Dave Chappelle Netflix Specials

[osh kosh bosh]

Yes they are, because if you don't know either

1. Your child is too scared to tell you for a variety of reasons.
2. Your negligent and don't even notice the kid.

However you cut it bad parent. Pay attention to your kids. Basically what you're saying is a parent has full jurisdiction over a teenagers identity?

You might as well send them to conversion camps.

I literally could not care less about your opinions on parent hood.

It's irrelevant. We don't adjudicate parenting via public school teachers.

 

[WASHED KING]

I literally could not care less about your opinions on parent hood.

It's irrelevant. We don't adjudicate parenting via public school teachers.

And your opinions about education is also irrelevant

Since we can't talk about things we're not involved in.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

This just seems on some level ridiculous to me

Unless I am an elementary school teacher, it is common for middle and high school students to see 5-9 different instructors in a day

Teachers in total at this level have nearly 200 students to look after. This was the case in my situation

So because I honor the request of one student, on strict guidelines, a request multiple other people have to grant, but I as a teacher choosing not to run to the parents is somehow akin to a therapist socially transitioning a child. This is basically what your argument reads like. I'm not hiding anything, if they want to ask me, I will be honest. If at a parent-teacher conference they inquire if anything unusual happens, I will be honest. But I am just not opting into playing snitch on a kid that is not disrupting my classroom because of some sense of responsibility to run and tell the parents.

i mean that's literally what it is, if you change the childs name and pronouns you are socially transitioning a child.

im glad to hear you wouldn't hide it if asked but I just don't know what gives a teacher the right to do this without consent in the first place.

Like if you are a parent of a child doing this, literally hundreds of people have to agree to honor, and at least over a dozen teachers and admins need to as well.

So I dunno, given all that could do worse, I just don't feel it is my place to play snitch to make up for a parent's shortcomings because I am so concerned with how bad honoring the kid's request will be because I assume the worse all the perils of gender theory when it comes to kids.

i just can't agree, i dunno it just seems totally indefensible to me.

Home school kids if you don't trust me then...or....or....be a parent your kids feel can tell this stuff.

so because I don't want unqualified teachers performing psychological interventions on my child behind my back.
I need to home school them?

unless im misreading
imo that's wild attitude to have and that kind of attitude just begs for a backlash that will make it harder for kids with gender dysphoria in the future.

 

[mplsdunk]

Teachers reporting pronouns and sexual orientation is Some Florida/Texas authoritarian stuff.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

And your opinions about education is also irrelevant

Since we can't talk about things we're not involved in.

you talking incredibly spicy for a public employee.
my opinions on the education of my children at local public school paid for with my tax dollars are totally relevant.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Teachers reporting pronouns and sexual orientation is Some Florida/Texas authoritarian stuff.

"hey unqualified teacher do not perform secret psychological interventions on a minor without my consent"

teacher: "how dare you, you authoritarian fascist!"


wut?


and for the 50 the time I didn't say anything about orientation.

 

[mplsdunk]

This isn’t even an issue.

It’s just some fake culture war bs.

 

[WASHED KING]

you talking incredibly spicy for a public employee.
my opinions on the education of my children at local public school paid for with my tax dollars are totally relevant.

Paying taxes =/= having control of public education.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

This isn’t even an issue.

It’s just some fake culture war bs.

i don't know if it's a pervasive issue, i like to think most teachers would not do this.

i was responding to something DCAllAfrican said was happening at a school.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Paying taxes =/= having control of public education.

i didn't say "having control "
i said my opinions are "relevant". and of course, they are... its public school.

 

[1995]

Teachers reporting pronouns and sexual orientation is Some Florida/Texas authoritarian stuff.

It sounds like that because that's exactly what it is

 

[osh kosh bosh]

It sounds like that because that's exactly what it is

Florida state Rep. Joe Harding (R) on Tuesday withdrew an amendment to his Parental Rights in Education act —
known to its critics as “Don’t Say Gay” — that would have required school principals to inform a student’s parents of their sexual orientation within six weeks of learning they were not straight."


luckily i did not say anything about reporting sexual orientation.

 

[WASHED KING]

Look....if a kid tells me they wants to go by Ben instead of Benjamin I need to drop everything I'm doing, immediately leave the classroom call the kids parents and make sure I have their CONSENT.

Because otherwise I'm performing manipulative social therapy on a child by shortening their name and it's not my place because I'm not a doctor or therapist and their parents pay taxes.

 

[RustyShackleford]

i mean that's literally what it is, if you change the childs name and pronouns you are socially transitioning a child.

im glad to hear you wouldn't hide it if asked but I just don't know what gives a teacher the right to do this without consent in the first place.

I am not a therapist, it is not literally what a therapist does

I was a teacher am trying to foster an environment conducive to learning, and a therapist is giving direct mental health services

I live with an actual therapist, I don't think anything I do comes close to what she does. I said I will only honor that request under certain circumstances regarding the parameters of my job.

I am not here to make a judgment about the student's gender identity and whether it is good or bad. I'm here to teach them.

But sure, strip away all the nuance to make this comparison work.

i just can't agree, i dunno it just seems totally indefensible to me.

And I think your position is totally indefensible and not reasonable

so because I don't want unqualified teachers performing psychological interventions on my child behind my back.
I need to home school them?

unless im misreading
imo that's wild attitude to have and that kind of attitude just begs for a backlash that will make it harder for kids with gender dysphoria in the future.

I am referring to your comment about trusting rando teachers to make decisions.

Parents trust rando teachers to make all sort of decisions, from the curriculum on down. Conservatives now want them to get dudes and be put on the line to make life and death decisions

So I am saying, if a parent can't deal with not trusting a teacher's judgment in school, then they have an option available to them. If they don't want to, or can't take that option, fine, but sending your kids to school inherently means you are placing trust into teachers.

Sorry, simply not buying this unless you are actively outing kids to their parents, you are hurting kids in the future. Just seems buried in this claim is the assumption of "hey, some kids are just be confused or faking it and we gotta weed those out" to protect the real ones

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Look....if a kid tells me they wants to go by Ben instead of Benjamin I need to drop everything I'm doing, immediately leave the classroom call the kids parents and make sure I have their CONSENT.

Because otherwise I'm performing manipulative social therapy on a child by shortening their name and it's not my place because I'm not a doctor or therapist and their parents pay taxes.

don't play dumb, and stop being cavalier

you know the difference between a common short form nickname.
and changing the gender identity of a child.

and it verges on transphobia, you are reducing social transition in order to help suffering from gender dysphoria.
to nickname change. cmon.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Look....if a kid tells me they wants to go by Ben instead of Benjamin I need to drop everything I'm doing, immediately leave the classroom call the kids parents and make sure I have their CONSENT.

Because otherwise I'm performing manipulative social therapy on a child by shortening their name and it's not my place because I'm not a doctor or therapist and their parents pay taxes.

I think Osh has a lot of underlying assumptions within his position

And that is a key part of why he feels the way he does

And instead of stating them, he is criticizing everyone for not making the same underlying assumption

And it has to do with his issue with progressive gender theory. Like if you are not actively fighting against it there is an issue.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I am not a therapist, it is not literally what a therapist does

I was a teacher am trying to foster an environment conducive to learning, and a therapist is giving direct mental health services

I live with an actual therapist, I don't think anything I do comes close to what she does. I said I will only honor that request under certain circumstances regarding the parameters of my job.

I am not here to make a judgment about the student's gender identity and whether it is good or bad. I'm here to teach them.

But sure, strip away all the nuance to make this comparison work.

if you chose to socially transition them you are making a judgment.
you can't elide, you are substituting your judgement for the parents judgement.
without any relevant expertise.

just because doing so would make your job more convenient doesn't make it justifiable.

I am referring to your comment about trusting rando teachers to make decisions.

Parents trust rando teachers to make all sort of decisions, from the curriculum on down. Conservatives now want them to get dudes and be put on the line to make life and death decisions

So I am saying, if a parent can't deal with not trusting a teacher's judgment in school, then they have an option available to them. If they don't want to, or can't take that option, fine, but sending your kids to school inherently means you are placing trust into teachers.

Sorry, simply not buying this unless you are actively outing kids to their parents, you are hurting kids in the future. Just seems buried in this claim is the assumption of "hey, some kids are just be confused or faking it and we gotta weed those out" to protect the real ones

I think there are limits to that trust.
and I think a pretty clear and obvious limit is psychological or medical interventions
that minors can't legally consent to without their parents.

 

[1995]

Florida state Rep. Joe Harding (R) on Tuesday withdrew an amendment to his Parental Rights in Education act —
known to its critics as “Don’t Say Gay” — that would have required school principals to inform a student’s parents of their sexual orientation within six weeks of learning they were not straight."


luckily i did not say anything about reporting sexual orientation.

Don't worry, they had your argument covered too

President Joe Biden, by speaking out against the bill, Harding said, is effectively "saying it's okay, for children as young as kindergarten, for someone within the school district to change their gender, change their name and be one person at school and be another person at home."As a parent, that is just shocking," he said.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I think Osh has a lot of underlying assumptions within his position

And that is a key part of why he feels the way he does

And instead of stating them, he is criticizing everyone for not making the same underlying assumption

And it has to do with his issue with progressive gender theory. Like if you are not actively fighting against it there is an issue.

you don't need to agree with any underlying assumptions.
you can think whatever you want about gender, social transition, it's a free country.

my point is don't impose those assumptions on children that are not your own.

don't fight for or against anything.
just leave it those decisions to the parents.

 

[RustyShackleford]

I think if *****s was more honest, and just stood on it that…they really don’t give af about “trans” or “lgbtq” issues or whatever, then **** would lead to realer and more productive discussions.

I can tell you right now, that stuff doesn’t concern me at all. I don’t really care that much about it, and naturally just find some of the stuff weird. And could never be guilted into accepting some of that stuff as norms to me, or anything else. And is that kinda f’d up? Well yeah.

On the same token, I’m also not naive to the othering of these folks, the vitriol they get, and where the climate could potentially lead to (again). Y’all kidding yourselves if you don’t see where this can lead to. Ugly places.

I’m not tripping on the “they/them” etc stuff. Let them have their thing, and represent themselves the way they want. If I’m talking to somebody, and I “misgender” them. Imma just call em by what they correct me as, and keep it moving. That’s one of the easiest things you can do.

Same way I don’t want nobody F’n up my name or any other thing. I feel like this **** has gotten so abstract, when it’s really simple.

It’s about respect and being human. I feel like ppl take the most polarizing and and extreme versions of these things, and just use them for culture war bs and weird thought experiences.

But on to Dave, I really don’t get why this is his go to now a days. It’s just TIRED, man. So many other things to joke about these days. Everybody can’t love you. And I think that’s what he ultimately wants/wanted. To be looked as “good” by everybody. But that doesn’t matter.

I won’t spoil his latest show, but he seemed to come to the same conclusions. Which is encouraging.

This discussion ain’t even about Dave anymore. He’s GOOD, and will always be good. It’s really interesting how this was successfully whipped
Up into hysteria tho. When we can all agree that members of all groups don’t have exactly the same beliefs. But it’s working, and it’s sad.

Famb this has been going on for like five years

A good chunk of his last special was just him whining about being criticized for his previous show

After the Closer, after promising to stop talking about it, he kept ranting because he seems upset that some people agreed with his critics

This thing is mainly about Dave's hurt feelings, so at some point, I think people have to wonder when he will give it a ******* rest.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Don't worry, they had your argument covered too

President Joe Biden, by speaking out against the bill, Harding said, is effectively "saying it's okay, for children as young as kindergarten, for someone within the school district to change their gender, change their name and be one person at school and be another person at home."As a parent, that is just shocking," he said.

that would be shocking to most parents. my assumption is that is not a widespread practice is schools in america.
if it was parents, would be rightfully shocked.

it's obviously inappropriate thats why republicans are using the idea to try and tar the democratic party with it.

 

[RustyShackleford]

you don't need to agree with any underlying assumptions.
you can think whatever you want about gender, social transition, it's a free country.

my point is don't impose those assumptions on children that are not your own.

don't fight for or against anything.
just leave it those decisions to the parents.

Cool

Then parents need to be up on their child's feelings and actions

I'm here to teach, not be their PI

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Cool

Then parents need to be up on their child's feelings and actions

I'm here to teach, not be their PI

like i said you don't need to snitch. (i think you should but I don't think you have to)
if they say they have gender dysphoria, or they say they think they are trans. i don't think you are obligated to tell anyone.

just don't socially transition them.
that way you won't need to lie or snitch about anything.

 

[RustyShackleford]

if you chose to socially transition them you are making a judgment.
you can't elide, you are substituting your judgement for the parents judgement.
without any relevant expertise.

just because doing so would make your job more convenient doesn't make it justifiable.

Nah, simply don't buy this

You are making an equivalency I don't think is reasonable

I think there are limits to that trust.
and I think a pretty clear and obvious limit is psychological or medical interventions
that minors can't legally consent to without their parents.

And again, I don't think you are being reasonable

I am saying I am here to teach and because I refuse to actively out students I am somehow imposing a psychological intervention on them

Just reads silly to me

 

[osh kosh bosh]

social transition is a psychological intervention.
it's what some therapists recommend as a way to treat gender dysphoria, which is a serious often time debilitating condition.


don't minimize,
don't pretend like it's some nickname
imo that is insulting to trans people. im sure they doin't view their gender identity like a silly nickname.

it's serious and important step that need a lot of consideration before anyone undertakes it.

miss griffin in homeroom 6 is not qualified to make that decision for a minor.