***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[keko jones]

Honestly, I’m not sure how the left even maneuvers around LGBTQ-phobia in communities like these.

Religious and cultural issues like these can’t really be transcended by modern politics since there is nothing a politician can say/do to make a community like this more tolerant. They probably just have to focus on issues that they would resonate more with such as immigration reform (since a lot of this same group feels it is fair that illegal immigrants get citizenship privilege while they had to wait their term before coming to the US for legal status).

You may be right. I'm not disagreeing, but I’m trying to highlight that these are significant talking points. Navigating them can be challenging, and perhaps the most strategic approach is to handle certain progressive stances quietly, without overt publicity—almost like the "under-the-radar" approach we’ve seen on some policies. Alternatively, there’s the approach of someone like JD Vance, who leaned fully into themes of religious and family values, which clearly resonated and may have contributed to a shift in voting patterns.

Perhaps factors like Kamala Harris being a woman played a role in public reception; it’s possible some segments of the electorate weren’t ready for that. These are all crucial considerations when nominating a candidate, as these major talking points clearly resonate and require thoughtful engagement.

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

Honestly, I’m not sure how the left even maneuvers around LGBTQ-phobia in communities like these.

Religious and cultural issues like these can’t really be transcended by modern politics since there is nothing a politician can say/do to make a community like this more tolerant. They probably just have to focus on issues that they would resonate more with such as immigration reform (since a lot of this same group feels it is grossly unfair that illegal immigrants get citizenship privilege while they had to wait their term before coming to the US for legal status).

My brother lives in El Paso and says that sentiment about undocumented immigrants has really soured in the Latino community. There’s still empathy, but not to the point of being happy they are here.

 

[keko jones]

If you wanna pick an issue that people actually vote on that is turning Latinos away I think there's much more evidence that it's abortion.

You’re probably right. Focusing solely on the idea that "they're trying to take women’s rights away" might not resonate with the female Latin community, and could even alienate them. It’s a complex issue with no one-size-fits-all solution.

 

[elpablo21]

I agree with you. I’ve never been the walk up hill both ways kind of person when discussing politics but I sometimes wonder where many of us would be if the past generations had this same apathy and attitude? Would people that look like you and me still be 3/5s of a person? I sometimes wonder how it must’ve felt for our grandparents and great grandparents to live during segregation and in the Jim Crow south and what it took never to give up and to keep trying to make things better? Many in society just aren’t built to play the long game and unfortunately many of those are who we need.

Yeah I don't know what it takes to bridge the gap between generations for voted to see things they may not benefit from in their lifetime to what can you do for me right now. People who need things now aren't wrong but these stop gaps of not voting are slowing the process of things of even anything short term.

People need more than just an education talk, they want something tangible BUT there's has to be some accountability on the people, these generations to understand there tangibles right in front of you. There can be some hand holding and coddling but at what point does it not even reap any benefits because it is not like Dems don't do that at all.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

My brother lives in El Paso and says that sentiment about undocumented immigrants has really soured in the Latino community. There’s still empathy, but not to the point of being happy they are here.

Canada has turned from one of the most pro immigrant countries to super anti immigrant in like 4 years.
people will just straight up say racist stuff if the topic of indian immigrants is brought up.

an older indian dude told me "these new ones they are sending have to go"


people just hate chaotic immigration, like sooo sooo much its wild.
canada doesn't even have a southern border but maaaaan if we did people would be going even crazier.

 

[staffsgtdignam]

Canada has turned from one of the most pro immigrant countries to super anti immigrant in like 4 years.
people will just straight up say racist stuff if the topic of indian immigrants is brought up.

an older indian dude told me "these new ones they are sending have to go"


people just hate chaotic immigration, like sooo sooo much its wild.
canada doesn't even have a southern border but maaaaan if we did people would be going even crazier.

Bro this is WILD

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

Immigration has been one of my most important issues. I think we are stronger as a nation when we allow a constant refresh of the world’s most ambitious.

But I realize that it’s completely non-viable. After a lifetime of holding my nose to vote for someone that doesn’t share my values, I have given up.

At this point, I think the Democrats in Congress should co-sponsor Draconian immigration reform. Let’s actualize mass deportation and fund the program through fines to businesses and landlords that enable undocumented immigrants to live here. The cost to deport is 13k per person. So let’s fine any business 50k and allocate some of the balance of fines to local law enforcement to motivate any assists to ICE.

If the country wants no immigrants in its fields, construction zones, packing plants, and kitchens, let’s give that to them.

 

[staffsgtdignam]

My brother lives in El Paso and says that sentiment about undocumented immigrants has really soured in the Latino community. There’s still empathy, but not to the point of being happy they are here.

Yeah the crazy thing that people don’t want to say out loud is that illegal immigration unethically benefits businesses and consumers.

Essentially, they provide a cheap labor force with little/no rights (and even the rights they have, many will not speak up about abuses out of fear of being deported). Even corporations can maneuver around it by contracting out work to contractors who would subcontract out labor contracts to those who hire illegal immigrants. This leads to cheap labor and lower prices, especially on goods/services needing unskilled labor as part of the process (think construction, farming, moving services, cleaning services, etc. etc.).

 

[IATT]

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

Yeah the crazy thing that people don’t want to say out loud is that illegal immigration unethically benefits businesses and consumers.

Essentially, they provide a cheap labor force with little/no rights (and even the rights they have, many will not speak up about abuses out of fear of being deported). Even corporations can maneuver around it by contracting out work to contractors who would subcontract out labor contracts to those who hire illegal immigrants. This leads to cheap labor and lower prices, especially on goods/services needing unskilled labor as part of the process (think construction, farming, moving services, cleaning services, etc. etc.).

Exactly. We need more programs like the Hatians. And the only way to get them is if people start paying the hidden cost.

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

Haha, I would hate to be Zelensky’s life insurer right now.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Bro this is WILD

people are BIG mad. its crazy.


basically the perception is the student visa system is being abused.

people set up fake bs schools, in order to get money from international students who are really just using it as a way to immigrate to canada. once they get here they drop the school, or the school gives them fake busy work.
and they just start working.

combine that with a massive housing shortage, and now everyone is blaming the immigrants for high housing prices.



not to mention because apartments are illegal, people are turning single family homes into like 15 room apartments.
or turning 2 bedroom condo into 8 room apartments.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

sad thing is canada is an aging country that needs immigrants.

we just didn't build enough housing,
now people hate immigration.


its a horrible situation

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

Heh… in grad school my 1 bedroom apartment was one of 4 on the floor of my building - exact same floor plan. By the time I moved out, the other 3 each had 3 Indian grad students.

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

sad thing is canada is an aging country that needs immigrants.

we just didn't build enough housing,
now people hate immigration.


its a horrible situation

Yeah, in retrospect our asylum program was a stupid idea without actually funding the immigration court system.

Unfunded mandates are death.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Heh… in grad school my 1 bedroom apartment was one of 4 on the floor of my building - exact same floor plan. By the time I moved out, the other 3 each had 3 Indian grad students.

its almost like if you make apartments illegal.

a black market forms.

 

[rolaholic]

Exactly. We need more programs like the Hatians. And the only way to get them is if people start paying the hidden cost.

Look at how that ended up being weaponized though with literal fake news to discourage those very programs and fan anti-immigrant fervor

The people who were actually living in those communities and speaking about the benefits to the local economy and the towns resurgance that the program brought didn't even get to control the narrative about themselves.

Dems are at a fundamental disadvantage with the vast Murdoch/Musk/Thiel funded RW-media ecosystem acting as a giant megaphone that insulates swathes of the country from reality. It's become genuinely difficult to even begin to pierce through the propaganda

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

Look at how that ended up being weaponized though with literal fake news to discourage those very programs and fan anti-immigrant fervor

The people who were actually living in those communities and speaking about the benefits to the local economy and the towns resurgance that the program brought didn't even get to control the narrative about themselves.

Dems are at a fundamental disadvantage with the vast Murdoch/Musk media ecosystem acting as a giant microphone that insulates swathes of the country from reality.

Yeah, that’s why we need the entire country to understand how much we rely on them. And there doesn’t seem to be any way to do that other than mass deportations.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Yeah, that’s why we need the entire country to understand how much we rely on them. And there doesn’t seem to be any way to do that other than mass deportations.

if Trump does the mass deportations there will be a guaranteed backlash that should help democrats.

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

its almost like if you make apartments illegal.

a black market forms.

To be fair, apartments are legal in Pittsburgh. It’s just that the entire market around CMU and Pitt is controlled by 3 slumlord companies that go from bad to worse to worst.

Coming from the renters market in Texas, it was quite painful.

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

if Trump does the mass deportations there will be a guaranteed backlash that should help democrats.

And immigrants. And the entire country.

 

[TooOlfForThisIsh]

Fetterman needs to get on it. Accelerated deportation in orderly style - the adios act.

 

[Betonblck]

if Trump does the mass deportations there will be a guaranteed backlash that should help democrats.

Backlash from who?

 

[osh kosh bosh]

To be fair, apartments are legal in Pittsburgh. It’s just that the entire market around CMU and Pitt is controlled by 3 slumlord companies that go from bad to worse to worst.

Coming from the renters market in Texas, it was quite painful.

according to this apartments are illegal to build on 39% of the land in pittsburgh

30% only single family homes, 9% two unit homes.



not quite as bad as toronto but pretty bad.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Backlash from who?

the electorate.

anti immigrant policies sound fine in theory.
but if they really do it people will be mad.


the same thing happened during the first trump presidency.
the public turned on immigration once he did family seperation.