The Official NBA Collective Bargaining Thread vol Phased in Hard Cap

[rexanglorum]

DubA169 wrote:

---

I honestly just get the feeling that the owners have no intention whatsoever of compromising. They WANT to lose the season. They WANT to crush the players. Which is why I'm on the players side 
  
I agree, the hard line owners really do not like Basketball in general, they are NFLophiles and should have either bought part of an NFL team or used their money to invest in securities. Owning an NBA team should be seen as owning a prestige asset like a yatch or vacation home, it is not meant to be an active revenue stream or at least a vast revenue stream.

They want to make the NBA into the NFL but the difference is cultural and the fact that they play different sports. Basketball is not football but delusional, new owners think it is and that they should make as much as an NFL owner does. They are also about to make the NBA less like the NFL, the NFL is not missing games and the NBA will, I wonder if that will aid or alleviate the owner's complaints about money?

 

[rexanglorum]

DubA169 wrote:

---

I honestly just get the feeling that the owners have no intention whatsoever of compromising. They WANT to lose the season. They WANT to crush the players. Which is why I'm on the players side 
  
I agree, the hard line owners really do not like Basketball in general, they are NFLophiles and should have either bought part of an NFL team or used their money to invest in securities. Owning an NBA team should be seen as owning a prestige asset like a yatch or vacation home, it is not meant to be an active revenue stream or at least a vast revenue stream.

They want to make the NBA into the NFL but the difference is cultural and the fact that they play different sports. Basketball is not football but delusional, new owners think it is and that they should make as much as an NFL owner does. They are also about to make the NBA less like the NFL, the NFL is not missing games and the NBA will, I wonder if that will aid or alleviate the owner's complaints about money?

 

[hankmoody]

Are we talking about the debt ceiling in here? Eerily similar rhetoric.

 

[hankmoody]

Are we talking about the debt ceiling in here? Eerily similar rhetoric.

 

[statis22]

The NBA doesn't generate as nearly as much revenue as the NFL does so that's not realistic.

I see no problem in wanting to turn a profit in something someone invest hundreds of millions of dollars into.

 

[statis22]

The NBA doesn't generate as nearly as much revenue as the NFL does so that's not realistic.

I see no problem in wanting to turn a profit in something someone invest hundreds of millions of dollars into.

 

[pmatic]

NBA owners, players likely to meet next week

On Tuesday, Tom Ziller of SB Nation reported the NBA players’ union and league officials were planning the first official post-lockout collective bargaining talks for some time in the first two weeks of August. That meeting will take place next week, barring some unforeseen scheduling issue, according to two sources familiar with the matter. It could take place as early as Monday, depending on how the schedules of a few key figures shake out, according to one of the sources.

Staff members from each side, including some top officials, have met twice since the lockout took effect on July 1 to finalize the 2010-11 basketball-related income figure, discuss possible structures for a new salary cap and schedule future meetings. But those sessions have not involved several key players, including NBA commissioner David Stern, union executive director Billy Hunter and top outside counsel for both sides.

Experts consider the two sides to be far apart in a dispute that centers on how the league should split its revenue pie with players. Under the just-expired collective bargaining agreement, players were guaranteed 57 percent of all basketball-related income, and the league recently had to fork over $162 million in escrow funds and an additional $26 million to make sure player salaries for the 2010-11 hit that mark. League officials have claimed that the 57 percent figure is too high, and that 22 of the league’s 30 teams have lost money over the last two years as a result of player salaries and rising expenses. Just before the lockout went into effect, players offered to accept a shade more than 54 percent of BRI, but that was not enough of a compromise for the league and its owners.

The two sides are also at odds over a number of other key issues. Among them:

• The owners’ push for a hard salary cap

• The amount of guaranteed salary in player contracts

• What revenues should be included in BRI

• What costs should come out the BRI pie

The gap is large enough that several player agents encouraged Hunter on Friday to consider desertification, a bold move that would give the players the right to file a federal antitrust suit and challenge the legality of the lockout, according to Yahoo!’s Adrian Wojnarowski and other sources. The union also has a pending unfair labor practices complaint in front of the National Labor Relations Board.


Link

 

[pmatic]

NBA owners, players likely to meet next week

On Tuesday, Tom Ziller of SB Nation reported the NBA players’ union and league officials were planning the first official post-lockout collective bargaining talks for some time in the first two weeks of August. That meeting will take place next week, barring some unforeseen scheduling issue, according to two sources familiar with the matter. It could take place as early as Monday, depending on how the schedules of a few key figures shake out, according to one of the sources.

Staff members from each side, including some top officials, have met twice since the lockout took effect on July 1 to finalize the 2010-11 basketball-related income figure, discuss possible structures for a new salary cap and schedule future meetings. But those sessions have not involved several key players, including NBA commissioner David Stern, union executive director Billy Hunter and top outside counsel for both sides.

Experts consider the two sides to be far apart in a dispute that centers on how the league should split its revenue pie with players. Under the just-expired collective bargaining agreement, players were guaranteed 57 percent of all basketball-related income, and the league recently had to fork over $162 million in escrow funds and an additional $26 million to make sure player salaries for the 2010-11 hit that mark. League officials have claimed that the 57 percent figure is too high, and that 22 of the league’s 30 teams have lost money over the last two years as a result of player salaries and rising expenses. Just before the lockout went into effect, players offered to accept a shade more than 54 percent of BRI, but that was not enough of a compromise for the league and its owners.

The two sides are also at odds over a number of other key issues. Among them:

• The owners’ push for a hard salary cap

• The amount of guaranteed salary in player contracts

• What revenues should be included in BRI

• What costs should come out the BRI pie

The gap is large enough that several player agents encouraged Hunter on Friday to consider desertification, a bold move that would give the players the right to file a federal antitrust suit and challenge the legality of the lockout, according to Yahoo!’s Adrian Wojnarowski and other sources. The union also has a pending unfair labor practices complaint in front of the National Labor Relations Board.


Link

 

[japanair21]

Originally Posted by PMatic

There's blame to go all around. I understand where both sides are coming from, I just wish they'd be receptive to one another and compromise.

But then that would mean they would actually act like grown-ups...

And that ain't happening right now.

 

[japanair21]

Originally Posted by PMatic

There's blame to go all around. I understand where both sides are coming from, I just wish they'd be receptive to one another and compromise.

But then that would mean they would actually act like grown-ups...

And that ain't happening right now.

 

[aepps20]

Both sides are to blame but from the looks of it, only one side genuinely wants to compromise and that's the players. Fisher and Hunter were willing to reduce the player's share to an even split and that was dismissed as a "modest" from Stern. In response the owners wanted to keep the player's escrow money. The solution to this lockout is so simple but the owners will only share revenue as a last resort and the players won't be willing to reduce their pay to the levels required to increase the owners revenue without revenue sharing.

 

[aepps20]

Both sides are to blame but from the looks of it, only one side genuinely wants to compromise and that's the players. Fisher and Hunter were willing to reduce the player's share to an even split and that was dismissed as a "modest" from Stern. In response the owners wanted to keep the player's escrow money. The solution to this lockout is so simple but the owners will only share revenue as a last resort and the players won't be willing to reduce their pay to the levels required to increase the owners revenue without revenue sharing.

 

[duba169]

Part of me hopes the top 20 players go to Europe and Asia. These owners and stern Need to be humbled

I don't see a season getting played. I wonder how much dan gilbert is to blame. You know he is hyping up the other owners

 

[duba169]

Part of me hopes the top 20 players go to Europe and Asia. These owners and stern Need to be humbled

I don't see a season getting played. I wonder how much dan gilbert is to blame. You know he is hyping up the other owners

 

[rexanglorum]

 

[rexanglorum]

 

[statis22]

Since that was my post he quoted I feel obligated to respond but my goodness.

I don't see how you can compare a media and financial conglomerate like the NBA to MLS, im willing to bet they don't generate 1/10 of the revenue (pure guess).

I'll try to break down the rest of that post later.

 

[statis22]

Since that was my post he quoted I feel obligated to respond but my goodness.

I don't see how you can compare a media and financial conglomerate like the NBA to MLS, im willing to bet they don't generate 1/10 of the revenue (pure guess).

I'll try to break down the rest of that post later.

 

[pmatic]

Players union bends under Stern’s rule

As the calendar flips to August, the NBA still unmoved with a take-it-or-leave-it offer for the Players Association, here’s the question the union ought to be asking itself: Why is the easiest, most logical target in this labor Armageddon untouched, unscathed and remarkably unchallenged?

Why is the union so afraid of David Stern?

The union talks about the owners, and it never registers with the public. The owners are a vague, fairly anonymous cast of characters who illicit no loathing, no emotion. Hard to rip Mark Cuban when he’s willing to go deep into the luxury tax, lose money and win a championship. Most fans wish he owned their team, instead of some of these deadbeats. And yet, Stern is the figure who most fans are dubious over, from his iron-fist control of officiating, to his complicity in hustling the Sonics out of Seattle, to his arrogance of ruling the league like a small-town mayor without term limits.

The reason for the union finally scheduling a meeting with the owners on Monday in New York City is simple: Union officials are trying to convince the players they’re doing something, but it’s worthless. This is a show. There’s nothing to negotiate, nothing to discuss. The NBA commissioner has made sure of it. Stern promised a new crop of owners that should they buy into the NBA, he’d give them the most one-sided labor deal in the history of sports. No fan has sympathy for these two sides, nor should they. Just understand this, though: When the NBA goes silent for a full year following a most wildly successful season, Stern will deserve full blame for the sport’s shutdown.

He won’t stand up to these owners, and why should he? He has the greatest job in sports, and someday soon he’ll be the highest-paid player in the NBA. Stern doesn’t need to push his owners on revenue sharing – the most viable solution for long-term league solvency – when it’s so much easier to go after the players and shut the sport down. He’s taking the easy way out, but it’s understandable considering the staggering salary these owners pay him.

Strange, but the union never has the courage to bring up the mystery surrounding Stern’s salary. Many owners don’t even know what Stern makes. “I’d say three or less know,

 

[pmatic]

Players union bends under Stern’s rule

As the calendar flips to August, the NBA still unmoved with a take-it-or-leave-it offer for the Players Association, here’s the question the union ought to be asking itself: Why is the easiest, most logical target in this labor Armageddon untouched, unscathed and remarkably unchallenged?

Why is the union so afraid of David Stern?

The union talks about the owners, and it never registers with the public. The owners are a vague, fairly anonymous cast of characters who illicit no loathing, no emotion. Hard to rip Mark Cuban when he’s willing to go deep into the luxury tax, lose money and win a championship. Most fans wish he owned their team, instead of some of these deadbeats. And yet, Stern is the figure who most fans are dubious over, from his iron-fist control of officiating, to his complicity in hustling the Sonics out of Seattle, to his arrogance of ruling the league like a small-town mayor without term limits.

The reason for the union finally scheduling a meeting with the owners on Monday in New York City is simple: Union officials are trying to convince the players they’re doing something, but it’s worthless. This is a show. There’s nothing to negotiate, nothing to discuss. The NBA commissioner has made sure of it. Stern promised a new crop of owners that should they buy into the NBA, he’d give them the most one-sided labor deal in the history of sports. No fan has sympathy for these two sides, nor should they. Just understand this, though: When the NBA goes silent for a full year following a most wildly successful season, Stern will deserve full blame for the sport’s shutdown.

He won’t stand up to these owners, and why should he? He has the greatest job in sports, and someday soon he’ll be the highest-paid player in the NBA. Stern doesn’t need to push his owners on revenue sharing – the most viable solution for long-term league solvency – when it’s so much easier to go after the players and shut the sport down. He’s taking the easy way out, but it’s understandable considering the staggering salary these owners pay him.

Strange, but the union never has the courage to bring up the mystery surrounding Stern’s salary. Many owners don’t even know what Stern makes. “I’d say three or less know,

 

[CP1708]

Holy hell that was a post. 

 

And he posted at 4 AM, prolly started typing around midnight. 

Good stuff Rex.  (I think)  I dunno, I didn't read it all.  Ok, I read like a paragraph, but liked what I saw.  I'ma go now....

 

[CP1708]

Holy hell that was a post. 

 

And he posted at 4 AM, prolly started typing around midnight. 

Good stuff Rex.  (I think)  I dunno, I didn't read it all.  Ok, I read like a paragraph, but liked what I saw.  I'ma go now....

 

[duba169]

As if i needed another reason to despise Stern

I want to make a dartboard of his face

 

[duba169]

As if i needed another reason to despise Stern

I want to make a dartboard of his face

 

[pmatic]

@KBerg_CBS Derek Fisher emerges from nearly 3-hour bargaining session and acknowledges owners and players are still in the same place as 30 days ago.

Edit:

@KBerg_CBS Asked if players are bargaining in good faith or not, Stern said, "I would say not," and walked away
Get the hell outta here $tern.