**OFFICIAL NBA MOST VALUABLE PLAYER (MVP) THREAD**

[franchise3]

Originally Posted by NobleKane

Franchise your hate for Kobe is showing....

Kobe doesnt make his teammates better?

He only makes the game easier for them?

Hillarious

I think you are still pissed off at the lakers knocking the rockets out a couple years back...

That has to be the reason because the reasons you are giving that Kobe shouldnt be mvp is hillarious...

Michael Jordan's game wasnt like Chris Paul or Lebron James yet he made his teammates better.

How?

By making the game easier for them.

My dude, I'm a Kobe fan.

If it wasn't for CP3, I'm with you guys, saying it's Kobe's to win it.

And that's what I've been getting at.

Kobe makes the game EASIER for his guys.

But compare him to CP3.

CP3 NO DOUBT makes his guys better.

I'm sorry, but I see guys like Farmar hitting shots, Bynum dominating in the paint (when healthy) Sasha become the Machine in a span of a season, andI'll stick with my opinion that Kobe's teammates are rising to the occasion, while Kobe is being Kobe.

I don't watch many Lakers game, so I'll take your guys word for it that Kobe has changed his game to conform to the team concept this season.

 

[kiddin like jason]

It's sad because he WILL go down as at the very least the #2 SG in history and top 10 EVER.
What's that got to do with this season's MVP?

Let's just say for the sake of argument that they 3 peat.
That's not outlandish or anything.

Not to say that CP3 shouldn't get some looks or he isn't close or that Kobe is "due" but dang we are witnessing history and we refuse to enjoy it. Really sad.
What history-making event am I missing out on?

 

[franchise3]

Originally Posted by Mamba MVP

Originally Posted by denni5themenace

im just curious,
can you attribute the emergence of guys like sasha vujajic, farmar, walton, ronny turiaf to kobe making his teammates better?

edit*

i didn't even see noble's post, but that's what i was basically trying to get at.

according to franchise, no. it is soley a product of them just stepping up their game and kobe has nothing to do with their improvement.

Lakers fans

Be real.

Andruw Bynum.

Does Kobe help this dude block shots? Rebound the way he was rebounding? Shooting at such a high %?

Farmar? Sasha? Vlad?

KOBE PLAYS A HUGE ROLE IN THE LAKERS SUCCESS.

He makes them 'better,' like all the great players do with their teammates, like I said.

BUT, CP3 is BETTER at making his teammates better.

It's clear as day.

It shows in the numbers.

It shows when you watch the Hornets play.

 

[franchise3]

I'm sorry Lakers fans.

But I see how CP3 is surgeical with the rock, killing the opposition on the pick and roll, and basically blows by everybody who tries to guard him, look at hisnumbers JUMP UP from last season, see that the Hornets are currently #1, everybody around him having career years, and I'm giving him the even now SLIGHTnod over Kobe.

It is what it is.

 

[denni5themenace]

Originally Posted by franchise3

I'm sorry Lakers fans.

But I see how CP3 is surgeical with the rock, killing the opposition on the pick and roll, and basically blows by everybody who tries to guard him, look at his numbers JUMP UP from last season, see that the Hornets are currently #1, everybody around him having career years, and I'm giving him the even now SLIGHT nod over Kobe.

It is what it is.

i too agree cp3 has the slight edge on the mvp race right now and wouldn't be mad one bit if he gets it (dude's my 2nd favorite player in theL).

i was just curious that's all

 

[franchise3]

Lakers fans also must have a case of amnesia.

Kobe does make his players better, but the truth of the matter is, Kobe had NO FAITH in these guys.

Why didn't he have faith?

It's because he played with basically the same whole group LAST season, and saw that it was HOPELESS.

..that is, until Kupcake didn't trade him, and Kobe just went to work, business as usual, and eureka.

Hey look. Sasha can hit shots now.

Bynum dominating the paint.

Etc.

 

[jsindaa]

Originally Posted by Kiddin Like Jason

It's sad because he WILL go down as at the very least the #2 SG in history and top 10 EVER.

What's that got to do with this season's MVP?

Let's just say for the sake of argument that they 3 peat.
That's not outlandish or anything.

Not to say that CP3 shouldn't get some looks or he isn't close or that Kobe is "due" but dang we are witnessing history and we refuse to enjoy it. Really sad.
What history-making event am I missing out on?


Had you read the sentence right before that first quote you would have seen I was talking about just the stuff he has accomplished period. I don't meanto say every single person is missing out just that some are because they are busy trying to find excuses....which was basically the whole point of that post.I only adressed this season in the first couple sentences. Even so....as far as I'm concerned the only two people that should be in the discussion thisyear are CP3 and Kobe......if they both finish in the top 3 I honestly don't know who I'd give the award to. I think the best thing to do in thatscenario is to do co-mvps. It may be the best solution period...but we will see

 

[MVP]

Originally Posted by franchise3

Originally Posted by Mamba MVP

Originally Posted by denni5themenace

im just curious,
can you attribute the emergence of guys like sasha vujajic, farmar, walton, ronny turiaf to kobe making his teammates better?

edit*

i didn't even see noble's post, but that's what i was basically trying to get at.

according to franchise, no. it is soley a product of them just stepping up their game and kobe has nothing to do with their improvement.

Lakers fans

Be real.

Andruw Bynum.

Does Kobe help this dude block shots? Rebound the way he was rebounding? Shooting at such a high %?

Farmar? Sasha? Vlad?

KOBE PLAYS A HUGE ROLE IN THE LAKERS SUCCESS.

He makes them 'better,' like all the great players do with their teammates, like I said.

BUT, CP3 is BETTER at making his teammates better.

It's clear as day.

It shows in the numbers.

It shows when you watch the Hornets play.

Does CP3 help Chandler grab rebounds or block shots

He sets Tyson uplike Kobe was setting up Drew a lot of the time. They are doing the same thing dog, getting their teammates open opportunities, CP3 is just getting moreassists and Kobe is doing more scoring b/c the Hornets have better shooters than the Lakers do, so every time Kobe passes them the ball it's still acrapshoot, they are more likely to make the shots, but they are nowhere near the shooters Peja and David West are when they are wide open.

 

[denni5themenace]

Originally Posted by franchise3

Lakers fans also must have a case of amnesia.

Kobe does make his players better, but the truth of the matter is, Kobe had NO FAITH in these guys.

Why didn't he have faith?

It's because he played with basically the same whole group LAST season, and saw that it was HOPELESS.

..that is, until Kupcake didn't trade him, and Kobe just went to work, business as usual, and eureka.

Hey look. Sasha can hit shots now.

Bynum dominating the paint.

Etc.

he had no faith in his guys because kwame would fumble the pass on the pick n roll.

sasha would brick that wide open 3.

kobe is giving them the same looks he has always given them. this time sasha is actually hitting the shots, gasol/bynum are actually catching those passes.etc.

 

[denni5themenace]

Originally Posted by Mamba MVP

Originally Posted by franchise3

Originally Posted by Mamba MVP

Originally Posted by denni5themenace

im just curious,
can you attribute the emergence of guys like sasha vujajic, farmar, walton, ronny turiaf to kobe making his teammates better?

edit*

i didn't even see noble's post, but that's what i was basically trying to get at.

according to franchise, no. it is soley a product of them just stepping up their game and kobe has nothing to do with their improvement.

Lakers fans

Be real.

Andruw Bynum.

Does Kobe help this dude block shots? Rebound the way he was rebounding? Shooting at such a high %?

Farmar? Sasha? Vlad?

KOBE PLAYS A HUGE ROLE IN THE LAKERS SUCCESS.

He makes them 'better,' like all the great players do with their teammates, like I said.

BUT, CP3 is BETTER at making his teammates better.

It's clear as day.

It shows in the numbers.

It shows when you watch the Hornets play.

Does CP3 help Chandler grab rebounds or block shots

He sets Tyson up like Kobe was setting up Drew a lot of the time. They are doing the same thing dog, getting their teammates open opportunities, CP3 is just getting more assists and Kobe is doing more scoring b/c the Hornets have better shooters than the Lakers do, so every time Kobe passes them the ball it's still a crapshoot, they are more likely to make the shots, but they are nowhere near the shooters Peja and David West are when they are wide open.

furthermore, the triangle offense is based off of multiple passes to the open man, so the assists should be allocated across the board to many playersrather then to one person (cp3) who dominates the ball and with one pass set up a teammate.

 

[franchise3]

Does CP3 help Chandler grab rebounds or block shots

He sets Tyson up like Kobe was setting up Drew a lot of the time. They are doing the same thing dog, getting their teammates open opportunities, CP3 is just getting more assists and Kobe is doing more scoring b/c the Hornets have better shooters than the Lakers do, so every time Kobe passes them the ball it's still a crapshoot, they are more likely to make the shots, but they are nowhere near the shooters Peja and David West are when they are wide open.
CP3 be setting up Chandler off alley oops all game, hence his increase in PPG.

Chandler was already a beast on the glass/defensively.

Bynum in one season, improved across the board.

Everywhere.

That's what I was trying to get at.

I'll take your word for it that Kobe be setting up Andrew the way CP3 sets up Chandler. I dunno, I don't watch as many Lakers games as you do.

And, let's be real. The Lakers have a lot more shooters than the Hornets.

When Kobe drives to the lane, and the defense collapses on him, he can dish it out to any shooter he wants.

DFish, Sasha, Vlad, Farmar, Luke.

CP3 drives the lane, and the defense collapses on him, he can alley it oop to Chandler, kick back to West for a 17 footer or Peja behind the arc.

That's about it.

 

[franchise3]

Finally, it's NOT just about assists.

It's a collection of things for CP3.

Increase in PPG, increase in %'s, increase in assists, lead the leagues in steals, assist/turnover ratio.

Like I said, it's IMPRESSIVE to ME that dude catapulted himself as the clear BEST PG in the game, in a span of one season.

IMO, that's MVPesque, considering during his tear this season, the Hornets are the #1 seed.

So, it's not all for show or a moot point.

 

[blaxoid]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that whichever team gets the best record in the West, between the Hornets and Lakers, their respective star willget the nod for MVP. If both teams had equal records, the argument is difficult to swing in either direction as both are on another level & their teams arethe most successful in a very competitive Western Conference.

 

[MVP]

Originally Posted by franchise3

Does CP3 help Chandler grab rebounds or block shots

He sets Tyson up like Kobe was setting up Drew a lot of the time. They are doing the same thing dog, getting their teammates open opportunities, CP3 is just getting more assists and Kobe is doing more scoring b/c the Hornets have better shooters than the Lakers do, so every time Kobe passes them the ball it's still a crapshoot, they are more likely to make the shots, but they are nowhere near the shooters Peja and David West are when they are wide open.

CP3 be setting up Chandler off alley oops all game, hence his increase in PPG.

Chandler was already a beast on the glass/defensively.

Bynum in one season, improved across the board.

Everywhere.

That's what I was trying to get at.

I'll take your word for it that Kobe be setting up Andrew the way CP3 sets up Chandler. I dunno, I don't watch as many Lakers games as you do.

And, let's be real. The Lakers have a lot more shooters than the Hornets.

When Kobe drives to the lane, and the defense collapses on him, he can dish it out to any shooter he wants.

DFish, Sasha, Vlad, Farmar, Luke.

CP3 drives the lane, and the defense collapses on him, he can alley it oop to Chandler, kick back to West for a 17 footer or Peja behind the arc.

That's about it.

I'm sorry but you lost all credibility with this argument by posting that name. D-Fish is really the only consistent shooter of those mentioned and hehas struggled over the past month. The other 3 are streak shooters at best even when they are set up for wide open shots. West and Peja more than 50% of thetime know down those similar wide open shots. Having consistent shooters>having greater number of shooters.

And as for Andrew, getting more consistent playing time is a big factor in why his numbers increased across the board. For some stupid reason Kwame wasstarting over him. I mean he was only avg. 22 min last year and is getting 29 min this year (should be more). So naturally with more opportunity he hasproduced more, is it all because of Kobe, all because of him, or a combination, who knows, all I know is that when Drew was playing; Kobe was setting him up alot ala Shaq.
One last thing, Kobe's numbers have increased across the boards except for scoring (but he's still 2nd in the league) and FT% (I think thepinky has something to do with it lately) and clearly is the best SG and believed by most to be the best player in the league.

 

[franchise3]

Kobe is the best player in the league, IMO.

It's just, again, like I said.

If the Hornets finish higher than the Lakers, I just can't see how CP3 doesn't get it, when you put everything together.

 

[atljunkie]

Id rather see cp3 win it over lebron and kobe.
just cause he seems more humble
and hes obviously talented as hell.

@ the hawks for passing that up!

 

[darthska]

the PGA tour:

---

Here are a little more definitive numbers. These are numbers of the elite PF's in the game, that KG guards.

Antawn Jamison
season average (sa)- 22 ppg, 44% fgp
Against KG (AKG)- 13 ppg, 31% fgp

Chris Bosh
SA - 22 ppg, 50% fgp
AKG- 20 ppg, 45% fgp

Zach Randolph
SA - 18 ppg, 46% fgp
AKG- 14 ppg, 32% fgp

Rasheed Wallace
SA - 13 ppg, 44%
AKG- 16 ppg, 40%

Carlos Boozer
SA- 22ppg 55%
AKG- 18 ppg, 52%

LaMarcus Aldridge
SA- 18 ppg, 49%
AKG-15 ppg, 48%

Dirk Nowitzki
SA - 24 ppg, 48%
AKG- 22 ppg, 40%

Tim Duncan
SA - 20 ppg, 50%
AKG- 16 ppg, 50%

Amare Stoudemire
SA- 25 ppg, 59%
AKG- 30 ppg, 54%

The Elite PF's are averaging 20.5 PPG and have are shooting 49.5% from the field

Against KG they are averaging 17 PPG and are only shooting 43% from the field.

Very solid numbers. Factor in that he's anchoring the best defensive team, with players not necessarily considered great defenders in front of him, and I'd say that is a worthy facet for an MVP canidate.
The only way that reply means anything will be when a similar reply is made that fulfills all of the following:
- compare the stats of the league's elite SGs to the stats of the league's elite SGs AKB
- compare the stats of the league's elite PGs to the stats of the league's elite PGs ACP

 

[kingaj619]

It's hard to decide but the top two candidates already are of course KB24 and CP3 just gonna have to wait til the end of the season to find out who'son top of the west.

 

[zeus23]

Kobe is going to be the league MVP guys let's be real. he's one of the greatest athletes of our time.

its not about stats, its about bein the most valuable piece on a successful team.

the award belongs to no one else rather than Kobe Bean Bryant

Kevin Garnett
is on an allstar team, definitely not the Center of Celtics organization, they can win games with out him.

Chris Paul
is second but won't win it this year simply because he's too young. He's only been in the leaue a couple years. There's no way he wins itunless the Lakers MISS the playoffs.

 

[ldea]

All I know is, I am going to be very pissed if the MVP is NOT CP3 or Kobe.

 

[knightngale]

damn franchise, your nuthugging is getting disgusting

worse than lebron groupies

Paul should win MVP for making Peja hit all those crucial shots all the time

peja>fisher, shasha, farmar as shooters

its not even close

@ mentioning walton

have you forgotten that Kobe doesn't have Bynum anymore and did not have gasol for most of the season yet his team is only 1 and a half games back?

 

[kiddin like jason]

Some of you guys care an unhealthy amount about the MVP award.

 

[bullsrepeat3peat]

 

[sohi 23]

Originally Posted by atljunkie

Id rather see cp3 win it over lebron and kobe.
just cause he seems more humble

Word, let's give the MVP to Adonal Foyle because he does alot of community work.
He deserves it

 

[franchise3]

Originally Posted by knightngale

damn franchise, your nuthugging is getting disgusting

worse than lebron groupies

Paul should win MVP for making Peja hit all those crucial shots all the time

peja>fisher, shasha, farmar as shooters

its not even close

@ mentioning walton

have you forgotten that Kobe doesn't have Bynum anymore and did not have gasol for most of the season yet his team is only 1 and a half games back?

I'm a Kobe fan. I like this dude Kobe more than CP3.

I'm just calling it how I see it.

Go ahead, make your case for Kobe.

MINUS the injuries, as that's a weak arguement.

That's living in a 'what if, coulda shoulda woulda' type world.