Why do you believe that there is a god?

[pleasurephd]

As far as the whole religious thing I feel like I'm agnostic, but I still tell people I'm religious. May be its brainwashing since I grew up catholic, but it has always been a part of my life and even though I don't believe in the bible at all or God in the traditional sense.

I believe in something that created the universe. Whether or not that thing can be classified as a person or a god. I still have faith in something that created us. That's all. Not sure what that classifies me as, but as a scientist I will always ponder the thought and keep my mind open to evidence of this creator.

It's sad because I feel like I have tried to have faith, but then so many things have turned me away from it over the years. For example I am in a career field of which if my church (the catholic church) found out I would probably be excommunicated. How can I have faith in something that doesn't have faith in me? As I try my hardest in life to work at something that I believe will help save lives and end a lot of suffering, something that I am so passionate about, my church is sitting there bashing it. How can I have faith in them after that?

Last thing I wanted to say is that those of you religious folk that say I believe and its proof because I see what he does for me on a daily basis, you guys need to read some Kant. Basically what Kant says is, I would assume all of you think that God is perfect, correct? Correct since this is what you are taught in church. Well as our creator he has the choice to control us or give us free will. But, as a perfect being he can only choose to give us free will because controlling us is along the lines of us being puppets or slaves.

So since we have free will he can not control any aspect of our lives and so those of you that say "I was blessed that day" or "he did this for me on this day" or "it was all part of his plan" you guys are not making a convincing argument. For the obvious reason of there being no proof and because this would mean that he is controlling our lives and therefore is not a perfect being, which can not be true because his is god, the perfect being.

 

[so nyuh shi dae]

Sounds like you're a deist, PleasurePhD.

 

[b smooth 202]

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

Richard Dawkins presented us facts from his wheel chair that God doesn't exist...all those idiots use their intelligence to argue against God rather than formulating something with true utility for the human race...what scientific contributions have they made to bettering life on earth?
have any of those books allowed greater understanding between people with differences? What is the point of theoretical research that supposedly proves God doesn't exist? 




WHERE ARE YOUR BOOKS ANTON?  

I've seen a man die right before my eyes, and it was completely preventable-if it were up to people like you we would still be living in a time when such unnecessary death couldn't be avoided

I do more in a day to promote the advancement of humanity than you would do in a lifetime and I know it makes ur soul burn

 

gimmie some books Anton....no MCAT....you told me to read right? 

 

[antonlavey]

Originally Posted by So Nyuh Shi Dae

Sounds like you're a deist, PleasurePhD.

he sounds human


All pleasure PhD had to do to formulate those views was THINK, as simple as that sounds


When I think of God a 1000 possibilities come into mind

Are we on the same level as microbes, and is he just a being of higher intelligence that manipulates us?
Does God himself have a God?
Is God a 12 year old child with conduct disorder who absolutely hates us?


It's a long list of questions, religion is a culture of NOT asking questions

 

[antonlavey]

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

Richard Dawkins presented us facts from his wheel chair that God doesn't exist...all those idiots use their intelligence to argue against God rather than formulating something with true utility for the human race...what scientific contributions have they made to bettering life on earth?
have any of those books allowed greater understanding between people with differences? What is the point of theoretical research that supposedly proves God doesn't exist? 




WHERE ARE YOUR BOOKS ANTON?  

I've seen a man die right before my eyes, and it was completely preventable-if it were up to people like you we would still be living in a time when such unnecessary death couldn't be avoided

I do more in a day to promote the advancement of humanity than you would do in a lifetime and I know it makes ur soul burn

 

gimmie some books Anton....no MCAT....you told me to read right? 

This is a good start, assuming you're serious about wanting to read

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

where is the reading material I asked for?
Sillyputty with another atheist pie chart

ORIGIN Middle English : via Old Frenchfrom Latin ignorantia, from ignorant- ‘not knowing’ (see ignorant )=agnosticism 

I'm waiting Anton

Funny But Greek came before Latin.
But never mind that...

*sigh*

You REALLY don't know anything do you?

You can't just equate the definition for ONE word with ANOTHER word that DOESNT MEAN THAT. 

What is your problem man? 

Seriously? 

Now a series of screen-caps:

From http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/agnostic , http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/agnostic , and http://www.thefreedictionary.com/agnostic

Anything else? 

 

[kix4kix]

Let me ask ya'll this, do you think religion is inseparable from god? I mean, never expected gifs and pics from the "mature" atheists. 
Seems like all of these threads now adays on here are started by nonbelievers. Do you believe in anything? Love? Knowledge? Yourself? Family?, do you have any set moral codes or do you just walk around doing whatever the $%*% you want?

Religion started a lot of things we adopt today, laws, marriage, and other cultural things were adopted from polytheistic religions , which in turn were adopted by the monotheistic ones, which were funneled to us. Point- being, religion isn't just about the actual existence of god, it's about us (people) 

And while, it may tick all of you proud atheists off that some people need religion just because you don't, ya needs to chill. 

Take the Catholic church for example, it feeds millions of hungry people around the world. But is also the richest entity on the planet, and no doubt is far from perfect. Things that involve humans, are flawed, because we are. Does that make a god any less probable? Not to me, but to some it might.

I was born affiliated with a religion, but found my own path, to what inspires me, and makes me a better person. IF being an atheist makes you a better person, do you. But don't push your thoughts, and ideals on to others, and chastise them when they fail to see it your way, because then aren't you becoming exactly what you stand against? 

 

[Pathos]

is Pious pious becuase God loves pious?

 

[mycoldyourdone]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

where is the reading material I asked for?
Sillyputty with another atheist pie chart

ORIGIN Middle English : via Old Frenchfrom Latin ignorantia, from ignorant- ‘not knowing’ (see ignorant )=agnosticism 

I'm waiting Anton

Funny But Greek came before Latin.
But never mind that...

*sigh*

You REALLY don't know anything do you?

You can't just equate the definition for ONE word with ANOTHER word that DOESNT MEAN THAT. 

What is your problem man? 

Seriously? 

Now a series of screen-caps:

From http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/agnostic , http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/agnostic , and http://www.thefreedictionary.com/agnostic

Anything else? 

homie just took the definition of ignorance 
http://www.google.ca/search?sourcei...ld+Frenchfrom Latin ignorantia,+from ignorant

and put an equals agnosticism at the end of it LOL

 

[antonlavey]

Originally Posted by kix4kix

Let me ask ya'll this, do you think religion is inseparable from god? 

You can't have religion without God but you can believe in God without subscribing  to a religion

 

[b smooth 202]

son posted Biology for Dummies. I'll accept that as a white flag. You won't even post the real Satanic garbage you read...'Anton Lavey' is a piece of #*+@. You wish you could get intiated into occultism...your an imitation poseur just like Anton Lavey is. 

 

[antonlavey]

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

son posted Biology for Dummies. I'll accept that as a white flag. You won't even post the real Satanic garbage you read...'Anton Lavey' is a piece of #*+@. You wish you could get intiated into occultism...your an imitation poseur just like Anton Lavey is. 

You asked me to post what I read all day, and I gave u a diluted version of it why are u getting mad

Anton LaVey was literally a model citizen to my understanding, to people like you that means absolutely nothing

He's a piece of sh, yet ur God who literally MURDERS thousands of people is the light of your eyes

Guy kills hundreds of people in the name of their "God"=good
Guys says f*** Yahweh, and spends every weekend in a volunteering at a soup kitchen=BAD



Do me a favor, be a better human being and I might actually entertain the thought of submitting to your "God"


I don't think that's too much to ask for

 

[smoke ya later]

Originally Posted by Hizzle

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202


son posted all those graphs like they mean something. nobody wants to read that bull !%!@..

who do you think conducted those surveys? The Worldwide Atheist Association ?

 

%@#@ outta here 

Here is some real material for real inquiring people...not machine-people with vendettas against God posting graphs from their Atheist text books. 

http://fractalontology.wordpress.com/

Quite possibly the dumbest post I've seen on NT. "All those facts you posted from major research institutions are stupid bro herp derp...Errrr, look at this blog for the realness." Also, I've read constantly in this thread how you think you're on another level above other individuals intellectually, but in those same posts it's apparent you don't even know the difference between your and you're. You're an idiot.

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by kix4kix

Let me ask ya'll this, do you think religion is inseparable from god? I mean, never expected gifs and pics from the "mature" atheists. 
Seems like all of these threads now adays on here are started by nonbelievers. Do you believe in anything? Love? Knowledge? Yourself? Family?, do you have any set moral codes or do you just walk around doing whatever the $%*% you want?

Religion started a lot of things we adopt today, laws, marriage, and other cultural things were adopted from polytheistic religions , which in turn were adopted by the monotheistic ones, which were funneled to us. Point- being, religion isn't just about the actual existence of god, it's about us (people) 

And while, it may tick all of you proud atheists off that some people need religion just because you don't, ya needs to chill. 

Take the Catholic church for example, it feeds millions of hungry people around the world. But is also the richest entity on the planet, and no doubt is far from perfect. Things that involve humans, are flawed, because we are. Does that make a god any less probable? Not to me, but to some it might.

I was born affiliated with a religion, but found my own path, to what inspires me, and makes me a better person. IF being an atheist makes you a better person, do you. But don't push your thoughts, and ideals on to others, and chastise them when they fail to see it your way, because then aren't you becoming exactly what you stand against? 

Ok...here we go.



No. Its not. Heres why. EVERY NOTION OF GOD was created in the context of a religion. The people that say god wants women to be wearing robes or the god that wants you to wait until marriage to have sex or the god that you have to pray to 5 times a year or the god that has 6 arms are ALL in the context of a religion. 




Without religion there is no god.




These people LIE to themselves saying, I believe in god but not religion...




that makes NO sense.




The god you believe in was CRAFTED by a religion. Lets say you're are raised as a muslim but you don't want to follow the religion anymore...do you still pray 5x a day? or do you only think god wants women to do certain things? or do you think god only answers certain types of prayer? Or what do you think happens to you when you die? Isn't that crafted by a religion too? 




Thats the point. Gods exist ONLY in religion. Those who disagree are simply lying to themselves. They want the privilege of being associated to a god but don't want to follow the rules of the religion they got their god from.




I do believe in myself. I'm a sucker for love. and I love to take care of people. I like doing nice things. Wearing nice clothes. Sleeping with bad women. I love it all. 




I just don't accept ideology that fails to supply its claims with facts.




Additionally, moral codes are NOT created by religion. There is a reason we don't stone people to death in this country any more. Society crafts its own religious doctrines over time to fit its needs. Morality is derived from people working together to derive a way to best suit the needs of all people.




Look into social contract theory. Read some philosophy. Morality is observed in all social animals. Humans are not an exception. To say that religion is responsible for it all is incredibly inaccurate. 




Religion is an umbrella for these things. Not the cause of them. If you've noticed, no one in this country makes laws based on kings and queens anymore. But I guess to you that means kings and queens started it all. 




Law as you know it as an american is based on English Black Law and codified law around the time of the magna carta. Do your research. 




Marriage existed long before any sort of religious context. Religion has attempted to hijack the concept of marriage when it started as a secular concept. 




Some people need gossip blogs to read every day but does that make them any more useful? I'm not knocking anyones source of motivation but to separate the goals of inspiration of religion from the supernatural and realistically impossible claims to which there is no evidence...and I mean NO EVIDENCE, then that is functionally and supremely inconsiderate. 




Furthermore, don't threaten me.




To disagree is one thing but to insinuate that i'm infringing on you is another. 




The catholic church doing good things doesn't mean you get to overlook the bad things. They influence a lot of people. They told people not to use condoms or to listen to scientists about receiving treatment or understanding modern scientific theory...to the obvious thing they do that they sweep under the rug




I mean hell there are top catholics that think Galileo was wrong... like they said this TWO months ago. http://www.chicagotribune...04,0,1142889.story 

In any case this is all besides the point.




What does doing good or bad have to do with anything? You don't have to be religious to help people and you don't have to be an atheist to be bad. NONE of this suggests that there is a god anyways. Its just people acting under the premise that there is one.




 If the fact that the catholic church exists is proof of god then the fact other religions exist is proof of their gods...and I know you don't agree with that. 




I'm not pushing my thoughts. I'm asking for people to provide evidence for their thoughts. Otherwise you're just free to do and say what you want and no one can check you on it. 




What if white people weren't forced to understand black people aren't as bad as they think they are? What if they just thought they could burn us at the stake because we were turned black because of a curse? But to you, you just want to be free to do whatever you want to say for no reason at all or without justification. Its illogical because religion is the only thing where you suspend your doubt and rationale that you apply in every other decision or thought you encounter otherwise. 




Be a good person for goodness sake. Thats the point here. You dont need a religion to do that. Especially one that you don't even follow completely. 

 

[carloszilla]

My reponse to this thread:


JESUS CHRIST THIS THREAD IS LONG

 

[|A-Man|]

Look what I missed out on. Not gonna bother after looking at this last page.

 

[pump fake]

B smooth what religion do you follow? Just curious.

 

[pleasurephd]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

Originally Posted by PleasurePhD

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

I don't know why people can't get this.

I am also a pacifist, but I still understand the current necessity for having a strong military. I still respect those that truly went to the military because they thought they were defending our country and have been killed. If for any other reason, don't expect me to give props. Your career choice doesn't mean anyone should respect you as a person. Plenty of bad people in all careers.

I feel like as soon as you say anything against the military and how effed up it can be or how unnecessary it should actually be, seeing how the average citizen looks down on violence and we are a highly intelligent species who should be able to figure out our problems without violence, people automatically say you hate America and #!@+ our country like they are even a native.

Not to stroke your ego or anything but studies indicate that atheists tend to be less nationalistic or patriotic.
Its not because they don't love their country, its more so that they don't fall into blind love affairs with propaganda and mental tricks to persuade people from doing things.

Remember all those skeptics at the beginning of the Iraq war? Why aren't we patting them on the back for trying to warn us? 

Makes sense. I don't consider myself atheist, but I do know a good amount that are a lot less patriotic. I mean I don't really consider them unpatriotic because they really do love America, and are all in career fields that try to support the growth and development of America. So if anything I think they are more patriotic.

But, I guess they are CONSIDERED less patriotic just because they don't drive a big gas guzzling white Ford or Chevy with an American flag on the antenna and back windshield.

 

[iamjusayn]

Originally Posted by sillyputty

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

Richard Dawkins presented us facts from his wheel chair that God doesn't exist...all those idiots use their intelligence to argue against God rather than formulating something with true utility for the human race...what scientific contributions have they made to bettering life on earth? What a true waste of intelligence...its not wonder these men aren't believers...they let their fellow men starve to death in the streets so they can make hypothetical musings about God. 



have any of those books allowed greater understanding between people with differences? What is the point of theoretical research that supposedly proves God doesn't exist? 

WHERE ARE YOUR BOOKS ANTON?  

Richard Dawkins isn't a para/quadriplegic. He is capable of up-right bipedal motion. 


Bruh...what??? 




You asked for an author talking about atheism...you picked ONE author... but upset at what they talked about? 

...then said they would be better writing about something you want them to write about? 

What scientific contributions have they made? 




What scientific contributions has Kobe bryant made? Jay-Z? Barack Obama? MLK Jr? Thurgood Marshall? Frederick Douglass. Dubois? 




Oh they didn't contribute anything scientifically so they're wastes of people too. 




What type of argument is that? 




So it invalidates their argument because they're not scientists? So all authors should be scientists? They don't talk about what you want them to so that makes them invalid? 

If nothing else, atheist writers have encouraged people to stop waiting on change that won't come by them sitting around. They have encouraged people to do things not for the reward of a heaven or hell or praise from a god but to do good work for the sake of doing good work and helping others. 




Are you asserting that no atheist has ever done community service? 


Dawkins is actually an evolutionary biologist. Sam Harris is a neuroscientist with an emphasis in social interaction. These two people alone have done more to teach us about ourselves than you have by attempting to discredit them with one sentence. 

If they are wrong for making hypothetical musings, are your musings all facts supported by evidence? 




And whats the point? Well do you care if anything you think is true or real, or is it only true and real because you say it is? 




If thats the case then I think the moon is made of cheese and the earth was created in 6 days and god (the all powerful one) got TIRED... and took a break on the 7th day. I also think god is a member of the AFL-CIO because he rested. 

 

[pleasurephd]

Originally Posted by So Nyuh Shi Dae

Sounds like you're a deist, PleasurePhD.

Hmm... I guess I could be now that I think of it, but I really don't want to classify my thoughts into anything. Especially since I feel open to many different points of view. I feel like having a mix of opinions is a good thing and helps you understand problems from various viewpoints. That being said I definitely am not open or receptive to B.S. whether or not people hold that B.S. with the highest regard. So certain things that people argue for I just can't agree or even compromise with.

 

[eashawty]

i wouldnt say im an atheist, but i cant say that 100% sure there is a god

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by PleasurePhD

Originally Posted by So Nyuh Shi Dae

Sounds like you're a deist, PleasurePhD.

Hmm... I guess I could be now that I think of it, but I really don't want to classify my thoughts into anything. Especially since I feel open to many different points of view. I feel like having a mix of opinions is a good thing and helps you understand problems from various viewpoints. That being said I definitely am not open or receptive to B.S. whether or not people hold that B.S. with the highest regard. So certain things that people argue for I just can't agree or even compromise with.

I feel the same way. I like understanding things from all angles then trying to assess what it is that I think I know or where I should make a conclusion. 

I don't like saying I'm an atheist...because there shouldn't really be a word for people that don't collect stamps or who don't live in america 

...

 

[iamjusayn]

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

yeah lemme go read my MCAT prep book...so I can learn some of your precious irreplaceable facts....why don't you suggest me some agnostic reading material...I'm sure your reading materials are full of interesting significant FACTS.



tell me what I do know Anton...

lolol now you just sound salty and you'd fail the MCATs stop that

Asking for reading material is salty? How so? I'm asking you to support your agnosticism with reading material and you can't even do that clown!



Then you resort back to your finger pointing by calling me 'salty' when I ask you for a legitimate reference. 

and you have the nerve to tell me what I know and don't know and to READ?  

 

My brain on LSD-25>>>>anything you'll learn in med school 

 

[pleasurephd]

Originally Posted by smoke ya later

Originally Posted by Hizzle

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202


son posted all those graphs like they mean something. nobody wants to read that bull !%!@..

who do you think conducted those surveys? The Worldwide Atheist Association ?

 

%@#@ outta here 

Here is some real material for real inquiring people...not machine-people with vendettas against God posting graphs from their Atheist text books. 

http://fractalontology.wordpress.com/

Quite possibly the dumbest post I've seen on NT. "All those facts you posted from major research institutions are stupid bro herp derp...Errrr, look at this blog for the realness." Also, I've read constantly in this thread how you think you're on another level above other individuals intellectually, but in those same posts it's apparent you don't even know the difference between your and you're. You're an idiot.

It's hilarious and so effing frustrating when people post links to garbage sites, videos, books, or blogs and think that just because something looks, sounds, or is written professionally that it is true knowledge. They take it as fact cause the so called author considers himself an expert in the area. That same author will just reference other "experts" that have non-verified and untested information for his credible sources.

Wake up people I can make a website or even get a book published on just about anything. This doesn't mean that it's true. Most websites and books are OPINION. NOT FACT.

Until you guys post something with credible sources or something that has been tested against peer reviews and followed the scientific method for analysis, no one with a brain will listen to you.

So please just stop posting garbage as your source of credibility. Look into some legit peer reviewed journals.