- Jul 21, 2012
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I feel ya mane. Respect.
- Jun 1, 2011
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I sure hope she does, because she is for sure black.
- Apr 27, 2002
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this was actually pretty informative, i think his analysis of the symptoms are on point...i just would disagree on the causes & some of the diagnoses, but that that actually came off much more sane than i expected (minus the effeminization bit...)
that is probably true, once anything gets popping people flock to it, the examples of which are plentiful...though i'm not sure that many in the diaspora deny their 'african-ness' (now, the extent to which individual people(s) actually embrace their 'african-ness' does vary wildly), they just may identify more with where they are & i also think to be 'black' to some is a label that discounts/generalizes the totality of their heritage...the "one drop rule" is very much an american thing & some have a more fluid reality of who they are. it is a different to claim something than to have it foist upon you...i think that's what is sometimes missed
just got around to reading this article about 'race' in tech, some very interesting notes on culture in silicon valley from people who are existing in & trying to change it:
http://www.fastcompany.com/3037940/a-different-kind-of-valley-life
- Mar 14, 2006
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^^^^Great read indeed. I always figured they're was some type of funny business going on with hiring. It's easy to hide discrimination without being called on it, especially when Mahoney of the ppl you're discriminating against are ignorant and blind to the methods.
I always said, you have to play the game. Simple statement but open to interpretation. I have a steep uphill battle getting into tech, no tech degree, no professional experience, no money, didn't graduate from a great tech school, etc. But what fun is success without a challenge?
I always said, you have to play the game. Simple statement but open to interpretation. I have a steep uphill battle getting into tech, no tech degree, no professional experience, no money, didn't graduate from a great tech school, etc. But what fun is success without a challenge?
- Jul 20, 2002
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Don't know if these two books have been posted, but plan on reading them for the next couple of months.
- Jul 21, 2012
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I haven't read DLC but Chancellor Williams dropped a gem. I hope you enjoy your reads.
- Jul 26, 2005
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View media item 1409820THOUGHT I SHOULD SHARE THIS FELLAS BEYONCE ROCKIN THIS JACKET ALL-STAR WEEKEND....SMFH PATHETIC
- Oct 11, 2013
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you just realizing that many famous African American Entertainers have sold out and become *****
- Jul 26, 2005
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O NO MAN I BEEN KNEW THAT ALL THE BLACK POLITICIANS & ENTERTAINERS HAVE SOLD US OUT I WAS JUST BRINGING THIS TO YALL BROTHERS ATTENTION
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- Jul 21, 2012
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^^^^Great read indeed. I always figured they're was some type of funny business going on with hiring. It's easy to hide discrimination without being called on it, especially when Mahoney of the ppl you're discriminating against are ignorant and blind to the methods.
I always said, you have to play the game. Simple statement but open to interpretation. I have a steep uphill battle getting into tech, no tech degree, no professional experience, no money, didn't graduate from a great tech school, etc. But what fun is success without a challenge?
though not outright explicitly discriminatory, in practice it functionally results in excluding people who may be qualified but maybe not familiar with the methods...there were also some good points about startups as well...
what aspect(s) of tech are you interested in? what steps are you taking to get the knowledge?
- Mar 14, 2006
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^^^^Great read indeed. I always figured they're was some type of funny business going on with hiring. It's easy to hide discrimination without being called on it, especially when many of the ppl you're discriminating against are ignorant and blind to the methods.
I always said, you have to play the game. Simple statement but open to interpretation. I have a steep uphill battle getting into tech, no tech degree, no professional experience, no money, didn't graduate from a great tech school, etc. But what fun is success without a challenge?
though not outright explicitly discriminatory, in practice it functionally results in excluding people who may be qualified but maybe not familiar with the methods...there were also some good points about startups as well...
what aspect(s) of tech are you interested in? what steps are you taking to get the knowledge?
Oh Yea, no doubt. It's an indirect form, can't say they're truly practicing discrimination without concrete evidence and u can't really prove that they are with the methods they use.
But I'm trying to get into IT Project management. I've been learning web development, java, project management fundamentals, and recently decided to pickup on Sharepoint and C# since there's a need for .Net developers as well. I've been on CodeAcademy, taking the 1000hr challenge on free codecamp.com, online tutorials and books. Won't be easy but i can get it done
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victor page
Banned
- Jan 14, 2013
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I got homies in Chicago who been talking about seeing special police forces running tactical drills all over the city. Some advance emergency prepared ****.
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- Jul 21, 2012
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This is long but informative. Not in the least bit religious but rather strictly judicial and legislative facts. Reginald Mabry is a brilliant researcher and scholar.
- Jul 27, 2013
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Was having this conversation with an old old-time friend- she's an anthropologists. an she likes to pick my brain every time she gets a chance, decided to run a few things by her and see what she thought about what is our current culture shock. Basically we've been through all the sub categorical pulls that a culture can to sustain itself- religious, militant, social, spiritual- all shot down by the same bullet. So how to deal with these recurring attempts at ethnocide with so little room for change/improvement while the small percentage of brothers with knowledge keeps seemingly getting smaller. should we let go of what we know at the facts that our culture has met its' devolution and corner to the melting pot, cause we can't pretend anymore that we aren't slowly but surely losing this fight. at this point we can either let it run its course and hope current american anti-intellectualism helps destroys itself and its' foundation(because it probably will) or challenge these ideas like many black org.'s have before and hope it improves our people for the better
After takin' all these L's I asked her what was the probability that we could come up in 2k15 or onward, me like her and a few of my other friends have studied some linguistic anthro for some time and a-like theories like the Saphir-Whorf hypothesis, Whorfanism, linguistic determinism(and its' lesser linguistic relativity), and we basically agreed that language manipulation(reverse manipulation) could be a big turn for the western world, and blacks altogether.
(Old interpersonal communication video, but you get a idea of what Saphir Whorf is)
There are critics of these ideas but certainly some truth. Deeper than religion in certain ways, black people in America have never had a native language(for obvious reasons), but could there be a need for a native language without a native land or out of native land. Seeing how religion and (black) nationalism aren't ideas that are ideal in this day and age. Do we have to distinguish ourselves to be successful collectively in another land.
For the most part,me and her was just bs'in around about all this but imagine: with a respective language how much harder things like culture appropriation and sellin' out would be.
in the hypothetical sit. that we could acquire a language and possibly a symbolic written system(like the alphabet) it would be a reason for separate education or schooling(not that it is what I want but that it would be a lot better for us overall)(and separate businesses, etc.). not to mention a chance to completely start over connotatively ( theoretically denotatively as a race).
Or with a type of phonological ruling like in Singapore(like how they have with Malay, Tamil, and Mandarin as official languages).
Not going to bore on with details but basically if we are to try and save our culture then we may need to find other means to further distinguish ourselves and I think that a dialect/language decades down could be a huge thing to build off of. Especially a recognized black western/american language, cause realistically the only thing needed for a language to be official is for it to be recognized.
After takin' all these L's I asked her what was the probability that we could come up in 2k15 or onward, me like her and a few of my other friends have studied some linguistic anthro for some time and a-like theories like the Saphir-Whorf hypothesis, Whorfanism, linguistic determinism(and its' lesser linguistic relativity), and we basically agreed that language manipulation(reverse manipulation) could be a big turn for the western world, and blacks altogether.
(Old interpersonal communication video, but you get a idea of what Saphir Whorf is)
There are critics of these ideas but certainly some truth. Deeper than religion in certain ways, black people in America have never had a native language(for obvious reasons), but could there be a need for a native language without a native land or out of native land. Seeing how religion and (black) nationalism aren't ideas that are ideal in this day and age. Do we have to distinguish ourselves to be successful collectively in another land.
For the most part,me and her was just bs'in around about all this but imagine: with a respective language how much harder things like culture appropriation and sellin' out would be.
in the hypothetical sit. that we could acquire a language and possibly a symbolic written system(like the alphabet) it would be a reason for separate education or schooling(not that it is what I want but that it would be a lot better for us overall)(and separate businesses, etc.). not to mention a chance to completely start over connotatively ( theoretically denotatively as a race).
Or with a type of phonological ruling like in Singapore(like how they have with Malay, Tamil, and Mandarin as official languages).
Not going to bore on with details but basically if we are to try and save our culture then we may need to find other means to further distinguish ourselves and I think that a dialect/language decades down could be a huge thing to build off of. Especially a recognized black western/american language, cause realistically the only thing needed for a language to be official is for it to be recognized.
- Apr 27, 2002
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so are the thoughts here a result of that discussion between you & your anthropologist friend? so basically you are advocating this new language as a way of creating a bond or a shared understanding/way of looking at the world?
not familiar with the name (Saphir Whorf) but conceptually the idea that language affects how you view the world is something i think most would have some exposure to through different experiences (some who study linguistics believe language to have its origins as a thinking tool rather than one of communication, or more a communication with oneself than necessarily with others) and to this point, it could be why many people (including black folk) negative associations of blacks generally, because the word black has so many negative connotations in many languages? language can frame our reference, 'pro-life,' 'war on drugs/poverty,' 'death panels,' etc....that is maybe a strong argument for changing the way we refer to ourselves/are referred to, maybe less of an argument for an altogether new language...esperanto is recently created language, that was constructed somewhat on similar principles
cultural appropriation & selling out, aren't necessarily made more difficult by language or culture, and history kind of bears that out...
question is, what problem(s) would this be attempting to solve? looking at how things are going politically, socio-economically and technologically, where more political power is being concentrated among the wealthy and/or corporate interests, the cost of education continues to creep ever more upward at almost every level at a time when there is a hollowing of the middle class and technology is accelerating, augmenting and simultaneously changing/making obsolete the ways we do many things...are there more immediate things to work towards?
another question, using phrases like 'culture shock,' 'ethnocide,' 'takin' all these Ls,' 'save our culture' ...are quite strong language, do you find that to be an accurate description of the current state of 'black culture' or personhood in america today? if so why? because i would argue, while it isn't nearly all good, the situation isn't that dire to the point of 'ethnocide' or needing to 'save our culture' ---also is there a working definition of 'black culture' that is universally understood? keeping in mind that identity is a part of culture and not synonymous with it...
victor page
Banned
- Jan 14, 2013
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This is a must listen to.
Been feeling that it's finally time to put this entire obsession w/ stripper culture to the rear view. We're ruining our women...which is equivalent to ruining the very thing from which you come from...the Earth.
That's why I usually scroll past all the stripper/g-string pics on women w/ big fake ***** in the Black Women Thread.
Like...when I think of a beautiful black woman...that's not the template I picture in my head.
- Jul 27, 2013
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Yes, if fully integrated into one environment studies show that language usually has an effect on the values of said people.
You hit it on the head, exactly my point, look at the bold and reread what you wrote prior, I think that you are missing the point in its' entirety. Something of this stature happening for black people would be a great chance for social improvement, . The bolded is a reason why affirming a cultural identity is important for a unified race or to be a unified race. I am fully aware of Esperanto, it is a very big international language now, and another prime example.
Cultures can only appropriate things from other cultures that they can translate into their own, if not then they cannot call it their own and that could change many things. Selling out your own is always easier when you don't personally identify with them, but whatever-- a sellout is a sellout.
@ the bolded: None-- and I mean NONE of those things have anything to do with what I wrote, NONE-- and I do mean NONE of those things have much of anything to do with the point of this very thread. Culture is never dead, there is no such thing as not having culture or someone having more culture than someone but culture is what identifies/unifies a race, what sub-cultural differences which makes us diverse. That might not matter to you but losing culture or simply letting it die because "it doesn't matter" is the type of anti-intellectualism that is constantly keeping us separated. Those things that you mentioned are important but on a whole nother' topic and not what is internally plaguing us at the moment. So culture and identity are not synonymous to you?... cultural identity? what do these words mean to you then? let me know, I am here to learn, teach me, srs. And trust me I seen the rest of that paragraph and I don't think it is worth responding to
Wade Davis is a brilliant scientist, but he is also one of those dudes who like listening to the sound of their own voice, so take heed.
Also, can't help but wonder-- why are you always trying your best to play devil's advocate after every other post in here, I don't mean to come at you, I am just truly curious if you are being genuinely sincere or trolling because I really don't see the meaning in some of your post and you seem like you are really capable of having a sensible conversation so I just wanted to know your take on it.
- Jul 21, 2012
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truth-serum
Banned
- May 16, 2013
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Good documentary on PBS channel 13 right now about Jim crow
- Apr 27, 2002
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wouldn't disagree that a language could have that affect, and not that any other action should exclude it, devising a new language is no small or quick undertaking, and to have it formalized and taught seems like it would be a massive thing especially given the current shortcoming of the current system, the same end goal might be achieved by a different framing easier? is esparanto big? i've actually never heard it spoken or met a speaker..not that that means anything
i don't think you need to translate to appropriate...things are transmitted to & from cultures often without context & without any understanding; and all appropriation isn't bad; it can lead to understanding. isn't the main issue with the type of appropriation that happens today that creators of a thing may not have the means, knowledge, and/or wherewithal to distribute and own that thing? the flipside of which is when a creator does manage to openly seek to actualize/access some way to gain by profiting off the thing they create they tend to be called a sellout (this is maybe becoming more rare, as the unabashed goal of profit over everything seems to be more acceptable at every level) for doing so...obviously there is a middle ground between these two extremes
well, you are right not as much to do with culture but i would say that all those things either disproportionally effect and/or people of color are underrepresented/underserved in those things (tangentially recently read these two pieces on minneapolis illustrate a divide familiar to almost every metro area), and maybe there is some way culture can be apart of explaining/solving that...and to my mind the extent that isn't part of the discussion, something is missed. at various point in the past, when racism & segregation was not de facto but law of the land, people of color where still able to improve on their standard of living, educated their children, lived in communities that were actually communities, but not not necessarily any less splintered in terms of the individual communities...done under the oppressive veil of white supremacy, because the economy was robust enough for all strata of men, education sufficient enough, opportunities available enough to make that possible...
presently, however persistent racism/white supremacy is today, it probably doesn't limit people like it once did, but the bigger difference is the economics, in the ways that globalization & technology have affected the way we live, in the switch from a manufacturing country, with lots of low-skill employment with one wage earner, to one that deals in products & services, which tends to require more education/investment/training over a longer time and both parents working (there of course other factors as well, tax cutting, over criminalization, poor education, etc.)...it may be apocryphal, but there seems to be evidence that MLK jr was planning to form of a coalition around these very politics, this is not an abandonment or a devil's advocation on race in america, just a realization that race is often used as a wedge to divide people who are in fact in the same position from forming a larger, stronger voice...inclusion not exclusion, this may be naive, but i do believe that "the arc of history is long, but bends towards justice..."
i agree on your assertion on sub-cultural differences enrich the whole, making for diversity...but doesn't that very diversity definitionally makes for splintering? it is not a given that people should want to group up if it in fact it is at the expense of whatever particular autonomy or agency of that sub culture; and indeed that is/has and maybe always will be a contentious thing. (to make an extremely archaic, exaggerated example, some subset of people may practice ritualistic sacrifice of their own; to what extent is the larger society to honor that? and how is that dynamic affected if that subset of people has substantial influence/power in that group?) i guess there are ways that culture & identity might be synonymous, but i'm not sure they always are because i think of identity being generalized & culture being specific...
as for ethnocide...to some degree in such a pluralistic society there will be have to be some acculturation, and as the world continues to get smaller, that is probably going to crowd out some aspects of some cultures...which as mentioned above is always a point of conflict to the degree the larger culture actively seeks to limit or change another...to what degree is this the case in terms of 'black culture?'
i mostly lurk on nt, but i'm generally interested in culture discussions and i saw basically 2 modes of thought in the thread, the conspiratorial "plot against the black man" and the lamenting "if only blacks would get it together/smarten up/wake up," which to me are really kind of the same argument (granted there is enough in the public record to give enough credence to make that thinking very tangible), and everyone patting themselves on the back for "seeing with their 3rd eye"and being wiser than the next man so i interjected; i'm no scholar, so it probably isn't always the most coherent...just someone with a different opinion...in some ways i guess it is trolling because i saw what the discourse was and chose to enter the fray, thus i'm called all types of agents, *****, and the like; which to the earlier point about grouping, is what happens with differing outlooks...i'm sure if i were to meet any one of those calling names under different circumstances we'd agree on the majority of things, but the on the internets, though more exaggerated than in real life, the differences create tribes of hyperbolic proportions and the similarities get minimized over the point(s) of difference/disagreement
- Jul 26, 2005
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UMAR CHEWED HER UP & SPIT HER OUT FINALLY ONE OF THE LEADERS ADDRESS THIS FOOLISH ARGUMENT...
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- Jul 27, 2013
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THIS. This right here... could have ended you a world of frustration(frankly should have ended your entire post). You agreed with me, you agree with me but you are going out of your way to try and make me out to be some kind of extremist or some type of sensationalist. You have a problem with all this "pro-blackness" talk and think that our problems are greatly exaggerated and make out every chance that you can to try and make out some type of moot point. which is all you've been doing-
A MOOT POINT: A IRRELEVANT QUESTION, A MATTER OF NO IMPORTANCE. NOT SUBJECT TO DEBATE. UNRELATED.- really this should really have ended my post.
This is why I stopped responding to you a few months ago when you did the same thing with the random nonsensical responses that have nothing to do with trying to improve or even actually disagreeing with me. Almost like you are trying to prove something...
Lets' just agree to disagree(even tho I have no clue what you are actually disagreeing about). We have derailed the thread enough. you really don't even have to respond, I am up for no reason and have to be in school in a few hours, I am done entertaining this nonsense. @tokes99
victor page
Banned
- Jan 14, 2013
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I'm surprised you engaged that cornball for so long
