Do YOU THINK Other Players In The League Resent Steve Nash For.........

[roscoe p wallace]

I dont think the other players resent HIM persay, its not like he paid anyone off or did anything to cheat and win it, the MVP Race is like a race youdon't really run, so you can't win it yourself, its up to other people to decide who is the winner.

The people who gave him the award should be the ones getting any hate, so why would other players dislike or resent Steve Nash (who no doubt they have alltalked to quiet a bit, and considering I have only ever heard he is a great guy, they probably like him) when he wasn't the one giving himself the award?They prolly all really like Steve, and he probably feels very lucky to have 2 awards, but he no doubt realizes each of them could have gone to other people andit would have been just as fair.

My opinion, he deserves one, and its hard to say which one he deserves more, but he deserves one (and Shaq and KB got theres now....so can't everyone justbe happy?)

At least he picked it up while still in the playoffs, unlike Dirk.... thats the real tragedy.

 

[darthska]

I think the MVP every year should include the playoffs (not the Finals).

Because as of right now, the playoffs count for nothing in terms of defining great players from that year.

We use the regular season to pick our MVP.

We use the Finals to pick our Finals MVP.

So the playoffs mean nothing in terms of comparing players; nothing done there matters.

My way, if a player has a hot season, but sucks a fat one in the playoffs, pick someone else (because my way, the playoffs [before the Finals] count).

 

[lesfamilia]

I definitely won't call myself a big Nash fan by any means, but are people forgetting how bad the Suns were that season before he got there? They hadpretty much all the same guys that were around Nash for the longest and only won a fraction of the games. Say what you want, but Nash deserved at least one ofthose MVPs.

 

[shuges]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

SHUGES:

---

My bad. I mixed up the seasons. Shaq should have had the first. Hiss the second.

Nah, I'm saying I was shocked you thought wither should have went to Kobe. Rare to see such objectivity in the Sports forum on NikeTalk anywhere.
Nah, I've always been against that second MVP.

I'm one of the biggest Dirty Snake haters, but I really thought people had a legit argument for him winning the award that year.

If you remember, the Lakers weren't even supposed to go anywhere. Every pre-season analyst predicted them not even making the playoffs! From Lakers.com:

A Jackson return meant a reunion with Kobe Bryant, two of the key components from the Lakers 2000, 2001 and 2002 Championship seasons. And despite the return, as well as significant off-season moves by the franchise, fans and media alike remained skeptical as to whether the Lakers would even challenge for a spot in the postseason.
Yet, [PTI] YA BOY [/PTI] took the Lakers to the SEVENTH spot in the West. The WEST! And not even with a .500 record. The Lakers went 45-37 thatyear. Which is impressive when you consider the roster was made up of Kwame, Smush, Cookie Monster, Luke, a rookie Turiaf, a rookie Bynum, pre-Machine Sashaaka "Sasha sucks!", LO, McKie, Jim Jackson, Slava, Mihm, and Devean.

I always hear two definitions of what MVP means.

1. The guy who is the best overall player in the L.

Or 2. The guy who if you take him away from his team, that team would be lottery-bound.

Jack Bauer fit both descriptions to the letter.

So I can't see how Nash won when he did NOT fit either of those definitions. Cuz he damn sure wasn't the best player in the L and the Suns damn sureweren't lottery-bound if he wasn't there. Not with Amare (though he was hurt), Bosa, Marion, Raja (when he was actually good and not suckered by RosterGuard 24), Diaw (who won Most Improved), etc on that team.

 

[darthska]

And people have the naive audacity to hold you in the same breath as zodogg?

Fools!

No but seriously, I'm pretty sure zodogg's head would have exploded... not figuratively, but literally...if he were to ever type anything similar to what you just did.

I can respect your opinion, but that was a time when my antipathy for Kobe was at an all time high, fresh off of Shaq bouncing. So although I can see whereyou're coming from, I think I was too bitter at the time to give him anything notable. And now, my opinion of him is still pending.

If we win the Finals this year, I'll probably agree that maybe he shouldhave gotten it that year. And the reason I'll probably agree won't be because we won the Finals, because that won't change a previous season. Thereason will be because I'll feel better about him, to the point where I'll be able to say 'Yeah, I agree... he should have taken it home.' Butif we lose, I'll maintain that he didn't deserve it that year.

It's a flawed opinion based on approval rating; I'm aware of that.

And... that's why I'm nobody in sports. Not a journalist, not a voter; nothing. And it should be that way, because these awards shouldn'tbe handed out on the combination of a person's 'emotion + approval rating'.

 

[dearwinter219]

Simply put, Nash deserves his 2 MVPs about as much, but definitely not more than CP3 deserved this one. And Kobe won this year.... think about that. That'sreally all there is to it. Nash was qualified and in the running, and he won. I don't really think he was the #1 candidate for the MVPs, but he deservesthem in the same sense that the Giants' players deserve their superbowl rings. He earned it... sorta. And it was given to him...sorta. Either way, it'swhatever

 

[nychiphophippo]

Originally Posted by SHUGES

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

SHUGES:

---

My bad. I mixed up the seasons. Shaq should have had the first. Hiss the second.

Nah, I'm saying I was shocked you thought wither should have went to Kobe. Rare to see such objectivity in the Sports forum on NikeTalk anywhere.

Nah, I've always been against that second MVP.

I'm one of the biggest Dirty Snake haters, but I really thought people had a legit argument for him winning the award that year.

If you remember, the Lakers weren't even supposed to go anywhere. Every pre-season analyst predicted them not even making the playoffs! From Lakers.com:

A Jackson return meant a reunion with Kobe Bryant, two of the key components from the Lakers 2000, 2001 and 2002 Championship seasons. And despite the return, as well as significant off-season moves by the franchise, fans and media alike remained skeptical as to whether the Lakers would even challenge for a spot in the postseason.
Yet, [PTI] YA BOY [/PTI] took the Lakers to the SEVENTH spot in the West. The WEST! And not even with a .500 record. The Lakers went 45-37 that year. Which is impressive when you consider the roster was made up of Kwame, Smush, Cookie Monster, Luke, a rookie Turiaf, a rookie Bynum, pre-Machine Sasha aka "Sasha sucks!", LO, McKie, Jim Jackson, Slava, Mihm, and Devean.

I always hear two definitions of what MVP means.

1. The guy who is the best overall player in the L.

Or 2. The guy who if you take him away from his team, that team would be lottery-bound.

Jack Bauer fit both descriptions to the letter.

So I can't see how Nash won when he did NOT fit either of those definitions. Cuz he damn sure wasn't the best player in the L and the Suns damn sure weren't lottery-bound if he wasn't there. Not with Amare (though he was hurt), Bosa, Marion, Raja (when he was actually good and not suckered by Roster Guard 24), Diaw (who won Most Improved), etc on that team.

Wut are u talking about...none of those define wut the MVP is. If its whoever the best overall player in the league is, then it would have been jordan manymore times.
and its not ur other definition of mvp, cuz the bulls without jordan almost made the finals.

 

[clutchshooter]

Why are people still so intent on trying to establish that Nash shouldnt have won one of or both of those MVP's?

He deserved them. BOTH of them.

He was also voted the player that other NBA players would most like to play with.

Players dont resent him. Bitter fans just want to take achievements away from him in any form they can.

IMO Chris Paul was the MVP this season, but you wont catch me making a thread about it 3 years from now.

Steve Nash played with 2 beasts, Amare averaging 26-9, Marion averaging 19-11. and a future star Joe Johnson adding 17 ppg. don't use the Nash "made those players better" because Amare was a beast before Nash got there, Marion was a 20-10 guy before Nash got there, and Joe Johnson continued to get better after he left the Suns, so he was obviously on track to being a star regardless of whether he played with Nash.


and where were amare and joe in season 2? what about boris? raja? Qrich? tim thomas's ever so brief return to a level above abismal?

Those MVP's cant be taken away .

LET IT GO!!!

 

[dmbrhs]

I find it funny that people post these stats put up by these so-called "beasts" Nash had around him. I'm sorry, what was the Suns' recordbefore Nash got there, with that same cast of "beasts?"

 

[dearwinter219]

^But you act like ANY team with threats and no facilitator has a great record. (to the dude two posts up). SCORING is just one facet of the sport. You needsomeone who can create scores for other ppl, and that AIN'T Starbury.

All Nash did was plug a hole in the Sun's roster (and he did so very well, but still). He's the same player he was in Dallas-- an ALL-STAR with a damngood jumper. That's it. He just had so many more finishers on PHX which makes it easier to fill up a stat-line with assists. He didn't improve his shotbecause it was already lights out. His D probably declined with age. He's been great with the ball as long as I personally can remember. And I don'treally think he has particularly GREAT court vision, but it's good. ANY half way decent PG in the league, plugged into the D'Antoni "run& gun" with Joe Johnson, Matrix, and STAT could get 9 assists a game and pick up 12 or so cheap points the Rondo way. And although 12 & 9isn't MVP status, it's very decent, which goes to show that it's the SYSTEM Nash plays in that helps his success. He just EXCELS with the systembecause it fits him. If anything, those 4 ppl I named (includ. the coach) MADE Nash into an MVP. That's not to say he didn't deserve it, but he getsmore credit than he should.

 

[shuges]

Originally Posted by dmbrhs

I find it funny that people post these stats put up by these so-called "beasts" Nash had around him. I'm sorry, what was the Suns' record before Nash got there, with that same cast of "beasts?"

He's the only difference between the Suns those two years. And as we all know by now, that man doesn't exactly make his overall team record or theplayers around him any better.

Originally Posted by nYcHipHopHippo

Wut are u talking about...none of those define wut the MVP is. If its whoever the best overall player in the league is, then it would have been jordan many more times.and its not ur other definition of mvp, cuz the bulls without jordan almost made the finals.

I'm a bit lazy right now to pick apart your statement (cuz I really don't remember when the Bulls "almost made the finals" w/o MJ). SoI'll just ask, what do YOU consider the definition of League MVP to be?

And I hear what you're saying ska. Trust me, I don't like arguing on Hiss' behalf. That dirty, snitching, whining,sucker-for-love, attempted raper.

But I try to call it like I see it (despite what some of your Laker brethren may think).

 

[kb8sandiego]

Originally Posted by SHUGES

I don't think other players resent him so much as they understand that it was all about politics.

Dirty Snake should have easily had Nash's first MVP and it's not even close in my book.

But fresh off of his rape case and it's aftermath, there was NO WAY IN HELL the L was gonna give Hiss that award.

What the?

Did I read that right?

 

[5am6oody72]

Originally Posted by K8be wan Kenobi

why doesnt he deserve them? he was the most important player to the team who had the best regular season record for the 1st time he won it. and the second one he put up even better numbers than the year before and the suns were the #2 seed. it doesnt make sense on why people hate on nashs mvp trophies. he was the clear winner on both seasons. get over it

typical Suns fan on NT... lol at "he was the clear winner" when the race with Shaq was one of the closest in NBA history.

Shaq was robbed, hands down.

Steve Nash played with 2 beasts, Amare averaging 26-9, Marion averaging 19-11. and a future star Joe Johnson adding 17 ppg. don't use the Nash "made those players better" because Amare was a beast before Nash got there, Marion was a 20-10 guy before Nash got there, and Joe Johnson continued to get better after he left the Suns, so he was obviously on track to being a star regardless of whether he played with Nash.

So Nash is playing with 3 stellar players and is only averaging 15-11 (i say "only" because Jason Kidd, Chris Paul, John Stockton, Kevin Johnson isshhhed on those season numbers during their careers, and didn't touch the MVP).

And on top of that, Nash is one of the worst defenders in the history of the NBA by MANY respectable people's accounts (Nash's own college coach said Nash is the worst defender he has ever seen). He is/was such a bad defender that it actually played a factor in many of their close losses.

Shaq averaged 23-10 on the best team in the EC that season, and as the leader on his team he was a beast offensively and defensively. Shaq's 23-10, 59-23 Heat season with D-Wade and uhhh.. Eddie/Damon Jones >>>>> Nash's 15-11, 62-20 season with Amare, Marion, and Joe Johnson


Exactly. He was playing with 2-3 other all star caliber players on his team those years. Not to mention players like Barbosa and Diaw who were also solid intheir own right and would have been even without Nash. Kobe was playing with Kwame Brown, Luke Walton, Lamar Odom, and Smush Parker as the rest of his startingcast.

And they won 45 games and almost took the Suns out of the playoffs that year. That's a damn lottery team with a HIGH pick without Kobe there.Now I don't think Kobe should have had the award if they had stuck to the precedents they always do (best player on a high seeded team). But I DO thinkKobe deserved it WAY more than Nash did that year. Personally I would have given the award to Shaq that year though.

 

[paul is on tilt]

I'm siding with the side that says that Nash deserved the two MVP awards that he received. But damn, this topic again? It's been three freakin'years.

 

[sohi 23]

 

[nychiphophippo]

Originally Posted by SHUGES

Originally Posted by dmbrhs

I find it funny that people post these stats put up by these so-called "beasts" Nash had around him. I'm sorry, what was the Suns' record before Nash got there, with that same cast of "beasts?"

He's the only difference between the Suns those two years. And as we all know by now, that man doesn't exactly make his overall team record or the players around him any better.

Originally Posted by nYcHipHopHippo

Wut are u talking about...none of those define wut the MVP is. If its whoever the best overall player in the league is, then it would have been jordan many more times.and its not ur other definition of mvp, cuz the bulls without jordan almost made the finals.

I'm a bit lazy right now to pick apart your statement (cuz I really don't remember when the Bulls "almost made the finals" w/o MJ). So I'll just ask, what do YOU consider the definition of League MVP to be?

And I hear what you're saying ska. Trust me, I don't like arguing on Hiss' behalf. That dirty, snitching, whining, sucker-for-love, attempted raper.

But I try to call it like I see it (despite what some of your Laker brethren may think).

1993-94 Bulls were one game away from the ECF, where they could have reached the finals to get spanked by Hakeem. And wut does my definition matter. Thepoint of my post was to say ur definitions are wrong.
I don't really have a clear cut definition for mvp. Just whoever i feel deserves it in aparticular season.

 

[dearwinter219]

Originally Posted by nYcHipHopHippo

Originally Posted by SHUGES

Originally Posted by dmbrhs

I find it funny that people post these stats put up by these so-called "beasts" Nash had around him. I'm sorry, what was the Suns' record before Nash got there, with that same cast of "beasts?"

He's the only difference between the Suns those two years. And as we all know by now, that man doesn't exactly make his overall team record or the players around him any better.

Originally Posted by nYcHipHopHippo

Wut are u talking about...none of those define wut the MVP is. If its whoever the best overall player in the league is, then it would have been jordan many more times.and its not ur other definition of mvp, cuz the bulls without jordan almost made the finals.

I'm a bit lazy right now to pick apart your statement (cuz I really don't remember when the Bulls "almost made the finals" w/o MJ). So I'll just ask, what do YOU consider the definition of League MVP to be?

And I hear what you're saying ska. Trust me, I don't like arguing on Hiss' behalf. That dirty, snitching, whining, sucker-for-love, attempted raper.

But I try to call it like I see it (despite what some of your Laker brethren may think).

1993-94 Bulls were one game away from the ECF, where they could have reached the finals to get spanked by Hakeem. And wut does my definition matter. The point of my post was to say ur definitions are wrong.
I don't really have a clear cut definition for mvp. Just whoever i feel deserves it in a particular season.

that's more like almost- almost - in the finals... which doesn't count for anything. Ask Lebron James ifhe was almost in the finals this year.

 

[null snake]

Originally Posted by KB8sandiego

Originally Posted by SHUGES

I don't think other players resent him so much as they understand that it was all about politics.

Dirty Snake should have easily had Nash's first MVP and it's not even close in my book.

But fresh off of his rape case and it's aftermath, there was NO WAY IN HELL the L was gonna give Hiss that award.

What the?

Did I read that right?

The world is coming to an end...

 

[jch3]

OK, why does this matter? Not only did this happen 2 years ago, but I don't understand the hate for Nash. Did he vote for MVP? No, the writers/GMs/coachesdo (Does anybody know exactly how this works, because I don't).


But what I really want to say is that this is the most VAGUE and AMBIGUOUS trophy in all of sports. Everybody that votes sees who is valuable differently.There is no clear-cut definition for this. Every fan (including me) will automatically think their hometown hero is the MVP. KOBE this, KG that, being a fantakes away most of his objectivity. Basically as a player, an MVP may look nice, but you getting the chip is the only thing in TEAM sports that really matters.


Back to the question, do players resent Nash? Probably, but like a lot of other people have said, they would never admit to it.

 

[kash55]

It is stupid to say he didn't deserve it.

 

[seymore cake]

Originally Posted by TheKingOfVa

Seymore , Barkley has a MVP award and Stockton wasn't a MVP caliber player. Now if you would have said Isiah Thomas I would agree with you.

Yea I know he got his in 93 the yr him Marjerle and KJ took Mike to 6... I used him as a reference to those who only have 1 MVP, and as far asStockton I was using him as an example of a player who played the same position as him that many would consider to be better than him in all aspects of thegame, besides outside shooting. Therefore seeing as tho I place him above Steve, I don't think he deserved two. I didn't even mention Zeke cause thatshould be a no brainer

 

[japanair21]

I'm personally fine with it, maybe I'm a bit biased because of him being my ex-favorite player,

Steve Nash blew the NBA world away when he came to Phoenix. There's no doubt about it. A lot of people just had heard the name Steve Nash when he was inDallas. When he went to Phoenix, he exposed people to his game and his nearly FLAWLESS offense they were running there. I mean one of the most versatile (ifnot the the most) in Matrix, a freakish athlete and dominant player in Amare, guys on the wings like JJ and Raja, then they got Barbosa, they were a scaryteam. Plus Nash himself is a great scorer (he chooses not to be a scorer), and his passing ability is top notch. Then again, I can see why he is overrated insome peoples eyes. But what I can safely say is that the Suns wouldn't have been this good the past few years without no, no doubt.

 

[N41D]

First you say this...

lol at "he was the clear winner" when the race with Shaq was one of the closest in NBA history.
Then you say this...

Shaq was robbed, hands down.
Huh? Was it a close race that could have gone either way, or was it Shaq being robbed because he should have won in a landslide?

Shaq's 23-10, 59-23 Heat season with D-Wade and uhhh.. Eddie/Damon Jones >>>>> Nash's 15-11, 62-20 season with Amare, Marion, and Joe Johnson
Was it really, though? Amare, Marion, and Joe Johnson were in Phoenix the year before, too, and where'd that get them?

Nash was the only real key difference between the Suns of 2004 and the Suns of 2005, and they more 40+ more games in 05 than 04... Not to mention how marginalthe East was as a whole that year when taking the Heat's record into consideration.

At best it's a coin flip between Shaq and Nash, so I really don't see how Shaq got robbed...

And everybody complaining about his second one seems to be pushing for Kobe in 2006... But his team won 45 games and netted a 7 seed in the playoffs... Whenwas the last time a player's team won 45 games, took a 7 or 8 seed in the playoffs, and he hoisted the MVP? It's been a long, long time...

People being upset or holding grudges towards a player over something he can't control seems kinda silly...

 

[Mad Master]

speaking of nash, just saw this video and it had me

- .gif material

 

[bigmike23]

i think they do. beause you hear some people say its a shame shaq only has 1 MVP and kobe just now won MVP. even take a look at players that just hung it uplike Jalen Rose and Mashburn on ESPN they pretty much say that.


shaq should of won the year nash got his 1st MVP.