2014-15 Official Lakers Season Thread, Vol: We Love Each Other

[BIG LEEMELONE]

He's a shoot first pg. But so is bledsoe

 

[rck3sactown]

 

Y'all don't want him...

Especially with a fully healthy Kobe...

And what he is probably gonna command, he's not worth it

Why ?

What's the deal, is he a chuck, knucklehead, turnover prone etc etc....what are the negatives because I've only seen a handful of kings games ?

shoot first, quick to look off players and then puts himself in horrible positions, defense is non existent (comes with being like 4 feet tall I guess), isn't the greatest decision maker,

 

[grandtheftbike]

he's short. i prefer my pgs 6'0 or taller (sorry Laker fans, we can never play pick up together)

 

[darthska]

Green is the quintessential "3 and D" player.

Kawhi is a really good defensive player...I suppose he gets the "defensive stopper" label.

Duncan and Splitter are good rim protectors.

Manu is still pretty good defensively.

Heat, uh just LeBron, Bosh and Birdman.

It just happened that they got roasted because Battier and Ray Allen each lost a step, Wade doesn't give consistent effort, Chalmers is whatever. The Heat got away with it for three rounds (remember, they were a relatiely pedestrian defensive team this past season) because they faced the Bobcats, Nets and Pacers. They face a top five offensive team and got embarrassed.

So the question was, "Who is the defensive stopper?"

P's answer, for the Spurs: "Green, Duncan, Splitter, maybe Kawhi."

Who is THE GUY? Because that's... 4 guys.

Which is exactly my point.

P's answer for the Heat? The Big 3. Obvious answer, but that's still too many for there to be "a defensive stopper", like CP originally asked about the Pau/Kobe/Melo/Randle possibility.

CP's answer?

Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green = perimeter stoppers.

Duncan and Splitter down low.

Parker and Diaw and Manu just do their jobs well enough, and are covered by those previous 4.


LeBron and Bosh and Chalmers are pretty good, Birdman helps when he's healthy. Wade for about 5 minutes a game.

Leonard, Green, Duncan, Splitter, Parker, Diaw, Manu, and a partridge in a pear tree. 'The defensive stopper' is the entire city of San Antonio. 

The Heat? Bron, Bosh, Chalmers, Birdman, Wade, Alonzo Mourning, TBug, Dan Majerle, Glen Rice... 

You guys made my point for me: great defensive teams don't HAVE 'the defensive stopper'. They have TEAM DEFENSE, implemented by the coach and executed by guys who want to.

Now THAT could be what you point to as a defensive liability: of those 4 guys, only Kobe really strikes me as a guy who takes pride in defense. I'm confident Randle will, but for the here and now, only Kobe, of those 4.

"OK, fine, Ska. Still, though, Kobe's infinity years old." So's Duncan. But the TEAM... as implemented by the COACH...

 

[rck3sactown]

depending on shoes I think I can pass for 6'0 

but I would be playing out of position 

 

[MambaMentality824]

So the question was, "Who is the defensive stopper?"

P's answer, for the Spurs: "Green, Duncan, Splitter, maybe Kawhi."

Who is THE GUY? Because that's... 4 guys.

Which is exactly my point.

P's answer for the Heat? The Big 3. Obviousl answer, but that's still too many for there to be "a defensive stopper", like CP originally asked about the Pau/Kobe/Melo/Randle possibility.

CP's answer?
Leonard, Green, Duncan, Splitter, Parker, Diaw, Manu, and a partridge in a pear tree. 'The defensive stopper' is the entire city of San Antonio. 

The Heat? Bron, Bosh, Chalmers, Birdman, Wade, Alonzo Mourning, TBug, Dan Majerle, Glen Rice... 

You guys made my point for me: great defensive teams don't HAVE 'the defensive stopper'. They have TEAM DEFENSE, implemented by the coach and executed by guys who want to.

Now THAT could be what you point to as a defensive liability: of those 4 guys, only Kobe really strikes me as a guy who takes pride in defense. I'm confident Randle will, but for the here and now, only Kobe, of those 4.

"OK, fine, Ska. Still, though, Kobe's infinity years old." So's Duncan. But the TEAM... as implemented by the COACH...

I see what you are saying, but at the same time what CP and P are saying is that although those teams might not have one single defensive stopper, those players they mentioned are all pretty good defensive players in their own right. Whereas with us, Kobe/Pau/Randle/Anthony are turnstiles for the most part at this point. Even though I think Melo being a bad defender is a false notion that too many believe to be true. I've seen dude lock up on plenty of occasions, he has the strength and foot speed to stay with most when he's locked in. He just has to be locked in

 

[pmatic]

CP and I listed multiple players in a vaccumm defensively that team up to form (very) good defensive teams.

Now evaluate Kobe, Pau, Melo and Randle individually on defense. Yeah.

 

[CP1708]

Green is the quintessential "3 and D" player.


Kawhi is a really good defensive player...I suppose he gets the "defensive stopper" label.


Duncan and Splitter are good rim protectors.


Manu is still pretty good defensively.


Heat, uh just LeBron, Bosh and Birdman.


It just happened that they got roasted because Battier and Ray Allen each lost a step, Wade doesn't give consistent effort, Chalmers is whatever. The Heat got away with it for three rounds (remember, they were a relatiely pedestrian defensive team this past season) because they faced the Bobcats, Nets and Pacers. They face a top five offensive team and got embarrassed.

So the question was, "Who is the defensive stopper?"

P's answer, for the Spurs: "Green, Duncan, Splitter, maybe Kawhi."

Who is THE GUY? Because that's... 4 guys.

Which is exactly my point.

P's answer for the Heat? The Big 3. Obviousl answer, but that's still too many for there to be "a defensive stopper", like CP originally asked about the Pau/Kobe/Melo/Randle possibility.

CP's answer?

Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green = perimeter stoppers.


Duncan and Splitter down low.


Parker and Diaw and Manu just do their jobs well enough, and are covered by those previous 4.



LeBron and Bosh and Chalmers are pretty good, Birdman helps when he's healthy. Wade for about 5 minutes a game.

Leonard, Green, Duncan, Splitter, Parker, Diaw, Manu, and a partridge in a pear tree. 'The defensive stopper' is the entire city of San Antonio. 

The Heat? Bron, Bosh, Chalmers, Birdman, Wade, Alonzo Mourning, TBug, Dan Majerle, Glen Rice... 

You guys made my point for me: great defensive teams don't HAVE 'the defensive stopper'. They have TEAM DEFENSE, implemented by the coach and executed by guys who want to.

Now THAT could be what you point to as a defensive liability: of those 4 guys, only Kobe really strikes me as a guy who takes pride in defense. I'm confident Randle will, but for the here and now, only Kobe, of those 4.

"OK, fine, Ska. Still, though, Kobe's infinity years old." So's Duncan. But the TEAM... as implemented by the COACH...

Naw man. Kawhi is the "stopper" as evidenced by the Finals and squaring off with LeBron-Durant, etc. But the "stopper" can't then go and guard Centers. Same as Kobe locking up AI, but need Shaq to control the big men.

Bron guards everyone from Tony Parker to Pau Gasol, if that's not a stopper, I don't know what is.


The point is, a stopper is merely a term for someone you can build your defense around. Wallace was a lockdown, and Prince, Billups, Rip, Sheed played around that.

Bowen was a lockdown with Duncan.

KG was lockdown, and Rondo, Pierce, Ray and Perk wheeled around that. But the lockdown guy was the hub the defensive is mastered off of.

Noah is that hub for the Bulls.


There is no hub in Pau, Randle, Melo, and Kobe. I don't give a **** if you have Pop, Thibs, Michael Cooper, or Shaft coaching, those 4 ain't stopping a High School team from scoring. It would be outrageous. To think otherwise in any shape or form is absurd. Those 4 are cheddar, mixed with swiss, slathered in miracle whip and cement.

 

[CP1708]

How do you guys get there 40 seconds before me? I type too damn long and come in second every time. ****.

 

[junglejim]

 

[kal-el-8]

I want Eric Bledsoe and Lance.

Melo isn't getting us anywhere imo.

 

[essential1]

I have a plan....Also involves a wink wink deal.

Let's say Melo signs here.. We convince him to leave $2mil on the table in first year, so the first year salary would be $20mil. Would end up with a 4 year / $84mil deal. With a stretch provision of Nash, cap holds, Kobe, Randle, Marshall, Sacre, Kelly, Clarkson it will leave us with exactly $9mil in cap space.

With that $9mil we use it on Isaiah Thomas.

Then we give Pau a 1 year deal at the Mid-Level Exception, and allows us to retain his bird rights. Because we do not have any cap space in 2015-16 with Melo/Kobe/IT2, we can retain Pau for another 1 year contract at $12mil, basically recouping the money he gave up to get a better team.


We'd roll out

PG: Isaiah Thomas / Kendall Marshall / Jordan Clarkson
SG: Kobe Bryant
SF: Carmelo Anthony
PF: Julius Randle / Ryan Kelly
C: Pau Gasol / Robert Sacre


Get some wing players for minimum and we are in the playoffs.

 

[darthska]

I think I have unfairly high hopes for Randle. 

My hopes are based on what I've seen from him at UK, but still, I really think he's goona be feasting in like 2-3 years. Like "Dwight who? Love what?" type feasting. DMC's production, minus the antics.

Actually... damn... I think the big man talk in like 3 years will pretty much be DMC, Randle, Eyebrows... and Love.

UK strong. 

 

 

[kal-el-8]

 
Dave McMenamin  ‏@mcten   45s

Hearing that James Worthy will be a part of the Lakers' pitch to Carmelo Anthony today.

They Listened!

 

[grandtheftbike]

midas whale invite dfish to make a sales pitch too

oh wait

 

[darthska]

I have a plan....Also involves a wink wink deal.

Let's say Melo signs here.. We convince him to leave $2mil on the table in first year, so the first year salary would be $20mil. With a stretch provision of Nash, cap holds, Kobe, Randle, Marshall, Sacre, Kelly, Clarkson it will leave us with exactly $9mil in cap space.

With that $9mil we use it on Isaiah Thomas.

Then we give Pau a 1 year deal at the Mid-Level Exception, and allows us to retain his bird rights. Because we do not have any cap space, we can retain Pau for another 1 year contract at $12mil, basically recouping the money he gave up to get a better team.


We'd roll out

PG: Isaiah Thomas / Kendall Marshall / Jordan Clarkson
SG: Kobe Bryant
SF: Carmelo Anthony
PF: Julius Randle / Ryan Kelly
C: Pau Gasol / Robert Sacre

I'll have to consult w/ P and CP and Senor on the feasibility of the logistics there, but I could get behind that team, for real.

 

[kal-el-8]

midas whale invite dfish to make a sales pitch too

oh wait

 

[mrdieselfuel09]

I have a plan....Also involves a wink wink deal.

Let's say Melo signs here.. We convince him to leave $2mil on the table in first year, so the first year salary would be $20mil. Would end up with a 4 year / $84mil deal. With a stretch provision of Nash, cap holds, Kobe, Randle, Marshall, Sacre, Kelly, Clarkson it will leave us with exactly $9mil in cap space.

With that $9mil we use it on Isaiah Thomas.

Then we give Pau a 1 year deal at the Mid-Level Exception, and allows us to retain his bird rights. Because we do not have any cap space in 2015-16 with Melo/Kobe/IT2, we can retain Pau for another 1 year contract at $12mil, basically recouping the money he gave up to get a better team.


We'd roll out

PG: Isaiah Thomas / Kendall Marshall / Jordan Clarkson
SG: Kobe Bryant
SF: Carmelo Anthony
PF: Julius Randle / Ryan Kelly
C: Pau Gasol / Robert Sacre


Get some wing players for minimum and we are in the playoffs.

My man...

 

[bravelude]

Lance is like JR smith in attitude. whats so good about bledsoe? why bring him up lol.

and stop saying we need a lock in defender, do u folks play basket or realize that defense is a collaborative effort? dfisher, harper all got burned plenty of times, but they still win rings.

melos issue isnt really on defense - well maybe a little. its his desire to purely want to score. he wont defer, he wont care about the shot he takes, he looks good racking up points, but he isnt the type to create. to say the least, he is no where close to LBJ, and he is definitely not a team player. this aint just from his NY days as so many people only remember.

 

[essential1]

I'll have to consult w/ P and CP and Senor on the feasibility of the logistics there, but I could get behind that team, for real.

From July of last year

He could accept the veteran's minimum of $1.45 million for 2014-15, allowing the Lakers to sign two big-name guys next summer and set themselves up for another coup in the summer of 2015 with spending power to add another big-ticket player, when LaMarcus Aldridge, Marc Gasol, Kevin Love and Rajon Rondo could be free agents.

If the Lakers pay Bryant $1.45 million in 2014-15, they would still have his "Bird rights," enabling them to pay him up to $19.5 million for the 2015-16 season, when he will be 37 years old. He would basically average $10.5 million over those two seasons.

Not to be forgotten, Pau Gasol could do the same exact thing in a year, if he's so inclined.

Of course there's one catch. The Lakers couldn't promise Bryant or Gasol that second year at $19.5 million because a prearranged deal would be illegal under the rules of the collective-bargaining agreement.

Wink-wink-nudge-nudge time.

http://articles.latimes.com/2013/jul/23/sports/la-sp-lakers-2014-20130724



Print article.. Highlights passage, gives to Pau while discussing contract

 

[CP1708]

PG: Isaiah Thomas / Kendall Marshall / Jordan Clarkson
SG: Kobe Bryant
SF: Carmelo Anthony
PF: Julius Randle / Ryan Kelly
C: Pau Gasol / Robert Sacre

Ladies and gentlemen, Robert Sacre is the absolute best defender on your LA Lakers and it is not even close.


I get your idea, you stacked up assets at least, I hear you. But, if I may.....


Shoot first PG
Shoot always SG
Shoot always SF
Offensively gifted Rookie PF
Ball needy C


Anyone notice anything? Anything at all?


Kendall Marshall and Ryan Kelly off the bench, neither are defensive help.

Leaving just Sacre, and MAAAAAAAYBE the rookie PG who might have some skill on the defensive side.



Guys, the NBA has two halves of a court. I know we love points, and offense sells, etc etc, but that team would look like a bunch of drunk James Harden's on defense.

 

[kingjaffejo]

So is the meeting over already or what?

 

[CP1708]

He could accept the veteran's minimum of $1.45 million for 2014-15

If the Lakers pay Bryant $1.45 million in 2014-15, they would still have his "Bird rights," enabling them to pay him up to $19.5 million for the 2015-16 season, when he will be 37 years old. He would basically average $10.5 million over those two seasons.

Kobe did accept the 1.45 offer.

Times 33.

 

[mrdieselfuel09]

PG: Isaiah Thomas / Kendall Marshall / Jordan Clarkson
SG: Kobe Bryant
SF: Carmelo Anthony
PF: Julius Randle / Ryan Kelly
C: Pau Gasol / Robert Sacre

Ladies and gentlemen, Robert Sacre is the absolute best defender on your LA Lakers and it is not even close.


I get your idea, you stacked up assets at least, I hear you. But, if I may.....


Shoot first PG
Shoot always SG
Shoot always SF
Offensively gifted Rookie PF
Ball needy C


Anyone notice anything? Anything at all?


Kendall Marshall and Ryan Kelly off the bench, neither are defensive help.

Leaving just Sacre, and MAAAAAAAYBE the rookie PG who might have some skill on the defensive side.



Guys, the NBA has two halves of a court. I know we love points, and offense sells, etc etc, but that team would look like a bunch of drunk James Harden's on defense.

Yes, I noticed MDA is with us without being with us.

With that said we just have to outshoot the team.

 

[essential1]

PG: Isaiah Thomas / Kendall Marshall / Jordan Clarkson
SG: Kobe Bryant
SF: Carmelo Anthony
PF: Julius Randle / Ryan Kelly
C: Pau Gasol / Robert Sacre

Ladies and gentlemen, Robert Sacre is the absolute best defender on your LA Lakers and it is not even close.


I get your idea, you stacked up assets at least, I hear you. But, if I may.....


Shoot first PG
Shoot always SG
Shoot always SF
Offensively gifted Rookie PF
Ball needy C


Anyone notice anything? Anything at all?


Kendall Marshall and Ryan Kelly off the bench, neither are defensive help.

Leaving just Sacre, and MAAAAAAAYBE the rookie PG who might have some skill on the defensive side.



Guys, the NBA has two halves of a court. I know we love points, and offense sells, etc etc, but that team would look like a bunch of drunk James Harden's on defense.

If you sign Melo it's to win now.

It's that or Melo, and Pau taking up the rest of the cap space

And your starting lineup is

Marshall - Kobe - Melo - Randle - Pau.



It's a way to circumvent what we have for the next 2 years, to give it a go at winning. Then you go into 2016-17 with Melo, IT & Randle and close to $30mil in cap space because you wouldn't have been able to sign any one significant in 2015-16.