Israel declares War - Destruction of Gaza / Growing conflict in Middle East

[shibadekobe]

Israel agrees to four-hour military 'pauses' in northern Gaza: White House

 

[IATT]

 

[DLF]

 

[osh kosh bosh]

It reminds me a lot of less known/talked about conflicts on the African continent where long-term peace has only been achieved after all warring parties accepted to forgive and forget.

my family was on the losing side of a civil war in Nigeria.
lots of stolen property, my grandfather and great uncles lost everything.

ultimately I guess they could have continued to wage a terrorist campaign to get their stuff back.

but eventually they had to take the L. no apologies were ever made. no reparations have been given.


"The pogroms I witnessed in Makurdi, Nigeria (late Sept. 1966) were foreshadowed by months of intensive anti-Igbo and anti-Eastern conversations among Tiv, Idoma, Hausa and other Northerners resident in Makurdi, and, fitting a pattern replicated in city after city, the massacres were led by the Nigerian army. Before, during and after the slaughter, Col. Gowon could be heard over the radio issuing 'guarantees of safety' to all Easterners, all citizens of Nigeria, but the intent of the soldiers, the only power that counts in Nigeria now or then, was painfully clear. After counting the disemboweled bodies along the Makurdi road I was escorted back to the city by soldiers who apologised for the stench and explained politely that they were doing me and the world a great favor by eliminating Igbos."


I feel like a lot of Americans are ignorant how often stuff like this happens across the globe.

 

[WASHED KING]

uuuhm jeeze
this post just seems like pure anti semtism, but go off i guess?

I come in peace. How so?

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I come in peace. How so?

Jewish =/= Isreali

Making every Jewish person responsible for the actions of a state that they may not live in, and may not even support is pretty text book anti semtism.

 

[WASHED KING]

Jewish =/= Isreali

Making every Jewish person responsible for the actions of a state that they may not live in, and may not even support is pretty text book anti semtism.

Got it, I was focusing on the topic of the post not the generalization part.

 

[IATT]

 

[moe200069]

quite the “democracy” in israel.

 

[moe200069]

not sure if posted but figured it would be relevant.



folks can support judaism and the jewish community while also being anti-zionist. denouncing zionism and the settler state of israel is constantly conflated with antisemitism, which it is not.

 

[me love nutella]

Behind Hamas’s Bloody Gambit to Create a ‘Permanent’ State of War

Hamas leaders say they waged their Oct. 7 attack on Israel because they believed the Palestinian cause was slipping away, and that only violence could revive it.

www.nytimes.com

Hamas, in their own words.





Looks like a Hail Mary to me.

The article is worth reading IMO. It does confirms the lack of internal consensus on the direction of the organization as a political entity, and that lack of unity usually is a bad omen for a resistance movement.

Ya, this is lacking context.

I have heard and watched interviews in the spoken Palestinian dialect of my mother tongue of a couple of Hamas leaders, and there is way more to this where Hamas leaders have explained aplenty what the aim of what they consider a retaliatory attack on Israel.

Why did Hamas attack now?​

Hamas’s move was triggered by three factors. First, the policies of the far-right Israeli government enabling settler violence in the occupied West Bank and Jerusalem led to a sense of desperation among Palestinians and growing demands for a reaction. At the same time, the rising tensions in the West Bank caused by these policies necessitated the shift of Israeli forces away from the south and into the north to guard the settlements. This gave Hamas both a justification and an opportunity to attack.

Second, the Hamas leadership felt compelled to act due to the acceleration of Arab-Israeli normalisation. In recent years, this process further diminished the significance of the Palestinian issue for Arab leaders who became less keen on pressuring Israel on this matter.

If a Saudi-Israeli normalisation deal had been concluded, it would have been a turning point in the Arab-Israeli conflict, which may have eliminated the already weak chances of a two-state solution. This was also part of Hamas’s calculations.

Third, Hamas was emboldened after it managed to repair its ties with Iran. In recent years, the movement had to reconsider the political position it assumed in the wake of the Arab Spring in 2011, in opposition to Iran and its ally, the Syrian regime.

Hezbollah Secretary-General Hassan Nasrallah has said that he was personally involved in improving the relations between Hamas and Damascus. A Hamas delegation visited Damascus in October 2022 and its political bureau chief Ismail Haniyeh travelled to Beirut in April and Tehran in June. Just last month, Nasrallah hosted the Secretary-General of the Palestinian Islamic Jihad Ziad al-Nakhalah and the deputy chief of Hamas’s political bureau Saleh al-Arouri.
...

What is Hamas’s end game?​

Three days into Hamas’s surprising and overwhelming attack, it is not clear what its end game is and what it can do to reap long-term benefits. Its priority has seemed to be to take both military and civilian hostages to help deter aggressive Israeli retaliation and later exchange them for Palestinian prisoners in Israeli jails.
...
The Hamas leadership has said that the objectives of the attacks are ending “Israeli violations”, securing the release of Palestinian prisoners, and “returning to the project of establishing a state”. Hamas may be able to secure a prisoner swap deal with Israel, although, in the past, many of those released from Israeli prisons had been quickly rearrested. But the group does not have a clear roadmap for moving forward on “establishing a state” and it cannot have one separately from the Palestinian Authority in the occupied West Bank.

Source: Analysis: Why did Hamas attack now and what is next?

 

[ntplayboy]

 

[htg designs]

forever war

 

[me love nutella]

This is interesting to think about when it comes to piecing together what took place on October 7th:







This is also just insane coming from an Israeli official spokesperson:

 

[ccastro02]

I support this move. The goal is to get ALL of the hostages returned. Every single one. Hamas has gained absolutely no ground by using the hostages as collateral. They have more to gain by releasing all the hostages.

 

[me love nutella]

I support this move. The goal is to get ALL of the hostages returned. Every single one. Hamas has gained absolutely no ground by using the hostages as collateral. They have more to gain by releasing all the hostages.

So then will Israel return the 5000+ illegally imprisoned and hostages they're asking for?

These swaps have been used between Israel and Palestinian groups for decades now.

Also, not sure Netanyahu can get the hostages back this way either. Hamas said 60 hostages were killed in bombardment. They said they're releasing a video soon of a 19 year old female soldier killed by Israeli bombardment and her soldier friend that got injured.

 

[moderndarwin]

This is a social media propaganda war as much as a real one. This sort of stuff has been going on globally for as far back as civilization has existed. This (and to a slightly lesser degree Ukraine) has been front and center on social media in what’s a first I think. Interesting to see how that machine works as it’s truly truly impacting life and death now.

 

[IATT]

 

[danikerhino]

This situation is a ****ing mess.

 

[TonyJetsun]

It’s gon get ugly….. in here… in here… in here *in my bubba sparxx and timbaland voice *

 

[LD7]

If this was a war on the battlefield between men and armies, I wouldn’t be so focused.

However, the fact that Israel is knowingly and consistently killing women and children is wrong, evil, and against everything that flag of the Star of David should represent.

Men go to war. Land and resources are lost in war. It’s in our nature. I can accept it. Russia vs Ukraine is war for land and resources. This will always be a part of life.

What Israel is doing is demonic. To kill the women and children is to erase a people’s future. They’re doing so out of fear, and understanding, that the youth will grow and want revenge for their ancestors.

Also, Israel is only copying the takeover blueprint set by Europeans when they came to America. They used the Bible to get what they wanted and Israel is hiding behind the scriptures to do as they please against anyone that stands up to them.

Before you refer to Hamas as terrorists after over 75 years of Jewish occupancy and attacks over THEIR land, remember what Americans did to the Native Americans, Mexicans, and African Americans in this country when their goal was the same. Land, resources, and superiority.

The British gave the permission to relocate to America and to Palestine. Neither land was rightfully theirs. Imagine that.

 

[ccastro02]

So then will Israel return the 5000+ illegally imprisoned and hostages they're asking for?

These swaps have been used between Israel and Palestinian groups for decades now.

Also, not sure Netanyahu can get the hostages back this way either. Hamas said 60 hostages were killed in bombardment. They said they're releasing a video soon of a 19 year old female soldier killed by Israeli bombardment and her soldier friend that got injured.

I’m not going to address your question directly because it’s an extremely charged question that is plastered of whataboutism.

If you’re asking for my opinion, I think hamas should at least release ALL the remaining civilian hostages in their possession. That is the immediate cause of the most recent string of conflicts. Soldiers being held hostage to be used for prisoner swaps. This is what it will take for a ceasefire.

 

[DripNick]

Pray for Gaza

 

[me love nutella]

If this was a war on the battlefield between men and armies, I wouldn’t be so focused.

However, the fact that Israel is knowingly and consistently killing women and children is wrong, evil, and against everything that flag of the Star of David should represent.

Men go to war. Land and resources are lost in war. It’s in our nature. I can accept it. Russia vs Ukraine is war for land and resources. This will always be a part of life.

What Israel is doing is demonic. To kill the women and children is to erase a people’s future. They’re doing so out of fear, and understanding, that the youth will grow and want revenge for their ancestors.

Also, Israel is only copying the takeover blueprint set by Europeans when they came to America. They used the Bible to get what they wanted and Israel is hiding behind the scriptures to do as they please against anyone that stands up to them.

Before you refer to Hamas as terrorists after over 75 years of Jewish occupancy and attacks over THEIR land, remember what Americans did to the Native Americans, Mexicans, and African Americans in this country when their goal was the same. Land, resources, and superiority.

The British gave the permission to relocate to America and to Palestine. Neither land was rightfully theirs. Imagine that.

It is a genocide. The number of children killed in this amount of time is unprecedented. It is because they have tried for 75 years to inflict ethnic cleansing and 'slow' genocide to make Palestinians submit and scare them away or die off, but it hasn't worked. Palestinians only resisted and kept going and their population growing becoming a demographic threat.

They are not trying to even hide it though. The numbers of death and injuries inflicted is like Israel is on some deadline and going literally unhinged and berzerk mode with no sanctity of life. The point is to make Gaza uninhabitable, and the next place is West Bank to drive them out too.

But, oh it is Hamas that wants to wipe out Israel, listening to rhetoric, when for 75 years it has been Israel literally ethnically cleansing and never providing a viable Palestinian statehood and sovereignty, and annihilating Palestinian families. This genocide who had hundreds of Palestinian families have their WHOLE bloodlines wiped off the public registry. You hear of families dead in one shot in the dozens, 40s, 60s. Where have we seen this happen to Israeli families? Some have THE NERVE to blame Hamas as wanting to eliminate Israel, when Israel is doing it to Palestinians, literally and figuratively.

They have been going mayhem targeting Gaza's hospitals again last night, killing civilians in the yard sheltering and inside hospitals, even MATERNITY WARDS, as a way for them to leave and evacuate. Hospitals. The docs and healthcare workers are saying they will not leave, and will die providing care to the patients in need until their last breath.

Dr. Mads Gilbert calling to global leaders of the world to stop the massacres at the hospitals, while the hospitals are being hit.



Adding this from Al-Jazeera's live update since it is relevant to Dr. Gilbert

‘Gaza 2023 makes hell look like a tea party’​

Mads Gilbert, a Norweigan doctor who has regularly volunteered at al-Shifa Hospital, says targeting hospitals is part of the Israeli military’s doctrine.

“They will shoot at anything that they consider Palestinian: Infrastructure, schools, churches, mosques, hospitals, ambulances, civilians. So, of course, what we see now is the most extreme expression of a racist politic where you do not respect human values,” Gilbert told Al Jazeera.

“The scenes from al-Shifa today were horrific … would this have been accepted by Europe and the US if these had been hospitals caring for white people in Europe? Never ever. This is racist politics, it’s utterly disgusting and I think we have to consider this as the greatest moral collapse in Western politics in my generation.

“It keeps going, and it’s not hell. Gaza 2023 makes hell look like a tea party,” Gilbert urged.

 

[me love nutella]

I’m not going to address your question directly because it’s an extremely charged question that is plastered of whataboutism.

If you’re asking for my opinion, I think hamas should at least release ALL the remaining civilian hostages in their possession. That is the immediate cause of the most recent string of conflicts. Soldiers being held hostage to be used for prisoner swaps. This is what it will take for a ceasefire.

It is not whataboutism though. Hamas is not only asking for fighters jailed. There are men, women, children in Israeli jails that are held illegally and not fighters, and are just civilians as well.