FINALLY, A RETRO OF THE NIKE TRAINER SC II 3/4 DONE RIGHT!! THANK YOU NIKE!

[soleaddict34]

Originally Posted by trethousandgt

Originally Posted by allthingsjordan

"Ultra premium leather"   

       .....You guys are giving Nike too much credit calling these premium leather and justifying the wrinkling on these shoes....I understand we are all excited to see these colors release but they should not come pre-wrinkled...They shouldn't even wrinkle as easy as much as they do when worn...Nike used cheap materials again and you guys are apologizing for them instead of just admitting they could've focused more on quality as usual. I would be willing to bet this is why Nike decided to not sell them on ndc...they new too many pairs came out poorly and didn't want to have to deal with the flood of returns themselves....I'm sure they thought it was a better idea to let boutiques deal with that instead...and don't be surprised when a bunch of these show up in outlets later this year because of the wrinkling issues....I mean you have guys on hear justifying the leather quality and having to poke out their own lace holes and still swearing Nike did their job on quality control!

If I had a tear in my leather would you call it "super premium"...."wow these are so soft and super premium they tore after one wear and I love them, thank you nike!" 

I bought 3 pairs and one was just like the pic above and both others had certain areas that are just un-accceptable for a pair of shoes that was never put on a foot...do you guys think that Nike came looking like this with wrinkles and shiny leather back during their original releases?

Actually the quality IS much better than any Jordan, or other Nike retro we've seen in YEARS.  
In the hundreds of people that posted maybe two people had this wrinkle issue, that doesn't sound like a flood of returns to me.

The lace hole thing happens across the board with every shoe brand, let me repeat that WITH EVERY SHOE BRAND, it happened with the originals as well. 

And to compare a reaction to a tear with a reaction to wrinkles (which happens to good leather anyway) is just DUMB.  

And do we think the original Nike Trainer SC II came looking like this with wrinkles during their original release?  YES, look at the advertisement below you can clearly see wrinkles to the leather (And the retro's leather is NOT shiny). 



You actually sound like someone thats salty they didn't show up on NDC.  They didn't show up on NDC most likely because boutiques kept calling up their warehouse to ship out more.  There was no original intention of carrying these on NDC.  Will some of these show up at outlets?  Possibly, but a flood?  Keep dreaming. 

this.

We can argue all day about what constitutes "good leather". I think most of us on this thread have been around long enough and had our feet in enough shoes to know the difference. I personally consider these good leather, especially compared to what they've been using on most of their retros. Protos pair looks like they used a soft, already wrinkled piece of leather in the manufacturing process. Definitely doesn't make it bad, just not like the other pairs we've seen. I personally wouldn't trip about it, but I can understand if you did.

I think people have become so accustomed to all the garbage that Nike(and especially JB) has been using in the past 4-5 years that they can't identify actual quality materials.  The idea that if it doesn't wrinkle its good has weeded its way into the thought processes of alot of "sneakerheads".  All this pleather/synthetic crap Nike's been pushing on us certainly doesn't crease as easily...it also doesn't flex as well either. My advice if want wrinkle free kicks, stick to pretty much all of Nike's current GR releases, leave these for the fans that know the difference....

 

[soleaddict34]

Originally Posted by Stuntman Mike

seriously though, dude kinda has a point. take a look at some of the first string converse releases and check out the materials they use. it's far superior to the crap nike uses on GR forces and much better than the material used on these qs sc iis. aaaannd...the converses are priced much cheaper. 

I think the reasoning behind that is Nike doesn't need to use better materials on models like the AF1 or other GR models because it has the 'swoosh' on it so it inherently carries a better sales profile. Converses on the other hand requires better materials because most consumers aren't gonna buy them for the name, its the materials that are selling those....

 

[stuntman mike]

Originally Posted by SoleAddict34

Originally Posted by Stuntman Mike

seriously though, dude kinda has a point. take a look at some of the first string converse releases and check out the materials they use. it's far superior to the crap nike uses on GR forces and much better than the material used on these qs sc iis. aaaannd...the converses are priced much cheaper. 

I think the reasoning behind that is Nike doesn't need to use better materials on models like the AF1 or other GR models because it has the 'swoosh' on it so it inherently carries a better sales profile. Converses on the other hand requires better materials because most consumers aren't gonna buy them for the name, its the materials that are selling those....

i agree. and that's saying that nike deliberately puts out an inferior product because they can 

it's been one of my biggest gripes with nike and one of the reasons why i buy less from them nowadays. they continually stick it to their consumer base because they can. shameful. 

 

[inchecksince81]

Not being able to find any of the OG pack locally FTL.

 

[dj proto j]

dude's way off about these, they are premium materials. i've bought enough shoes in my life time to know.

this part circled:



i think it just wrinkles there due to the actual shape and design of the shoe, particularly if this kind of soft buttery leather is used, and not the hard shiny crap they used on the other GR's b4 these (although i'm sure that could end up looking worse once it does crease/wrinkle there)...

mine, they just sewed on a wrinkled piece of leather, and prolly shoulda been marked b-grade and not slipped through a QC check.

whatever tho, i just copped another pair off ebay for $130 shipped (about what it cost me for my 2nd pair of infrareds from mercer) and sneakerhead.com sent me a free return label earlier today, so i'm good.

thanx for the advice tho guys.

if i can't help anyone with my size 13's in each colorway for retail i'm just gonna send 'em back to district tomorrow and take the L on shipping.

 

[weatherman]

I really wouldn't worry about it, but maybe that's just me. You say you have doubles? I really wouldn't even stress it..

This is my only pair of Infrareds.. kinda sucks but I wear them so it doesn't really bother me

Here, the "webtec" material doesn't line up on the front of both shoes. One shoe you can clearly see two strips, while on the other, only one is really visible

Then there's this on the inners. The shoe on the right is the one I originally posted a picture of (and then deleted because it didn't really matter) when I got my pair. It came really pre-creased and mashed up, nothing like the other side. I don't know if you can actually tell from the picture, but the white perforated area actually seems to have two different types of leather on each shoe. The one on the right is a lot more shiny and plasticy, but still nothing like the GR leather.

And of course, the grey strip doesn't line up either. On the left it passes over the navy, which I believe is the way it should be, while the right shoe doesn't even reach the end of the navy.

But like I said, on my feet, I don't notice and I'm sure no one else does, so I'm not even stressing it..

 

[soleaddict34]

Originally Posted by Stuntman Mike

Originally Posted by SoleAddict34

Originally Posted by Stuntman Mike

seriously though, dude kinda has a point. take a look at some of the first string converse releases and check out the materials they use. it's far superior to the crap nike uses on GR forces and much better than the material used on these qs sc iis. aaaannd...the converses are priced much cheaper. 

I think the reasoning behind that is Nike doesn't need to use better materials on models like the AF1 or other GR models because it has the 'swoosh' on it so it inherently carries a better sales profile. Converses on the other hand requires better materials because most consumers aren't gonna buy them for the name, its the materials that are selling those....

i agree. and that's saying that nike deliberately puts out an inferior product because they can 

it's been one of my biggest gripes with nike and one of the reasons why i buy less from them nowadays. they continually stick it to their consumer base because they can. shameful. 

yeah, i think this is one of the main reasons a lot of us old heads have started to shun Nike in the past few years.

 

[c4]

If anyone has a pair of originals, could you please post or pm me a close up pic of the webtec. I know I saw a pic somewhere in this
thread, but I can't find it. thanks

 

[wallyhopp]

. The good o'l leather quality discussion. I think I can write a book on this topic.


After a couple wears, here are my citrons:

Surprisingly the "left shoe" or one on the right in the photos seems to truly have a softer more buttery feeling leather. Now given both came unwrinkled and nice, but they are pretty much at Proto's level after a few wears. And I couldn't be happier. It's wrinkling/creasing differently but Im okay with that
-------------
I may have done this dozens of pages back but it bears repeating:

Many have stated this in the past two pages but I really feel many have forgotten how good leather should look and act. It's as if Nike took the complaints about leather creasing and decided to just harden and cheapen the synthetics so there would be "less" issues. But it's turned out to truly backfire as the creasing on the crappy materials OVER TIME looks worse.. It may take longer to reach that point, but it eventually looks worse.. The crappy materials may look DS and "fresh" much longer than the premium stuff that would fold and crease right away. But at the end of the day, it's the old school leather quality who stand the test of time. One could actually graph it out. Old school quality appeared to wrinkle and crease right away but plateaued within dozens of wears getting minimally worse as the years went on. Common day GR materials are slower to reach that point of creasing but get much worse as time goes on. The creasing also starts to appear a bit unnatural.

Let's go through some examples:

Spoiler

Spoiler

Spoiler [+]

Spoiler

2000 at1 vs. 2002 at1
One features real materials and the other synthetics

-The 2000 toebox on the left looks a bit weak and unstructured. This is generally a good thing... 2002s look almost too perfect on the front toe end.. Creasing is another story. As noted above, the fake crap will crease in a totally different manner than the real stuff

-2000s had some structural issues around the end of the toebox as evident in the photo above. But generally speaking, there is no question which one I would rather have

2000s just have a crease life all its own

Another shot of a 2002 toebox. with the fake synthetic crap

---------------------------------

I've shown this one before..

2008 zoom tennis trainers feature this synthetic like pleather. Some argue that it's like that for the hardiness TENNIS factor. Others say that it was because the price point lowered to $80 from $110, and went with cheaper crap

2004s feature a really soft cloth like material with a slim leather top layer. I believe some would call this a garment leather. The type to be used in the past
----------------------------------------

2004 air trainer 1 ft. Msrp $80.. Featured some of the softest white leather you will find on a shoe. Hundreds of wrinkles everywhere

The black/bone version has a different type of premium leather. This one wrinkles and creases with ease

------------

2000 ds vs. 2009 ds

-You can already see the 2000 white leather ready to give way to instant wrinkles and wear.. Again 2000s win out.. yet people would rather have a shoe that looks stiff and perfect for 9-10 wears?

Here is a side by side on your foot look at two used pairs:
-Look at the creasing on the foot bend

CREASING IS GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD!



---------------------------------
Side shot of a 1999 pimento with the old school leather

And a 1998 royal blue trainer

-Entire leather upper is somewhat "unstructured" in that it's all really soft thin leather moving around creating thousands of crease points.

---------------------
2009 auburns after a few wears.. You can tell the creasing will be much deeper. Almost like a gash

-------------------

2009 auburn vs. 1999 pimento:

And then your 2011 infrared:

They are on the path to true old school style creasing.

1989 OG used:

-just like your 2000 med. balls, they feature a toebox that is a bit caved in and ready for movement... These 2011 retros will need some time to break in

Here a 1988 OG.. This shoe is stuffed here, so its hard to totally see the wrinkles, but it has the same wrinkle effect as the other OLDER retros, where it just kind of creases into 100s of wrinkles.

Bottom line, Don't listen to the common consumer Nike. I love creasing. I love materials that bend and move like it's all naturally flowing and moving..

 

[stuntman mike]

no doubt the leather is decent on these quickstrikes but it's a sad time when we ( i ) get so happy with materials that should be standard and not "premium". this leather is not "premium". 

 

[bossplayaz45]

its about time. i love these

 

[allthingsjordan]

Originally Posted by Stuntman Mike

no doubt the leather is decent on these quickstrikes but it's a sad time when we ( i ) get so happy with materials that should be standard and not "premium". this leather is not "premium". 

Thats all I am saying!!!

 

[wallyhopp]

I know they aren't premium in the truest sense of the word. But considering what we have been paying for from 2003 to 2011, and the quality that went into that and the PRICE..

It's a bargain two fold.

ONE, we're finally getting back to the old days of paying decent prices for a decent product.. Nostalgia got the best of many with retros for years and years
TWO, instead of paying $150 for what Nike would deem as "premium", some would agree we are sort of thrown a bone here and paying less for MORE.

I guess one could argue that there shouldn't be that congratulatory thank you for finally getting back to where they started and get out of depriving us of what other brands have been doing since forever.. It's definitely a weird position to be in as a consumer. Do you say thanks? Or get snotty and say "IT'S about darn time".

 

[dj proto j]

wow wally, not i feel like i'm kinda tripping for returning those, your's look mad similar after a few wears (although the cut on mine outside of the stitching is terrible)...

i guess the thing is tho, if mine already looks that wrinkled DS, it could get really ugly after some wears. i dunno.

i messaged the dude on ebay i picked up another pair from today, he had 2 12's, so i asked him to open the boxes and make sure he sends me the best looking one, with no wrinkles and stuff.

we'll see what i get...

 

[flintgrey]

Very happy with these. Was going to pass on Infrared joints, then I slipped em on....hotness

 

[josephmartin]

I never get tired of seeing these. Post up more pics!

 

[frazier10]

Originally Posted by JosephMartin

I never get tired of seeing these. Post up more pics!

i really like the white gray pair...i need to pull the trigger

 

[wallyhopp]

So, a little back story on the navy/red theme. Back around 1987 the first cross trainer model releases in the white grey black green colorway.  Months later, a red accented counterpart. This pair actually had a dark blue tint to it.

------
Years later for the 1994-1995 release, it appeared in the same DARK blue tinted color.

-------------
We now just commonly refer to that colorway as the varsity reds, and look to the 2000 retro of those which feature all black accents:

Nike had a lot going against them as they could've made the mistake of past retros and just went with black, but they really got that indigo blue right
-----------------------

On a related note:
check out these vintage pics
http://www.arkamix.com/vintage-nike/cross-training/nike-air-trainer-sc-ii
5th photo shows the same type of creasing right above the swoosh. Sometimes it's just how the upper wants to be and the leather bends or creases
http://www.arkamix.com/vintage-nike/cross-training/nike-air-trainer-sc-i-80-s
4th photo shows the heel. Creasing is there

 

[ptngina]

NDC will have these tomorrow at 12 noon Pacific.
http://twitpic.com/6lfqah

nikestoreOnline Nike Store




#ReleaseUpdate
Trainer SC II (Citron & Infrared) drops tomorrow 3 PM EDT/ Noon PDT on
NikeStore http://gonike.me/6015RrpH

 

[mcflyxbalboa]

Definetly want the Raiders and Infrared colorways of the SC II 3/4 ..... but im being a cheap bastard and waiting until theyre marked down #jordanshrug

 

[ptngina]

Originally Posted by allthingsjordan

"Ultra premium leather"   

       .....You guys are giving Nike too much credit calling these premium leather and justifying the wrinkling on these shoes....I understand we are all excited to see these colors release but they should not come pre-wrinkled...They shouldn't even wrinkle as easy as much as they do when worn...Nike used cheap materials again and you guys are apologizing for them instead of just admitting they could've focused more on quality as usual. I would be willing to bet this is why Nike decided to not sell them on ndc...they new too many pairs came out poorly and didn't want to have to deal with the flood of returns themselves....I'm sure they thought it was a better idea to let boutiques deal with that instead...and don't be surprised when a bunch of these show up in outlets later this year because of the wrinkling issues....I mean you have guys on hear justifying the leather quality and having to poke out their own lace holes and still swearing Nike did their job on quality control!

If I had a tear in my leather would you call it "super premium"...."wow these are so soft and super premium they tore after one wear and I love them, thank you nike!" 

I bought 3 pairs and one was just like the pic above and both others had certain areas that are just un-accceptable for a pair of shoes that was never put on a foot...do you guys think that Nike came looking like this with wrinkles and shiny leather back during their original releases?

   They will be on NDC tomorrow...

 

[cojp]

Not really a fan of the highs. If the lows in royal came back out... that would be an instant cop for me. lol

 

[Magic33]

Originally Posted by ptngina

Originally Posted by allthingsjordan

"Ultra premium leather"   

       .....You guys are giving Nike too much credit calling these premium leather and justifying the wrinkling on these shoes....I understand we are all excited to see these colors release but they should not come pre-wrinkled...They shouldn't even wrinkle as easy as much as they do when worn...Nike used cheap materials again and you guys are apologizing for them instead of just admitting they could've focused more on quality as usual. I would be willing to bet this is why Nike decided to not sell them on ndc...they new too many pairs came out poorly and didn't want to have to deal with the flood of returns themselves....I'm sure they thought it was a better idea to let boutiques deal with that instead...and don't be surprised when a bunch of these show up in outlets later this year because of the wrinkling issues....I mean you have guys on hear justifying the leather quality and having to poke out their own lace holes and still swearing Nike did their job on quality control!

If I had a tear in my leather would you call it "super premium"...."wow these are so soft and super premium they tore after one wear and I love them, thank you nike!" 

I bought 3 pairs and one was just like the pic above and both others had certain areas that are just un-accceptable for a pair of shoes that was never put on a foot...do you guys think that Nike came looking like this with wrinkles and shiny leather back during their original releases?

   They will be on NDC tomorrow...

Edit: I'm late, my bad, didn't read prior post

going to be hard to turn down the Citrons

 

[frazier10]

just got the tweet both available on NDC at 3 pm est 12 pst friday

 

[green rhino123]

Originally Posted by JosephMartin

I never get tired of seeing these. Post up more pics!

ok...


if you insist