The Official NBA Season Thread: Las Vegas Summer League | USA VS South Sudan at 3 ET on Fox

if you didn’t watch sixers/warriors yet, let me save you two hours.. joel embiid vs the warriors in < 10 seconds

 
dacomeup said:
The % are literally both in the 60s w/in 6 ft of the rim
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Ehhh numbers lie in this scenario

There’s a difference between being too slow to get back and contest rather than not even contesting

And regarding Giannis…..it’s a lot different when you’re not in drop so you can roam since you got Brook Lopez back there
 
BIG LEEMELONE said:
You brought up the video montages. Those are from the past 10 games AFAIK. I already broke down the entire year. Just because they're both in the 60s does not mean they're similar. Post All Star Jokic is at 70.4% to Embiid's 62.7%, a gap of 20 centers. Post all star performance has always been important in the MVP race.

But I'm genuinely curious...if you didn't have these numbers and you completely dismissed the actual game film, what were you even basing your opinion on?
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i literally gave you numbers on both of their defensive fg % within 6ft on the rim, but somehow that was dismissed as not being similar when it was. :lol: I’m not even talking about MVP performance here. I got Embiid as the MVP. I’m just talking about both being defensive liabilities, even if it “looks” different.
 
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amitt5504 said:
Ehhh numbers lie in this scenario

There’s a difference between being too slow to get back and contest rather than not even contesting

And regarding Giannis…..it’s a lot different when you’re not in drop so you can roam since you got Brook Lopez back there
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So what you’re saying is they’re both liabilities but it just looks different? :lol: Is it better because Embiid is too slow to get back? I don’t know how this is helpful or convincing at all. My whole point was that they’re both food in PnR and they have similar numbers defending at the rim. Both are true.

Brook plays drop himself. We’re going to punish Giannis for being a better defender and athlete?
 
dacomeup said:
So what you’re saying is they’re both liabilities but it just looks different? :lol: Is it better because Embiid is too slow to get back? I don’t know how this is helpful or convincing at all. My whole point was that they’re both food in PnR and they have similar numbers defending at the rim. Both are true.

Brook plays drop himself. We’re going to punish Giannis for being a better defender and athlete?
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Last nights game looked like every Jokic game in against the warriors last May
 
dacomeup said:
i literally gave you numbers on both of their defensive fg % within 6ft on the rim, but somehow that was dismissed as not being similar when it was. :lol: I’m not even talking about MVP performance here. I got Embiid as the MVP. I’m just talking about both being defensive liabilities, even if it “looks” different.
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Defenders shoot better than their average against Jokic and worse than their average against Embiid. Better is not similar to worse. You're not reading the numbers correctly. They're not the same caliber of defender
 
dacomeup said:
So what you’re saying is they’re both liabilities but it just looks different? :lol: Is it better because Embiid is too slow to get back? I don’t know how this is helpful or convincing at all. My whole point was that they’re both food in PnR and they have similar numbers defending at the rim. Both are true.

Brook plays drop himself. We’re going to punish Giannis for being a better defender and athlete?
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No we’re not punishing Giannis. I’m just providing context

You’re gonna have more guys in the PnR attack Jokic at the rim. Guys are not attacking Embiid at the rim in PnR (ball handler specifically) that much. More often than not, it’s a floating when they enter the paint or they try to throw a lob that Embiid 9/10 breaks up but those pass break ups aren’t counted as shot attempts

Example: Lavine at a clean lane to the rim but decided to pass it because Embiid was sitting right there. That steal ain’t counted as a shot attempt
 
BIG LEEMELONE said:
Defenders shoot better than their average against Jokic and worse than their average against Embiid. Better is not similar to worse. You're not reading the numbers correctly. They're not the same caliber of defender
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Their DWS is pretty damn close. You’re relying on one number and I’m looking at a bunch of different ones that tell the same story.
 
for the season Embiid has like 80 more PNR defensive possessions than Jokic. In 5 less games

PNR defense is more than just protecting the rim. Still need to contest the middle game. Need to show on the 3 ball

Fact is neither dude is Giannis, AD, or Bam. Even JJJ. They are going to constantly get attacked.
 
If we got BS counting stats like “screen assists”, there needs to be stat that counts the amount of times shots don’t go up when certain dudes are in the paint
 
addict4sneakers said:
for the season Embiid has like 80 more PNR defensive possessions than Jokic. In 5 less games

PNR defense is more than just protecting the rim. Still need to contest the middle game. Need to show on the 3 ball

Fact is neither dude is Giannis, AD, or Bam. Even JJJ. They are going to constantly get attacked.
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And Joel does that too. Is it at the same rate as those other guys who aren’t in a drop? Nah but it’s disingenuous to say he can’t or is gonna get cooked
 
dacomeup said:
Their DWS is pretty damn close. You’re relying on one number and I’m looking at a bunch of different ones that tell the same story.
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Lmao you literally have been going off one number this whole time. You didn't even know where I got the numbers from and you said the game film adds nothing to the convo. You were specifically talking about rim protection. Now you wanna bring up DWS. It's like saying Steph is a similar shooter to Kyle Anderson because they're both in the 40s. You just don't want to admit that you're wrong at this point. It's ok
 
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amitt5504 said:
And Joel does that too. Is it at the same rate as those other guys who aren’t in a drop? Nah but it’s disingenuous to say he can’t or is gonna get cooked
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We’ve seen him get cooked though. Like this happens. Is he getting less cooked cause he blocks a shot or changes a few? Either way the opposing teams game plan is to put him in as much action as possible. It’s the nature of todays game
 
BIG LEEMELONE said:
Lmao you literally have been going off one number this whole time. Now you wanna bring up DWS. It's like saying Steph is a similar shooter to Kyle Anderson because they're both in the 40s. You just don't want to admit that you're wrong at this point. It's ok
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You can easily search our convo on this back and forth where I talked about the team defensive rating as well. Embiid is a better defender. Both are food in PnR. Nothing I’m wrong about here.
 
addict4sneakers said:
We’ve seen him get cooked though. Like this happens. Is he getting less cooked cause he blocks a shot or changes a few? Either way the opposing teams game plan is to put him in as much action as possible. It’s the nature of todays game
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I’ve seen them other guys get cooked too. It happens

I have faith in my guy holding it down when it matters. Last night was an aberration lol
 
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