TAY: IT'S A MAN THING GINA

[fontaine]

Still in Dallas? Took my girl here, was awesome, had us in that food coma though https://www.groupon.com/biz/richardson-tx/blue-charcoal Went to Northpark Mall first and watched her get an unneeded makeover and waste like 3 bills on makeup in Neiman Marcus, then went to Whole Foods and picked out a wine and some fruit, then to the above spot and back to the telly and passed out before we could even smash or find out where exactly that Erykah Badu appearance was supposed to be happening

In Houston, I go to Chama Guacha Brazillian steakhouse on Westheimer. Never got to take a girl there though

already.

We still got a gang of places to check out.

Here's a list:
la Duni
Slow bone bar b q
Fish city grill Arlington
Lousiena poboys in carrollton downtown
Seasons 52
Illcane Russo
LA calle doce
Melters
Mr Phil's and Odom's
Owners box at the omni
Cool river

I'll add that place to the list.

 

[tdogg2k]

For my USA Travelers,

My girl and I decided we're goign to hit a little road trip.
What are some nice scenic areas?
Some personal recommendations.

 

[flyeed]

man I'm worried I'm incapable of loving.

I can't look beyond chicks having a past because of my culture and how i was brought up, but most chicks that would have conducted themselves "acceptably" are either too young or most likely too lame. i'm with a girl right now who i wouldn't trade to be with any other chick i know, and can't develop emotions for her because she's been in past relationships and experienced everything possible on an intimate level with 2 different dudes before. and I know it's wrong because she's down for me now, but I can't control how i was brought up and knowing she did those things growing up in the same culture where even going on a date is taboo for a chick.

and it sucks because it's really difficult to find a advice on this since much of NT understandably wouldn't be able to empathize with the culture, and I can't bring it up with friends/fam in case I wind up marrying this chick. gotta keep it under wraps.

idk maybe when i find the chick that's really right for me, i'll be so blinded by love that i wouldn't give a F about previous things.

 

[drkingschultz]

^^^^ oh........ok
My dude said his first chance to confront me

Could it be that some dudes just got game like that
And could finesse a woman out their underwear
I can't fault a woman for wanting to get D'd down by me
**** I'm handsome
Good head in my shoulders
Funny
Charming
Funny
And have always had steady/good jobs
Some women just start leaking when they run across a dude whose irrisistable

I'm Sorry if I find your personality a little bit abrasive to say the least.. And not "irresistible" like the vunerable women you prey upon find you.

I wonder how is that so? With all the good qualities you possess like..
Funny
Charming
Funny

You got game. Carry on with that good head "in" your shoulders. see where it takes you.

View media item 1338096

 

[Kaleo15]

At work and all I can think about is beating my girls back out
She gave head like a ******* champ last night
That no gag reflex she got is
Like she swallowed me whole bruhs........WHOLE
She was kissing my Testicles
WHILE she was using her throat muscles to jack me off
It was like a Chinese finger trap
And at the feeling of all that warm spit when it falls down the shaft to the balls
So hyped I busted 5 MAYBE 6 pumps in and rolled over and fell asleep
Damn I gotta stop playing and marry this woman

with that much fervor for the d, how u know she's won't do that indiscriminately at some point later on? Im not sure how real that whole lady in the street, freak in the bed thing is

Well I'm not naive and know she sucked a d or two before we got together
But I know in these 7 years we been together my d is the ONLY d she wants
And not just cause I d her down proper
It's cause of all the other lil things I do in our relationship
any female can suck and **** and all that
BUT a TRUE female
The female for u
Will suck and **** and let u fall asleep without trippin about not getting hers
And go get the rag and wipe up after while u sleep

Your girl does this too? Yeah bro... put a ring on it! I BEEN off ththe market for a minute now. Can't let another dude get the steal.

 

[jumpmanpro97]

7 years damn wife her already

 

[purple sneaks]

Taking notes with da lurk..... i see yall.

 

[suberzat1]

 I need to take my *** to sleep knowing that I am not about to make that trip for yambs tonight...

 

[23kidd]

I can never fall asleep after a good session, i always get hungry LOL

 

[datznasty]

Still in Dallas? Took my girl here, was awesome, had us in that food coma though https://www.groupon.com/biz/richardson-tx/blue-charcoal Went to Northpark Mall first and watched her get an unneeded makeover and waste like 3 bills on makeup in Neiman Marcus, then went to Whole Foods and picked out a wine and some fruit, then to the above spot and back to the telly and passed out before we could even smash or find out where exactly that Erykah Badu appearance was supposed to be happening

In Houston, I go to Chama Guacha Brazillian steakhouse on Westheimer. Never got to take a girl there though

already.

We still got a gang of places to check out.

Here's a list:
la Duni
Slow bone bar b q
Fish city grill Arlington
Lousiena poboys in carrollton downtown
Seasons 52
Illcane Russo
LA calle doce
Melters
Mr Phil's and Odom's
Owners box at the omni
Cool river

I'll add that place to the list.

Add Hard Eight BBQ to the list too if you've never been. I'mma google the ones you posted all day at work in a few hours though. Dallas is just a quick, easy getaway for a weekend place for us since it's only 3 hrs and she lived there before for a short time so knows some things to hit up. Seems like ain't no good concerts at HOB, Trees, or Medusa for a while though. Jon B and Eric Benet at the casino here in a few weeks tho but I missed FKA Twigs and Elle Varner like a week apart from each other, and even Daley a week before. Did catch that Marsha Ambrosius though

 

[bandman]

man I'm worried I'm incapable of loving.

I can't look beyond chicks having a past because of my culture and how i was brought up, but most chicks that would have conducted themselves "acceptably" are either too young or most likely too lame. i'm with a girl right now who i wouldn't trade to be with any other chick i know, and can't develop emotions for her because she's been in past relationships and experienced everything possible on an intimate level with 2 different dudes before. and I know it's wrong because she's down for me now, but I can't control how i was brought up and knowing she did those things growing up in the same culture where even going on a date is taboo for a chick.

and it sucks because it's really difficult to find a advice on this since much of NT understandably wouldn't be able to empathize with the culture, and I can't bring it up with friends/fam in case I wind up marrying this chick. gotta keep it under wraps.

idk maybe when i find the chick that's really right for me, i'll be so blinded by love that i wouldn't give a F about previous things.

You're Muslim bro?

The fact that she has had two intimate relationships before you shouldn't be a hindrance especially if you have a similar number or considerably higher. It's pretty hard these days to find a girl with no sexual history, has good character etc. that you're compatible with. Something always has to give. If you don't see yourself ever developing emotions for her because of her past, then it's probably best if you let her go. 

I'm confused as to how you say you can't develop emotions for her yet there is still the possibility that you might end up marrying her. How old are you both? Age plays a factor in these types of cultures especially with marriage and having kids. 

 

[drkingschultz]

drkingschultz unsubscribe from this thread please.

I'm not subscribed I do what I want, you can't tell me nothing.

 

[mgrand15]

man I'm worried I'm incapable of loving.

I can't look beyond chicks having a past because of my culture and how i was brought up, but most chicks that would have conducted themselves "acceptably" are either too young or most likely too lame. i'm with a girl right now who i wouldn't trade to be with any other chick i know, and can't develop emotions for her because she's been in past relationships and experienced everything possible on an intimate level with 2 different dudes before. and I know it's wrong because she's down for me now, but I can't control how i was brought up and knowing she did those things growing up in the same culture where even going on a date is taboo for a chick.

and it sucks because it's really difficult to find a advice on this since much of NT understandably wouldn't be able to empathize with the culture, and I can't bring it up with friends/fam in case I wind up marrying this chick. gotta keep it under wraps.

idk maybe when i find the chick that's really right for me, i'll be so blinded by love that i wouldn't give a F about previous things.

Man, listen to yourself.

Chick has no partners = too lame
Chick has TWO partners = you can't get over it

Pick one. Either get over these outdated, stupid feelings that your culture forced you to have or find a girl that's a virgin and accept her because you're just as lame as she is.

 

[drkingschultz]

man I'm worried I'm incapable of loving.

I can't look beyond chicks having a past because of my culture and how i was brought up, but most chicks that would have conducted themselves "acceptably" are either too young or most likely too lame. i'm with a girl right now who i wouldn't trade to be with any other chick i know, and can't develop emotions for her because she's been in past relationships and experienced everything possible on an intimate level with 2 different dudes before. and I know it's wrong because she's down for me now, but I can't control how i was brought up and knowing she did those things growing up in the same culture where even going on a date is taboo for a chick.

and it sucks because it's really difficult to find a advice on this since much of NT understandably wouldn't be able to empathize with the culture, and I can't bring it up with friends/fam in case I wind up marrying this chick. gotta keep it under wraps.

idk maybe when i find the chick that's really right for me, i'll be so blinded by love that i wouldn't give a F about previous things.

The past is the past, you can't change it, everybody has a past, how many intimate relationships have you been in? Less than her 2 previous intimate relationships? Because that's a good number for a woman now days if your number is the same or higher, then it would seem your guilty of double standards. if she is down for you now, loyal to you and you wouldn't trade her for anybody else, that speaks for itself doesn't it? What relevance does her past play in this?

It's not as if your trying to wife an ex porn star, you know..

Your comment that said, maybe when you find that one girl thats right for you also speaks volumes on your feelings for this woman, but I would be careful that you don't end up losing someone special, because of mistakes or choices they have made in their past, before they even knew you, you may end up living to regret that.

Our mistakes make us who we are, we learn, change and grow through them.
Regarding the Culture, friends and family's opinions and judgements don't matter really, think about it if you end up marrying this woman, you will be the one living with her and sharing a bed together. All that really matters is that she makes you happy and is good for/to you.

Also, let me remind you if you are looking for someone perfect and pure in this world, your going to have a long search, you can pay me if you like and I'll help you look haha don't let the past stop you from having a future.

 

[truballa101]

If I tell a chick that I've never been in a serious relationship (I'm 25), do you think that's a valid for her to be hesitant about a future with me?
I was conversing with this one chick and she has this idea that I don't value relationships since I've been known to avoid them.

 

[marcmac360]

If I tell a chick that I've never been in a serious relationship (I'm 25), do you think that's a valid for her to be hesitant about a future with me?
I was conversing with this one chick and she has this idea that I don't value relationships since I've been known to avoid them.

It all depends on why you were avoiding them in the first place...say if you were career driven and wanted to focus on your goals, then not as valid as her being hesitant because you didn't wanna be tied down.

 

[flyeed]

 You're Muslim bro?

The fact that she has had two intimate relationships before you shouldn't be a hindrance especially if you have a similar number or considerably higher. It's pretty hard these days to find a girl with no sexual history, has good character etc. that you're compatible with. Something always has to give. If you don't see yourself ever developing emotions for her because of her past, then it's probably best if you let her go. 

I'm confused as to how you say you can't develop emotions for her yet there is still the possibility that you might end up marrying her. How old are you both? Age plays a factor in these types of cultures especially with marriage and having kids. 

 

 

Man, listen to yourself.

Chick has no partners = too lame
Chick has TWO partners = you can't get over it

Pick one. Either get over these outdated, stupid feelings that your culture forced you to have or find a girl that's a virgin and accept her because you're just as lame as she is.

 

 

The past is the past, you can't change it, everybody has a past, how many intimate relationships have you been in? Less than her 2 previous intimate relationships? Because that's a good number for a woman now days

if your number is the same or higher, then it would seem your guilty of double standards. if she is down for you now, loyal to you and you wouldn't trade her for anybody else, that speaks for itself doesn't it? What relevance does her past play in this?

It not as if your trying to wife a ex porn star, you know..

Your comment that said, maybe when you find that one girl thats right for you also speaks volumes on your feelings for this woman, but I would be careful that you don't end up losing someone special, because of mistakes or choices they have made in their past, before they even knew you, you may end up living to regret that.

Our mistakes make us who we are, we learn, change and grow through them.
Regarding the Culture, friends and family's opinions and judgements don't matter really, think about it if you end up marrying this woman, you will be the one living with her and sharing a bed together. All that really matters is that she makes you happy and is good for/to you.

Also, let me remind you if you are looking for someone perfect and pure in this world, your going to have a long search, you can pay me if you like and I'll help you look haha

don't let the past stop you from having a future.

+1 to all that took the time to read/reply

yes I'm Muslim. strange as it sounds but i might still marry her because even if I can't be "in love" with her, I can still easily love her as a person, a best friend, and a great mother/wife that she can be. 

As far as the amount of partners that I've had, it's more than the amount she's been with. Never intimately in the sense of being in love with a person though. So I guess I've been with a few more people in short-lived empty/meaningless flings, and she's had more in the sense of emotions, just about every intimate experience, and long term relationships with people.

I'm 25 and she's 26 btw. And if it matters, she's been with 3 total, her most recent one was a short relationship though right before our thing started.

I think that one of my big problems isn't exactly that she isn't a virgin (I didn't expect her to be,) but that she had those relationships knowing she wasn't ever going to marry the first 2 people she was with because of the culture (they weren't muslim,) and she knew eventually she'd marry a decent muslim dude like myself who would obviously take issue with that, yet she still did it. And despite knowing how our culture is, her "progressive" self believes that since I messed around with chicks that she owes me no apology or to ask for forgiveness in any way. I initially told her that i don't care about her past and that i don't want to know. she was the one that insisted on telling me. And my issue is that she told me, but then never followed up with an I regret it, i'm sorry, forgive me, etc. A close friend of mine was recently talking to a girl and they were thinking of getting married. She'd been with only one person before and was crying in shame and regret. I'm not saying I want her in tears, but I think I'm owed something.

It sucks too because I do believe that forgiveness and acceptance is such a beautiful thing, and it bothers me that I've made her feel guilty for her past over and over instead of just being able to say I'll take you how you are, lets only focus on the present and future. But I think when you're planning on marrying a decent muslim dude, yet still do your thing with other men, you should be able to give some sort of apology to the decent muslim dude when he rolls around saying he thinks he wants to marry you.

 

[iamdef]

already.

We still got a gang of places to check out.

Here's a list:
la Duni
Slow bone bar b q
Fish city grill Arlington
Lousiena poboys in carrollton downtown
Seasons 52
Illcane Russo
LA calle doce
Melters
Mr Phil's and Odom's
Owners box at the omni
Cool river

I'll add that place to the list.

lemme go 'head and add ALL these places to my newly created list

taking the fam to schliterban (or however it's spelled) this coming summer should be fun with the kiddos

man I'm worried I'm incapable of loving.

I can't look beyond chicks having a past because of my culture and how i was brought up, but most chicks that would have conducted themselves "acceptably" are either too young or most likely too lame. i'm with a girl right now who i wouldn't trade to be with any other chick i know, and can't develop emotions for her because she's been in past relationships and experienced everything possible on an intimate level with 2 different dudes before. and I know it's wrong because she's down for me now, but I can't control how i was brought up and knowing she did those things growing up in the same culture where even going on a date is taboo for a chick.

and it sucks because it's really difficult to find a advice on this since much of NT understandably wouldn't be able to empathize with the culture, and I can't bring it up with friends/fam in case I wind up marrying this chick. gotta keep it under wraps.

idk maybe when i find the chick that's really right for me, i'll be so blinded by love that i wouldn't give a F about previous things.

Yea, Imma need you to let one of those restrictions go. Just like grand said, you can't complain if she has 0 then complain that she has 2. a chick with just 2 bodies is a treasure nowadays. pactically a virgin. you not gon find many with less than 5 under they belt. I understand where you're coming from but with what you said you need to find you a chick thats been with 1 dude just to fit the medium.

and it's not always about the "right chick" sometimes you realize how stupid some requirements are and you let go of that stereotypical disdain and accept it

If I tell a chick that I've never been in a serious relationship (I'm 25), do you think that's a valid for her to be hesitant about a future with me?
I was conversing with this one chick and she has this idea that I don't value relationships since I've been known to avoid them.

Yea it's some what valid but understandable. The question that is raised for me is "Why?" were you purposely not involving yourself with women that you took serious? do you only fool around with these women but never commit yourself to them etc

 

[mgrand15]

+1 to all that took the time to read/reply

yes I'm Muslim. strange as it sounds but i might still marry her because even if I can't be "in love" with her, I can still easily love her as a person, a best friend, and a great mother/wife that she can be. 

As far as the amount of partners that I've had, it's more than the amount she's been with. Never intimately in the sense of being in love with a person though. So I guess I've been with a few more people in short-lived empty/meaningless flings, and she's had more in the sense of emotions, just about every intimate experience, and long term relationships with people.

I'm 25 and she's 26 btw. And if it matters, she's been with 3 total, her most recent one was a short relationship though right before our thing started.

I think that one of my big problems isn't exactly that she isn't a virgin (I didn't expect her to be,) but that she had those relationships knowing she wasn't ever going to marry the first 2 people she was with because of the culture (they weren't muslim,) and she knew eventually she'd marry a decent muslim dude like myself who would obviously take issue with that, yet she still did it. And despite knowing how our culture is, her "progressive" self believes that since I messed around with chicks that she owes me no apology or to ask for forgiveness in any way. I initially told her that i don't care about her past and that i don't want to know. she was the one that insisted on telling me. And my issue is that she told me, but then never followed up with an I regret it, i'm sorry, forgive me, etc. A close friend of mine was recently talking to a girl and they were thinking of getting married. She'd been with only one person before and was crying in shame and regret. I'm not saying I want her in tears, but I think I'm owed something.

It sucks too because I do believe that forgiveness and acceptance is such a beautiful thing, and it bothers me that I've made her feel guilty for her past over and over instead of just being able to say I'll take you how you are, lets only focus on the present and future. But I think when you're planning on marrying a decent muslim dude, yet still do your thing with other men, you should be able to give some sort of apology to the decent muslim dude when he rolls around saying he thinks he wants to marry you.

1. Do you regret or apologize for all of your past partners? If you've had meaningless flings, you definitely had no intention of marrying them.

2. Why do you think she should ask for your forgiveness? Why should she be sorry for her past relationships? How did she wrong you? What she did in the past is what molded her into becoming the person she is today.

I think you're trying to mask your feelings by hiding behind your culture honestly. I don't know if you're jealous or if you just want the power but you should reconsider if you actually want to marry this person. The fact that you even bring up a "friend's wife" crying in shame from being with one partner says a lot about your mentality. Do this lady a favor - look for a virgin or a more "traditional" lady. It's not fair to her and you're not going to be happy.

You're owed nothing bro.

 

[iamdef]

 
As far as the amount of partners that I've had, it's more than the amount she's been with. Never intimately in the sense of being in love with a person though. So I guess I've been with a few more people in short-lived empty/meaningless flings, and she's had more in the sense of emotions, just about every intimate experience, and long term relationships with people.

I'm 25 and she's 26 btw. And if it matters, she's been with 3 total, her most recent one was a short relationship though right before our thing started.

I think that one of my big problems isn't exactly that she isn't a virgin (I didn't expect her to be,) but that she had those relationships knowing she wasn't ever going to marry the first 2 people she was with because of the culture (they weren't muslim,) and she knew eventually she'd marry a decent muslim dude like myself who would obviously take issue with that, yet she still did it. And despite knowing how our culture is, her "progressive" self believes that since I messed around with chicks that she owes me no apology or to ask for forgiveness in any way. I initially told her that i don't care about her past and that i don't want to know. she was the one that insisted on telling me. And my issue is that she told me, but then never followed up with an I regret it, i'm sorry, forgive me, etc. A close friend of mine was recently talking to a girl and they were thinking of getting married. She'd been with only one person before and was crying in shame and regret. I'm not saying I want her in tears, but I think I'm owed something.

It sucks too because I do believe that forgiveness and acceptance is such a beautiful thing, and it bothers me that I've made her feel guilty for her past over and over instead of just being able to say I'll take you how you are, lets only focus on the present and future. But I think when you're planning on marrying a decent muslim dude, yet still do your thing with other men, you should be able to give some sort of apology to the decent muslim dude when he rolls around saying he thinks he wants to marry you.

Bro, so she should be shamed of her 3 bodies and be apologetic but are you apologetic or regretful of the 3+ that you've been with? Were you planning on marrying those women that you been with?

It seems like you've fully invested in a double standard. A double standard that I understand the logic of but don't fully agree with. But once again, that's how it SEEMS

 

[truballa101]

Yea it's some what valid but understandable. The question that is raised for me is "Why?" were you purposely not involving yourself with women that you took serious? do you only fool around with these women but never commit yourself to them etc

It all depends on why you were avoiding them in the first place...say if you were career driven and wanted to focus on your goals, then not as valid as her being hesitant because you didn't wanna be tied down.

Focused on school and work. I've always been somewhat selfish and I always accepted that.
So I made sure to never waste a females time just because I value mine. So no, I've never invested in a chick and proceed to play her out.

But recently I've been getting my ish together, so I've been considering a relationship a lot more than I would've in my college years.
And of course I would slay yambs here and there but never on some playa-type steez. I think girls low-key think that's what I'm about.

 

[omariwestafari]

man I'm worried I'm incapable of loving.


I can't look beyond chicks having a past because of my culture and how i was brought up, but most chicks that would have conducted themselves "acceptably" are either too young or most likely too lame. i'm with a girl right now who i wouldn't trade to be with any other chick i know, and can't develop emotions for her because she's been in past relationships and experienced everything possible on an intimate level with 2 different dudes before. and I know it's wrong because she's down for me now, but I can't control how i was brought up and knowing she did those things growing up in the same culture where even going on a date is taboo for a chick.


and it sucks because it's really difficult to find a advice on this since much of NT understandably wouldn't be able to empathize with the culture, and I can't bring it up with friends/fam in case I wind up marrying this chick. gotta keep it under wraps.


idk maybe when i find the chick that's really right for me, i'll be so blinded by love that i wouldn't give a F about previous things.

You're Muslim bro?

The fact that she has had two intimate relationships before you shouldn't be a hindrance especially if you have a similar number or considerably higher. It's pretty hard these days to find a girl with no sexual history, has good character etc. that you're compatible with. Something always has to give. If you don't see yourself ever developing emotions for her because of her past, then it's probably best if you let her go. 

I'm confused as to how you say you can't develop emotions for her yet there is still the possibility that you might end up marrying her. How old are you both? Age plays a factor in these types of cultures especially with marriage and having kids. 

Im muslim too brah so i understand where your comingg from

My advice would be to not judge her on her past. As muslims its difficult to not adhere to american society and have sex before marriage. So imo its kinda acceptable especially since ypu also grew up in america.

 

[iamdef]

Focused on school and work. I've always been somewhat selfish and I always accepted that.
So I made sure to never waste a females time just because I value mine. So no, I've never invested in a chick and proceed to play her out.

But recently I've been getting my ish together, so I've been considering a relationship a lot more than I would've in my college years.
And of course I would slay yambs here and there but never on some playa-type steez. I think girls low-key think that's what I'm about.

That makes since and is respectable but as you said some females may believe that you one of them 'dog' guys who don't love em, just hump em. So you may run into a few females who will be skeptical, which would be understandable, some who will run away and some who will accept you.

 

[flyeed]

^ mgrand15 and all others that have taken their time to help/shed light, I never thought I would regret anything, but after meeting her and she kind of half-heartedly said she wishes she can hit the reset button on her past, it made a part of me me wish I can on mine and that I waited with her. But there's a part of me that knows that I'd never have been able to bag her had I not done the dirt I did before and still been that awkward boy I was growing up. But yea she wanted to treat this relationship as being "special" and i agreed with her idea that we can wait until marriage to have sex.

Even chicks I know who are saving themselves in my culture are ok with the guy having been with some partners. Yes, it's a double standard, but if you care enough about the culture to only want to marry someone exclusively in it, you should care to follow the rules and be considerate of your future partners feelings. We all grew up differently from our parents, but we're still literally only one generation removed from them.

And truth be told, outside of this one girl I never cared to marry someone in my culture/religion. And I knew when I did my thing that nobody in my future would ever have a problem with it, whether she was part of the culture or not. Difference is when she did her, she was well-aware of what she'd look for in the future, and aware it would be deemed unacceptable by many people to the point of not even being given a chance, and I've given her that but feel that if we do get married that she owes me something. If not, at this very moment she doesn't, but whoever she does wind up marrying she does owe something to if it's a person from my culture/religion.

And I never said I care to see her in tears, just using it as an example to say that's how **** usually goes down.

Btw I appreciate the different perspectives and the disagreements. It's all love here and I'm not taking anything personally to my culture/perspective.

But yes you guys are definitely right in saying there's a jealousy factor in it as well, which partially has something to do with the possessiveness of men from my region. We want to feel like we exclusively own something and it's only ours. I guess since I haven't loved before, I can't really comprehend how things feel when you move onto someone else. If there's an element of comparison or feeling like you're re-living old experiences with just a new person. It sounds lame but she told me about a museum on top of a mountain she wants to go to with me in Europe one day that she's been to before and how romantic it is, and there's a part of me that can't help feel like im just a different dude that you're re-living the same old experience with.

 

[iamdef]

what would she owe you or whomever she marries?

glad you're taking it as all love. learning and talking about other cultures is great pasttime for me