The 2012 NFL Draft Thread, 4/26 8EST/5PST Vikings are on the clock

[theone2401]

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

Originally Posted by psk2310


DoubleJ- I have a lot of respect for you. Your always pretty thoughtgful in the threads that you create or post in but RGIII is going to be running like Forest Gump for the next 3 years or so. Without an o-line & WRs, that kid is going to be runnin'...I think the deadskins now need to get that boy a someone to throw to like Vincent Jackson in free agency...

It's not going to be a magical turnaround next year....they have a lot of holes to fill.  However, with a ton of cap space they can now look to fill some of those holes with vets.  When focusing on the draft in round 3 and beyond, they could potentially take the BPA, which hasn't always been the case.

IF Griffin works out, I'd expect a drastically different record within the next 2-3 seasons.  This team has not had a franchise QB in my lifetime, and making this move was something that had to be done. 

Think about it, the Skins have NEVER had a mobile QB who can extend plays outside of the pocket.  That's an asset to RG3's skill set.  A skill-set that he'll have to use next year as I'm sure he'll be running around a bit.  That being said, he's amazing IN the pocket.  As the team fills it's need on the line, we'll see a lot of plays (hopefully) being made while getting adequate protection. 

I can't stress enough as to how big this move is.  Hopefully, having RG3 in the fold will be enough to lure a few FA WR's as well as some O-lineman to play in DC. 

I am not calling you out but a lot of people just assume because RG3 is black and fast that he is good outside the pocket. His abilities to use his legs are very overrated by the media and people who havent seen him play that much.

He has very average pocket presence and only straight line speed. He will be Aaron Rodgers running the ball at the next level not even close to Cam or Vick. And that is a good thing..

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by MMG

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

Originally Posted by psk2310


DoubleJ- I have a lot of respect for you. Your always pretty thoughtgful in the threads that you create or post in but RGIII is going to be running like Forest Gump for the next 3 years or so. Without an o-line & WRs, that kid is going to be runnin'...I think the deadskins now need to get that boy a someone to throw to like Vincent Jackson in free agency...

It's not going to be a magical turnaround next year....they have a lot of holes to fill.  However, with a ton of cap space they can now look to fill some of those holes with vets.  When focusing on the draft in round 3 and beyond, they could potentially take the BPA, which hasn't always been the case.

IF Griffin works out, I'd expect a drastically different record within the next 2-3 seasons.  This team has not had a franchise QB in my lifetime, and making this move was something that had to be done. 

Think about it, the Skins have NEVER had a mobile QB who can extend plays outside of the pocket.  That's an asset to RG3's skill set.  A skill-set that he'll have to use next year as I'm sure he'll be running around a bit.  That being said, he's amazing IN the pocket.  As the team fills it's need on the line, we'll see a lot of plays (hopefully) being made while getting adequate protection. 

I can't stress enough as to how big this move is.  Hopefully, having RG3 in the fold will be enough to lure a few FA WR's as well as some O-lineman to play in DC. 

man i hope for ******** sake your right man, cause if that kid fails, i expect another 10 years of

Positive thoughts!!  He can't fail...he just can't. 

This was a huge risk, but it was something that needed to be done.  Griffin is gonna have the weight of the world on his shoulders here in DC.  If you're going to have any sort of continued success in today's NFL, you need more than a "game manager."  Griffin is the type of QB/athlete that the Skins have NEVER had.  I just really hope he's as good as advertised and the front office surrounds him with quality players going forward. 

I am not calling you out but a lot of people just assume because RG3 is black and fast that he is good outside the pocket.

He has very average pocket presence and only straight line speed. He will be Aaron Rodgers running the ball at the next level not even close to Cam or Vick. And that is a good thing..


I should have clarified....If he can make the first guy miss and extend the play by another second or two, that would be a luxury.  Again, he's the type of athlete we've NEVER had in DC at QB.  I'm not expecting him to be like Vick and scramble all the time...but if the pocket is collapsing, knowing that he can use his mobility to extend the play, this is only going to help the skill positions on the field. 

 

[theone2401]

No I am agreeing with you. It is a good thing he isnt Vick or Cam. But there will be a lot of people who are surprised how ineffective a runner he is when they actually get to see him on Sundays instead of just hearing about him.

He will be set if they get Vincent Jackson or any legit deep threat.

RG3 throws one of the best deep balls ive seen in a long time.

It is going to be interesting to see the next couple of years to compare where the Rams, Skins, and Browns are in the wake of this blockbuster deal.

 

[buc em]

So wait, the reason why you Skins fans think Vincent Jackson is a done deal to come to your team now is because you traded 3 1st rounders and a 2nd rounder for a rookie quarterback that's never thrown a ball in the NFL? The hell do you think he is, Tom Brady? I think V-Jax, Finnegan and Stephen Tulloch are a package deal wherever they go. Just what I've heard. I understand that Snyder throws around a crap ton of money every year but I don't think you'll be getting either of those 3. You should look at Pierre Garçon who'd be a great deep threat for RG3.

 

[doublejs07]

names being thrown around....

Jsteelz

 

[mmg]

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

names being thrown around....

Jsteelz

 

[Air273]

smart move for the ********, they feel that Griffin is a franchise QB well then if you have a shot to get him go do it.....the price is not too great if you have a your QB for the next 15 years.......ask the chargers if they would have given up 4 first round picks to move up 1 spot to draft peyton 15 years ago......
if i were skins fan i wouldnt even worry about those 2 1st round picks, no matter how great or how much of a bust those players turn out to be, there is a slim chance that the skins would have been a position to draft those players and that they would have drafted them........even if next draft the skins are the worst team in the NFL which i doubt, if they didnt get Giffin and instead got flynn or other QB they wouldnt have been in position to draft that high any way.

 

[theone2401]

How good is Colston without out Brees and that offense?

How much are you going to have to pay him?

When is his next knee surgery scheduled for?

I wouldnt touch Colston with a 10 foot pole.

 

[buc em]

Yeah I think Colston, Eddie Royal, Josh Morgan or maybe Garcon are more the names they could grab.

Let's not act like Santana Moss and Jabar Gaffney aren't atleast solid vet receivers for RG3 to throw to. Look what Sam Bradford and Blaine Gabbert have been throwing to. Freeman had a bunch of 2nd-6th rounder rookies and Sanchez had Jerricho Cotchery, Chansi Stuckey, David Clowney and Brad Smith.......

 

[mmg]

Originally Posted by theone2401

How good is Colston without out Brees and that offense?

How much are you going to have to pay him?

When is his next knee surgery scheduled for?

I wouldnt touch Colston with a 10 foot pole.

your asking alot of what ifs, but you guys just sold the house on a what if.

 

[gunna get it]

a potential franchise QB "what if" is worth a lot more risk than an aging slow possession WR

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by Buc Em

Yeah I think Colston, Eddie Royal, Josh Morgan or maybe Garcon are more the names they could grab.

Let's not act like Santana Moss and Jabar Gaffney aren't atleast solid vet receivers for RG3 to throw to. Look what Sam Bradford and Blaine Gabbert have been throwing to. Freeman had a bunch of 2nd-6th rounder rookies and Sanchez had Jerricho Cotchery, Chansi Stuckey, David Clowney and Brad Smith.......

Moss and Gaffney are nothing but possession WRs and have no business being the #1 and #2 anywhere on a NFL roster.  Skins have to make a big splash in FA to get a WR and hope that Hankerson can 1) recover from his injury and 2) slide into the #2 spot on the depth chart. 

I love what Moss has done in DC, but he's washed. 

 

[extraordinary swag]

John Wall and RG3 will be one in the same once the season starts, and I mean that in the worst possible DC franchise way

 

[buc em]

Naaa dawg...championship contender. RG3 2 V-Jax.

 

[the natural mystic]

I'm excited! It's a very good start to rebuilding our pride.

 

[reduce523]

Originally Posted by Buc Em

So wait, the reason why you Skins fans think Vincent Jackson is a done deal to come to your team now is because you traded 3 1st rounders and a 2nd rounder for a rookie quarterback that's never thrown a ball in the NFL? The hell do you think he is, Tom Brady? I think V-Jax, Finnegan and Stephen Tulloch are a package deal wherever they go. Just what I've heard. I understand that Snyder throws around a crap ton of money every year but I don't think you'll be getting either of those 3. You should look at Pierre Garçon who'd be a great deep threat for RG3.

Yes cause Vjax is taking a lower pay to win a title with the chargers? He wants money and the ******** have money.

 

[CP1708]

Skins have had so much success in the past buying free agents, surely they can just piece players together.

I like RG, but 3 firsts and a 2. It is very hard to recover from the lack of picks. Trust me, I know. Miami gave 4 firsts in 5 years to start the decade, eventually it depleted the roster.

 

[buc em]

You're right, no other team has money except the ********.

 

[denni5themenace]

what do you guys mean by possession receiver? sorry if noob question
edit* googled it. makes sense. 

 

[5am6oody72]

To add, I think it says something that both Mike Holmgren and Mike Shanahan, two HOF coaches who have won Superbowls with HOF QB's and know a thing or two about QB play, were willing to give up this much to draft RGIII. And so was Seattle apparently. Bill Polian said that Luck and Griffin were the two best QB prospects he had come across since Peyton Manning. Those dismissing this as just another desperate splash move by Snyder are off base IMO.

Yes the team still has needs and a rookie QB won't fix those, but look at the Giants trading up for Eli Manning and how he's brought them two Super Bowls in the past 8 years. Griffin just turned 22 and could conceivably be the face of the franchise for the next 10-12 years. If they are that sold on him (which they are) then IMO it's worth it to do what you need to make sure you get him. Aside from his measurables and stats, he is one of the most impressive guys as far as personality, intellect, and his approach and mental acuity for the game go. He is an excellent teammate and a guy players will want to play with and win for. He is the epitome of everything you would want in a guy to represent your franchise and the city. Obviously it's not a guarantee he will reach that level of success but it's not a guarantee that our next three first rounders will bring us that success either. Orakpo, Trent Williams, and Ryan Kerrigan were all fairly high first round picks and we were still a mediocre to poor team with them. I'd trade all three of those guys for a franchise QB like Rodgers, Brady, Eli, Peyton, Brees, etc in a hot second.

We have $40 mil in cap space and there is a pretty deep class of FA wide receivers. The line is still a question mark but looked worse than it should have due to being decimated by injuries and Trent's suspension last year (not to mention poor QB play). We will still have all the rest of our draft picks in the coming years, and we have plenty of current players that were selected outside of the first round (Helu and Perry Riley in the 4th, Fred Davis in the 2nd, Jarvis Jenkins in the 2nd, Royster in the 6th). Shanahan thrived with later round picks in Denver (Rod Smith and the bevy of RB's) so I somewhat trust him to turn those picks into valuable contributors more than I would the previous regime.

Bottom line, we probably won't be a playoff team next year and we gave up a lot, but the future is a HELL of a lot brighter than it was 24 hours ago. I haven't been excited or happy to be a ******** fan since about 05. Hell, I was actually upset that I was forced to attend a game last year because my sister wanted to go for her birthday

That's how down on this team I was. This will be the first time since I've been following the team that we will have a marquee player who's exciting to watch and will draw fans from around the league. You even have Cowboys and Eagles fans in here saying they wish he weren't going to the Skins but they are fans of his and hope he does well as long as he's not playing their team. When was the last time the Skins had a player that anyone said that about? Clinton Portis and Santana Moss are the closest we've come to game breaking playmakers in the past decade

 

[5am6oody72]

Originally Posted by CP1708

Skins have had so much success in the past buying free agents, surely they can just piece players together.[/b[

I like RG, but 3 firsts and a 2. It is very hard to recover from the lack of picks. Trust me, I know. Miami gave 4 firsts in 5 years to start the decade, eventually it depleted the roster.

I'm not saying that, but you also have to look at who was signing those free agents then vs. who will be signing them now. Snyder went after old washed up guys like Bruce Smith, Jeff George, Deion Sanders, and clowns like Haynesworth (to be fair to them I don't think anybody foresaw how disastrous of a signing that would be, overpaid or not). Cerrato was such a terrible GM he tried to trade TWO 1st rounders for Chad Johnson in 08 (the only thing worse was that that Bengals said no

) The guys we have in charge now may not be the greatest, but they have a track record of being far more competent than the previous regime responsible for all those doomed FA signings. The signings they made last year were unspectacular but have proven to be solid pickups.

Personally I would only want V-Jax if we signed him to a fairly short term deal, as he's already 29. I think some combo of V-Jax/Colston and Josh Morgan/Eddie Royal will be plenty good to go along with Moss, Gaffney, and Hankerson, as well as Davis and Cooley if he's healthy.I think the OL will be more of a concern IMO.

 

[the natural mystic]

Originally Posted by 5am6oody72

To add, I think it says something that both Mike Holmgren and Mike Shanahan, two HOF coaches who have won Superbowls with HOF QB's and know a thing or two about QB play, were willing to give up this much to draft RGIII. And so was Seattle apparently. Bill Polian said that Luck and Griffin were the two best QB prospects he had come across since Peyton Manning. Those dismissing this as just another desperate splash move by Snyder are off base IMO.



Yes the team still has needs and a rookie QB won't fix those, but look at the Giants trading up for Eli Manning and how he's brought them two Super Bowls in the past 8 years. Griffin just turned 22 and could conceivably be the face of the franchise for the next 10-12 years. If they are that sold on him (which they are) then IMO it's worth it to do what you need to make sure you get him. Aside from his measurables and stats, he is one of the most impressive guys as far as personality, intellect, and his approach and mental acuity for the game go. He is an excellent teammate and a guy players will want to play with and win for. He is the epitome of everything you would want in a guy to represent your franchise and the city. Obviously it's not a guarantee he will reach that level of success but it's not a guarantee that our next three first rounders will bring us that success either. Orakpo, Trent Williams, and Ryan Kerrigan were all fairly high first round picks and we were still a mediocre to poor team with them. I'd trade all three of those guys for a franchise QB like Rodgers, Brady, Eli, Peyton, Brees, etc in a hot second.



We have $40 mil in cap space and there is a pretty deep class of FA wide receivers. The line is still a question mark but looked worse than it should have due to being decimated by injuries and Trent's suspension last year (not to mention poor QB play). We will still have all the rest of our draft picks in the coming years, and we have plenty of current players that were selected outside of the first round (Helu and Perry Riley in the 4th, Fred Davis in the 2nd, Jarvis Jenkins in the 2nd, Royster in the 6th). Shanahan thrived with later round picks in Denver (Rod Smith and the bevy of RB's) so I somewhat trust him to turn those picks into valuable contributors more than I would the previous regime.



Bottom line, we probably won't be a playoff team next year and we gave up a lot, but the future is a HELL of a lot brighter than it was 24 hours ago. I haven't been excited or happy to be a ******** fan since about 05. Hell, I was actually upset that I was forced to attend a game last year because my sister wanted to go for her birthday

That's how down on this team I was. This will be the first time since I've been following the team that we will have a marquee player who's exciting to watch and will draw fans from around the league. You even have Cowboys and Eagles fans in here saying they wish he weren't going to the Skins but they are fans of his and hope he does well as long as he's not playing their team. When was the last time the Skins had a player that anyone said that about? Clinton Portis and Santana Moss are the closest we've come to game breaking playmakers in the past decade

I agree with all of this!

 

[bigmike23]

"To add, I think it says something that both Mike Holmgren and Mike Shanahan, two HOF coaches who have won Superbowls with HOF QB's and know a thing or two about QB play, were willing to give up this much to draft RGIII. And so was Seattle apparently. Bill Polian said that Luck and Griffin were the two best QB prospects he had come across since Peyton Manning. Those dismissing this as just another desperate splash move by Snyder are off base IMO. "



Ya and both guys recent track record shows they both know what there doing still?

 

[frshstunna]

I think everybody wins with the trade....well except the browns, what are they gonna do about qb now?

:x

 

[Kimchi Papi]

^ I think Colt McCoy will be a solid QB. He just needs guys to throw to & a reliable RB. That o-line seemed to struggle a bit last year. Were some o-lineman injured last year that resulted in missing games? I kinda recall some injuries...