**Official '11 NYK LOCKOUT thread*** lockout over

Originally Posted by Ballinsam23

The Knicks are making a play for Omri Casspi. Knicks brass believe Toney Douglas and $3M can get it done.
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Whats with these TD trade proposals...Flynn, Casspi...they seem like washes to me or even worse. Now if we can get Andre Miller somehow, thats a different story. I think I'd be good with keeping TD if all we're going to get is the exact same thing or worse in return.
 
Dantoni trying to get yet another foreign Shooter (-_-). The scary part is im sure he plans on using a frontline of Melo/Caspi/Stat smfh
 
Damn these TD rumors are BS. Would Casspi put Purp out the rotation? Pringles would do it too probably.

Neither Flynn nor Casspi address any weaknesses that we have. Who the eff is calling these shots right now?

I don't think Fields off the bench is necessarily killing his value. I think most teams view him as a 3, just cause of dumb#@* pringles he is able to play the 2 on the offense side in this system and thankfully he's athletic enough to stick with most 2's. If you compare him to other 3's in the L he's coming off the bench for most playoff teams IMO and there shouldn't be any reason why that should be different for us.

Whoever is calling the shots in the front office just needs to clean it the $+%! up right now, this can't be happening. Honestly this feels like Pringles playing GM with these guys being brought up
 
Originally Posted by YEEUPP

Think POR Blazers would do T. Douglas + 17 for Andre Miller ?
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yeah, but why would we?
there shouldn't be any reason why that should be different for us.
reason will be $.

this team can't invest $4-$5 million a year in a back up SF next year -- not if they want to eventually win. Landry either stays at SG or is dealt.
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y would jimmer to NY be any good? get marshon brooks. avoid the PGs.

The knicks need defensive players or big men which lack in this draft but jimmer will just need the ball in his hands too like at BYU. Not enough shots to go up there with melo and stat as it is
 
Fields did a good job "filling in the gaps" when Gallinari and Chandler were on the team. That all changed when the Melo trade occurred. He didn't find ways to play off Melo, plus other teams did a better job scouting him while he hit the rookie wall. With more time, I think Fields can find a way to play off Melo and the others.

If the Knicks draft a SG (Brooks, Thompson, Burks), they should start Fields to compliment the starters because of his defense, rebounding and in general not needing to have the ball in his hands to be effective. Then the rookie SG could be an instant scorer off the bench role. That and eventually taking over for Fields would be the only reasons I can think of as to why the Knicks would draft a SG at #17.
 
I wish we could pull off this trade.

Turiaf/Balkman/Walker/Rautins/#17 to GS for Biedrins and #11

Our best bet will be trying to get a big that a team is trying to unload
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Think POR Blazers would do T. Douglas + 17 for Andre Miller ?
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Why are we trading for a PG older than our current PG?
 
get marshon brooks.

same issue as Jimmer. Maybe even more-so.

ball dominant guys just aren't gona work next to Amare/Melo. Jimmer/Marshon both are.

Rather take Klay over Marshon, he is/can be a catch and shoot guy. Don't think that's in Marshon's game at all at this point.

good players, wrong fit on this team.
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RuffRydya08 wrote:

Whoever is calling the shots in the front office just needs to clean it the $+%! up right now, this can't be happening. Honestly this feels like Pringles playing GM with these guys being brought up

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it does. But these are just rumors. This is the knicks though incompetence at the top shouldn't shock you. I could see dantoni here for a long time. 
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unless klay or bismack are available. we gotta go with best player available, %*%* a need. maybe its just me, but i hate drafting based on a need. i feel like it never works out
 
I think it's all smoke and mirrors. I think we have a good idea of who we want.

Some of these rumors make no sense. Casspi for TD and 3 million? Really? Where is he going to play?
 
I just feel like with STAT and Melo there should be no way way the front office can ##+% things up. I mean they CAN, but they shouldn't be. But I'm gonna guess that Jimmer and trading TD for whoever has been brought up is a pretty damn good start. I don't remember who said but Courtney Lee was brought up before, he would be a great piece IMO.
Melo is signed up for 4 more years, same with Amar'e, IMO this year there has to be real progress made as far as developing pieces to go to war with. This year just proved that chemistry is going to trump talent 9 times out of 10. Even if we put the right pieces around these guys winning whenever the upcoming season starts is going to be asking a lot anyways. If the wrong pieces are brought in this is just gonna stunt the development for another year, which could end up being 2 after the lockout is over. With STAT & Melo the front office can't be dicking around, they need to address weaknesses immediately. As much as I want to say this team has a great 3-4 year period ahead of it what goes down this summer is crucial, even if we do end up trading these pieces for CP3 or whoever, the front office can't ##+% this up.

Not now.
 
if they go with an inside hire they will %*%* the future up imo. Besides warkstein

it seems like the baboon wants yes men and his boy toy instead of legitimate GM
 
And that will be the only way this gets $%+!+% up. If Dolan tries to control this thing.

Mannnnnnn
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Can't even let my head go there right now
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Imagine pissing away your chances when you had Melo + Amar'e? Wow, honestly, I can't, but knowing this organization Jimmy Do is the only guy that could I guess
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Wait, remember when half this board wanted Flynn to fall to us, even over Steph Curry? Now yall hate the dude.

I'd be fine with Jimmer, Jackson, Faried, Biyombo or Klay. Would love to buy as many picks as we can towards the end of the round.
 
Originally Posted by you go boy

first of all trading toney douglas for johnny flynn makes no sense... douglas is definitely better and all the knicks got off the bench... if they trade toney at least get a good point guard like andre miller or somebody with value...and trading up to get jimmer is also dumb... i wouldn't mind picking him up if he falls at 17 our spot but if we trade up we need to get a big man like bismack...our biggest need is the center position and then the 1 and 2 position... id get that guy out of providence too...hes 2nd best in the league in scoring so thats showing something
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Im confused to how we KNOW that douglas is DEFINITLEY better than flynn... this doesnt make much sense to me at all. We KNOW that douglas is better than Flynn because of 2 NBA seasons in which Flynn played in the worst kind of offensive system possible for him with no supporting cast and also injured?

First off Flynn was picked 23 picks higher than TD in the same draft, which has to say at least something, he is also 3 years younger than Toney and we were very high on him and you can bet that if he would have fell 2 picks later the Knicks would have drafted him over J. Hill at 8 and Douglas would have never been a Knick.

I dont get how some of yall are saying that trading Toney for Flynn makes no sense but getting a guy like Andre Miller does. PG for the next year or so is not the issue because we already have Billups on the roster, which is the only reason getting Dre would make sense because hes lasting no longer than Billups really. Our priority is to get a guy who will be ready to take over once Billups is done and IMO and i know the Knicks think so as well it is better off getting a young PG now rather than a year or 2 down the road if we can so they have the chance to ease in to the role as a backup initially, learn from one of our generation's greats in Chauncey, and take over when they are ready to.

Lets face it, Toney is good off the bench but he really has no more ceiling, he is a very poor decision maker, and he will never be a starting PG. The Knicks should get a young PG to try and develop as our future guy in case someone like CP3 or Williams doesnt work out because of the CBA, and Flynn may be the smartest option because although he will come relatively cheap due to his underachieving past 2 seasons, he has a higher ceiling imo than any PG available at 17 outside of maybe Selby, but is safer because he was not drafted as high as he was for no reason and he was put into a triangle offense right away. It would also potentially save us from using a draft pick on  a PG allowing us to address other needs which is good for us because we have so many holes.

Our system would benefit Flynn's athleticism right away, he is a good decision maker, and he is a warrior and a great leader who wont be intimidated come playoff time playing with Melo/Amare. I really feel like alot of yall are underating him/ throwing him under the bus too early in his career. I mean look how easily the Wolves got Beasley this season because he had some issues in Miami and he really tuned around this year. Also Flynn will benefit like no other learning from Billups because his carreer got off to a similar bumpy start and alot of people were counting him out as a bust before he turned around his career and now is a sure hall of famer.

Im not saying Flynn will definitley turn around his career and be our PG of the future... what i AM saying is that he has a much better chance to be than Douglas (obviously) and using that piece to get him is a much better option than getting dues like Sessions, Andre Miller, etc etc who have no ceiling what so ever. Thats why if the deal is Flynn for Douglas, i think it makes perfect sense for both teams, and i say pulll the damn trigger. We gotta take some chances and its not like we can get MUCH better value for TD even if he doesnt pan out as planned. So i really dont see why alot of yall are saying that this deal makes no sense but are instead suggesting going after Andre Miller.

I do agree with you about Jimmer though, although i am totally for drafting him so long as he falls to us at 17 and he is by far the best option. I would be disappointed if we traded up only to take him over a guy like Bismark.

Also, alot of drafts have Kemba falling to as far as #9 to Charlotte. If we could trade up and hes still available what do yall think about drafting him if we can? I am mixed because hes undersized and hes not really a true point plus he controls the ball alot something we really dont need at all with Melo/Stat already but hes a tough NYC kid who could potentially be our PG moving forward and his skill/toughness/grit was meant for NYC/MSG so i thought i would just put out the option...

EDIT: and just to weigh in on the SG discussion, i feel like Fields HAS to be the starter next season no matter what. If he ends last year like he did and than gets benched next season, he is done. He needs to start next year and if he can get back to where he was before (which i think he will once this team starts to click, which naturally takes awhile) or even more hopefully pulls a DLee and improves where he was last season (which ialso think he will because he has the hard working attributed that Lee had and he knows he played like *#%% and he wants to regain the love he lost in NY) it will benefit this team.

I have been saying that it is foolish to give up on him because this team will take awhile to click and he is much better than he played late in the season/playoffs but he reminds me alot of DLee as in he was a 4 year college player, a husstle player, and a low draft pick. Dude is a hard worker he is not finished yet and you can bet like DLee used to he will be living in the gym working on aspects of his game like ball handling and shooting range, defense, etc. NOBODY though Lee had any ceiling when he got here but he worked his *@% off and went from a noboodt, to a hustle player, to our best offensive option and even a spot on jump shooter.

My point it Fields NEEDS to be the starter because not only does he give us the best option imo because he is talented, can hit the open shot, but he is unselfish and will play D which we need when Melo/Stat will control the ball, but also IF he can get back to last season status or even improve we could either keep him as the full time potion at the 2 moving forward but it will ALSO improve his trading value immensely to the point that it was at earlier this season where he almost anchored a Melo deal. Who knows? maybe he could do the same in a CP3 deal... those are all unknowns but to put an end to the Fields project this early in his career after the way he played for 80% of last season would be detremental to Fields' career and our team moving forward.

Any 2 guard we draft should come off the bench initially which is why i am more open to guys like Klay Thompson because he is a spot up shooter which we need with guys like Melo/Stat, or Alec Buirks since he can also play the point and has a higher ceiling, than a Marshon Brooks because while i agree Marshon is a great player, he dominates the rock and is not a distributor like Burks or a shooter like Klay. I see Burks as more of a Jamal Crawford kind of guy which is not by any means bad but not exactly what we should be looking for.
 
Why do yall want Andre Miller?
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Al3xis, you're low balling Fields or w/e sg we might draft in either scenario. Neither of their stocks will drop if they become available for trade. Especially Fields, despite hsi bad 2nd half he's still coming in next season as one of the top sophomores. We'd at least get equal value for dude if not picks for a future good draft. So if he ends up on the bench a team wanting him would just look at it as the Knicks not using him right and think they got the better part of a deal involving him. Also, wouldn't jump on calling dudes like Jimmer or Marshon ball dominant players if they're hypothetically coming to this Knicks team as rookies. No reason they can't continue to expand and mold their game while Melo or STAT are on the bench even if they start off as ball hogs.

As far as these rumors and Pringles playing GM, I think it's Donnie doing w/e he can to help his guy so he doesn't get fired right away. I been watching the draft combines and I'm now noticing he was at every one. He's got his eye on these dudes so if he's thinking of trading up for these offensive players or buying picks that's what he probably has in mind; Pringles' system.
 
Originally Posted by Ballinsam23

unless klay or bismack are available. we gotta go with best player available, %*%* a need. maybe its just me, but i hate drafting based on a need. i feel like it never works out
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Honestly this is exactly my view on the draft this season as a Knicks fan.  I think both of these players will perfectly fit needs for us. However if they are not there then I am fine with the best player available because I am not really enamored with anyone else. 

I do think this draft is important for the team though because of the lack of first round picks over the next few years so we need to at least draft another player who can come in a make an impact like Fields did last year. Hopefully we can buy a late first round or second round pick.

As far as the rumored Flynn for Douglas deal goes. I would pull the trigger....I liked Flynn coming out of college and he still has some upside. I think he would come here and learn under Billups for a year but still have something to prove. I always like having a player with something to prove. I think its worth the gamble to do the deal....Douglas is a nice player but he most likely is what he is already... a career backup.

And please lets stop the Andre Miller talk. Thats a stupid deal that's not happening.  The last thing the Knicks want to do is add age at the PG position.
 
I wanna trade down and get a first next year

Flynn is a undersized pg who is definitely not a shooter. A straight up Flynn for TD is a lopsided trade. The guy averaged 8 ppg in the nbdl

That year I was praying for Curry
 
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