of Trump. This would not benefit Trump in the slightest.

However, there are wider consequences beyond merely the legal ones: Trump pardoning his ‘fixer’ would invariably point to the notion that there’s some form of quid-pro-quo in play, and that Cohen expects Trump to bail him out of any legal trouble - and that Trump will have done this. That raises some serious questions as to why Trump is so inclined to protect Cohen - noting that narcissists do not stick their necks out for anybody unless there’s a good reason. Put bluntly: Cohen being in need of protection is one thing, but getting that protection from Trump is quite another.

This will, of course, serve as further evidence that Trump is willing to play fast-and-loose with the justice system: wielding the Presidential Pardon nepotistically, to save those close to him from being in trouble. How is he protecting the United States when he subverts the justice system to protect his friends and allies? It would be a simple declaration: “My friends are above the law, even when convicted by it”. Is that a President anyone can truly have faith in?

It’s also worth noting that acceptance of a Presidential Pardon is often taken as admission of guilt. If Cohen is guilty of wrongdoing, that’s a real problem for Donald Trump, because Cohen only has three clients, one of whom is none other than Donald Trump. If Cohen has been engaged in criminal activities, were they done on behalf of, at the behest of, or in the interests of Donald Trump?

 

[dwalk31]

There has to be some sort of conflict of interest law that would prevent him from pardoning his own damn attorney

Then again there's nothing just about our justice system, so there's probably not.

I mean a pardon is certainly within his presidential powers. If Cohen is pleading guilty, but saying that President Trump had no knowledge of it, then there is not really any exposure on the president.

Can't be a co-conspirator if you didn't conspire. Of course, this is all speculation at this point. He could implicate Trump and then it is a different conversation.

The idea that a pardon is an admission of guilt kind of falls flat since him taking a plea deal is an admission of guilt as well.

 

[dwalk31]

Jury in Paul Manafort trial said they are hung on 10 of the 18 counts. This means that earlier they were hung on 17 of the 18 counts.

Judge interviewing the jurors individually.

 

[wavycrocket]

Judge Ellis aint right

 

[RustyShackleford]

They got Walnuts on the other 8 counts

The Ostrich Leather Gawd is officially is done for.

 

[wavycrocket]

Paulie Still going up the road.

How your campaign manager and personal lawyer both plea/found guilty 45 minutes apart

 

[dacomeup]

And this is just the first trial. Paulie ain't seeing the outside of a prison.

 

[nomnom]

PAUL MANAFRAUD

 

[DADDYFATSACKS]

Get them cheeks ready Paulie. Someone gonna be hitting back shots in the pen.

 

[dwalk31]

Five counts of tax fraud, two counts of bank fraud and one count of failing to file foreign bank account reports.

Going to be paying some hefty fines.

 

[DADDYFATSACKS]

Five counts of tax fraud, two counts of bank fraud and one count of failing to file foreign bank account reports.

Going to be paying some hefty fines.

Plus prison time.

 

[wavycrocket]

@osh kosh bosh

You know what to do .

And to think...these dudes could’ve kept defrauding America and making M’s for the rest of their lives if Trump ain’t run for president .

Now, they felons. Yikes

 

[nawghtyhare]

they reading the verdict today???

 

[dwalk31]

Plus prison time.

Not so sure. Especially considering the realistic probability that Trump could just pardon him. Which is likely, considering that none of these convictions are related to President Trump.

 

[RustyShackleford]

If Walnuts got any dirt on Trump he needs to call up Bob Mueller and act like a middle aged freshly divorced lesbian, at a family dinner, that has been living in a loveless marriage with an abusive man for the last 25 years....

It is time to speak your truth.

 

[dacomeup]

 

[DADDYFATSACKS]

Not so sure. Especially considering the realistic probability that Trump could just pardon him. Which is likely, considering that none of these convictions are related to President Trump.

Trump doesn’t have the balls to pardon him.

 

[dwalk31]

Turns out that Cohen did implicate Trump. "At the direction of a candidate for federal office." Now it makes more sense.