I don't know much about the Israel/Palestine conflict, but I do know a sonning

[lexflex81]

Originally Posted by whywesteppin

Originally Posted by DubA169

the underlying ROOT of the problem is that the entire world hates jews and doesn't know what to do with them.

This pretty much encapsulates the entire problem for me, in one sentence. It implies and assumes so much.
What you are basically saying is that religious groups cannot coexist. We're not even talking about ethnic groups here.

DubA, that is a gross overstatement. Anti-semitism in any extreme form is very hard to find. 
Now, there is plenty of (for lack of a better word) hate towards the state of Israel for the crimes they are committing against humanity. But don't get is twisted, this has nothing to do with hating the Jews just for being Jews.

I suggest anybody who is interested checks out the documentary "Defamation"

http://www.youtube.com/wa...;feature=player_embedded

It's especially disturbing to see all these Israeli kids, before their field trip to Auschwitz, being taught by the state that the whole world hates them and Israel is the only safe haven in the world. (the girls are 

 btw..such a shame that they're being raised with so much hate in them)

And Hazeleyed Honey, I applaud you....way to drop knowledge! 

 

[duba169]

Originally Posted by lexflex81

Originally Posted by whywesteppin

Originally Posted by DubA169

the underlying ROOT of the problem is that the entire world hates jews and doesn't know what to do with them.

This pretty much encapsulates the entire problem for me, in one sentence. It implies and assumes so much.
What you are basically saying is that religious groups cannot coexist. We're not even talking about ethnic groups here.

DubA, that is a gross overstatement. Anti-semitism in any extreme form is very hard to find. 
Now, there is plenty of (for lack of a better word) hate towards the state of Israel for the crimes they are committing against humanity. But don't get is twisted, this has nothing to do with hating the Jews just for being Jews.

take a trip to Europe. Poland would be a good place to start.

 

[hovkid]

Originally Posted by Kicktionair

Originally Posted by HOVKid

Everyone hates the Jews?

Is that cause we got all the money? 

Let me get some

On a serious note; If I were to convert and become Jewish...... will I get the moneys?

You won't get all the money but you will get some.  If you are serious about converting we can discuss it at out next Saturday "meeting."  You'll probably get like half the normal alotment we give the rest of the Jews when they are born......I'll pencil in a discussion right after our customary 10:00am "maintain control of Hollywood" conversation.  Once you convert is alsowhen we give you your accounting/medical/lawyer license.  We got room for a few accountants lately so that is probably the license you'll get.

 

[duba169]

Originally Posted by HOVKid

Originally Posted by Kicktionair

Originally Posted by HOVKid

Everyone hates the Jews?

Is that cause we got all the money? 

Let me get some

On a serious note; If I were to convert and become Jewish...... will I get the moneys?

You won't get all the money but you will get some.  If you are serious about converting we can discuss it at out next Saturday "meeting."  You'll probably get like half the normal alotment we give the rest of the Jews when they are born......I'll pencil in a discussion right after our customary 10:00am "maintain control of Hollywood" conversation.  Once you convert is alsowhen we give you your accounting/medical/lawyer license.  We got room for a few accountants lately so that is probably the license you'll get.

we'll get you hooked up with a jewelry store too. you can take over Jacobs store until he gets out of prison

 

[lexflex81]

Originally Posted by DubA169

Originally Posted by lexflex81

Originally Posted by whywesteppin

Originally Posted by DubA169

the underlying ROOT of the problem is that the entire world hates jews and doesn't know what to do with them.

This pretty much encapsulates the entire problem for me, in one sentence. It implies and assumes so much.
What you are basically saying is that religious groups cannot coexist. We're not even talking about ethnic groups here.

DubA, that is a gross overstatement. Anti-semitism in any extreme form is very hard to find. 
Now, there is plenty of (for lack of a better word) hate towards the state of Israel for the crimes they are committing against humanity. But don't get is twisted, this has nothing to do with hating the Jews just for being Jews.

take a trip to Europe. Poland would be a good place to start.



I actually live in Europe 

 in Holland to be exact and I know that especially in Poland and Belgium (our neighbours) neo-nazism/racism is pretty rampant.
But the Jewish community in, say, Amsterdam and Antwerp (I admit I can't really speak on Poland) is thriving and pretty much one of the richest and influential of the communities in the city and the neo nazi's seem to be focussing the more vicious attacks on people of Arab and African descent. That is not to say there is no anti semitism in Europe, but it seems to be more anti-semite graffiti and small things like that. 

In no way is the anti semitism so extreme that it causes a threat to the state of Israel and that is, after all ,what they're claiming.

Again, I encourage you to watch the docu that I posted, it's quite interesting.

 

[hazeleyed honey]

Originally Posted by lexflex81

DubA, that is a gross overstatement. Anti-semitism in any extreme form is very hard to find. 
Now, there is plenty of (for lack of a better word) hate towards the state of Israel for the crimes they are committing against humanity. But don't get is twisted, this has nothing to do with hating the Jews just for being Jews.

I suggest anybody who is interested checks out the documentary "Defamation"

http://www.youtube.com/wa...;feature=player_embedded

It's especially disturbing to see all these Israeli kids, before their field trip to Auschwitz, being taught by the state that the whole world hates them and Israel is the only safe haven in the world. (the girls are 

 btw..such a shame that they're being raised with so much hate in them)

And Hazeleyed Honey, I applaud you....way to drop knowledge! 

I think that the extremist Zionists, or aspects within them, try to place this fear by implying that antisemitism in today's world is severe like it was in the WWII era so that they can scare Jewish populations to immigrate to Israel as a safe haven. Of course, there are many kinds of antisemitism still alive and rampant. However, nowadays in Europe, it seems that "Islamophobia" is a lot more persistent and even accepted in Europe. Thanks for that documentary! I'll watch it.

Here is a documentary that really touched me. It is a bit over an hour long, but if you have free time, watch it.

• Arna's Children

Julian Mer Kamis
Documentary, Israel, 2003, 84 minutes
Arabic and Hebrew with English Subtitles
D.C. Premiere

Juliano Mer Khamis, son of an Israeli Mother and Palestinian father,

spends years of his youth teaching theater to Palestinian children as part of an alternative education program that his mother, Arna, established in the occupied West Bank. Years after his mother's death, Mer Khamis returns to find that the children he knew and loved have now joined the intifada—and captures how childhood innocence is lost to war.

Arna Mer Khamis was a legendary activist against the Israeli Occupation. Born into a Jewish family she married a Palestinian Arab and spent her life campaigning for justice and human rights in her homeland. Arna founded an alternative education system for Palestinian children whose lives had been disrupted by Israeli occupation. In the Jenin refugee camp, Arna opened a theatre group where she taught the children to express anger, bitterness and fear through acting and art. The children slowly grew to trust and to love Arna: "She's like my mother," says one child. "She helps us. She saved us from the streets." Arna's son, Juliano Mer Khamis, was a director at the theater group and filmed his mother and the children rehearsing and performing over a six year period. When Arna died of cancer in 1995, the theater group struggled to continue for another two years but ultimately did not survive.
Five years after Arna's death, Juliano, now one of the region's leading actors, returns to the camp to discover what happened to "Arna's Children." Shifting back and forth in time, Mer Khamis's film juxtaposes the sweet-faced young boys with the militants and martyrs they become. "Arna's Children" reveals the tragedy and horror of young lives trapped by the circumstances of occupation.
"Yousef committed a suicide attack in 2001. Ashraf was killed in the battle of Jenin. Ala leads a resistance group. I returned to the ruins of Jenin with my camera, to see what happened to the children I knew and loved...my film tries to tell their stories and to understand their choices." - Director, Juliano Mer Khamis
"A must-see documentary. Sure to spark controversy for its straightforward presentation of the Palestinian struggle, ['Arna's Children'] limns a devastating group portrait of the legacy of occupation." - Variety
To watch :
http://www.nationalgeographic.com/allroads/schedules_dc.html

 

[hazeleyed honey]

I found the documentary on Youtube! Here it is:

 

[carlos tevez]

Originally Posted by Hazeleyed Honey

Originally Posted by DubA169

i wonder how many people would be crying if israel lost the 6 day war? israel kicks the !@*+ out of everyone, takes land, and then they want to complain. okay. how about the yom kippor war? start a war try to attack israel and get their %@@ kicked and the crying comes again. how many scholars would be screaming for the jews if they lost these wars?

this !@*+ isn't as one sided as most of you people think it is. it's a travesty at this point in time. but alot of you have a warped view of israel and how it was even founded. people thinking if israel didn't exist tomorrow than the whole muslim world will hold hands and everything will be fine. it's complete BS.

I flew over the middle east and saw one green tiny patch. guess which country it was.

I do not care how many wars the Arabs lost, an occupation is an occupation. Who is to take anyone's else's land and dispossess them? Especially at that time when you had the ideologies of human rights and the right to nationhood and sovereignty that were set in stone and on paper. I do not care about other Arabs nations and governments when it comes to this mess because they are also to blame for the plight of the Palestinians, especially when you have traitors and backstabbers like Jordan and Egypt.

A lot of the blame should be put on the colonizers because of the way they partitioned that territory by disregarding the regards of the native Palestinians Arabs and basically gave most of the fertile land to the Jewish minority at that time. What they did completely messed everything up. Maybe the Arabs should have accepted what they got, the @%$% end of the deal, especially since they were so screwed and they did not have the upperhand. But, I guess they thought that resistance was a better strategy and they actually thought they would win the war.
However, the way that Israel was created was by violence, force, terrorism, and the method of ethnic cleansing the Palestinians. Without all of that, the creation of Israel would not have succeeded.


At the end of the day, it is an occupation. The Palestinians are oppressed, Israel is the oppressor, and the Palestinian people deserve their right to return and self-determination. The root of this conflict is the occupation itself.

Woah, woah, woah...are you kidding me?

Have you forgotten which Arab country has gone to war the most times with Israel? Five times...no other Arab country has suffered more casualties fighting for the Palestinians against Israel. And this same country had the support of the people when they spent 3-decades fighting Israel.

That same country has had a corrupt, un-elected, American-backed leader rule over 80 million people for 28-years. He does not have the support of the people and the people do not support his pro-Israeli policies that are causing their Palestinian brothers and sisters to suffer. So to label an entire nation as backstabbers because a crook is making decisions on behalf of 80 million people without the populace's consent shows a complete misunderstanding of the situation.

And the Palestinian leaders deserve as much blame as everyone else. Palestinian leaders (namely Arafat) have had numerous chances to forge a long-lasting peace agreement with Israel but they failed to get the job done. The best opportunity in recent times was when the moderate Ehud Barak was Prime Minister of Israel. It was at a time when Barak's days were numbered as Israeli PM and the surveys showed that the hard-line Netenyahu was set to win the upcoming elections. Although the Israeli/American offer to Arafat was not perfect, it was an offer that should've garnered more careful consideration from Arafat. Lets not forget the fact that crooks such as Arafat and other Palestinians have stolen hundreds of millions of dollars in international aid to fill up their European bank accounts while their own people live in despicable and inhumane conditions.

Arabs like to play the blame game and often fail to take accountabilityfor their own actions. The dumba.ss Arab league failed to foresee thatIsrael were here to stay and that a two-state solution was the way togo. It was not until 2002 that the Arab League accepted the possibilityof having normal relations with Israel. The same group of countriesthat outlawed Egypt from the organization 23-years earlier becauseEgypt recognized that fighting Israel was a battle the Arabs couldn'twin.

 

[daytona 5000]

Originally Posted by lexflex81

Originally Posted by whywesteppin

Originally Posted by DubA169

the underlying ROOT of the problem is that the entire world hates jews and doesn't know what to do with them.

This pretty much encapsulates the entire problem for me, in one sentence. It implies and assumes so much.
What you are basically saying is that religious groups cannot coexist. We're not even talking about ethnic groups here.

DubA, that is a gross overstatement. Anti-semitism in any extreme form is very hard to find. 
Now, there is plenty of (for lack of a better word) hate towards the state of Israel for the crimes they are committing against humanity. But don't get is twisted, this has nothing to do with hating the Jews just for being Jews.

I suggest anybody who is interested checks out the documentary "Defamation"

http://www.youtube.com/wa...;feature=player_embedded

It's especially disturbing to see all these Israeli kids, before their field trip to Auschwitz, being taught by the state that the whole world hates them and Israel is the only safe haven in the world. (the girls are 

 btw..such a shame that they're being raised with so much hate in them)

And Hazeleyed Honey, I applaud you....way to drop knowledge! 


a few of the youtube comments

The whole society is obsessed with being victims. Its their entire identity. With out the shroud of victim hood they are just citizens of a rouge nation illegally occupying other peoples homeland. They can justify any crime with this.

(uploader)This is a free field trip for these kids. If they had to pay it would probably them cost a few thousand dollars each. But if you are Jewish and live in Britain you get a free plane trip, hotel lodging, and a tour thru Europe paid for by British citizens while their own kids are not even allowed such perks. It's quite the scam Brits let the Jew con out of them, yes, but is nothing compared to Jews getting us to fight wars for them on account of propaganda they spread

 

[hazeleyed honey]

Originally Posted by Carlos Tevez

Woah, woah, woah...are you kidding me?

Have you forgotten which Arab country has gone to war the most times with Israel? Five times...no other Arab country has suffered more casualties fighting for the Palestinians against Israel. And this same country had the support of the people when they spent 3-decades fighting Israel.

That same country has had a corrupt, un-elected, American-backed leader rule over 80 million people for 28-years. He does not have the support of the people and the people do not support his pro-Israeli policies that are causing their Palestinian brothers and sisters to suffer. So to label an entire nation as backstabbers because a crook is making decisions on behalf of 80 million people without the populace's consent shows a complete misunderstanding of the situation.

Sorry, should have been more specific. I did not mean the whole entire country and its people and specifically meant the regime and governments of the country.

Egypt did a lot for us Palestinians and sacrificed their men to fight for Palestinians in the wars, and its people fully support the Palestinians, especially  under the leadership of Nasser who himself supported the Palestinian cause. However, I am talking about its government when it comes to Sadat (after Yom Kippur war) and Mubarak later on in the 70s to this day. Don't get me started on Mubarak and how he is building that wall on the Gaza-Egypt border. As for Jordan, I just meant to say also that comment was directed towards the Hashemite Kingdom. I am also talking specifically about the deal that was struck between the Hashemites and Charles Weizmann to give control of Palestine to Jews and all the other backstabbing they did decades after. Jordanian government did send armies to fight in wars too but I think it was just show by the Jordanian government.

 

[carlos tevez]

What did Sadat do wrong after the Yom Kippur war?

He negotiated a peace-treaty with Israel that ensured his country would no longer lose billions of dollars annually, and more importantly, lose thousands upon thousands of lives, fighting a war that was militarily un-winnable. He got Sinai back and the treaty ensured the safety of the Egyptian people.

Mubarak has pretty much had the same stance as Sadat (maintain peace with Israeli, negotiate diplomatically) however he has formed an extremely cozy relationship with America and Israeli in recent years in order to maintain his strangle-hold on power.

Mubarak has been utterly incompetent as a leader and unfortunately his rule has caused Arabs to forget which country sacrificed the most in trying to aid the Palestinian cause.

It took over 5-decades but Arabs have finally realized that Israel are here to stay and the only way to improve things for the Palestinians is by using diplomatic means to work out an agreement with the U.S. and Israel. Obama, like Clinton, is a man who has a bit more balanced view on this conflict. Unfortunately, we currently have a hard-right Israeli Prime Minister with a minority government and two conflicting organizations ruling over the Palestinians. We will not be able to proceed with serious peace negotiations until Hamas and Fatah work out their differences and a centrist/leftist Israeli is elected as Prime Minister. As a result, this conflict will not be resolved anytime soon.

BTW, does anyone know what Netenyahu's approval rating is at the moment? I've read mixed things so far...one piece I read said that the Israelis supported Netenyahu's settlement expansions. Another article I read a few days ago said that while the Israeli people are not too fond of Obama, they are extremely concerned about the possible negative implications that the current tension between the U.S. and Israel may have on their country in the near future. In fact, Ehud Barak (currently Israeli defense minister) has warned Netenyahu to take a softer stance in order to maintain a healthy relationship with Washington.

 

[hazeleyed honey]

Originally Posted by Carlos Tevez

And the Palestinian leaders deserve as much blame as everyone else. Palestinian leaders (namely Arafat) have had numerous chances to forge a long-lasting peace agreement with Israel but they failed to get the job done. The best opportunity in recent times was when the moderate Ehud Barak was Prime Minister of Israel. It was at a time when Barak's days were numbered as Israeli PM and the surveys showed that the hard-line Netenyahu was set to win the upcoming elections. Although the Israeli/American offer to Arafat was not perfect, it was an offer that should've garnered more careful consideration from Arafat. Lets not forget the fact that crooks such as Arafat and other Palestinians have stolen hundreds of millions of dollars in international aid to fill up their European bank accounts while their own people live in despicable and inhumane conditions.

Arabs like to play the blame game and often fail to take accountabilityfor their own actions. The dumba.ss Arab league failed to foresee thatIsrael were here to stay and that a two-state solution was the way togo. It was not until 2002 that the Arab League accepted the possibilityof having normal relations with Israel. The same group of countriesthat outlawed Egypt from the organization 23-years earlier becauseEgypt recognized that fighting Israel was a battle the Arabs couldn'twin.

I agree on your incompetency of corrupt Palestinian leaders. No disagreement with you there on what you said. However, I disagree about the deals when it comes to Camp David accords and Palestinians were happy Arafat did not accept it. There were so many issues with it, especially when it came to the way it would be controlled in which basically Palestinians would not have full authority or sovereignty, the Jerusalem and the refugees issue. That was such a bad proposal. I also think Arafat could not do as much as was asked for him.

As I see it, the Israeli occupation of Palestinian land is the foremost obstacle to peace. A genuine peace deal enclosing a minimum of justice necessitates a fully independent and viable Palestinian statehood on the territories illegally occupied by Israel in '67, Jerusalem should be shared as the capital for both Israel and Palestine, and Palestine should be an equal neighbouring country alongside Israel with ultimate peace and security for both peoples of the countries.

Since 1988, Palestinian authorities officially have recognized the state of Israel and already accepted its existence on 78% of historical Palestine, with the understanding that a sovereign and viable Palestine state would be established on ONLY the remaining 22% of that land. This is the historic Palestinian compromise for peace which Israel has refused to accept over and over. In all those deals that Israel has proposed which are insufficient for full Palestinian sovereignty and statehood, the right of return of refugees has been shafted and ignored when it is guaranteed under international law and U.N. resolution 194. This must be implemented somehow and Israel keeps ignoring it. The refugee problem is also at the core of the issue of the Palestinian cause which should be dealt with in the peace proposals.

 

[kingofilladelph]

Originally Posted by HOVKid

Originally Posted by Lex Starks

I agree in the sense that Jewish people need to stop playing the Holocaust card and their usage of crocodile tears to further their agendas as ol girl was trying to do. This is prevalent in the younger communities as they think they have some sort of entitlement because of what their ANCESTORS went through. You don't get to use that as an excuse.

Save the anti-semite comments.


http://www.youtube.com/v/T1NLdRVkJiA&hl=en_US&fs=1&http://www.youtube.com/v/T1NLdRVkJiA&hl=en_US&fs=1&

Waoooooooooooooooooooooh!

If you are black, I trust you never play the slave card and are against affirmative action?



  

I'm black and I don't play the slave card.  I'm indifferent about affirmative action.  What are you implying by your statement (or question)?

   moneyisthemotive wrote:

---

Lex Starks wrote:

---

I agree in the sense that Jewish Black people need to stop playing the Holocaust Slavery card and their usage of crocodile tears to further their agendas. This is prevalent in the younger communities as they think they have some sort of entitlement because of what their ANCESTORS went through. You don't get to use that as an excuse.

what if someone typed that? i think it is very insensitive to type what you did ...


If someone typed that, I'd agree with it.  What's insensitive about it?

But like its been said, the comparison is apples and oranges.

No person or group of people should use an event that no longer impacts them to further an agenda.  Especially tragedies like the Holocaust or slavery.

 

[superantigen]

Originally Posted by KingofIlladelph

Originally Posted by HOVKid

Originally Posted by Lex Starks

I agree in the sense that Jewish people need to stop playing the Holocaust card and their usage of crocodile tears to further their agendas as ol girl was trying to do. This is prevalent in the younger communities as they think they have some sort of entitlement because of what their ANCESTORS went through. You don't get to use that as an excuse.

Save the anti-semite comments.


http://www.youtube.com/v/T1NLdRVkJiA&hl=en_US&fs=1&http://www.youtube.com/v/T1NLdRVkJiA&hl=en_US&fs=1&

Waoooooooooooooooooooooh!

If you are black, I trust you never play the slave card and are against affirmative action?



  

I'm black and I don't play the slave card.  I'm indifferent about affirmative action.  What are you implying by your statement (or question)?

   moneyisthemotive wrote:

---

Lex Starks wrote:

---

I agree in the sense that Jewish Black people need to stop playing the Holocaust Slavery card and their usage of crocodile tears to further their agendas. This is prevalent in the younger communities as they think they have some sort of entitlement because of what their ANCESTORS went through. You don't get to use that as an excuse.

what if someone typed that? i think it is very insensitive to type what you did ...


If someone typed that, I'd agree with it.  What's insensitive about it?

But like its been said, the comparison is apples and oranges.

No person or group of people should use an event that no longer impacts them to further an agenda.  Especially tragedies like the Holocaust or slavery.

Question--are you suggesting that present day blacks (younger community) who bring up historical black slavery (slavery of ancestors) in this country are doing so to further an agenda?


...

 

[keepzdasneakz]

 

[kingofilladelph]

Originally Posted by SuperAntigen

Originally Posted by KingofIlladelph

Originally Posted by HOVKid

Originally Posted by Lex Starks

I agree in the sense that Jewish people need to stop playing the Holocaust card and their usage of crocodile tears to further their agendas as ol girl was trying to do. This is prevalent in the younger communities as they think they have some sort of entitlement because of what their ANCESTORS went through. You don't get to use that as an excuse.

Save the anti-semite comments.


http://www.youtube.com/v/T1NLdRVkJiA&hl=en_US&fs=1&http://www.youtube.com/v/T1NLdRVkJiA&hl=en_US&fs=1&

Waoooooooooooooooooooooh!

If you are black, I trust you never play the slave card and are against affirmative action?



  

I'm black and I don't play the slave card.  I'm indifferent about affirmative action.  What are you implying by your statement (or question)?

   moneyisthemotive wrote:

---

Lex Starks wrote:

---

I agree in the sense that Jewish Black people need to stop playing the Holocaust Slavery card and their usage of crocodile tears to further their agendas. This is prevalent in the younger communities as they think they have some sort of entitlement because of what their ANCESTORS went through. You don't get to use that as an excuse.

what if someone typed that? i think it is very insensitive to type what you did ...

If someone typed that, I'd agree with it.  What's insensitive about it?

But like its been said, the comparison is apples and oranges.

No person or group of people should use an event that no longer impacts them to further an agenda.  Especially tragedies like the Holocaust or slavery.

Question--are you suggesting that present day blacks (younger community) who bring up historical black slavery (slavery of ancestors) in this country are doing so to further an agenda?


...




No.  Bringing up slavery is one thing.  Using it as an excuse is another.

Saying "I live in the hood because of slavery and now I have to sell drugs" is more so what I meant in how it can be used to push an agenda.

 

[shaunhillftw49]

Terrorist scarf at 1:19.
But people should stop assuming every Jewish person loves Israel's actions.

 

[callhimar]

Originally Posted by Hazeleyed Honey

Originally Posted by Carlos Tevez

And the Palestinian leaders deserve as much blame as everyone else. Palestinian leaders (namely Arafat) have had numerous chances to forge a long-lasting peace agreement with Israel but they failed to get the job done. The best opportunity in recent times was when the moderate Ehud Barak was Prime Minister of Israel. It was at a time when Barak's days were numbered as Israeli PM and the surveys showed that the hard-line Netenyahu was set to win the upcoming elections. Although the Israeli/American offer to Arafat was not perfect, it was an offer that should've garnered more careful consideration from Arafat. Lets not forget the fact that crooks such as Arafat and other Palestinians have stolen hundreds of millions of dollars in international aid to fill up their European bank accounts while their own people live in despicable and inhumane conditions.

Arabs like to play the blame game and often fail to take accountabilityfor their own actions. The dumba.ss Arab league failed to foresee thatIsrael were here to stay and that a two-state solution was the way togo. It was not until 2002 that the Arab League accepted the possibilityof having normal relations with Israel. The same group of countriesthat outlawed Egypt from the organization 23-years earlier becauseEgypt recognized that fighting Israel was a battle the Arabs couldn'twin.

I agree on your incompetency of corrupt Palestinian leaders. No disagreement with you there on what you said. However, I disagree about the deals when it comes to Camp David accords and Palestinians were happy Arafat did not accept it. There were so many issues with it, especially when it came to the way it would be controlled in which basically Palestinians would not have full authority or sovereignty, the Jerusalem and the refugees issue. That was such a bad proposal. I also think Arafat could not do as much as was asked for him.

To add, the only mistake that Arafat made at Camp David was not making a counter offer. Things were obviously not in his favor and the proposal was ridiculous. Any land that doesn't have control over its borders airspace and water cannot possibly be called a sovereign nation.

Finklestein was great. Kind of annoyed me that he avoided answering the only question I really wanted him to speak on which was his preference on a solution (one state or two states) and the reality of either one, although I can be almost certain he'd favor two states like most people.

 

[kix4kix]

Drake is Jewish Lulz