NBA Off-Season News Thread: Roy extends 80/5, AI to Grizz, Chandler/Okafor swap, Marquis to C's.

[h2]Their numbers just don't add up[/h2]
In basketball, not everything is quantifiable. That's why it can be misleading to judge a player's value solely by his statistics. Stats don't measure small but significant things like setting a solid screen or playing good positional defense. They don't measure intangible qualities like competitiveness or a positive attitude. FOXSports.com NBA editor John Galinsky lists 10 current players who put up big numbers but aren't as valuable as their stats suggest. Some are All-Stars. Some aren't. But for all these guys, the whole really is less than the sum of its parts

1
[h2]Zach Randolph, F-C, Memphis Grizzlies[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 20.8 ppg, 10.1 rpg
When does 20 plus 10 equal zero? When you're adding up the contributions of Randolph, whose prolific scoring and rebounding stats are negated by his deficiencies. He's a poor passer, a worse defender and is useless in transition. His last three teams - the Blazers, Knicks and Clippers - have been more than happy to find a taker for his services. Now in Memphis, he'll be paid like a superstar ($33.3 million the next two years), score and rebound like an All-Star, and lose 60 games a year
[h2]Jamal Crawford, G, Atlanta Hawks[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 19.7 ppg, 4.4 apg
Drafted in 2000, the 29-year-old Crawford has produced points everywhere he's gone. In fact, he's one of four players to score at least 50 in a game for three NBA teams. (Wilt Chamberlain, Moses Malone and Bernard King are the others.) Yet in a league where more than half the teams make the playoffs, he's never played a single postseason game. His 597 games without a playoff appearance mark the sixth-longest streak in league history. Some of that is bad luck, of course. But it also might have something to do with Crawford's abysmal shot selection, reluctance to pass and aversion to defense. Grossly overpaid by Isiah Thomas, Crawford's last two teams have been desperate to unload his contract. Now with the Hawks, he should end his playoff drought unless he messes up a good thing in Atlanta.

3
[h2]Al Harrington, F-C, New York Knicks[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 20.7 ppg, 6.3 rpg
Harrington is known for scoring a lot in the first three quarters, then disappearing in crunch time. But his high spot on this list is more about representing all of the guys whose value has been wildly inflated by Mike D'Antoni's system. Harrington is the Knicks' leading scorer, but there's also David Lee, who led the NBA with 66 double-doubles, and Nate Robinson, who averaged 17.2 points off the bench. Lee and Robinson thought their fat stats would earn them fat contracts as free agents, but the league's GMs haven't been fooled by the eye-popping numbers. If only Isiah Thomas were still around to give them $100 million.

4
[h2]Kevin Martin, SG, Sacramento Kings[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 24.6 ppg
Let's not be too harsh on Martin, who deserves credit for a diverse offensive game that includes deadeye accuracy from long range, a sweet midrange game and over 10 free-throw attempts per contest. But despite finishing seventh in the league in scoring, he's no one's idea of an All-Star. At 6-7 and 185 pounds, he's proved to be brittle, missing 52 games the past two seasons. And when he scores 25, the man he's guarding often gets 30

5
[h2]Corey Maggette, F, Golden State Warriors[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 18.6 ppg, 5.5 rpg
Maggette is the epitome of a player who contributes little besides points, points and more points. A good enough athlete to be a lockdown defender, he doesn't play with much intensity on that end of the court and generally coasts through games. A black hole on offense, his numbers are inflated by "Nellieball," but you can say the same about most of the Warriors

6
[h2]Josh Smith, F, Atlanta Hawks[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 15.6 ppg, 7.2 rpg, 1.6 bpg
Few players can fill up a stat sheet like the absurdly athletic Smith, a 6-foot-9, 240-pounder whose vicious dunks and ferocious swats regularly populate the nightly highlights.But he's one of many talented young players around the league who don't do the little things necessary to win games. He doesn't always play hard. He pouts. He complains. He racks up techs. He forces bad shots. At 23, his immaturity may be temporary. But not everyone grows out of a bad attitude

7
[h2]Carlos Boozer, F, Utah Jazz[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 16.2 ppg, 10.4 rpg
Why have most Utah fans soured on Boozer despite his big numbers and two All-Star Game selections over the past five years? Because he hasn't been durable, missing 134 games in that span. Because he's a lousy team leader. Because of his matador defense. And most of all, because he's greedy. Boozer planned to opt out of the last year of his Jazz contract before he realized he wouldn't get more than $12.6 million elsewhere. Even now he's trying to force a trade, but the league-wide consensus is clear: He's not as good as he thinks he is. You can bet he won't be on Team USA in 2012

8
[h2]Marcus Camby, C, Los Angeles Clippers[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 10.3 ppg, 11.1 rpg, 2.1 bpg
Offensive stats aren't the only ones that can be misleading. Camby won the 2007 NBA defensive player of the year award based on his monster block and rebounding totals. But in truth, the slender center is easily overpowered in the post. He gets most of his blocks in weak-side help and frequently takes himself out of good defensive position by going for highlight swats. The Nuggets were criticized for trading Camby to the Clippers before last season, but Denver's defense actually improved in his absence

9
[h2]Vince Carter, SF, Orlando Magic[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 20.8 ppg, 5.1 rpg, 4.7 apg
Though it's been a while since he jumped over a 7-foot Frenchman, the 32-year-old Carter remains among the most extraordinary scorers and athletes in the game. He's averaged at least 20 points for 11 straight seasons, but there's a reason he's never sniffed a championship. When it comes to toughness and competitive intensity, no one's ever confused Carter with his fellow UNC alum, Michael Jordan. The NBA runners-up Magic traded for Carter, presumedly to put them over the hump. But if he keeps launching fadeaway jumpers in crunch time and failing to facilitate as well as the departed Hedo Turkoglu, Orlando may end up taking a big step back

10
[h2]Allen Iverson, G, Free agent[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 17.4 ppg, 4.5 apg
He'd be higher on this list if his stats hadn't taken a nosedive last season in Detroit, but Iverson gets the nod here for career achievement. In NBA history, only Michael Jordan, Wilt Chamberlain and Elgin Baylor have averaged more points per game than Iverson's 27.1. But all of those points, and his admirable toughness, have been undermined by A.I.'s bad qualities. His inability to play well with others. His ball hogging. His poor practice habits - yes, we're talkin' 'bout practice! - and atrocious defense. At 34, he should have a few good years left in him, but there's a reason no team seems interested. Like Pete Maravich, Iverson will be best remembered as an uniquely gifted offensive player but, ultimately, a sideshow, not a winner.
 
10
[h2]Allen Iverson, G, Free agent[/h2]
2008-09 stats: 17.4 ppg, 4.5 apg
He'd be higher on this list if his stats hadn't taken a nosedive last season in Detroit, but Iverson gets the nod here for career achievement. In NBA history, only Michael Jordan, Wilt Chamberlain and Elgin Baylor have averaged more points per game than Iverson's 27.1. But all of those points, and his admirable toughness, have been undermined by A.I.'s bad qualities. His inability to play well with others. His ball hogging. His poor practice habits - yes, we're talkin' 'bout practice! - and atrocious defense. At 34, he should have a few good years left in him, but there's a reason no team seems interested. Like Pete Maravich, Iverson will be best remembered as an uniquely gifted offensive player but, ultimately, a sideshow, not a winner.



Someone on this very board says that all the time about dude.
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With No Offer From Knicks, Sessions To New York Looks Dead
Aug 25, 2009 9:15 PM EST

Alan Hahn writes that the Knicks do not have a standing offer to Ramon Sessions and that the team would only make a long-term commitment to the restricted free-agent if Donnie Walsh is able to move the contract of either Jared Jeffries or Eddy Curry.

Hahn therefore concludes that the Knicks' chances of landing Sessions this summer are remote.

Via Newsday


U DA MAN Donnie
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On Tuesday, we broke down which players we think will have the biggest impact in 2009-10. Today, we ask: Who will be the worst newcomer this season?

Here's the voting breakdown:
[h3]2009-10 predictions: Worst newcomer[/h3]
[table][tr][th=""]RANK[/th] [th=""]PLAYER[/th] [th=""]VOTES[/th] [/tr][tr][td]
1
[/td] [td]
1017.jpg

Zach Randolph
Power forward
Memphis Grizzlies[/td] [td]
Last season
New York/L.A. Clippers
20.8 ppg, 10.1 rpg[/td] [td]
12
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-2
[/td] [td]
25.jpg

Ron Artest
Small forward
Los Angeles Lakers[/td] [td]
Last season
Houston Rockets
17.1 ppg, 5.2 rpg[/td] [td]
6
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-2
[/td] [td]
883.jpg

Rasheed Wallace
Power forward
Boston Celtics[/td] [td]
Last season
Detroit Pistons
12 ppg, 7.4 rpg[/td] [td]
6
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-4
[/td] [td]
2426.jpg

Trevor Ariza
Small forward
Houston Rockets[/td] [td]
Last season
Los Angeles Lakers
8.9 ppg, 4.3 rpg[/td] [td]
4
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-4
[/td] [td]
614.jpg

Shaquille O'Neal
Center
Cleveland Cavaliers[/td] [td]
Last season
Phoenix Suns
17.8 ppg, 8.4 rpg[/td] [td]
4
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-6
[/td] [td]
136.jpg

Vince Carter
Shooting guard
Orlando Magic[/td] [td]
Last season
New Jersey Nets
20.8 ppg, 4.7 apg[/td] [td]
3
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-6
[/td] [td]
862.jpg

Hedo Turkoglu
Small forward
Toronto Raptors[/td] [td]
Last season
Orlando Magic
16.8 ppg, 5.3 rpg[/td] [td]
3
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]Also receiving votes: Tyson Chandler (2), Ben Gordon (2), Emeka Okafor (2), Charlie Villanueva (2), Allen Iverson (1), Dahntay Jones (1), Shawn Marion (1), Quentin Richardson (1), Ben Wallace (1), Paul Westphal (1)[/td] [/tr][/table]
[h3]The skinny[/h3]
Randolph (12 votes)
Normally, when a 20-and-10 guy joins one of the worst teams in the league, it's a good thing. Not in this case, according to a dozen of our voters. Despite his talent, Z-Bo's questionable character would appear to be detrimental to a young Grizzlies squad. Not to mention that he is one of the biggest black holes in basketball and doesn't play defense.

To make matters worse, the Grizzlies took on the remaining two years and $33 million of his contract. Sure, he could earn the Griz a few more wins with his post play, but so could, uh, Pau Gasol (minus the headaches). Just sayin'.

pg2_g_artest_134.jpg


Artest (6 votes)
The thinking here is easy: Why mess with a good thing? The Lakers just won the championship with Trevor Ariza at small forward. Why replace him with one of the most combustible players in the league?

Yes, Artest is an upgrade over Ariza, but his unpredictability on and off the court might become a huge distraction for the Lakers -- one that could jeopardize their chances of a title repeat.

Wallace (6 votes)
The C's need big things from Sheed to contend for a title; many of our voters don't expect him to deliver. His production has plateaued during the past three seasons, and he continues to make a negative impact with his technicals. Playing alongside KG might help Sheed stay interested, but will Wallace embrace his role off the bench for 82 games?

Ariza (4 votes)
After five seasons and three teams, Ariza finally made his mark during the Lakers' title run last season. But whether it's his career 6.9 ppg or the fact that Houston will have a 7-foot-6, 310-pound hole in the paint next season, some of our voters aren't sold on the five-year, $34 million deal the 24-year-old forward signed with the Rockets this offseason.

[h4]NBA OFFSEASON BUZZ[/h4]
nba_offseason_buzz_110.jpg
Who's poised for a big year? Who could be on the decline? We're taking a look at all 30 rosters. Offseason Buzz
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O'Neal (4 votes)
Although eight members of our panel think Shaq could help the King win a ring, four feel Cleveland's big Shaquisition will be a big flop. He may be the most talented running mate LeBron has had, but with 1,100-plus games on his knees and without access to the Suns' miracle training staff, the Big Daddy may revert back to the injury-prone ways that haunted him in Miami.

Carter (3 votes)
Adding an eight-time All-Star to an already successful lineup should make the reigning East champs even better. There is a certain amount of risk here, though. Carter will turn 33 in January, and Orlando will owe him $33 million in salary the next two years. Plus, some say Carter brings potential chemistry issues and could have a negative effect on Orlando's vaunted defense.

Turkoglu (3 votes)
Turkoglu had some big playoff moments in 2009 -- the Kobe block, double-doubles against Cleveland and Boston and daggers in Philly. But the Raptors gave $53 million to a guy who has never made an All-Star team and probably never will. He's a good piece, but remember, elite teams such as San Antonio and Orlando let him walk. There must be a reason, no?




There has been much player movement this offseason, with big names changing teams and conference pecking orders. So, on the second day of our Summer Forecast series, we ask 53 of ESPN's best basketball minds: Who will be the best newcomer this season?

Here's the voting breakdown:
[h3]2009-10 predictions: Best newcomer[/h3]
[table][tr][th=""]RANK[/th] [th=""]PLAYER[/th] [th=""]VOTES[/th] [/tr][tr][td]
1
[/td] [td]
1006.jpg

Richard Jefferson
Small forward
San Antonio Spurs[/td] [td]
Last season
Milwaukee Bucks
19.6 ppg, 4.6 rpg[/td] [td]
14
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
2
[/td] [td]
614.jpg

Shaquille O'Neal
Center
Cleveland Cavaliers[/td] [td]
Last season
Phoenix Suns
17.8 ppg, 8.4 rpg[/td] [td]
8
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-3
[/td] [td]
25.jpg

Ron Artest
Small forward
Los Angeles Lakers[/td] [td]
Last season
Houston Rockets
17.1 ppg, 5.2 rpg[/td] [td]
6
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-3
[/td] [td]
136.jpg

Vince Carter
Shooting guard
Orlando Magic[/td] [td]
Last season
New Jersey Nets
20.8 ppg, 4.7 apg[/td] [td]
6
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-5
[/td] [td]
510.jpg

Shawn Marion
Small forward
Dallas Mavericks[/td] [td]
Last season
Miami/Toronto
12.9 ppg, 8.5 rpg[/td] [td]
3
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-5
[/td] [td]
557.jpg

Andre Miller
Point guard
Portland Trail Blazers[/td] [td]
Last season
Philadelphia 76ers
16.3 ppg, 6.5 apg[/td] [td]
3
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-5
[/td] [td]
862.jpg

Hedo Turkoglu
Small forward
Toronto Raptors[/td] [td]
Last season
Orlando Magic
16.8 ppg, 5.3 rpg[/td] [td]
3
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]
T-5
[/td] [td]
883.jpg

Rasheed Wallace
Power forward
Boston Celtics[/td] [td]
Last season
Detroit Pistons
12 ppg, 7.4 rpg[/td] [td]
3
[/td] [/tr][tr][td]Also receiving votes: Blake Griffin (2), Emeka Okafor (2), Trevor Ariza (1), Jamal Crawford (1), Terrence Williams (1)[/td] [/tr][/table]
[h3]The skinny[/h3]
Jefferson (14 votes)
The first big move of the offseason will prove to be the best move, more than one-quarter of our voters said. RJ is the piece that will get the Spurs back into the West's elite. Jefferson's shooting numbers were down last season with the Bucks, but he shot 40 percent from beyond the arc and still knows how to score. Playing in a winning atmosphere certainly will help matters, too.

Most important, perhaps, is that RJ has been healthy for the past two years -- something the Spurs' big three has not been -- and he's still on the right side of 30. If he proves to be the perfect fit, the Spurs could push the Lakers for the Western Conference crown.

nba_g_shaqts_134.jpg


O'Neal (8 votes)
Witness this: Seven of our voters -- and Cleveland's front office -- are banking on a motivated Shaq to take the Cavs to new heights. Although some wonder whether Shaq can take a backseat to LeBron or handle Dwight Howard come playoff time, there's no question there's still some Diesel left in the tank. Adding his post presence to a team that won 66 games last season without one makes Shaq's mission -- "Win a ring for the King" -- look highly possible.

Artest (6 votes)
To gain this honor, Artest is in a tough spot. When you join the defending champs, there are plenty of opportunities for downward mobility. Ordinary things can derail any title favorite (hello, injuries), perhaps a far more likely event than Ron-Ron Twittering Kobe & Co. into a funk. But with his drive and focus to earn a first title, it could be time to paint the portrait of Artest as a champion.

nba_g_carter1_sw_134.jpg


Carter (6 votes)
All things considered, many of the voters here eventually could rue not hopping onto this bandwagon. Although the "Heir Jordan" references vanished long ago, the numbers indicate Carter will be an upgrade over Turkoglu. So the Magic lose some length? How about VC's many strengths, such as his still-powerful forays to the hoop? Think his solid 3-point accuracy (38.5 percent) with the woeful Nets last season will improve when he plays alongside the best big man in the game?

Marion (3 votes)
Sure, he's coming off his lowest scoring average (12.9 points per game) since his rookie season, but there are three good reasons Marion earned three votes: (1) He should enjoy life in the fast lane again, this time with Jason Kidd running the break; (2) he can still defend multiple positions; and (3) there's no way he can shoot any worse from downtown than he did last season (19 percent).

Miller (3 votes)
The Blazers wanted Turkoglu, but landing Miller might be a blessing in disguise. He gives the team a veteran presence and, more importantly, allows Brandon Roy to play off the ball. Although he can't spread the floor with his 3-point shot, he can get the ball into the hands of those who can shoot it from deep and get the team easy baskets in transition. And if it doesn't work out, Portland can let him walk in two years.

[h4]NBA OFFSEASON BUZZ[/h4]
nba_offseason_buzz_110.jpg
Who's poised for a big year? Who could be on the decline? We're taking a look at all 30 rosters. Offseason Buzz
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Turkoglu (3 votes)
Turkoglu provided the best offseason intrigue when he nearly signed with Portland and then, at the eleventh hour, opted for Toronto. He gives the Raptors a sense of the dramatic on the court, too: His late-game heroics were special in the '09 playoffs. Yes, $53 million is a lot for a guy who shot only 41 percent from the floor (110th in the NBA) and 35 percent from behind the arc (95th) last season, but he'll take some pressure off Chris Bosh and maybe even persuade him to stay.

Wallace (3 votes)
No doubt Wallace needed a change of scenery after five years in Detroit. Boston is probably the perfect place for him now. He'll get to start fresh with a title contender loaded with veterans. Sheed will play a smaller role than he did with the Pistons, but he still needs to get in shape and keep his emotions in check. Either way, he is a considerable upgrade over Mikki Moore.
 
Originally Posted by Mr Kuter

How are all those players on both lists? Am I overlooking some fineprint?

No, those ESPN clowns just don't know what they're talkin about so they say both ways so no matter what they look right.

Don't pay any attention to their list.
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Originally Posted by Mr Kuter

How are all those players on both lists? Am I overlooking some fineprint?


it was a bunch of different people voting so some had different list



Hope the CLips give a big deal to Sessions so LeBron can't sign for the max there.

for the clippers to get bron anyways they would have to trade some players for more cap space
 
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I actually like Z-Bo. But I honestly believe he could care less about winning, since he's gettin' paid.
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Originally Posted by KingJay718

laugh.gif
I actually like Z-Bo. But I honestly believe he could care less about winning, since he's gettin' paid.
laugh.gif
I'm pretty sure he will start caring knowing that his "getting paid" days are coming to an end.
 
Originally Posted by Bigmike23



Hope the CLips give a big deal to Sessions so LeBron can't sign for the max there.

for the clippers to get bron anyways they would have to trade some players for more cap space
Kaman, Bum Dizzle, etc would be those players.
 
Allen Iverson twittered again Wednesday, saying the Grizzlies have made him an offer -- and Memphis says it's true.

Grizzlies general manager Chris Wallace told ESPN.com Wednesday night that negotiations between the sides have heated up to the point where the Grizzlies have made their first formal offer.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=366
"We're heading into the home stretch before the season, and we have had interest in Allen all summer," Wallace said. "We've been in touch on a fairly consistent basis and had dialogue with his agent, Leon Rose, since the beginning of free agency."



[h4]Sheridan: Iverson options[/h4]
sheridan_chris_m.jpg

A number of teams could be interested in former NBA MVP Allen Iverson. Chris Sheridan takes a look. Story http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=366

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=366

Iverson is one of the most high profile, unrestricted free agents remaining on the market, and there were reports in recent days that he was leaning hardest toward reuniting with his old coach, Larry Brown, with the Charlotte Bobcats.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=366
But the Bobcats are for sale and are under severe financial constraints, and Iverson's other strongest suitor -- the Miami Heat -- is already more than $3 million into luxury tax territory and has not been willing thus far to make Iverson a substantial financial offer.

Memphis is approximately $3.5 million under the salary cap for the 2009-10 season and thus could easily outbid Charlotte and Miami for the services of the 10-time All-Star, whom Grizzlies owner Michael Heisley sees as a strong gate attraction.

Wallace would not disclose the size of the offer or what kind of a time table he is on.

"We'll probably add another guard at some point, but we don't need to rush to do it," Wallace said.

Iverson played in only 57 games between Denver and Detroit last season due to injury and averaged a career-low 17.5 points per game.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/profile?playerId=366
Chris Sheridan covers the NBA for ESPN Insider
 
I don't wanna see Iverson in Memphis. I don't know how well an old Iverson/Mayo backcourt would work defensively. Not to mention there's a lot ofyoung guns on Memphis that need their shots to develop. Iverson would take a lot of shots away. I would much rather see him in Miami. Anybody know how muchMiami could actually give Iverson? And no comment on Charlotte...
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It seems like AI and his people had memphis in there back pocket the whole time. nobody else proably gave them a offer they wanted so back to talking withmemphis
 
I feel like AI should go to New York for a year. He can definitely put up numbers on that team and possibly get them to the playoffs (provided they re-signDavid Lee).
 
At this point I'm tired of iverson trying to use memphis. I only want him as a bench option more than a starter. I'm more excited at how the grizzcurrent team will look anyway. Adding carney and flip murray would be alot better.
 
MayhemMonkey000 wrote:
I don't wanna see Iverson in Memphis. I don't know how well an old Iverson/Mayo backcourt would work defensively. Not to mention there's a lot of young guns on Memphis that need their shots to develop. Iverson would take a lot of shots away. I would much rather see him in Miami. Anybody know how much Miami could actually give Iverson? And no comment on Charlotte...
laugh.gif


We can offer the mid and bi level exemptions. Also the L minimum. Miami let Beverley go to Europe for a season so they're in the market for a PG becausethey only have Rio n Quinn as their PG. I have a funny feeling that ai end up in Miami
 
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