Is Dwyane Wade the 3rd best SG of all time?

[DCAllAfrican]

Iverson in his prime is better than any version of Wade. He took a squad that was as bad as Lebron's in 07, to the finals by himself.

1. He didn't do it by himself. Elite coaching, elite defensive principals, elite role players. Most importantly, elite team-work.

2. It is a fallacy to say, "Iverson led his team to the finals alone when Wade didn't. So Iverson is better." Well, there are dozens of factors that play into who makes the finals and who doesn't, so it isn't as simple as you make it out to be my man. I know we love to credit one player with a team's success, but it is a team sport.

3. Wade has size over Iverson. Wade is a better defender than Iverson. After that, there really isn't much more that distinguishes these two great players.

 

[laokratwr]

I think he is better than all of these guys. I would say yes Wade is arguabally the 3rd best SG of all time.[/quote ] you must be 16 and live in dade county.

repped.and as for wade.no.

 

[semf]

Jerry West, george gervin, Iverson, Drexler, Dumars.

there's some Joe D love on NT? WOW, Joe D is one of my fave players of all time. Underrated. Class act. He was a low key guy who got lost in all the flashy bells and whistles of the late 80's / early 90's.

Verdykt, you just shot to the top of my NT Christmas card list . . .

 

[laokratwr]

No.
OJ Mayo is third.
Clyde Drexler is fourth.
Manu Ginobili is fifth.
Joe Johnson is sixth.
Then Dwyane.

 

[mertonhanks]

Dudes are forgetting how nasty Wade was before Bron got to MIA. Wade>AI and Im a 90's cat.

 

[munnnjee]

1. MJ

2. Kobe

3. Who cares

+1

 

[munnnjee]

I would place him top 10

 

[Jumanji]

The healthy years before lebron came, he definitely could of been considered 3rd best SG of all time. What he did against the Mavs in the finals and the 08-09 finals after he was supposedly "wash-up" was fealthy.

 

[Trillmatic90]

In the weakest Eastern Conference in history. Look at SRS in '01. Only TWO East teams were better than the West's 9th seed. Houston went 45-37 overall but went 25-5 against the East. The East was a joke that year.

And no it wasn't "by himself". Sure the '01 Sixers didn't have much offensive talent but they were the 5th best defensive team in the league.

Getting to the finals through a weak conference doesn't discredit Iverson for what he did though. They had great defense, but how good can a team be without a player like Iverson when a defensive minded player like Theo Ratlif is the second leading scorer with 12 ppg?

1. He didn't do it by himself. Elite coaching, elite defensive principals, elite role players. Most importantly, elite team-work.

2. It is a fallacy to say, "Iverson led his team to the finals alone when Wade didn't. So Iverson is better." Well, there are dozens of factors that play into who makes the finals and who doesn't, so it isn't as simple as you make it out to be my man. I know we love to credit one player with a team's success, but it is a team sport.

3. Wade has size over Iverson. Wade is a better defender than Iverson. After that, there really isn't much more that distinguishes these two great players.

1-2) I agree, he didn't do it by himself, but he had very little help and still somehow managed to lead a team like that to the finals (less help than Wade ever had in his three trips to the finals).

3) Size isn't the end all be all in player comparisons. Iverson also led the league in steals three straight years (averaging almost 3 spg those three years) and has a career average of Wade's highest spg season.

Not to mention, Iverson is also a better scorer and better play maker.

 

[worldbeefreeg]

Wade is just better than Iverson, no real comparison. Wade is the second best defensive two guard of all-time (yes he is a better defender than Kobe imo)...

Dude's really blow Ivo's run to the finals so out of proportion. Ivo is great but his peak was relatively short compared to Wade who still looks to have a handful of good years ahead of him. When he has 3 rings the argument is deaded.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Getting to the finals through a weak conference doesn't discredit Iverson for what he did though. They had great defense, but how good can a team be without a player like Iverson when a defensive minded player like Theo Ratlif is the second leading scorer with 12 ppg?
1-2) I agree, he didn't do it by himself, but he had very little help and still somehow managed to lead a team like that to the finals (less help than Wade ever had in his three trips to the finals).
3) Size isn't the end all be all in player comparisons. Iverson also led the league in steals three straight years (averaging almost 3 spg those three years) and has a career average of Wade's highest spg season.
Not to mention, Iverson is also a better scorer and better play maker.

1. He had very little offensive scoring help. Say that. Just from a SCORING standpoint, he dominated. Scoring is one portion of the game of basketball "Melo."

2. Size isn't the end all, be all but it is a factor that needs to be considered when comparing two players. And please don't resort to the steals argument. We know steals and blocks aren't true stats when it comes to determining defensive ability.

3. Better scorer? Based on what? Because he took more shots and scored more points? That makes you better?

Please don't assume I am an Iverson hater. I grew up in DC. Big East Fan since birth, so before you resort to the, "You just hate Iverson" card, actually listen to my points.

 

[trasoul82]

He's a great as the refs whistles allow him to be.

 

[duba169]

He's a great as the refs whistles allow him to be.

View media item 136517

 

[mertonhanks]

Getting to the finals through a weak conference doesn't discredit Iverson for what he did though. They had great defense, but how good can a team be without a player like Iverson when a defensive minded player like Theo Ratlif is the second leading scorer with 12 ppg?
1-2) I agree, he didn't do it by himself, but he had very little help and still somehow managed to lead a team like that to the finals (less help than Wade ever had in his three trips to the finals).
3) Size isn't the end all be all in player comparisons. Iverson also led the league in steals three straight years (averaging almost 3 spg those three years) and has a career average of Wade's highest spg season.
Not to mention, Iverson is also a better scorer and better play maker.

Iverson is not a better scorer unless your just looking at ppg. Wade is the more efficient scorer. Wade is also the better playmaker.

 

[Trillmatic90]

1. He had very little offensive scoring help. Say that. Just from a SCORING standpoint, he dominated. Scoring is one portion of the game of basketball "Melo."
2. Size isn't the end all, be all but it is a factor that needs to be considered when comparing two players. And please don't resort to the steals argument. We know steals and blocks aren't true stats when it comes to determining defensive ability.
3. Better scorer? Based on what? Because he took more shots and scored more points? That makes you better?
Please don't assume I am an Iverson hater. I grew up in DC. Big East Fan since birth, so before you resort to the, "You just hate Iverson" card, actually listen to my points.

He took more shots, but that was the result of being on teams that were lacking offensive weapons. The year Iverson got traded to the Nuggets, his fga went down by 6 (while still averaging something like 26 ppg) cause he finally had a reliable scorer on his team.

To answer your question on Iverson being a better scorer:

Do you agree Iverson is a better all around shooter (mid range, perimeter, and free throw)?
Do you agree that Iverson was better at drawing fouls?
Do you agree that Iverson was better at creating his own shot?

I'm not saying you're biased, but if you think Wade was better at any of those things on the offensive end then Iverson, I don't know what to say. The only thing Wade had over Iverson in terms of offense is slashing/cutting ability due to his size. That's it.

 

[gllahone84]

Dudes in here talking about Jerry West when they haven't seen dude play a day in their life..and yes Jerry West against today's talent would not fair as well as he did back in the day. The talent is just too great...

That's like when guys bring up Bill Russell...dude was dominant back in the day of course because the parity just wasn't there. 

 

[Trillmatic90]

Iverson is not a better scorer unless your just looking at ppg. Wade is the more efficient scorer. Wade is also the better playmaker.

Look at my response to DC. Also, Wade is not a better play maker. Iverson's play making abilities go unnoticed so often, just because he was known as a scorer. He was consistently hovering around the 7 apg mark despite the low level of offensive talent on his Sixers teams.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

He took more shots, but that was the result of being on teams that were lacking offensive weapons. The year Iverson got traded to the Nuggets, his fga went down by 6 (while still averaging something like 26 ppg) cause he finally had a reliable scorer on his team.
To answer your question on Iverson being a better scorer:
Do you agree Iverson is a better all around shooter (mid range, perimeter, and free throw)?
Do you agree that Iverson was better at drawing fouls?
Do you agree that Iverson was better at creating his own shot?
I'm not saying you're biased, but if you think Wade was better at any of those things on the offensive end then Iverson, I don't know what to say. The only thing Wade had over Iverson in terms of offense is slashing/cutting ability due to his size. That's it.

1. As mentioned, Iverson wasn't a very efficient scorer. So why exactly are we calling him a BETTER scorer? Again, is it because he scored more points? If not, give me a valid reason as to why you feel Iverson is a better scorer? But hell, lettuce say he was a better scorer, it isn't by a margin that is worth mentioning by any stretch.

2. I don't have prime Iverson's shot locations since HoopData wasn't around but I am willing to bet that Iverson's shot% from each location wasn't on par with Wade.

3. Creating their own shot. They both can do it on a HOF level. Not worth mentioning which one was better. That would be like arguing who is faster between prime Chris Johnson and Devin Hester. Pointless argument. They both are at a HOF level when it comes to that skill.

4. Drawing fouls, we can look at numbers. FTA per game, for career. Fair comparison since they both play starter mins. Iverson averages 0.1 more FTA over the course of his career than Wade. Again, what exactly are you getting at? Wash.
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/366/allen-iverson
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/1987/dwyane-wade

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Look at my response to DC. Also, Wade is not a better play maker. Iverson's play making abilities go unnoticed so often, just because he was known as a scorer. He was consistently hovering around the 7 apg mark despite the low level of offensive talent on his Sixers teams.

You ever hear of the term, "Iverson Assists." -

They both can create but they both are primarily scorers. Neither one is above and beyond the other to say one is clearly better than the other at play making skills.

 

[friscostylez]

No.
OJ Mayo is third.
Clyde Drexler is fourth.
Manu Ginobili is fifth.
Joe Johnson is sixth.
Then Dwyane.

MY MAN

 

[rook]

Did I just read that Iverson wasn't a better scorer than Wade? LMAO man WHAT!????

And don't act like the year the Heat won their 1st ring that the East wasn't horrid also. Only the Pistons were a thread to the Heat.

And lets not even begin on that NBA finals :x

 

[Trillmatic90]

When I posed those questions, I wasn't looking for an answer based on stats but based on observation. Most people agree that Iverson had a better stroke, but let's just say they were equal.

To answer the question, was Iverson less efficient than Wade? Yes. But don't efficiency/fg% fool you. Duncan has a better fg% than Dirk, but we both know that Dirk is still the better overall scorer.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Did I just read that Iverson wasn't a better scorer than Wade? LMAO man WHAT!????

No you read people wanting an explanation as to why people feel that way. What makes Iverson a better scorer?

 

[Trillmatic90]

1. As mentioned, Iverson wasn't a very efficient scorer. So why exactly are we calling him a BETTER scorer? Again, is it because he scored more points? If not, give me a valid reason as to why you feel Iverson is a better scorer? But hell, lettuce say he was a better scorer, it isn't by a margin that is worth mentioning by any stretch.
2. I don't have prime Iverson's shot locations since HoopData wasn't around but I am willing to bet that Iverson's shot% from each location wasn't on par with Wade.
3. Creating their own shot. They both can do it on a HOF level. Not worth mentioning which one was better. That would be like arguing who is faster between prime Chris Johnson and Devin Hester. Pointless argument. They both are at a HOF level when it comes to that skill.
4. Drawing fouls, we can look at numbers. FTA per game, for career. Fair comparison since they both play starter mins. Iverson averages 0.1 more FTA over the course of his career than Wade. Again, what exactly are you getting at? Wash.
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/366/allen-iverson
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/1987/dwyane-wade

When I posed those questions, I wasn't looking for an answer based on stats but based on observation (just like you did when you discredited spg for the defense argument). Most people agree that Iverson had a better stroke, but let's just say they were equal.

To answer the question, was Iverson less efficient than Wade? Yes. But don't let efficiency/fg% fool you. Duncan has a better fg% than Dirk, but we both know that Dirk is still the better overall scorer.

 

[do be doo]

HEY No A Vs B threaDS...................

Unless it praise a laker...............

Then it stays open.