2016 MLB thread. THE CUBS HAVE BROKEN THE CURSE! Chicago Cubs are your 2016 World Series champions

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I didn't realize that large father actually tested positive for steroids :lol:

How does he seem to get a free pass? :lol:
 
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Cause he was mentioned in the same 2003 report as A-Rod. Got fortunate there was a bigger target next to him.
 
madj55 said:
Cause he was mentioned in the same 2003 report as A-Rod. Got fortunate there was a bigger target next to him.
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Because no one knows the details of his failed test. He was just part of the % that failed the test so that Major League Baseball started the drug program.
 
Jewbacca2 said:
I didn't realize that large father actually tested positive for steroids :lol:

How does he seem to get a free pass? :lol:
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Because he isn't a douche like A Rod or Bonds
But tbh half the league took peds or steroids around that time, I don't get the witch hunts either
Why would they choose the better roided up guy to punish than the one who roided up but still isn't as good? :lol: more like the league was trying to save face from what everyone knew
 
Manny Ramirez, former Red Sox left fielder (2001-08): "You know very well the career David has had, but he was not yet the player he is now [when he joined the Sox in 2003]. He was not Big Papi then. When he came over and we began to see him work, we saw he had the potential, the power, and we started working on some things. We went to the cage together and we learned from each other. He is a complete hitter. He can hit for average, he can hit home runs, he can be a clutch hitter, he can get you RBIs. David Ortiz is among the best ever -- him and Barry Bonds. The moment I saw him, I told him he would also reach 500 home runs, and he said, 'No, I don't think I can ever do that.' I told him he certainly was going to get them, and look what happened."
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I'm not saying Ortiz never took PEDs (he probably did, like many other players from that era), but that whole situation was a joke.


The only drug test that Ortiz failed was a survey test conducted in 2003. The purpose of this test wasn’t to catch individuals who were using PEDs. The purpose of the test was to get a general idea of how many people were using PEDs, and if that number was over a certain threshold, it triggered a mandatory drug testing program (this program went into place anyway due to pressure from lawmakers, but that’s beside the point). Promises were made that any failed tests would not be linked to any individual, but names were eventually leaked to the New York Times in 2009. Ortiz was one of the names leaked, along with Alex Rodriguez and Manny Ramirez.

So, that means that Ortiz used PEDs, right? Well, not exactly. And it’s because of the nature of the test, and the veracity of the results. For example:

Both Major League Baseball and the MLBPA have stated that the number of positive tests from the survey was 96. The list that the New York Times got access to had 104 names on it. This calls into question the accuracy of the list the NYT saw. It is obviously incorrect in terms of the overall number; it may also be incorrect in terms of the names.

The MLBPA contested 13 of the 96 positive tests, but it’s unclear which 13 players were the subject of this dispute.

The list that the NYT got access to was compiled by the federal government, who exceeded their Constitutional authority. Agents were given warrants to seize drug samples and test results for just the 10 players involved in the BALCO investigation. We have no way of knowing whether the government properly obtained the information they used to compile the list, or what information it was - was it samples, lab records, computer records, or something else?

Because it was a survey test, players were not told what they tested positive for. A player could have tested positive for PEDs, or a masking agent, or something else entirely. They could have been deliberately popping Winstrol, or they might have taken something they bought at GNC that lacked quality control and had a banned substance in it. Whether it was the former or the latter, there was no reason for anyone to care, because there were no consequences for failing the test, so the fact that testing was going on wouldn’t have caused anyone to be diligent about what they were putting in their body in the same way that they need to be now.

When his positive 2003 test was initially reported by the New York Times in 2009 , Ortiz held a press conference at Yankee Stadium (where the Sox were playing at the time). He denied ever buying or using steroids, but admitted to being careless with supplements, and apologized to fans, players, etc., for the distraction the report caused. He said that he met with the union in 2004, but they did not tell him that he tested positive, and that the union decided to reveal that he had a positive test only after the Times report was published.

The union released a statement around the same time explaining that the list of 104 did not reflect the true number: that there were 96 tests that MLB considered positive, but they believed there were only 83 positive tests, and that the figure of 83 constituted the number of positive tests, not the number of players who tested positive. They also said this:

“Substantial scientific questions exist as to the interpretation of some of the 2003 test results. The more definitive methods that are utilized by the lab that administers the current Drug Agreement were not utilized by the lab responsible for the anonymous testing program in 2003. The collective bargaining parties did not pursue definitive answers regarding these inconclusive results, since those answers were unnecessary to the administration of the 2003 program.

“In 2003, legally available nutritional supplements could trigger an initial ‘positive’ test under our program. To account for this, each ‘test’ conducted in 2003 actually consisted of a pair of collections -- the first was unannounced and random, the second was approximately seven days later, with the player advised to cease taking supplements during the interim. Under the 2003 program, a test could be initially reported as ‘positive,’ but not treated as such by the bargaining parties on account of the second test.”

The unfortunate step that Ortiz took was to assure everyone that he was going to get to the bottom of what had happened. Because the list is sealed by court order, there’s nothing he can do to “get to the bottom of it,” so when he failed to do so, and didn’t want to talk about it, it became something of a running joke, similar to how O.J. said he was going to find the real killers. He can’t be told what he tested positive for because the list was supposed to be confidential, even though that confidentiality was breached when the list was leaked to the NYT.

The parties subject to the confidentiality agreement kept it confidential. The federal government, while investigating BALCO, seized all of the test results and compiled their own list based on everything they collected. It’s that list that was leaked

He was asked about it again in 2013 and responded angrily that no one would tell him what he tested positive for.
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"The purpose of the test was to get a general idea of how many people were using PEDs, and if that number was over a certain threshold, it triggered a mandatory drug testing program (this program went into place anyway due to pressure from lawmakers, but that’s beside the point)."

:lol: :lol: :lol:

I can't even with that
 
the big thing people keep saying about Ortiz is that he's such an ambassador of the game and face of the game. i think it's clear that's why he hasn't got the same treatment that Bonds and Arod have gotten. but as far as getting into the HOF, who knows. he'll likely face the same the criticism from those damn writers.
 
DeadsetAce said:
the big thing people keep saying about Ortiz is that he's such an ambassador of the game and face of the game. i think it's clear that's why he hasn't got the same treatment that Bonds and Arod have gotten. but as far as getting into the HOF, who knows. he'll likely face the same the criticism from those damn writers.
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Maybe bc it's NY radio, but people seem to believe over here that Ortiz is beloved in Boston/up North... and that's about it.

Ripken, Jeter and Mo resinated with more people across the country.
 
macbk said:
DeadsetAce said:
the big thing people keep saying about Ortiz is that he's such an ambassador of the game and face of the game. i think it's clear that's why he hasn't got the same treatment that Bonds and Arod have gotten. but as far as getting into the HOF, who knows. he'll likely face the same the criticism from those damn writers.
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Maybe bc it's NY radio, but people seem to believe over here that Ortiz is beloved in Boston/up North... and that's about it.

Ripken, Jeter and Mo resinated with more people across the country.
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definitely possible. i was just reading quotes from different people in baseball about Ortiz and that whole "ambassador of the game" kept popping up. granted, most of the guys are guys who are connected to ortiz in one way or another. but yeah, i don't know how other fans outside of Sox nation actually feel about him.
 
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Jewbacca2 said:
I didn't realize that large father actually tested positive for steroids :lol:

How does he seem to get a free pass? :lol:
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Compared to who? A-Rod, for example?

Most of us in this thread are between 18 and 35 years old; we all know A-Rod and Barry Bonds are interchangeable as 1A and 1B when it comes to all time greats. We all know these guys are Hall Of Fame players. Theyre the best players any of us have seen. Our eyes tell us that and so do their ridiculous stats. Yet they have only one ring between them. On top of that, their teammates and beat writers (the guys who have HOF votes) hated them due to their scumbag tendencies.

Theres a story out there about A-Rod when he was in Texas. When a game was out of hand and he had a friend on the opposing team up to bat, he would tip them pitches.

What this was all part of was a quid pro quo, according to the people I spoke with. Alex would tip his middle infielder buddy on the other team and the player on the other team would in turn tip Alex. What it was was slump insurance. You could count on your buddy to help you break out of your slump, if you're 0 for 3 or you've had a bad week. There was no intent to throw a game or change the outcome.

A-Rod was out here cheating his own teammates and playing his worst baseball when the stakes were highest. Bonds was a **** head to his teammates and the writers that traveled with the team. Beat writers never liked either of these guys which makes it's extremely easy to to spite them by leaving them off their ballot.
 
Jewbacca2 said:
"The purpose of the test was to get a general idea of how many people were using PEDs, and if that number was over a certain threshold, it triggered a mandatory drug testing program (this program went into place anyway due to pressure from lawmakers, but that’s beside the point)."

:lol: :lol: :lol:

I can't even with that
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What do you mean?
 
Oh, according to the MLB website the threshold was only 5%. :rofl:

And they claim that only 5% to 7% tested positive which seems hard to believe.
 
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