African Descendants ✊🏿 Black People - Americas, Africa, Caribbean Culture Discussion

[KHUFU]

stumbled across this scholarly paper on the cultural juxtaposition of Jimi Hendrix and this passage stood out:




I´ve always identified with dude--short version of his story: born in Bum****, Bamasippi, people hated him because suntan, moved to England, oh **** it´s Jimi Hendrix--and this paper is even helping me realize why.

happens to be one of the most talented musicians in modern history too, so that helps.

would also like to get some angles on this concept, it reflects my personal experience.




I think I have posted enough pictures of myself on this chat line to highlight why this is relevant.

Jimi's misfortune, if you wanna call it that, came at a time that James Brown and his sound ruled the soul/r&b charts. Coupled with a heavy Black identity, the Black power movement had just started getting rolling. If it didn't have that funk underneath it? That 1/3 groove? It wasn't getting played on Black radio. That sound that Jimi was messing with suddenly became the music of white boys, and that is because Black music was still in control of itself to some degree. Jazz had lost its steam in the early 60's, with Miles being the only one making real money. Miles LOVED Jimi because of the Blues, and the sound that he had. But even Miles had starting dabbling into the James Brown sound. His On The Corner album was trying to latch onto that evasive, and ever evolving Black audience.

For me, Brown was like Jordan in the music narrative during the late sixties and early seventies. Many acts could never get a chip, because of what he was doing and how revolutionary it was at that time, reducing every instrument in his band to a drum, then putting the groove on the 1 and 3. It resonated, and Jimi doing his thing at that time, wasn't where heads was at. Motown was doing its thing as well, as was Staxx out of Memphis, but Jimi simply did not fit where things were going, and that includes the direction of Black identity and politics.

 

[cosmiccoffee9]

Jimi's misfortune, if you wanna call it that, came at a time that James Brown and his sound ruled the soul/r&b charts. Coupled with a heavy Black identity, the Black power movement had just started getting rolling. If it didn't have that funk underneath it? That 1/3 groove? It wasn't getting played on Black radio. That sound that Jimi was messing with suddenly became the music of white boys, and that is because Black music was still in control of itself to some degree. Jazz had lost its steam in the early 60's, with Miles being the only one making real money, and Miles LOVED Jimi because of the Blues and the sound that he had, but even Miles had starting dabbling into the James Brown sound, with his On The Corner album, trying to latch on to that evasive and ever evolving Black audience.

For me, Brown was like Jordan in the music narrative during the late sixties and early seventies. Many acts could never get a chip, because of what he was doing and how revolutionary it was at that time, reducing every instrument in his band to a drum, then putting the groove on the 1 and 3. It resonated, and Jimi doing his thing at that time, wasn't where heads was at. Motown was doing its thing as well, as was Staxx out of Memphis, but Jimi simply did not fit where things were going.

I can appreciate this evaluation from a purely American perspective (and dig James Brown, btw), but is it fair to say ¨that´s not the way things were going¨ when dude became a global superstar before the age of 30?

I don´t necessarily call it a ¨misfortune,¨ but if you´re not readily embraced by those around you is it really a surprise that you would then seek out those that do, especially if they appreciate you THAT MUCH MORE?

moreover, is it not a tangible loss for a community to alienate such a talent? sure wasn´t Jimi´s loss.

 

[KHUFU]

I can appreciate this evaluation from a purely American perspective (and dig James Brown, btw), but is it fair to say ¨that´s not the way things were going¨ when dude became a global superstar before the age of 30?

I don´t necessarily call it a ¨misfortune,¨ but if you´re not readily embraced by those around you is it really a surprise that you would then seek out those that do, especially if they appreciate you THAT MUCH MORE?

moreover, is it not a tangible loss for a community to alienate such a talent? sure wasn´t Jimi´s loss.

Check the edit.

What you are forgetting is the wealth of talent that comes from the Black community, and what we also leave behind. Black art is always moving, never standing still. You can't miss what you've never embraced in the first place. He wasn't alienated, he simply went to an audience that could dig what he was trying to do. The Blues is painful, especially how HE played it. Hearing that, takes an ear that wasn't damaged in the first place. James Brown, Motown, Staxx, were appealing to empowerment, uplifting, not oppression. The Blues speaks through the trauma. White audiences ate that up, and that is because the music was authentic to them. They did not know that feeling first hand.

I do not think that it was any accident that Jimi died as he did, as it was tragic. But you cannot immerse yourself into something that deeply, without being affected spiritually. I mean, the Blues did birth Gospel for a reason...

 

[cosmiccoffee9]

Check the edit.

What you are forgetting is the wealth of talent that comes from the Black community, and what we also leave behind. Black art is always moving, never standing still. You can't miss what you've never embraced in the first place. He wasn't alienated, he simply went to an audience that could dig what he was trying to do. The Blues is painful, especially how HE played it. Hearing that, takes an ear that wasn't damaged in the first place. James Brown, Motown, Staxx, were appealing to empowerment, uplifting, not oppression. The Blues speaks through the trauma. White audiences ate that up, and that is because the music was authentic to them. They did not know that feeling first hand.

I do not think that it was any accident that Jimi died as he did, as it was tragic. But you cannot immerse yourself into something that deeply, without being affected spiritually. I mean, the Blues did birth Gospel for a reason...

ah got it...yeah he did a little politicking with the Panthers but it definitely wasn´t His Main Thing.

yeah tho, this point is not to separate Jimi from the concept of blackness, I make it to advocate for his inclusion.

to have a Jimi Hendrix fundamentally represent what it can be to be black.

the freedom he embodied, the drive that forced him into uncomfortable spaces, the strong platform of confidence required to envision something totally different from anyone around you...that´s part of the legacy.

I don´t feel like there´s enough said about that.

...and maaaaaan, don´t even get me started on his death. what a loss, almost Tupac-level (and not as a rapper).

 

[KHUFU]

ah got it...yeah he did a little politicking with the Panthers but it definitely wasn´t His Main Thing.

yeah tho, this point is not to separate Jimi from the concept of blackness, I make it to advocate for his inclusion.

to have a Jimi Hendrix fundamentally represent what it can be to be black.

the freedom he embodied, the drive that forced him into uncomfortable spaces, the strong platform of confidence required to envision something totally different from anyone around you...that´s part of the legacy.

I don´t feel like there´s enough said about that.

...and maaaaaan, don´t even get me started on his death. what a loss, almost Tupac-level (and not as a rapper).

Jimi is indeed Black. What he was doing did not speak to what Black people were looking toward during the fight for Black rights in America, then around the world. It simply was not the voice. There, is the disconnect. White people can analyze it anyway that wish, while also speaking to his genius. However, not all artists find their true audiences, nor influences, while alive. That may include Tupac as well.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

 

[Coromanti]

Strong words from Balotelli. However, I dislike the strategy. Any developing society needs to step away from grand gestures/monuments. Afterthey are built their maintenance costs are enormous. The money to build and maintain stadiums could be better used to support development and leagues. Let the stadiums come with sustainability and stability.

 

[mayor of nyc]

Need to implement boxing and poetry programs within the troubled schools for the misguided youth. Therapy through spoken word, you feel me? Im 99% sure these kids look up to 6ix9ine, dababy and their ilk. We have a lot of deprogramming to do, in general and we need to start with our youth. Wish i had the credentials required to mentor some kids here in Brooklyn.

 

[layziegunts]

I’ve been seeing that quote recently, but I never actually heard him say it

 

[gry60]

Strong words from Balotelli. However, I dislike the strategy. Any developing society needs to step away from grand gestures/monuments. Afterthey are built their maintenance costs are enormous. The money to build and maintain stadiums could be better used to support development and leagues. Let the stadiums come with sustainability and stability.

The main issue is money: players leave because they can't make a living out of soccer. They get easily lured to Europe by unscrupulous agents and sometimes human traffickers because they are promised financial stability, and African federations turn a blind eye to that. There's also the reality thag clubs cannot develop a fanbase and associated revenue streams (jersey sales, tickets, etc...) because people are just not paid enough to be able to afford these things on a regular basis.

The second issue is corruption and that one is multilayered. You have corruption at the executive level (think big scandals involving leaders of federations diverting money into their pockets - see the case of incomplete stadiums for the ACN that was supposed to be played in Cameroon last year). There's also the lack of enforcement of intellectual rights, which results in the fake market being prevalent, which means that clubs can't make money off their image. Same goes with TV rights: every public place where a game is displayed pays a fee for that and some of that money goes back to the club. In my country, if I have a large TV, a hook up for cheap beer, a few tables, and a couple of large speakers, I have a bar. If I can tap the neighbor's TV feed illegally or stream the match for free, nothing is going back to the club.

Balotelli's heart is the right place but I agree with you. It will take serious action by African governments to develop a thriving professional soccer ecosystem that will make players want to stay here and play in front of the African public (like Egypt is doing). Just to tell you how bad it is right now, Roger Milla still doesn't have a public statue or a street named after him despite all he's done to put Cameroon on the soccer map. The young local players see that and they're like "even if they throw bananas at me, I'm still gonna get paid."

 

[melo0115]

Dont know to much about any of this.. but very interesting.. Im of the people of cameroon and congo.. So i've been trying to become more educated on things that afflict the culture..

 

[jordanhead718212]

The Balotelli quote is too little too late for me.
I'm of Ghanaian descent, we were asking him to play for us 10 years ago.
He always declined and reiterated that he's an Italian man.
Now that he's gotten older and sees what's real out here, he wants to wake up?
If you didn't realize what it was by the age of 19 (he's 29 now, so 10 years ago) then idk what to say.

 

[gry60]

The Balotelli quote is too little too late for me.
I'm of Ghanaian descent, we were asking him to play for us 10 years ago.
He always declined and reiterated that he's an Italian man.
Now that he's gotten older and sees what's real out here, he wants to wake up?
If you didn't realize what it was by the age of 19 (he's 29 now, so 10 years ago) then idk what to say.

I remember that very well.
Again, it comes down to money and potential earnings. Playing for a side that is a consistent fixture on the international stage guarantees exposure and sponsorship money. This is something few African national sides can offer.
In addition, guys like Balotelli and Mbappe evolved in the Italian and French systems, and unlike so many African stars who started in Africa, it is much harder to convince those guys to play for their parents' countries.
Third (and the reason I don't blame them for representing European nations), players see the lack of organization of national sides (unpaid bonuses, favoritism, coaching decisions made by people outside of the coaching staff) caused by the political nature of football on the continent and I find it understandable that they wouldn't want their short careers (10-15 years with 2-3 realistic chances at playing the world cup/continental tourneys) to be sidetracked by the surrounding nonsense.

 

[Nouss]

Yea, I always side eyed Balotelli for those Italian comments. Im only a few years older but even back then.

I understand that his situation, being adopted by Italian parents, was a bit different but you can never forget that you're black cuz the world won't.

I wont disagree with a player for choosing to play for a euro squad that calls them up. Its just soo much more beneficial for them to do so, financially and it gives you a better chance to play/win on the world stage.

Which is why I respected Prince Boateng's decision to play for Ghana when he could have played for Germany. He could have won a world cup with his younger brother Jerome, playing for Germany. Prince said he felt more Ghanian.

Shoot, I almost side eyed Jerome when he didnt play for Ghana but the brothers grew up with different white mothers under different circumstances. Im not gonna that judge that dude and it seems to have worked out well for him.

 

[layziegunts]

I’m big on soccer, I keep seeing that same quote.

HOWEVER MARIO NEVER ACTUALLY SAID IT

fellas please stop believing anything on the internet

 

[marikomorose]

I’m big on soccer, I keep seeing that same quote.

HOWEVER MARIO NEVER ACTUALLY SAID IT

fellas please stop believing anything on the internet

to being bias, it's annoying:

Balotelli on abuse: 'Problem is that I am Italian'

Mario Balotelli says the racist abuse he suffered at Hellas Verona on Sunday was especially a "problem" because he's Italian.

www.espn.com

 

[DCAllAfrican]

 

[fluid hips]

Yea, I always side eyed Balotelli for those Italian comments. Im only a few years older but even back then.

I understand that his situation, being adopted by Italian parents, was a bit different but you can never forget that you're black cuz the world won't.

I wont disagree with a player for choosing to play for a euro squad that calls them up. Its just soo much more beneficial for them to do so, financially and it gives you a better chance to play/win on the world stage.

Which is why I respected Prince Boateng's decision to play for Ghana when he could have played for Germany. He could have won a world cup with his younger brother Jerome, playing for Germany. Prince said he felt more Ghanian.

Shoot, I almost side eyed Jerome when he didnt play for Ghana but the brothers grew up with different white mothers under different circumstances. Im not gonna that judge that dude and it seems to have worked out well for him.

Prince only played for Ghana because Germany didn't want him. He was a reject. He only played for Ghana because that was his only option to play internationally and at a world cup

He's the type like many others that embrace Africa and claim their blackness when the going gets rough and options become limited

Same with balotelli. Dude is washed up and no team wants him. Now he wants to claim his Africaness all of a sudden FOH

He made his bed. He should lay in it

 

[dwalk31]

Joe Biden, in testy interview, says 'you ain’t black’ if you're undecided over him vs. Trump

'I should not have been so cavalier': Joe Biden apologizes for suggesting black Trump voters 'ain't black'

"I should not have been so cavalier. I've never, never, ever taken the African American community for granted," Biden told black business leaders

www.usatoday.com

 

[fluid hips]

I remember that very well.
Again, it comes down to money and potential earnings. Playing for a side that is a consistent fixture on the international stage guarantees exposure and sponsorship money. This is something few African national sides can offer.
In addition, guys like Balotelli and Mbappe evolved in the Italian and French systems, and unlike so many African stars who started in Africa, it is much harder to convince those guys to play for their parents' countries.
Third (and the reason I don't blame them for representing European nations), players see the lack of organization of national sides (unpaid bonuses, favoritism, coaching decisions made by people outside of the coaching staff) caused by the political nature of football on the continent and I find it understandable that they wouldn't want their short careers (10-15 years with 2-3 realistic chances at playing the world cup/continental tourneys) to be sidetracked by the surrounding nonsense.

We can't allow this excuse. All these players have been using this excuse for years.

We as a people need to understand that personal sacrifices have to be made in order to pave the way for future generations.

That's the problem with black people. No one looks at the bigger long term picture. No one wants to make the personal sacrifice now so we can all benefit in the future.

Collective personal sacrifices have to be made. No black Messiah will come and save us.

 

[wayniac211]

Wish i had the credentials required to mentor some kids here in Brooklyn.

All the credentials you need, you stated in your paragraph. It all starts with an idea

 

[gry60]

We can't allow this excuse. All these players have been using this excuse for years.

We as a people need to understand that personal sacrifices have to be made in order to pave the way for future generations.

What I'm referring to goes beyond personal sacrifice. It's about the inability of African sports authorities to recognize the talent that emanates from the continent and the unwillingness to give that talent its just value. When the athletes themselves are aware of their talent and how it can translate into financial stability not only for themselves but for the generations above and below them, it is downright evil to guilt them into giving up that opportunity when you know their countries cannot offer something similar.

African athletes already sacrifice too much to accept being undervalued by those in charge of athletics (ministries and federations). Sacrifice is baked into sports in Africa, especially at the amateur/young level. Because all the money is allocated towards the men's national soccer teams, most athletes are self-funded or resort to borrowing money from family and friends to train, buy equipment, and travel to take part in regional/continental tournaments.

Then, those who sacrifice beyond what's reasonable often end up getting burned. Take Francoise Mbango:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Françoise_Mbango_Etone

This is how she went from winning two gold medals for Cameroon to representing France since 2010:
https://www.athletics.africa/www2/b...francoise_mbango_changed_nationality/545.html

This article has more examples and a better explanation of what African sports administrators are doing wrong:

Own goal? Africa's shambolic sports management

The call for better management of sport is heard across Africa - often as a lament, more regularly as an outburst of barely contained frustration, writes the BBC's Piers Edwards.

www.bbc.com

Countries can't keep asking what their sportsmen do for them when they never raise the smallest finger to help them out, and knowing what the situation is like on the ground, I can't sit there and act like patriotism alone will feed those athletes.

 

[Grine]

The comments are lit...

 

[ggarvinxx3]

The comments are lit...

my girl said that his daughter looks like a biracial Kyla Pratt and I can’t unsee it.

 

[Coromanti]