OFFICIAL 2010-2011 NBA PLAYOFFS THREAD : VOL. MOST. ANTICIPATED. PLAYOFFS. EVER?
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by bigmike23,
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that spurs game was insane. glad i caught the 2nd half of the 4th quarter and OT
i fella sleep with denver up 9. surprised to see that they lost. gotta watch that clip.
i fella sleep with denver up 9. surprised to see that they lost. gotta watch that clip.
dacomeup
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Have the media realized that Memphis isn't mentally weak yet?
What happened last night is how our entire season went. Remember that Phoenix/Memphis game where we was basically up and Jason Richardson had a game tying tip in to send it into OT? Tyreke Evans half court shot? If you still think the Spurs are the better team after 5 games, then I don't know what to say.
I would be shocked to see Memphis not come out on fire in Game 6 behind a sellout crowd (the game sold out within 30 minutes). Like I said a few pages back, I expect a double digit win. San Antonio know they got extremely lucky, they even said it in the press conference. This is the main reason why I wanted to end this thing last night. Too much speculation up until game time and all that crap. About that Duncan shot, the Spurs were going back to San Antonio the next game I believe. If Neal did that in Memphis and the Spurs were going back home it would be a different story.
OKB, don't you dare say the Thunder should shop Westbrook. Ibaka is suppose to get one of the most consistent jumpers in the league to make him effective and there is no way Westbrook/Durant won't work. More and more people are starting to see what I was seeing two years ago. I'm starting to feel like CP
DBD sent me a PM too:
What happened last night is how our entire season went. Remember that Phoenix/Memphis game where we was basically up and Jason Richardson had a game tying tip in to send it into OT? Tyreke Evans half court shot? If you still think the Spurs are the better team after 5 games, then I don't know what to say.
I would be shocked to see Memphis not come out on fire in Game 6 behind a sellout crowd (the game sold out within 30 minutes). Like I said a few pages back, I expect a double digit win. San Antonio know they got extremely lucky, they even said it in the press conference. This is the main reason why I wanted to end this thing last night. Too much speculation up until game time and all that crap. About that Duncan shot, the Spurs were going back to San Antonio the next game I believe. If Neal did that in Memphis and the Spurs were going back home it would be a different story.
OKB, don't you dare say the Thunder should shop Westbrook. Ibaka is suppose to get one of the most consistent jumpers in the league to make him effective and there is no way Westbrook/Durant won't work. More and more people are starting to see what I was seeing two years ago. I'm starting to feel like CP
DBD sent me a PM too:
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The amount of nonsense on this board the past couple days is hilarious. Trade one of the best young players in the world who is 22? Yeah, Ok...IF y'all dudes didn't notice they just beat a pretty decent Denver team in 5 games. If having Russy go nut at times is your biggest potential issue going forward, well than that's a great potential issue to have cause it is quite fixable.
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I dont ever complain about calls but 3 really stood out to me :
1) Half court on Battier where him & duncan ( ithink) tripped over each other while a 2 on 1 was going on ahead of them.
2) Clear as day block by Gasol on Ginobili near the end of the game
3) Parker bumrushing Conley and getting the call
Props to the Spurs though they did everything they had to do to win the game.. Wont get the benefit of the doubt in Memphis though
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Ok...we will let the team stay complacent and think this isn't a problem at all. Westbrook going nuts isn't their only issue either. They still need a big thats respectable on the offensive end. I don't know why people keep ignoring that and then go on to think Ibaka will just become some good offensive player.
If Westbrook and Durant can pull a Jordan and Pippen, then I'll give them all the glory. But, I bet teams with a more balanced attack are very capable of beating them in a series whether its Portland, Memphis, LA and maybe even Dallas. The only way I'll call them the clear cut best team out West is if Westbrook/Durant show they can be just as good as that Chicago duo or they get a big man that can do work offensively.
Until then, I'm going to continue to doubt their dominance. I'm not saying they don't have the talent or the superstar in Durant, but its whether the other talent on the team can continue to mesh the right way. IF this continues, they are better off trading Westbrook for a package of Love/Rubio.
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I can't wait to download and re-watch the game.Originally Posted by henz0
@ DBD
I dont ever complain about calls but 3 really stood out to me :
1) Half court on Battier where him & duncan ( ithink) tripped over each other while a 2 on 1 was going on ahead of them.
2) Clear as day block by Gasol on Ginobili near the end of the game
3) Parker bumrushing Conley and getting the call
Props to the Spurs though they did everything they had to do to win the game.. Wont get the benefit of the doubt in Memphis though
DBD was right about the third quarter of game four but that was the first time all series the calls went the Grizzlies' way for an extended period of time.
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Zyzz wrote:
When did you start pulling for the Spurs or you just want Memphis to lose to make you look smarter?
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and go after what exactly?
the only trade i consider is russell + perk (and anyone outside of KD, harden, ibaka and i guess maynor) for dwight howard.. that's it (and of course dwight has to sign long term)
and please when talking about westbrook remember his age + his lack of experience playing the PG position
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Ibaka, is 21, KD & Russ are 22...They are getting better still. Once again half this board has just been rambling *%*% out there *$+ the past two days, playoff basketball makes y'all lose your minds. A guy could score 60 one game half y'all dudes would call him Jordan, the next game a guy could struggle and ya'll would be calling for him to be traded for Steve Blake or some *%*%
D
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Originally Posted by Seymore CAKE
Originally Posted by PO2345
Originally Posted by The Bad Guy
I thought it might have been just me but yeah those were the words.
He dead @+% had thebefore KD went to the line on the And 1.
Someone please upload that sequence & Durant quote!
Westbrook really wanted the ball!
PO
That.
They put a pretty big guy on him fronting and denying him and I had a smallish guy on me, about 5-9 guard and I'm 5'11 200 (mind you, this was back when I was a pretty complete player and in my athletic prime, I could slash, bang 3s, putbacks, post up, jump over folks, had healthy knees....dunk etc)
So I camp out on the right block, get the ball straight from the inbound at half court, take one dribble, two dribbles, shimmy to my right, turn middle, launch up a turnaround fadeaway, had my leg kicked out, over the defender (had me feeling like MJ
Anyways, I had my Jordan fist pump going, everyone on my team was going nuts, except for the 6-6 guy. He was TICKED he did not get the ball. Guy wouldn't even look at me, let alone give me a high five or chest bump
Very Westbrook and Durant-esque
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Wait...what Durant quote?
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Originally Posted by PO2345
Durant is a GROWN @@* MAN!
Westbrook was looking at him like, "Is this real life?"
PO
I was watching it like "Is This Real Life?!?!"
KD was geekin for respect
Spoiler [+]
These playoffs are all about surprises, aren't they? Even when the "favorite" wins, as San Antonio did in dramatic fashion last night to stay alive against eighth-seeded Memphis, the way they do it leaves us slack-jawed.
A year ago, only the most hard-core of basketball fans knew who Gary Neal was. I was not among them. After toiling in obscurity in Europe, he got an invite to San Antonio's summer league team. He decided to cancel his honeymoon so he could attend, and the rest is history. (One presumes Mr. and Mrs. Neal will get a bit more leisure time this summer.)
Neal destroyed the Las Vegas summer league, earned a contract from the Spurs, had a solid rookie year and kept the Cinderella story going by keeping San Antonio's season alive Wednesday night.
No, not Timmy, not Tony and not Manu. Gary Neal.
His 3-pointer off the dribble at the regulation buzzer was the only thing standing between the Spurs and a long summer of reflection and, perhaps, rebuilding. While one can reasonably castigate Memphis for its defensive choices on that possession, the fact remains Neal hit an amazing shot in the most pressure-filled of situations.
And that's not the only shot he's made. The rook has had a very solid series, averaging 17.7 points per 40 minutes and, unexpectedly, adding 5.9 boards, against a tough defensive team from Memphis. And he's not taking shots off anyone else's plate, either -- he has one turnover the entire series.
Add in our shock at that season-saving shot, and Neal, for the moment, tops our list of playoff surprises.
Here's a look at some other players who have been revelations with their play in the first round:
Crawford
Jamal Crawford, Atlanta
Crawford is 6-foot-6, and the Orlando guards who have been checking him are not, a combination which has made it very easy for him to get off his jump shot and ignite an otherwise-moribund Atlanta offense. Among players seeing at least 20 minutes a game, Crawford is seventh in playoff player efficiency rating. Look at the list, and its six super-duper stars: Chris Paul, LeBron James, Kevin Durant, Dwyane Wade, Dwight Howard and Derrick Rose … and then Crawford.
In a series in which hardly anyone else can score, he's putting up 27.9 points per 40 minutes. He's shooting 51.9 percent on 3s, averaging six free throw attempts per game (a ton for him) and even spreading the wealth a bit with more than three assists per game. If the Hawks end up completing their first-round upset of Orlando on Thursday night, a leading reason will be all the jumpers Crawford was able to uncork over smaller Orlando defenders.
Stojakovic
Kidd
Jason Kidd and Peja Stojakovic, Dallas
These two are old enough to remember when Texas was its own country, but they're a big reason Dallas is ahead against Portland. Between them they've made 26 of the 40 Dallas 3-pointers, on just 61 attempts; that's a 42.6 percent conversion rate. Each has a true shooting percentage in the 60s and each has a PER several points higher than his regular-season output.
Kidd, in fact, ranks third among all point guards at 22.40; in addition to his shooting, he's pitched in on the boards and has 33 assists against just nine turnovers. Dallas might need one more throwback game from this duo to get out of the first round, but as long as Dirk Nowitzki and Jason Terry keep getting them easy catch-and-shoot opportunities, they should be up to the task.
Allen
Ray Allen, Boston
Yes, Rajon Rondo was great in Round 1. But we expected that. Allen was mired in a slump over the final quarter of the season, so his re-emergence in the New York series is by far the bigger story. Allen memorably hit the game winner in Game 1 but he was on fire the whole series -- an absurd 17-of-26 on 3-pointers, plus he made every free throw and shot 50 percent on 2s. Allen's 23.79 PER ranks 10th among all playoff performers.
Allen's play also underscored a great divide that has to have Celtics fans concerned. Boston's four All-Stars posted PERs of at least 18 in the New York series, but their other four rotation players were awful -- Glen Davis (6.56), Jermaine O'Neal (11.54), Delonte West (3.52) and Jeff Green (4.19) will need to provide much more against Miami.
Ibaka
Serge Ibaka, Oklahoma City
While Wednesday night wasn't a great showcase of Ibaka's offensive skills -- he had five turnovers despite hardly touching the ball -- the series as a whole was a spectacular display of his talents. "I-block-a" sent back an estimated 12.4 percent of the 2-point attempts by the Nuggets in the series, according to Basketball-Reference.com, turning aside 24 shots in five games. None were bigger than his two at-the-basket denials when the Thunder led by nine with fewer than four minutes left on Wednesday. Take those away, and it's game over; no amount of Durant heroics would have mattered.
And for the series, Ibaka played some decent offense, too. He made 17 of his 20 free throws, hit enough midrange J's to keep defenders honest and finished with a respectable 10 points a game. Throw in his domination on the glass (a spectacular 19.3 rebound rate) and he was a huge reason the Thunder can chill out for a few days waiting on the winner of the San Antonio-Memphis series.
Turner
Evan Turner, Philadelphia
The Sixers didn't advance, but they have to be impressed by how Turner held up against the two best wing players in the game. Turner had a rocky rookie season but played confidently and effectively against the Heat's superstars. Amazingly, he didn't have a turnover the entire series and he hit four of his five 3-point attempts. He also averaged 9.5 boards per 40 minutes and narrowly missed leading the team in PER for the series.
The next step is drawing some fouls -- he took only two free throws in five games. But his playoffs performance was a wholesale improvement on how he looked in the regular season, and the Sixers will have their fingers crossed that it's an omen for next year.
Vogel
Frank Vogel, Indiana
One of the more pleasant postseason surprises was how competitive the Pacers were against Chicago; despite losing in five games, each of the first four went down to the wire. Indiana's fight was impressive and even if it doesn't get Vogel a permanent gig in Indy it's likely to put him on the short list for other open positions.
Indy was 20-18 under Vogel to close the regular season, and while the players obviously deserve credit, too (Danny Granger, in particular, had a great series), Vogel was the biggest surprise.
Noah
Joakim Noah, Chicago
Noah had a fantastic start to the season but struggled to regain his timing and effectiveness when he returned from injury after the All-Star break. It appears he rediscovered his mojo in the Indiana series. Noah had three double-doubles in five games, averaging a board every three minutes for the series and providing much of the rebounding advantage that, in turn, was the main reason the Bulls knocked off Indiana (Chicago grabbed a ridiculous 36.8 percent of its missed shots on the series).
Noah also rejected 13 shots, made his free throws and provided a useful relief valve when the Pacers doubled Derrick Rose -- most notably when he found Kyle Korver (himself a pleasant postseason surprise) for a crucial 3-pointer late in Game 2.
Ariza
Trevor Ariza, New Orleans
Ariza still appears to have no concept of what is a good shot and what isn't, and in that sense he's been no surprise at all -- he had a 48.8 TS% in the regular season and a 48.7 TS% in the playoffs. Yes, that's awful.
Here's the thing, though: Ariza has been so good in other areas that he's still been a highly valuable player. His defense against Kobe Bryant has been as solid as one can reasonably expect. His help on the boards has been crucial. Although the Hornets are getting outrebounded overall, it would be much worse without his 11.0 rebound rate from the small forward spot. And with 15 assists against just five turnovers, he's at least taking care of the ball. Sure, we'd like to see him use better judgment -- those off-the-dribble 18-footers with 17 on the shot clock aren't helpful. But overall, he's had a very strong series.
Mayo
Battier
Vasquez
Arthur
Memphis' bench
Yes, Zach Randolph and Marc Gasol are having big series, but the big reason Memphis has a 3-2 lead that could just as easily be 5-0 is because, Neal's shot last night excepted, the Grizzlies' unheralded subs have outplayed San Antonio's.
We'll start with Darrell Arthur, who is still way below the radar, despite my pushing him for Most Improved Player. Believe it or not, he has the best PER of any player in the series born north of the equator. He's 19-of-34 from the field, thanks to a deadly midrange jumper, and defensively has swatted eight shots in just 85 minutes.
But it's not just Arthur. Greivis Vasquez? Que? Believe it. The backup point guard was supposed to be a liability, but he had 14 points and 10 assists in his 38 minutes. He and Arthur, in fact, keyed the run that turned Game 3 into a blowout.
On the wings, Shane Battier may have fallen asleep on Neal's 3-pointer but he also hit the game winner in Game 1 and, surprisingly, has made two-thirds of his 2-point shots in addition to his usual dollop of steady team defense. While O.J. Mayo has struggled in other areas, he's made half his 3-pointers to provide a bit of spacing to an otherwise hopelessly congested Memphis attack.
As a result, despite Neal's heroics, the Griz are still well-positioned to pull off a shocking first-round upset … which would unquestionably provide the biggest of the many surprises in this opening playoff round.
A year ago, only the most hard-core of basketball fans knew who Gary Neal was. I was not among them. After toiling in obscurity in Europe, he got an invite to San Antonio's summer league team. He decided to cancel his honeymoon so he could attend, and the rest is history. (One presumes Mr. and Mrs. Neal will get a bit more leisure time this summer.)
Neal destroyed the Las Vegas summer league, earned a contract from the Spurs, had a solid rookie year and kept the Cinderella story going by keeping San Antonio's season alive Wednesday night.
No, not Timmy, not Tony and not Manu. Gary Neal.
His 3-pointer off the dribble at the regulation buzzer was the only thing standing between the Spurs and a long summer of reflection and, perhaps, rebuilding. While one can reasonably castigate Memphis for its defensive choices on that possession, the fact remains Neal hit an amazing shot in the most pressure-filled of situations.
And that's not the only shot he's made. The rook has had a very solid series, averaging 17.7 points per 40 minutes and, unexpectedly, adding 5.9 boards, against a tough defensive team from Memphis. And he's not taking shots off anyone else's plate, either -- he has one turnover the entire series.
Add in our shock at that season-saving shot, and Neal, for the moment, tops our list of playoff surprises.
Here's a look at some other players who have been revelations with their play in the first round:
Crawford
Jamal Crawford, Atlanta
Crawford is 6-foot-6, and the Orlando guards who have been checking him are not, a combination which has made it very easy for him to get off his jump shot and ignite an otherwise-moribund Atlanta offense. Among players seeing at least 20 minutes a game, Crawford is seventh in playoff player efficiency rating. Look at the list, and its six super-duper stars: Chris Paul, LeBron James, Kevin Durant, Dwyane Wade, Dwight Howard and Derrick Rose … and then Crawford.
In a series in which hardly anyone else can score, he's putting up 27.9 points per 40 minutes. He's shooting 51.9 percent on 3s, averaging six free throw attempts per game (a ton for him) and even spreading the wealth a bit with more than three assists per game. If the Hawks end up completing their first-round upset of Orlando on Thursday night, a leading reason will be all the jumpers Crawford was able to uncork over smaller Orlando defenders.
Stojakovic
Kidd
Jason Kidd and Peja Stojakovic, Dallas
These two are old enough to remember when Texas was its own country, but they're a big reason Dallas is ahead against Portland. Between them they've made 26 of the 40 Dallas 3-pointers, on just 61 attempts; that's a 42.6 percent conversion rate. Each has a true shooting percentage in the 60s and each has a PER several points higher than his regular-season output.
Kidd, in fact, ranks third among all point guards at 22.40; in addition to his shooting, he's pitched in on the boards and has 33 assists against just nine turnovers. Dallas might need one more throwback game from this duo to get out of the first round, but as long as Dirk Nowitzki and Jason Terry keep getting them easy catch-and-shoot opportunities, they should be up to the task.
Allen
Ray Allen, Boston
Yes, Rajon Rondo was great in Round 1. But we expected that. Allen was mired in a slump over the final quarter of the season, so his re-emergence in the New York series is by far the bigger story. Allen memorably hit the game winner in Game 1 but he was on fire the whole series -- an absurd 17-of-26 on 3-pointers, plus he made every free throw and shot 50 percent on 2s. Allen's 23.79 PER ranks 10th among all playoff performers.
Allen's play also underscored a great divide that has to have Celtics fans concerned. Boston's four All-Stars posted PERs of at least 18 in the New York series, but their other four rotation players were awful -- Glen Davis (6.56), Jermaine O'Neal (11.54), Delonte West (3.52) and Jeff Green (4.19) will need to provide much more against Miami.
Ibaka
Serge Ibaka, Oklahoma City
While Wednesday night wasn't a great showcase of Ibaka's offensive skills -- he had five turnovers despite hardly touching the ball -- the series as a whole was a spectacular display of his talents. "I-block-a" sent back an estimated 12.4 percent of the 2-point attempts by the Nuggets in the series, according to Basketball-Reference.com, turning aside 24 shots in five games. None were bigger than his two at-the-basket denials when the Thunder led by nine with fewer than four minutes left on Wednesday. Take those away, and it's game over; no amount of Durant heroics would have mattered.
And for the series, Ibaka played some decent offense, too. He made 17 of his 20 free throws, hit enough midrange J's to keep defenders honest and finished with a respectable 10 points a game. Throw in his domination on the glass (a spectacular 19.3 rebound rate) and he was a huge reason the Thunder can chill out for a few days waiting on the winner of the San Antonio-Memphis series.
Turner
Evan Turner, Philadelphia
The Sixers didn't advance, but they have to be impressed by how Turner held up against the two best wing players in the game. Turner had a rocky rookie season but played confidently and effectively against the Heat's superstars. Amazingly, he didn't have a turnover the entire series and he hit four of his five 3-point attempts. He also averaged 9.5 boards per 40 minutes and narrowly missed leading the team in PER for the series.
The next step is drawing some fouls -- he took only two free throws in five games. But his playoffs performance was a wholesale improvement on how he looked in the regular season, and the Sixers will have their fingers crossed that it's an omen for next year.
Vogel
Frank Vogel, Indiana
One of the more pleasant postseason surprises was how competitive the Pacers were against Chicago; despite losing in five games, each of the first four went down to the wire. Indiana's fight was impressive and even if it doesn't get Vogel a permanent gig in Indy it's likely to put him on the short list for other open positions.
Indy was 20-18 under Vogel to close the regular season, and while the players obviously deserve credit, too (Danny Granger, in particular, had a great series), Vogel was the biggest surprise.
Noah
Joakim Noah, Chicago
Noah had a fantastic start to the season but struggled to regain his timing and effectiveness when he returned from injury after the All-Star break. It appears he rediscovered his mojo in the Indiana series. Noah had three double-doubles in five games, averaging a board every three minutes for the series and providing much of the rebounding advantage that, in turn, was the main reason the Bulls knocked off Indiana (Chicago grabbed a ridiculous 36.8 percent of its missed shots on the series).
Noah also rejected 13 shots, made his free throws and provided a useful relief valve when the Pacers doubled Derrick Rose -- most notably when he found Kyle Korver (himself a pleasant postseason surprise) for a crucial 3-pointer late in Game 2.
Ariza
Trevor Ariza, New Orleans
Ariza still appears to have no concept of what is a good shot and what isn't, and in that sense he's been no surprise at all -- he had a 48.8 TS% in the regular season and a 48.7 TS% in the playoffs. Yes, that's awful.
Here's the thing, though: Ariza has been so good in other areas that he's still been a highly valuable player. His defense against Kobe Bryant has been as solid as one can reasonably expect. His help on the boards has been crucial. Although the Hornets are getting outrebounded overall, it would be much worse without his 11.0 rebound rate from the small forward spot. And with 15 assists against just five turnovers, he's at least taking care of the ball. Sure, we'd like to see him use better judgment -- those off-the-dribble 18-footers with 17 on the shot clock aren't helpful. But overall, he's had a very strong series.
Mayo
Battier
Vasquez
Arthur
Memphis' bench
Yes, Zach Randolph and Marc Gasol are having big series, but the big reason Memphis has a 3-2 lead that could just as easily be 5-0 is because, Neal's shot last night excepted, the Grizzlies' unheralded subs have outplayed San Antonio's.
We'll start with Darrell Arthur, who is still way below the radar, despite my pushing him for Most Improved Player. Believe it or not, he has the best PER of any player in the series born north of the equator. He's 19-of-34 from the field, thanks to a deadly midrange jumper, and defensively has swatted eight shots in just 85 minutes.
But it's not just Arthur. Greivis Vasquez? Que? Believe it. The backup point guard was supposed to be a liability, but he had 14 points and 10 assists in his 38 minutes. He and Arthur, in fact, keyed the run that turned Game 3 into a blowout.
On the wings, Shane Battier may have fallen asleep on Neal's 3-pointer but he also hit the game winner in Game 1 and, surprisingly, has made two-thirds of his 2-point shots in addition to his usual dollop of steady team defense. While O.J. Mayo has struggled in other areas, he's made half his 3-pointers to provide a bit of spacing to an otherwise hopelessly congested Memphis attack.
As a result, despite Neal's heroics, the Griz are still well-positioned to pull off a shocking first-round upset … which would unquestionably provide the biggest of the many surprises in this opening playoff round.
Spoiler [+]
Question: Which playoff team most needs to blow things up and rebuild, the Orlando Magic or the San Antonio Spurs?
BROUSSARD: When you're a top playoff seed year after year, it's vital that you recognize when your team has reached the end of its run. If you've won a championship, it's understandable if you get sentimental with your core guys and keep them a bit longer than you should. But if your run has been title-less, you shouldn't hesitate to retool.
When I look at this year's top four seeds in each conference, I see five teams that will fall further away from a title next season because of either decline or stagnation -- the Boston Celtics, Orlando Magic, San Antonio Spurs, Dallas Mavericks and Los Angeles Lakers.
Boston and the Lakers could get back to where they are by adding the right role players. Dallas makes good but not great changes every year and is not in danger of losing its superstar, Dirk Nowitzki. And San Antonio's reloading effort should come in the summer of 2012 when the contracts of Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess expire. The way I see it, Orlando is the most desperate team of this bunch, because the failure to make the proper moves could result in the Magic losing Dwight Howard.
BUCHER: I'm not sure how many seasons there have been in which the second overall seed in the NBA has been in need of an immediate overhaul, but this is one of them. The San Antonio Spurs, if they want to get back to their championship-contending ways, have to face the harsh reality that their Big Three core -- Tim Duncan, Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker -- is not good enough and will not be good enough going forward to lift a fifth Larry O'Brien trophy. They posted their strong regular-season record because of the selflessness of their stars and the craftiness and flexibility of coach Gregg Popovich, who devised a penetrate-and-kick game with just enough post work by Duncan to thump every team not as good as them, almost without fail, and to beat a fair number of the teams better than them. In the regular season.
But they did it with a style -- playing fast and shooting 3s to hide a mediocre defense -- that they knew was not crafted to win a title. But what were they going to do? Play their old style, scratch into the playoffs and not be good enough anyway? I believe they did that the previous two seasons. They made the best of what they had this season and there's no shame in that. Still, it's clear that the time has come for them to rebuild.
CB: While hiring Doc Rivers as coach might keep Howard in town, I won't go there because Magic CEO Bob Vander Weide recently told the Orlando Sentinel that Stan Van Gundy will definitely return next season. Plus, Doc, whose family lives in Orlando, is likely to take a season off.
The dream scenario for the team is to get Chris Paul to come to Orlando. That would keep Howard there and perhaps propel the Magic to the top of the East. That won't be easy, because the Magic have few desirable assets outside of Howard and two horrible contracts for Gilbert Arenas (3 years, $60 million left after this season) and Hedo Turkoglu (3 years, $34 million left). But GM Otis Smith needs to do everything in his power to put together the type of three- or four-team deal that could bring Paul to Orlando. Jameer Nelson would obviously be one player moved in such a deal.
RB: What can the Spurs do now? Changing out pieces around the Big Three has been done, several seasons in a row now, without success. Somebody from the core has to go. If GM R.C. Buford and Popovich were the steely pragmatists that the late Bill Walsh was, one or more of them already would've been moved. Then again, San Francisco and the 49ers in their heyday were a little more of a free-agent magnet than San Antonio, so it's understandable if the Spurs stand by Duncan and Ginobili, who took less on one or more of their last deals to stay in silver and black.
Now, Tony Parker in a different jersey? Odd, but not inconceivable, and that's where they have to start. And this is in no way to discredit what TP has contributed to the Spurs. It's simply that he's not enough of a playmaker at point guard to raise the level of those around him. Nor does he have enough size to dominate his position at both ends of the court and create mismatches -- at least the kind of mismatches the Spurs now need from their third star with Duncan's star dimming. But as a quick, scoring point guard in an era that sees them flourishing, he has to have some value on the trade market -- and maybe just enough to ratchet the Spurs back up a few notches to put them back in the title conversation.
CB: If the Magic can't get Paul, they can target Rudy Gay. Memphis has been able to succeed without Gay and may now be open to moving him next season (not saying that the Grizzlies are better without him). Again, it would likely take a three- or four-team deal since Memphis has no need for Nelson and won't want Turkoglu and -- especially -- Arenas.
I admit that retooling Orlando will not be easy -- not even close. Arenas and Turkoglu are as close to untradable as it gets. But history has proven that no player or contract is absolutely unmovable. It's up to Smith to beat the bushes and find teams willing to take on some of his dead weight.
Otherwise, unless Arenas makes a miraculous return to old form, the Magic will remain stuck in the middle of the Eastern Conference playoff race next season, and perhaps lose the ultimate prize (Howard) to free agency in the summer that follows.
RB: Little-known fact: Duncan can opt out of his contract this summer. If he were willing to opt out of next season's $21 million deal and re-sign for a longer-term contract at a per-year number more reflective of his current ability, San Antonio actually could pick up a midrange free agent, depending on cap parameters under the next CBA.
So, San Antonio's building blocks are cap room for a complementary or up-and-coming free agent, and Parker. The needs? Well, if George Hill can step into the starting point-guard role -- and I believe he can -- then the list starts with a backup point guard and Robert Horry-type power forward. Slight problem: No long, stretch 4s are readily available. The young lightning-in-a-bottle candidates are Shawne Williams of the New York Knicks and the Grizzlies' Darrell Arthur. It's hard to see how Memphis can re-sign Marc Gasol and keep Arthur. (Or, could San Antonio possibly convince Gasol to head south if the new CBA makes it prohibitive for the Grizzlies to keep him? In that case, Duncan becomes the stretch 4.) Williams is a free agent who made $884,000 this year.
Both Arthur and Williams, presumably, would jump at the chance to start and get prime minutes next to Duncan. Would the Knicks move Toney Douglas, Williams and Ronny Turiaf for Parker, even though they've already re-upped Billups for one more season? It's worth finding out. I've never been big on concocting fantasy trades, but I'm doing so here to illustrate the kind of dice roll and infusion of youth the Spurs desperately need. Don't look at the win-loss record. Look at how and where the Memphis Grizzlies are preying on their weaknesses -- weaknesses that will only increase, not lessen, if not addressed before next season.
BROUSSARD: When you're a top playoff seed year after year, it's vital that you recognize when your team has reached the end of its run. If you've won a championship, it's understandable if you get sentimental with your core guys and keep them a bit longer than you should. But if your run has been title-less, you shouldn't hesitate to retool.
When I look at this year's top four seeds in each conference, I see five teams that will fall further away from a title next season because of either decline or stagnation -- the Boston Celtics, Orlando Magic, San Antonio Spurs, Dallas Mavericks and Los Angeles Lakers.
Boston and the Lakers could get back to where they are by adding the right role players. Dallas makes good but not great changes every year and is not in danger of losing its superstar, Dirk Nowitzki. And San Antonio's reloading effort should come in the summer of 2012 when the contracts of Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess expire. The way I see it, Orlando is the most desperate team of this bunch, because the failure to make the proper moves could result in the Magic losing Dwight Howard.
BUCHER: I'm not sure how many seasons there have been in which the second overall seed in the NBA has been in need of an immediate overhaul, but this is one of them. The San Antonio Spurs, if they want to get back to their championship-contending ways, have to face the harsh reality that their Big Three core -- Tim Duncan, Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker -- is not good enough and will not be good enough going forward to lift a fifth Larry O'Brien trophy. They posted their strong regular-season record because of the selflessness of their stars and the craftiness and flexibility of coach Gregg Popovich, who devised a penetrate-and-kick game with just enough post work by Duncan to thump every team not as good as them, almost without fail, and to beat a fair number of the teams better than them. In the regular season.
But they did it with a style -- playing fast and shooting 3s to hide a mediocre defense -- that they knew was not crafted to win a title. But what were they going to do? Play their old style, scratch into the playoffs and not be good enough anyway? I believe they did that the previous two seasons. They made the best of what they had this season and there's no shame in that. Still, it's clear that the time has come for them to rebuild.
CB: While hiring Doc Rivers as coach might keep Howard in town, I won't go there because Magic CEO Bob Vander Weide recently told the Orlando Sentinel that Stan Van Gundy will definitely return next season. Plus, Doc, whose family lives in Orlando, is likely to take a season off.
The dream scenario for the team is to get Chris Paul to come to Orlando. That would keep Howard there and perhaps propel the Magic to the top of the East. That won't be easy, because the Magic have few desirable assets outside of Howard and two horrible contracts for Gilbert Arenas (3 years, $60 million left after this season) and Hedo Turkoglu (3 years, $34 million left). But GM Otis Smith needs to do everything in his power to put together the type of three- or four-team deal that could bring Paul to Orlando. Jameer Nelson would obviously be one player moved in such a deal.
RB: What can the Spurs do now? Changing out pieces around the Big Three has been done, several seasons in a row now, without success. Somebody from the core has to go. If GM R.C. Buford and Popovich were the steely pragmatists that the late Bill Walsh was, one or more of them already would've been moved. Then again, San Francisco and the 49ers in their heyday were a little more of a free-agent magnet than San Antonio, so it's understandable if the Spurs stand by Duncan and Ginobili, who took less on one or more of their last deals to stay in silver and black.
Now, Tony Parker in a different jersey? Odd, but not inconceivable, and that's where they have to start. And this is in no way to discredit what TP has contributed to the Spurs. It's simply that he's not enough of a playmaker at point guard to raise the level of those around him. Nor does he have enough size to dominate his position at both ends of the court and create mismatches -- at least the kind of mismatches the Spurs now need from their third star with Duncan's star dimming. But as a quick, scoring point guard in an era that sees them flourishing, he has to have some value on the trade market -- and maybe just enough to ratchet the Spurs back up a few notches to put them back in the title conversation.
CB: If the Magic can't get Paul, they can target Rudy Gay. Memphis has been able to succeed without Gay and may now be open to moving him next season (not saying that the Grizzlies are better without him). Again, it would likely take a three- or four-team deal since Memphis has no need for Nelson and won't want Turkoglu and -- especially -- Arenas.
I admit that retooling Orlando will not be easy -- not even close. Arenas and Turkoglu are as close to untradable as it gets. But history has proven that no player or contract is absolutely unmovable. It's up to Smith to beat the bushes and find teams willing to take on some of his dead weight.
Otherwise, unless Arenas makes a miraculous return to old form, the Magic will remain stuck in the middle of the Eastern Conference playoff race next season, and perhaps lose the ultimate prize (Howard) to free agency in the summer that follows.
RB: Little-known fact: Duncan can opt out of his contract this summer. If he were willing to opt out of next season's $21 million deal and re-sign for a longer-term contract at a per-year number more reflective of his current ability, San Antonio actually could pick up a midrange free agent, depending on cap parameters under the next CBA.
So, San Antonio's building blocks are cap room for a complementary or up-and-coming free agent, and Parker. The needs? Well, if George Hill can step into the starting point-guard role -- and I believe he can -- then the list starts with a backup point guard and Robert Horry-type power forward. Slight problem: No long, stretch 4s are readily available. The young lightning-in-a-bottle candidates are Shawne Williams of the New York Knicks and the Grizzlies' Darrell Arthur. It's hard to see how Memphis can re-sign Marc Gasol and keep Arthur. (Or, could San Antonio possibly convince Gasol to head south if the new CBA makes it prohibitive for the Grizzlies to keep him? In that case, Duncan becomes the stretch 4.) Williams is a free agent who made $884,000 this year.
Both Arthur and Williams, presumably, would jump at the chance to start and get prime minutes next to Duncan. Would the Knicks move Toney Douglas, Williams and Ronny Turiaf for Parker, even though they've already re-upped Billups for one more season? It's worth finding out. I've never been big on concocting fantasy trades, but I'm doing so here to illustrate the kind of dice roll and infusion of youth the Spurs desperately need. Don't look at the win-loss record. Look at how and where the Memphis Grizzlies are preying on their weaknesses -- weaknesses that will only increase, not lessen, if not addressed before next season.
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Rus been playing like an idiot these last two games but no way in hell should they shop him
D
Deleted member 38182
Guest
Originally Posted by Proshares
Where did JA's seething disdain for OKC come from?
He is just jelly
is that tongue face new???
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All I ever said was that Russel Westbrook was a terrible shooter with terrible shot selection.
Rajon Rondo is a terrible shooter too.
People just had to retaliate and try to defend him, saying he's not that bad.
The kid is a phenomenal player, great athlete, and very well-rounded, but his jumpshot sucks. I definitely never said they should trade him, he just needs to develop his shot more. It's really poor, as is his shot selection.
That's all I ever cared about OKC.
And yeah, I had problems with calling someone a contender who never won a playoff series, that kind of bothered me. I just don't really see them as a threat if you're not going to consider Dallas a threat.
To me, like I said before, the two contenders in the West were San Antonio and LA. Not OKC, not Dallas. San Antonio had the record and the experience, and LA is the defending champ. If people want to go ahead and call OKC contenders, fine, whatever.
.
Go ahead and call Dallas contenders too while we're at it.
Rajon Rondo is a terrible shooter too.
People just had to retaliate and try to defend him, saying he's not that bad.
The kid is a phenomenal player, great athlete, and very well-rounded, but his jumpshot sucks. I definitely never said they should trade him, he just needs to develop his shot more. It's really poor, as is his shot selection.
That's all I ever cared about OKC.
And yeah, I had problems with calling someone a contender who never won a playoff series, that kind of bothered me. I just don't really see them as a threat if you're not going to consider Dallas a threat.
To me, like I said before, the two contenders in the West were San Antonio and LA. Not OKC, not Dallas. San Antonio had the record and the experience, and LA is the defending champ. If people want to go ahead and call OKC contenders, fine, whatever.
Go ahead and call Dallas contenders too while we're at it.
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now that i'm thinking about it..
which team would say no first to a dwight howard for russ + perkins + thabo trade? (replace thabo for cook, if you want.. hell throw nate in too)
of course this isn't factoring in that dwight seems determined to go to a bigger market
which team would say no first to a dwight howard for russ + perkins + thabo trade? (replace thabo for cook, if you want.. hell throw nate in too)
of course this isn't factoring in that dwight seems determined to go to a bigger market
