A Serious Discussion About The State of Hip-Hop

[Magic33]

Around doesn't mean the same.

And you're naming three guys. Yes, they might be the biggest ones. But where is there copy cat. Meanwhile it's a million copy cats of nonsense and mumbling.

There is a reason that Cardi B exist today. In the 90's you had to be Eve. Now, in every strip club across America a girl is trying to rap. That was before Cardi B. Now it's about to be worse. Because now, talent is a minimum.

You can be famous off one song. Get a deal off one song. Have no talent whatsoever.

And we can't just blame the labels. Because a lot of these dudes are coming up on their own.

That's precisely why I said guys can't be upset at Desiigner. You can't have rules for sounding like Future, when almost everyone today is unoriginal. Because you like Future that's unacceptable?

Hip hop is the wild wild west with no rules now. Hip hop is street basketball. You call your own fouls. You make your own rules(make it take it, three point line etc...). You can get a run as long as you're picked or wait long enough. Hip hop in the 80's and early 90's was the NBA.

 

[6pac]

PS Jody Breeze had next.....

**** Jazze Pha

why do you say that?

 

[mgrand15]

Around doesn't mean the same.

And you're naming three guys. Yes, they might be the biggest ones. But where is there copy cat. Meanwhile it's a million copy cats of nonsense and mumbling.

There is a reason that Cardi B exist today. In the 90's you had to be Eve. Now, in every strip club across America a girl is trying to rap. That was before Cardi B. Now it's about to be worse. Because now, talent is a minimum.

You can be famous off one song. Get a deal off one song. Have no talent whatsoever.

And we can't just blame the labels. Because a lot of these dudes are coming up on their own.

That's precisely why I said guys can't be upset at Desiigner. You can't have rules for sounding like Future, when almost everyone today is unoriginal. Because you like Future that's unacceptable?

Hip hop is the wild wild west with no rules now. Hip hop is street basketball. You call your own fouls. You make your own rules(make it take it, three point line etc...). You can get a run as long as you're picked or wait long enough. Hip hop in the 80's and early 90's was the NBA.

You're just going off in a bunch of different directions. Impossible to have a discussion that way.

What's clear to me is that you don't listen to current music if you don't hear the Kanye, J Cole, Kendrick influence in newer artists. How are you going to have an opinion on the current state of hip hop without giving the newer acts a real chance? Cause of Instagram and 30 minutes of radio? With spotify and streaming, there's no excuse anymore.

 

[Magic33]

You're just going off in a bunch of different directions. Impossible to have a discussion that way.

What's clear to me is that you don't listen to current music if you don't hear the Kanye, J Cole, Kendrick influence in newer artists. How are you going to have an opinion on the current state of hip hop without giving the newer acts a real chance? Cause of Instagram and 30 minutes of radio? With spotify and streaming, there's no excuse anymore.

In who?

Vic Mensa? Chance? Logic?

 

[Peep Game]

I miss posse cuts

Where everyone tried to out due their peer. Where you had debates on who had the best verse.

This, and legitimate posse cuts, not the ones where they just try to pile as many artists on a song as they can, then rotating their verses throughout the rest of the album. I'm sure there have been other ones, but the last cool natural sounding posse cut I remember is the one from ASAP Rocky's debut album

 

[Xennial]

I'm 33 years old and I think right now is the most interesting time ever in hip hop because the first time ever we have rappers from the under 20 teens, to the ones in their 20s and 30s, to the ones in their 40s still doing it like E40, Ice Cube, Jayz, Fat Joe, Snoop, Nas. Charlamagne and Adam22 spoke about this recently on Brilliant Idiots where Charlamagne said even Rick Ross is over 40 now and Khaled who's 1 of the biggest figures in hip hop is 40 etc.

 

[Magic33]

I'm 33 years old and I think right now is the most interesting time ever in hip hop because the first time ever we have rappers from the under 20 teens, to the ones in their 20s and 30s, to the ones in their 40s still doing it like E40, Ice Cube, Jayz, Fat Joe, Snoop, Nas. Charlamagne and Adam22 spoke about this recently on Brilliant Idiots where Charlamagne said even Rick Ross is over 40 now and Khaled who's 1 of the biggest figures in hip hop is 40 etc.

I don't agree

because a lot of the older ones, especially mainstream still don't make age appropriate music.

You had 20 year olds making more mature music in the 80's and 90's. Age is just a number.

 

[lamekilla]

Hype Williams
Paul Hunter
Little X

In that order.

 

[ninjahood]

i do miss the big budget videos

but where is the money supposed to come from lol

the internet ****ed everything up

because of da advances on technology, da indie videos are finally catching up thank god.

 

[Chopper]

How you gonna start this thread and be oblivious to the internet impact...

Good music is always around. You just have to look for it. Cats that say **** like this are just to lazy to look for it.

 

[tomdiginson]

There are SEVERAL projects & artist out now that are far from trash & putting out music that will last

This is true, but said artist are obscure in terms of notoriety. The Brent Faiyaz, Cyhi, Krit and even Gold links have been out for years and their music is still brushed past for the "play with P like peek a boo".

 

[6pac]

because of da advances on technology, da indie videos are finally catching up thank god.

at the expense of the hype williams director x type videos tho smh

why drop 100k on a video when you can just have your videographer move around really fast and put some effects on it

 

[6pac]

This is true, but said artist are obscure in terms of notoriety. The Brent Faiyaz, Cyhi, Krit and even Gold links have been out for years and their music is still brushed past for the "play with P like peek a boo".

the problem is that there is no entity or gatekeeper that determines what the "forefront" is a la 106 and Park

ppl always say yachty and co are at the "forefront" but the place i most see music in terms of media is on my social media wher eeveryone controls what they see

MTV is bringing back TRL with DCYOUNGFLY tho lol

 

[kingsrborn]

The Streets/The Black Youth arent the gate keepers of Hip Hop/Rap anymore.The Streets dictated what was (clothes/style) and who (Rapper) was popular back in the day.Im about to get really deep into this discussion.

This is a very interesting topic.So please dont troll.Ive been to Hip Hop/Rap concerts as a kid (90,s).I recently went to the Kendrick/Travis Scott tour.Just from looking at the crowd.I can see whats changed drastically about the culture.Hip Hop/Rap has sold sold out for the cash.

I didn't see any Black youth there.It was probably 5-10 % Blacks there.Everything is expensive when it comes to bigger Rap artist.Because its all about the dollar now.In the 90,s i seen Black kids (12-16) get let in a Bone Thugs and a Biggie concert for free.Because they didn't have any money.

I know for a fact that wouldnt happen at a Kanye/Kendrick concert today.Plus anybody can be a Rapper today.That also dalutes the quality of the culture also.If a kid has parents thats willing to throw away money on his rap dreams.Dye his hair/dreads and make mediocre famouse dex/Uzi copy cat songs while calling himself lil pump.

Nobody will check him.Because like someone else said earlier.Theres no rules in Hip Hop/Rap anymore.Thanks to technology and us selling out the culture.Theres no gate keepers anymore.It was controlled by quality back in the day.Im not bashing how they get in the game.But at least practice and come with a little bit of quality also.

Think about it.Most of these cats wouldve gotten laughed out of Death Row/Def Jam/Rocafella offices.Today they just need a little studio time with a couple of homemade videos and thats it.Most of these cats dont have star quality either.Pac,Pimp C,Snoop had star quality.

Most of these of these cats just dont have the it factor either.Kevin Gates has it,2 Chainz has it,Max B has it,Pac has it,Eminem has it,50 has it,Boosie has it,ODB had it.Alot of Rappers are talented.But some dont have the it factor to me.Jay Z is talented.But his personality seems boring.Kanye is very Talented.

But it seems like he forces himself to act a certain (arrogant) to get attention.Behind closed doors around family.I dont think hes like that.The way he acts is for his image.The people i named with the it factor can hold peoples attention just by being themselves.They can talk for hours and people will sit back and listen.

Most of these new cats dont have the it factor at all.

 

[Xennial]

What is "age appropriate music"? And who out of the 40+ rappers in your opinion aren't making age appropriate music?

I don't agree

because a lot of the older ones, especially mainstream still don't make age appropriate music.

You had 20 year olds making more mature music in the 80's and 90's. Age is just a number.

 

[kingsrborn]

On the flipside of the internets effect on the culture.It has helped the artist for the betterment of making money.Theres cats out here making between 6-8 figures a year because of the internet/online help they get.The internet helped the artist in a big way.So i cant give the negative without giving the positive.

 

[Magic33]

The Streets/The Black Youth arent the gate keepers of Hip Hop/Rap anymore.The Streets dictated what was (clothes/style) and who (Rapper) was popular back in the day.Im about to get really deep into this discussion.

This is a very interesting topic.So please dont troll.Ive been to Hip Hop/Rap concerts as a kid (90,s).I recently went to the Kendrick/Travis Scott tour.Just from looking at the crowd.I can see whats changed drastically about the culture.Hip Hop/Rap has sold sold out for the cash.

I didn't see any Black youth there.It was probably 5-10 % Blacks there.Everything is expensive when it comes to bigger Rap artist.Because its all about the dollar now.In the 90,s i seen Black kids (12-16) get let in a Bone Thugs and a Biggie concert for free.Because they didn't have any money.

You mean like being in front of 20,000 people allowing them to say the N word

They sell their souls for fame and money

 

[Magic33]

What is "age appropriate music"? And who out of the 40+ rappers in your opinion aren't making age appropriate music?

Meaning a lot of the 30+ year olds are making the same music that the young ones 18 are.

You've seen growth in Jeezy, TI and Jay. They don't still rap about the same stuff they did ten years ago.

French, Ross, 2 Chainz....

 

[kingsrborn]

The culture was more in favor for the Black Youth back then.Now the culture is more in favor for the Suburban crowd.Our genre has sold out for the worse right now.Ive seen Famous Rappers in the 90,s outside of the stadium tell security to let the poor kids outside get in for free just because they where big fans.

Since they couldnt afford to get in.They just loved the culture so much that they just wanted to be around what was going on.Its hard to explain.But its just different now.Its all about the money with no message behind it.The artist today will sell out a full stadium to well off to do people without thinking about the black kids who love them.Who cant afford to go to there and buy merch.

People need to realize its turned into 100% business/corporation now.Artist use to be for the people to an extent back then.A couple of Rappers might still be.But its changed drastically from what it use to be.

 

[6pac]

The Streets/The Black Youth arent the gate keepers of Hip Hop/Rap anymore.The Streets dictated what was (clothes/style) and who (Rapper) was popular back in the day.Im about to get really deep into this discussion.

This is a very interesting topic.So please dont troll.Ive been to Hip Hop/Rap concerts as a kid (90,s).I recently went to the Kendrick/Travis Scott tour.Just from looking at the crowd.I can see whats changed drastically about the culture.Hip Hop/Rap has sold sold out for the cash.

I didn't see any Black youth there.It was probably 5-10 % Blacks there.Everything is expensive when it comes to bigger Rap artist.Because its all about the dollar now.In the 90,s i seen Black kids (12-16) get let in a Bone Thugs and a Biggie concert for free.Because they didn't have any money.

14:40



what youre referring to started with biggie/snoop/puff/percy/pac's generation lol

for better or worse white people getting involved is when it became feasible to become a multi millionaire off rap

 

[kingsrborn]

When your making concious music like Kendrick.But its 90% coucassions at your shows.Its going to leave a bitter taste in your mouth.I understand the culture has changed more in favor for the money.But if the people your speaking to arent even at your shows because they cant afford to be.Then howdo you think the people who your trying to reach are going to feel.How would 2pac feel in front of 90% crowd on a nightly basis thats not of his ethnic background.Its something to think about.Like Scarface said.I hope Hip Hop Rap doesnt become the new Rock and Roll.See what happened to that genre after the 80,s/90,s.

 

[trynafeelmink]

The culture was more in favor for the Black Youth back then.Now the culture is more in favor for the Suburban crowd.Our genre has sold out for the worse right now.Ive seen Famous Rappers in the 90,s outside of the stadium tell security to let the poor kids outside get in for free just because they where big fans.

Since they couldnt afford to get in.They just loved the culture so much that they just wanted to be around what was going on.Its hard to explain.But its just different now.Its all about the money with no message behind it.The artist today will sell out a full stadium to well off to do people without thinking about the black kids who love them.Who cant afford to go to there and buy merch.

People need to realize its turned into 100% business/corporation now.Artist use to be for the people to an extent back then.A couple of Rappers might still be.But its changed drastically from what it use to be.

I can't agree with this all the way, because artist still do free shows & events for there fans.. ESPECIALLY up & coming rappers.. off the top of my head i've seen Cole, Pusha, Meek, Swizz, Jadakiss for free the past few years... and even at those events (the most recent being Meek for his album release) the events were still heavily mixed if not more Caucasian & that's at the show of arguably the biggest "street rapper" out these days.

Also we are two decades removed from the 90's and as hiphop grew from the streets & hoods naturally a much larger white audience was gonna be noticed simply because they are still a majority when compared to blacks in America. the more hiphop grew the more the crowds were destined to include more and more people who were interested in the culture rather then developed in it.

So while artist like Cole & Kendrick shows may have predominately white audiences that doesn't equate to their message falling on deaf ears, the music is still being supported & filtered through the black youth, its just naturally the shows are gonna be filled with those who can afford them more often than not. Also this isn't a new thing i've heard artist like Talib, Dead Prez, X Clan speak on how surprised they were to see there shows with a majority white audience.

 

[VARNELL HILL]

I ******* hate the term "conscious hip-hop". All of it is "conscious".

Music is collective consciousness. It's merely set of shared beliefs, ideas and moral attitudes that operate as a unifying force within a given society. These little colored dread minions and their fans share a conscious. The hood ****** with face tatts who go to sleep with choppers next to em and rap over the same 5-10 slow BPM trap beats share a conscious.

The music that's referred to as "conscious hip-hop" today would not have been referred to as such 30 years ago because the majority of it had political and activist tones in it. All of a sudden when the bang bang shoot em **** comes along...everything not on that frequency gets put into a box of "conscious" that can be manipulated as "corny" or "lame".

 

[trynafeelmink]

No lie about Conscious being deemed as corny.... however i'm seeing that start to deviate again, A lot of the bigger rappers are starting to push an agenda of not being victim to drugs/bad habits, ownership etc etc.. Now thats not to say their PE with it but i've seen a definite increase in artist putting the candy with the medicine.

 

[J'onn J'onzz]

because of da advances on technology, da indie videos are finally catching up thank god.

You say that as if there weren't indie videos in the 80's and 90's. "Protect Ya Neck" was an indie video directed by RZA and Kurt Anthony.
In fact, despite having a budget, Wu-Tang was well received for the voyeuristic aspect of their videos. They let you see the "love" and "action" as they experienced it. It's also the secret to rappers like Chief Keef's success, they make themselves, or their brand, the "product".



Angela Yee's longevity though...