**Official '11 NYK LOCKOUT thread*** lockout over

[duba169]

I think Frank is a good option but amare and melo need to actually listen up and not just do whatever they want

 

[al3xis]

like JVG, Frank is just a bizzaro D'Antoni.

all defense, no offense. guy had Jason Kidd in the back end of his prime and only had one year where the offense was not in the bottom 5 of the league (and even then, it was 16th)

go for balance.

Melo and Amare are not two 'figure out yourself' offensive players. at least not to me. they need coaching on that end too to make this thing work.

I saw the 'figure it out' offense squander titles in the 90's. & the opposite hasn't worked, so split the difference IMO.

 

[duba169]

do you have a suggestion? maybe adleman as coach and frank and defensive assistant

 

[|A-Man|]

Originally Posted by THE GR8

Originally Posted by ATGD7154xBBxMZ

I don't think he's coming here and soon we'll semi forget about the threat of him once all available management and coaching positions are filled long term.

Isiah really isn't a terrible coach though

It's just that he was coaching a team he put together here.

Like I said he coached bums he brought to the team. Back when he was GM/Pres it looked like he was sabotaging all the coaches he hired by bringing even more bums to the team.

No surprise when he said he might as well coach himself he didn't even bother to try. In his mind I'm guessing he felt he had the job until he wanted to quit.

If you look at how he coached that Indiana team from 00-03 it wasn't the same iso, no ball movement type of offense or bs defense. He just sucked as a coach in the playoffs for them.

 

[sircharles2ol3]

Sorry I been ghost guys..I'm on vacation in California.. Donnie will be missed as GM.. he's done big things for us.

 

[yeeupp]

Adelman as coach and Frank as defensive assistant sounda good... idk

 

[buc em]

I hope they hire Adelman so D'Antoni can go to Toronto. Would improve both teams.

 

[yeeupp]

For GM, I would rather take Warkenstein, Executive of the yr before.. and Nuggets were very good team at the time.. we don't need any stars .. just complimentary role placers and a bench.


I had a dream last night that Dalembert signed to us.. that's not a dream but I dreamed it lol

 

[the gr8]

Originally Posted by ATGD7154xBBxMZ

Originally Posted by THE GR8

Originally Posted by ATGD7154xBBxMZ

I don't think he's coming here and soon we'll semi forget about the threat of him once all available management and coaching positions are filled long term.

Isiah really isn't a terrible coach though

It's just that he was coaching a team he put together here.

Like I said he coached bums he brought to the team. Back when he was GM/Pres it looked like he was sabotaging all the coaches he hired by bringing even more bums to the team.

No surprise when he said he might as well coach himself he didn't even bother to try. In his mind I'm guessing he felt he had the job until he wanted to quit.

If you look at how he coached that Indiana team from 00-03 it wasn't the same iso, no ball movement type of offense or bs defense. He just sucked as a coach in the playoffs for them.

Not saying its an all-star team or anything, but when you have a roster filled with guys like Marbury, Crawford, QRich, Lee, ZBo, Nate, Curry, etc. its not great by any means but that is certainly enough talent where your only offensive set shouldnt be a one man game with either Curry or Crawford. 
I have always said back when he was on the Knicks that despite being mentally ******ed and a horrible defender Zach Randolph is one of the most versatile scoring 4s in the NBA, i remember i even made a post about that or some %$%+ and people laughed. He can take you inside, he had a sweet jumper for a guy his size, etc. but i always said yes he is a moron and you can t have him play next to a guy like Eddy Curry who is even worse at the things Z Bo doesnt do than ZBo himself.

Now you put Boseph in Memphis next to a center like Marc Gasol who compliments him well, and look at the success that he had this season. Isiah was a !*!+%$@ terrible coach. I mean coaching and being a GM are pretty much correlated when you have both spots because he would make stupid GM moves to the roster BECAUSE he was a bad enough coach wherte he thought it would work.

for example yes it was a GM move getting Zach Randolph over here, but he only made the move because he was a stupid enough coach to believe that Curry/Z Bo would make a dominant front court even when he already had DLee putting in work off the bench....

anyway enough Isiah talk. Im not sold on Adelman, but anyone is better than D'Antoni for me right now... and allen good points on Frank and i guess i could respect that, but i think with all the offensive talent that we have Frank could keep this team as a top 5-10 offensive team (i mean he is a smart Xs and Os kind of guy and how could you not keep this team AT LEAST top 10 in offense), while also bringing us into the top half at least in the league in terms of defense.

Maybe he is not the best candidate but in terms of guys that you consider "proven" aka no Mark Jackson. I think I like Frank over guys like Adelman, etc...

i mean +#!% it lets just do it live...

my dudes served his time enough 

 

[nychiphophippo]

i think herbs an og or some %!*% cuz nobody has the nuts to fire him and it seems like he doesnt contribute anything

i hate mike just as much as anyone here, and he was exposed in the playoffs. but i think we should give mike a training camp and an offseason of knowing who his personnel is to put together plays and utilize their strengths. if there were an "A list" coach on the market id say otherwise but nows mikes first (and only imo) chance to show the players, owner, and fans that his rep of being an offensive genius isnt because he had steve nash. if he flops this year his contract is up and we explore better options than adelman such as van gundy.

 

[nyelectric]

Hey, big bummer obviously. On another note, who's going to sell me an iPhone 4 for a reasonable price?

 

[the wizard]

Chad Ford said that according to multiple sources, Walsh and his crew is still in charge of the Draft & we are down to 5 players.

Thompson, Fredette, Selby, Brooks & Faried

 

[|A-Man|]

Originally Posted by THE GR8

Originally Posted by ATGD7154xBBxMZ

Originally Posted by THE GR8

Like I said he coached bums he brought to the team. Back when he was GM/Pres it looked like he was sabotaging all the coaches he hired by bringing even more bums to the team.

No surprise when he said he might as well coach himself he didn't even bother to try. In his mind I'm guessing he felt he had the job until he wanted to quit.

If you look at how he coached that Indiana team from 00-03 it wasn't the same iso, no ball movement type of offense or bs defense. He just sucked as a coach in the playoffs for them.

Not saying its an all-star team or anything, but when you have a roster filled with guys like Marbury, Crawford, QRich, Lee, ZBo, Nate, Curry, etc. its not great by any means but that is certainly enough talent where your only offensive set shouldnt be a one man game with either Curry or Crawford. 
I have always said back when he was on the Knicks that despite being mentally ******ed and a horrible defender Zach Randolph is one of the most versatile scoring 4s in the NBA, i remember i even made a post about that or some %$%+ and people laughed. He can take you inside, he had a sweet jumper for a guy his size, etc. but i always said yes he is a moron and you can t have him play next to a guy like Eddy Curry who is even worse at the things Z Bo doesnt do than ZBo himself.

Now you put Boseph in Memphis next to a center like Marc Gasol who compliments him well, and look at the success that he had this season. Isiah was a !*!+%$@ terrible coach. I mean coaching and being a GM are pretty much correlated when you have both spots because he would make stupid GM moves to the roster BECAUSE he was a bad enough coach wherte he thought it would work.

for example yes it was a GM move getting Zach Randolph over here, but he only made the move because he was a stupid enough coach to believe that Curry/Z Bo would make a dominant front court even when he already had DLee putting in work off the bench....

anyway enough Isiah talk. Im not sold on Adelman, but anyone is better than D'Antoni for me right now... and allen good points on Frank and i guess i could respect that, but i think with all the offensive talent that we have Frank could keep this team as a top 5-10 offensive team (i mean he is a smart Xs and Os kind of guy and how could you not keep this team AT LEAST top 10 in offense), while also bringing us into the top half at least in the league in terms of defense.

Maybe he is not the best candidate but in terms of guys that you consider "proven" aka no Mark Jackson. I think I like Frank over guys like Adelman, etc...

i mean +#!% it lets just do it live...

my dudes served his time enough 

You seem to already have it in your head that Isiah is a horrible coach because of his time in NY instead of looking at his whole body of work as a coach. I'm not saying he's some amazing coach that deserves accolades but he's definitely not the worst hire out there. Not that I'm saying we should hire him since I already said we shouldn't.

Knicks fans like most die-hard fans of teams seem to have a talent to focus on w/e bad the coach is doing and feel validated especially when the team isn't good. When's the last good coach we even had? Red!? There's a bunch of cons I still remember ppl bringing up for JVG and Pat Riley.

I'm not about to argue all of that revisionist history of Zach Randolph you're spewing. He was a ball hog concentrating on stats so he couldn't get blame for losses. Coupled with the possibility he couldn't handle NYC pressure. When you team a young guy like that with Stephon Marbury who has never proved to be a capable leader it's no surprise even Larry Brown couldn't get that team to win or play coheisvely. QRich always been a bum to me. Miss me on any talk about him. Plus you starting Jamal Crawford

There's no point in wasting time on how Zeke handled that team's offense. I mean what coach is making that team better? Isiah put a bad team together and when he went down on the court to try and coach it he realized how hard he was making it for Lenny Wilkens.

But hey if you're convinced he's a horrible coach, fine. I disagree.

If Herb gets the job I feel that he's being set up just like with Don Chaney.

They'll give him the job and anything short of a championship would have just been him keeping the seat warm for when they pursue Phil Jackson.

 

[johnnyredstorm]

C'mon now, you all know Herb Williams will never be more than an interim head coach in the NBA

And follow me on the twitter @frank_world

 

[pr0phecy718]

^^^ stop spamming lol

 

[johnnyredstorm]

Man if NYelectric could use this thread to cop an iphone on the low, posting my Twitter's aight

 

[buc em]

$@%#%#$ swag 

 

[pr0phecy718]

http://www.nytimes.com/20...rtner=rssnyt&emc=rss

 

[the gr8]

Originally Posted by ATGD7154xBBxMZ

You seem to already have it in your head that Isiah is a horrible coach because of his time in NY instead of looking at his whole body of work as a coach. I'm not saying he's some amazing coach that deserves accolades but he's definitely not the worst hire out there. Not that I'm saying we should hire him since I already said we shouldn't.

Knicks fans like most die-hard fans of teams seem to have a talent to focus on w/e bad the coach is doing and feel validated especially when the team isn't good. When's the last good coach we even had? Red!? There's a bunch of cons I still remember ppl bringing up for JVG and Pat Riley.

I'm not about to argue all of that revisionist history of Zach Randolph you're spewing. He was a ball hog concentrating on stats so he couldn't get blame for losses. Coupled with the possibility he couldn't handle NYC pressure. When you team a young guy like that with Stephon Marbury who has never proved to be a capable leader it's no surprise even Larry Brown couldn't get that team to win or play coheisvely. QRich always been a bum to me. Miss me on any talk about him. Plus you starting Jamal Crawford

There's no point in wasting time on how Zeke handled that team's offense. I mean what coach is making that team better? Isiah put a bad team together and when he went down on the court to try and coach it he realized how hard he was making it for Lenny Wilkens.

But hey if you're convinced he's a horrible coach, fine. I disagree.

If Herb gets the job I feel that he's being set up just like with Don Chaney.

They'll give him the job and anything short of a championship would have just been him keeping the seat warm for when they pursue Phil Jackson.

Look at isiah's past history... ok

dude coached talent loaded PAcers teams in the early 2000s and was held to .500 or so records every season he was there and he was exposed in the playoffs. but lets break those years down...

The year before Isiah got there (2000) the Pacers had 56 wins and lost in the NBA finals... the next season (Isiah's 1st as a head coach) with pretty much the same roster in tact, PLUS a newly signed Jermaine O'Neal, and their 2 best players (Reggie and Jalen Rose) both putting up better #s than the previous year the Pacers dipped to .500 and were bounced in the 1st round of the playoffs.

Than after another season where they also acquired Ron Artest entering his prime (#$!!@%* beast) they had a similar season with a 42-40 record + a first round loss. Than in the net season (Isiah's last in Indiana) with Reggie aging but still effective plus that new core coming together of guys like Jermaine, Artest, etc (which IMO turned into one of the best teams this decade if they all werent a bunch of #$!!@%* thugs and went into the stands) but anyway he had more success picking up 48 wins but they were once again bounced in the 1st round pretty easily by an inferior Celtics team... after Isiah was fired the next season the Pacers won 61 games earning them the Eastern Conference's best record but lost in the ECF to that title winning Pistons squad.

So basically Isiah coached great Pacers teams to near .500 records for 3 seasons when the year before he got there they went to the NBA finals and the year after he left they had the best record in the NBA... im really not impressed.

You cant always go by the #s and see 48 wins and just assume he did a good coaching job. That PAcers team was better than 48 wins and a 1st round playoff exit and they showed it once Isiah was fired. IF you are calling Isiah a "decent" coach even from underachieving with talented teams in Indiana and than doing an abysmal job in NY, i dont care what the +#+! talent he had around him because i watched every game during those 2 seasons and was just mortified by that stagnant $%% offense both seasons, than  dont get what you are basing that off.

I understand when you have limited talent to deal with, but the point that i am making about guys like Zach Randolph is that he brought him in BECAUSE as a coach he believed it would be smart to pai him and Eddy Curry... He thought he could coach that team and have a dominant front court... as a COACH he believed he could run an offense with Eddy Curry as the focal point. As a COACH he thought the best offense that he could run is having Jamal Crawford take the ball up as a point guard and play #$!!@%* streetball.

These are all coaching decisions, not GM/front office moves. those teams certainly were not talented but could have done better with a better coach. The last example of a smart coaching job i can think of is when we made the playoffs in 04. Lenny Wilkins was not given the most talented roster by any means, and Marbury wasnt a PG who was going to take us to the promise land, yet he exploited Marbury's strengths, as well as the other players on the team by running pick/pops with Kurt Thomas who was over the hill but still had that sweet midrange jumper as a strength, allowing Marbury to penetrate the hoop where he is best and either find Kurt if the defense picks him up, take it to the hoop if they back off him, or find Allan Houston (who was really able to do nothing but pop 3s at this point) on the wing for a drive/kick out if Houston's man helped on MArbury. And than he had Nazr Mohammed around the basket for dunks/putbacks. This was not a talented team but Lenny was able to utilize the limited strengths left in all of his players to reach the maximum potential that team had and make the playoffs.

I understand that team didnt have 48 wins like Isiah did in Indiana buyt when you look at coaches you have to look at how they maximize their teams potential more than overall record, and Lenny did just that while Isiah did the oppisite as displayed by the 61 wins the same team picked up the next season with Zeke gone.

Yes, Isiah was a bad GM, but if you watched the Knicks those seasons that he coached it wasnt hard to see that he was just as bad/worse as a coach (because he was at least good at drafting as a GM).

I mean it even showed, D'Antoni was having alot of success with that same exact roster until Donnie gutted them for cap room November 22nd. Z Bo was playing the best basketball of his career to that point and they actually had an effective offense without Eddy Curry. That team was more talented than they showed with Isiah as coach. When you have scoring threats like Jamal, ZBo, Nate, MArbury, Lee, and the only set you run is isolations, thats on the coach... No doubt in my mind if we didnt trade Jamal and ZBo (our 2 leading scorers) on that day we would have been a playoff team in 09, with the same roster Isiah had coached in 08.

So please dont tell me as a Knicks fan i am blinded on only not having success here, because i have followed Isiah very closely and i watched those teams when he was in NY, i didnt just check the box scores. Isiah cannot coach worth #$!!@%* #+*$ and for his name to even be mentioned as the 100th choice for a coaching candidate (not even a GM) for any franchise not named @$!+%$* Florida International University is @$!+%$* moronic but for him to still be mentioned with the New York Knicks, the franchise that he helped run to the ground in every aspect of the word is more #$!!@%* idiotic than wanting to bring Scott Layden back to man the president of basketball operations spot and bring Shannon Anderson back from retirement. I am #$!!@%* sick of hearing Isiah's name be brought up and to give him credit as even a decent head coaching option is ridiculous... imo... just sayin

Chad Ford said that according to multiple sources, Walsh and his crewis still in charge of the Draft & we are down to 5 players.

Thompson, Fredette, Selby, Brooks & Faried
not from what ive been hearing necessarily, word is Darius Morris is also very much in the mix. Apparently the Knicks are really high on him because he is big, athletic, and the only really pure passing PG which fits us better because we already have scorers, also according to nbadraft.net he beat Jimmer in one on one workouts with the Knicks even. Im pretty much fine with that entire list with Brooks being kind of the oddman out yet i wouldnt be so mad if we chose him, i just think i would rather the others and if we are going 2 guard and him and Klay are both available i like Klay more because hes more of a shooter which we need more than a slasher imo because Melo/Stat are both slashers/dominate the ball.

I was wondering if it were possible to draft potentially Faried at 17, because out of all the guys we are looking at imo he is the most unique/fits exactly what we need for next season, but than ALSO try and trade later into the 1st round, maybe buy a pick from a team that does not need theirs especially in a weak draft lets say like OKC who is reportdly shopping their pick and being from a small market they would potentially be down to sell for $, and than try and take Morris/Selby with that pick. That would be perfect IMO because you are fulfilling 2 crucial needs right there without using any of our MLE, and than in FA you go after a center, or even better a center and a 2 guard to come off the bench. than we would be #$!!@%* sett

EDIT: ps we missed out on Mark Jackson, watch the Warriors make some power moves and make the playoffs next season... heard it here 1st

 

[johnnyredstorm]

With our depth issues and the whole trading for CP3 thing, we need to acquire as many draft picks as possible. Whoever's the GM needs to buy a late first rounder and early to mid second rounder. We could get a couple of good (role player) steals with those two picks.

 

[duba169]

reading that article is depressing. We are screwed for years

 

[the gr8]

Originally Posted by DubA169

reading that article is depressing. We are screwed for years

i really dont necessarily feel that. step 1 was getting the stars which Donnie did and now the next step is to assemble the supporters... Give Amare/Melo a tough/savvy floor general, a legit 7 footer, a defensive minded PF, and a shooter or 2 off the bench and this team is the class of the east imo. And while that sounds like a whole lot to aquire with limited cap space it could be done.

Just now because of our limited cap situation the role of GM becomes more important because every move that we make for the next 2 years HAS to be made to fill one of these roles. Meaning that every 1st round draft pick that we get must pan out as a guy who will come in and fill one of those needs, aka no more Jordan Hills or busts. When we sign free agents to the MLE they gotta come and fill one of those roles for years to come as well, aka no Jerome James, Jared Jeffries, and every other free agent signee from 2001-2010

This is why even though we do not have such a high draft pick and this draft is considered "weak" by most experts, i am still placing so much focus and am so worried/anxious/excited for this upcoming draft. because there are guys out there who could potentially fill needs and draft picks are the most effiecient way to do so if possible because they dont effect how much $ we can spend in free agency. Thats why as i said earlier, if we could aquire a late 1st round pick and get a Faried and another one of our targets than i say go for it cause if we could get 2-3 of those role players during this offseason from the draft/MLE alone, things will be looking positive heading forward...

however if our draft pick(s) dont pan out and we get another Jerome James with the MLE this summer... we are royally %+#@@!

 

[big j 33]

Speaking of Mark Jackson, think of it this way... the Knicks got a win-win

Either he fails miserably (as I expect) and spares the Knicks from taking a chance on an unknown... or he's very successful and turns the Warriors around, at which point we offer him a bigger deal to come back to NY.

 

[duba169]

there wont be a MLE

the cheap free agents will be flocking to miami
from everything im reading we are about to have a bunch of shills and yes men puppets in the front office. things are going to get very bad imo

isiah thomas came out and publicly endorsed Grunwald as president and Gabriel and Warkstein and co GM's. everyone will report to O'Neil and everyone is a CAA client

WHY IS ISIAH ENDORSING ANYONE

i $+!#$$@ hate this team so damn much

 

[losalmighty]

Originally Posted by DubA169

reading that article is depressing. We are screwed for years

I think we'll be alright with the new CBA. I find it hard to believe a hard cap of $40MM-$50MM will be set with out rolling back salaries.