I WANT TO ENCOURAGE A MORE CONSTRUCTIVE DISCUSSION OVER RACE RELATIONS ON NT

[Brownstone]

What in the world is going on in here 

 

[luckyluchiano]

This is a Quote from a user from another site I`m on in a thread about the DR in regard to someone calling Dominicans "Black"

"Youre viewing this through an African American lens

blackness in DR, and Latin American as a whole, isnt as cut and dry as it is in the US

there isnt really a one drop rule, there's never been a civil rights movement, and nationalism > race

the whole "I'm not black, I'm Dominican" thing is really semantics. In DR & Latin America, black = African American. Even in the Caribbean black = African American

If you were to ask "Do many of your ancestors originate from Africa" you'd get a different answer"

 

[ksteezy]

This is a Quote from a user from another site I`m on in a thread about the DR in regard to someone calling Dominicans "Black"

"Youre viewing this through an African American lens

blackness in DR, and Latin American as a whole, isnt as cut and dry as it is in the US

there isnt really a one drop rule, there's never been a civil rights movement, and nationalism > race

the whole "I'm not black, I'm Dominican" thing is really semantics. In DR & Latin America, black = African American. Even in the Caribbean black = African American

If you were to ask "Do many of your ancestors originate from Africa" you'd get a different answer"

Bruh weve disagreed and gone at each other many times, but you are singing sweet music in my ear and is hilarious how these dudes are in here reppin your posts as if this isn't the same **** I've been preaching for 50+ pages

 

[ninjahood]

Few people who favor the new term expect to see it replace ''black'' entirely, although they would like it to be the principal reference eventually. For now, there does not seem to be the distaste toward ''black'' that many felt toward ''Negro'' or ''colored'' two decades ago. Instead, there is a feeling that ''African-American'' can sometimes convey a significance that ''black'' cannot.

http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/31/u...-many-of-america-s-blacks.html?pagewanted=all

So "black" a term that was supposed to be replaced by African American is somehow linked to latinos according to a mental ******.

 

[ninjahood]

This is a Quote from a user from another site I`m on in a thread about the DR in regard to someone calling Dominicans "Black"

"Youre viewing this through an African American lens

blackness in DR, and Latin American as a whole, isnt as cut and dry as it is in the US

there isnt really a one drop rule, there's never been a civil rights movement, and nationalism > race

the whole "I'm not black, I'm Dominican" thing is really semantics. In DR & Latin America, black = African American. Even in the Caribbean black = African American

If you were to ask "Do many of your ancestors originate from Africa" you'd get a different answer"

Bruh weve disagreed and gone at each other many times, but you are singing sweet music in my ear and is hilarious how these dudes are in here reppin your posts as if this isn't the same **** I've been preaching for 50+ pages

Cuz THEY dont like it when Ninjahood is right...THEY..

Dont be THEY...be Great..major [emoji]128273[/emoji] alert.

 

[ninjahood]

Few people who favor the new term expect to see it replace ''black'' entirely, although they would like it to be the principal reference eventually. For now, there does not seem to be the distaste toward ''black'' that many felt toward ''Negro'' or ''colored'' two decades ago. Instead, there is a feeling that ''African-American'' can sometimes convey a significance that ''black'' cannot.

http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/31/u...-many-of-america-s-blacks.html?pagewanted=all

So "black" a term that was supposed to be replaced by African American is somehow linked to latinos according to a mental ******.

ksteezy

You see this? Black at NO point was EVER designated to latinos...someone's argument is completely dust now

 

[luckyluchiano]

So there is a ninjahood in another site.


Nationalism>>>race, that is understood but Caribbeans in this country are considered black, just like ninjahood is black. They are usually like yea, i'm black from so and so Island. They have no insecurities about saying that. A senegalese man would be like yea i'm black, I'm from Senegal. Some hispanics like ninjahood subject other members of the African diaspora to the American idea of race (which is barely a strictly American phenomena but let's pretend it is) while taking himself out. Race exists in South America, colorism exists in Latin America, they just have other words for it, or pretend to ignore it when it is ingrained int he sociopolitical make-up of those countries.


Of course nationalism>>>race for many, but black to many people INCLUDING many latinos which I've given examples of understand this difference.


Race, ethnicity and citizenship are different ways of describing people.

The only Pass I give Latin Americans outside of Brazilians are that they are in situations where they tend to have say 3 different "groups" of people in their nations,1)A group thats Majority African mixed with other stuff, 2)A group thats majority "Indigenous" tribe mixed with other stuff, and 3) a group thats majority Euro mixed with other things, so within these nations they distinguish each other by a nationally used Ethnicity, but when they leave the nation they refer to themselves strictly regarding their Nationality.

When you factor in West Indians like Jamaicans and such these people tend to be on islands where they are the overwhelming majority thus being that that land becomes synonymous with being of African descent.

Most immigrants from these areas have to learn what "Black" means and often times want to reject it being that the media has made narrative that African Americans/Black are the face of crime and failure.

People dont understand subconsciously Whites in the West have essentially programmed us to think we are all different when in fact we are more related than we think.

The interesting thing is an Afro Latino will side with his say Majority Euro Country man vs his "Black" American Cousin even though in their native land their ethnic group is being oppressed by these people.

 

[harlemtothebronx]

Next topic, we tackle calling all latinos "Spanish".

Jesus Christ.

I'm actually glad this was left open.

EDIT: Nevermind, I kept reading.

 

[luckyluchiano]

Bruh weve disagreed and gone at each other many times, but you are singing sweet music in my ear and is hilarious how these dudes are in here reppin your posts as if this isn't the same **** I've been preaching for 50+ pages

At the end of the day the topic at hand is a tricky situation. "Black" doesnt exist in the "Old World" it was only a term used to describe people. The thing is Blacks in America had the civil rights movements, and black empowerment movements, which were done to restore a lost identify being that essentially even though African Americans built America they were told they could never be American. Notice Nobody in the Western World has to add something special to their nationality/ethnicity besides African Americans. White people can be "Americans" but Blacks born in America have to be "African American".

Hell West Africa was once called "Western Sudan" as Sudan = Land of the Blacks. These were names given to us by outsiders. Black is a name given to us. So I`m not surprised that people not from the USA dont want to accept it BUT, they can still acknowledge that in America they are considered black.

As A West African I see my culture in Latinos, West Indians, and Americans. Hell Santeria = Yoruba spiritual system.

At the end of the day these titles still dont defeat the fact that we are all literally ancestral cousins.

 

[luckyluchiano]

ksteezy

You see this? Black at NO point was EVER designated to latinos...someone's argument is completely dust now

The argument at hand now is Black as a Description vs Black as a title.

Black as a Title falls in line with the various names African Americans had to carry from Negro to Colored to Afro American to African American to Black. So your statement that Latinos were never given those titles (although they may have been given something else which isn't used in America) is valid.

But Black is also used in America to describe someone with African Ancestry, so at this point we are talking semantics/ or at least we are talking about the same Concept (acknowledgment of having African Ancestry) but arguing over how it is applied.


"Blacks" of the West are Mixed, so for instance one may have Fulani DNA in them but have other things, so if they said they were Fulani, an actual 100% Fulani from Africa would look at them funny, thus in the West all these titles are used to describe the "New Ethnic Groups" that came about due to the unfortunate historical circumstances.

 

[Mark Antony]

Aight well I know who's back I ain't got if **** goes down. Ol "we good over here" selfish muh *******.

Born alone die alone b.

That whole African American = black is ya leaders fault

Go blame Jessie Jackson

African-American' Favored By Many of America's Blacks
By ISABEL WILKERSON, Special to the New York Times
Published: January 31, 1989
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CHICAGO, Jan. 30— A movement led by the Rev. Jesse Jackson to call blacks African-Americans has met with both rousing approval and deep-seated skepticism in a debate that is coming to symbolize the role and history of blacks in this country.

The term, used for years in intellectual circles, is gaining currency among many other blacks, who say its use is a sign that they are accepting their difficult past and resolving a long ambivalence toward Africa.

The term has already shown up in the newest grade-school textbooks, been adopted by several black-run radio stations and newspapers around the country and appeared in the titles of popular books and in the conversations of many blacks as they warm to the idea and speak of visiting Africa one day.

For many, the issue is already settled, not only in their minds but in their hearts. ''Whenever I go to Africa,'' said Roger Wilkins, a senior fellow at the Institute for Policy Studies, ''I feel like a person with a legitimate place to stand on this earth. This is the name for all the feelings I've had all these years.''

Mr. Wilkins's feelings are not shared by all. Skeptics, many of them older blacks who have lived through previous name changes, are resisting the move. Some say they do not identify with Africa and resent prominent blacks telling them what to be called. Others fear that the debate over a new name draws attention away from problems like unemployment and drug abuse.

Leaders of the movement to change the language say it was concern about those problems and growing involvement in the fight to end racial separation in South Africa that led to the search for a clearer group identity.

They say they want to shift the definition of the group from the racial description black to a cultural and ethnic identity that ties the group to its continent of origin and fosters dignity and self-esteem.

''This is deeper than just name recognition,'' said Mr. Jackson who, along with others, called for the change at a news conference in late December. ''Black tells you about skin color and what side of town you live on. African-American evokes discussion of the world.''

Few people who favor the new term expect to see it replace ''black'' entirely, although they would like it to be the principal reference eventually. For now, there does not seem to be the distaste toward ''black'' that many felt toward ''Negro'' or ''colored'' two decades ago. Instead, there is a feeling that ''African-American'' can sometimes convey a significance that ''black'' cannot.

The debate among blacks comes at a time when other minority groups are also struggling toward redefinition. In recent months, Jews here and in Israel have been torn over the question ''who is a Jew?'' Hispanic Americans have grappled with the use of Latino and Hispanic. And Asian-Americans, seeking recognition of their many nationalities, have successfully lobbied the Census Bureau to delineate Asian groups in the 1990 census, even listing Samoans and Guamanians.

The push for a change from ''black'' to ''African-American'' came too late to become a category in the 1990 census, said Nampeo McKenney, director of the agency's special populations division. The form will say ''Black or Negro'' in the section on race. But in light of growing pressure, the agency is adding special instructions telling those filling out the forms that ''Black or Negro includes African-Americans.'' The term African-American cannot be used officially until the agency tests it in a process that takes several years, she said. Turning Point Is Seen

Still, the push by Mr. Jackson is seen by black historians as an important step. ''This is a significant psychological and cultural turning point,'' said Dr. Walter Allen, a professor of sociology at the University of Michigan who is black. ''This makes explicit what was implicit. First we had to convince everyone to come into the fold as black. Now we are clarifying what that means.''

Dr. Ramona Edelin, president of the National Urban Coalition, said: ''There were bitter battles when we went from 'Negro' to 'black.' We don't want that this time.'' Dr. Edelin said that when she brought up the idea for adopting the term African-American at a meeting of 75 black groups convened by Mr. Jackson late last month, there was ''overwhelming consensus'' favoring the change. The meeting attracted scores of people from fraternities, sororities and civic and social groups.

Several school districts, including Atlanta and Chicago, have adopted the term in their curriculums and encourage teachers to use it. ''We just feel it's a more accurate term,'' said Dr. Alice Jurica, director of social studies for the Chicago public schools.

Two of the largest black-oriented radio stations in New York City, WWRL and WLIB, have been using the term. Now more listeners who call in refer to themselves as African-Americans, although once they get going they often slip back to using black, said David Lampel, WLIB program director. ''Often they will use black and African-American in the same phone call,'' he said. Changes in the Press

The heightened awareness has brought a bit of confusion. The station recently broadcast a report that referred to a woman with a dark complexion and a Hispanic surname. ''Everybody in the newsroom was struggling with what to call her,'' Mr. Lampel said. ''They decided on African-Latino.''

Several black newspapers, like The Amsterdam News in New York and The Chicago Daily Defender, are now changing their usage rules to accommodate the new term, to the delight of black editors like J. Lowell Ware of The Atlanta Voice, who replaced ''black'' with ''African-American'' 10 years ago.

'' 'Black' just never looked right to me,'' Mr. Ware said. '' 'Black' does not define a race of people. It's a color. It's an adjective, not a noun. And a long time before it was accepted, it was not accepted. It was one word we couldn't stomach from anyone. I just couldn't stand it anymore, so I changed it.''

Editors in mainstream journalism, including The Associated Press and The New York Times, said they had made no decision on the term. ''We're waiting to see how usage develops among writers and speakers generally,'' said Allan M. Siegal, assistant managing editor of The New York Times, which uses black ordinarily and African-American in references to advocacy of the term. Dictionary Editors Cautious

Similarly, editors of the major dictionaries said they were reserving judgment. ''We would have to see a preponderance of citations to make such a drastic change,'' said Eugene Schewmaker, senior editor of Random House dictionaries.

The question of a name has caused pain and controversy since the first Africans were captured and shipped to the Americas in the 17th century. The slaves called themselves Africans at first, but slave masters gave them English names and called them Negroes, the Portuguese word for black, historians say. That term was resented by some blacks who said it was degrading when whites mispronounced it, accidentally or intentionally.

The term African-American has had several incarnations in previous years, with ''Afro-American'' having spurts of popularity since the late 19th century and particularly in the 1960's. But supporters of the current movement find fault with that usage. ''We came from Africa,'' said Dr. Olive Taylor, a professor of history at Howard University. ''We didn't come from 'Afro.' ''

Arthur Ashe decided to use the term in his new book, ''A Hard Road to Glory: A History of the African-American Athlete,'' published late last year by Amistad-Warner. ''It was given a great deal of thought; it was definitely not going to be 'black,' '' the tennis player said. '' 'African-American' is much more appropriate and correct than 'Afro-American' or 'black' or any other alternative. And I didn't want to leave the wrong impression with something so permanent as a book.''

Now others are getting accustomed to the term. Hilda Whittington, a Chicago lawyer, has been calling herself an African-American since Mr. Jackson's remarks last month and is now planning a trip to West Africa next year. ''After thinking about it, I kind of like it,'' Mrs. Whittington said. ''We should call ourselves African-Americans and get it over with. This is it for me.''

But not for everyone. ''When did they take a vote on what blacks wanted to be called?'' C. Hutherson, a black Chicagoan, asked in a letter to The Chicago Sun-Times. ''They must have done it while I was asleep. Jesse Jackson and other black leaders have a lot of nerve speaking for all blacks.'' 'I Want to Stay Black'

In a recent discussion in Eva Brown's sophomore history class at Chicago's Kenmore Academy, several students were suspicious of the term. ''I want to stay black,'' said Madonna Cliff, who is 16 years old.

Nor should blacks see changing a name as a panacea, many say. ''This doesn't mean that everything will be wonderful and all the poor people will get taken care of,'' said Mary Frances Berry, a professor of history at the University of Pennsylvania who is a member of United States Civil Rights Commission.

''But with the devastating problems in the community now, building self-esteem can't be all bad,'' said Professor Berry, who is black. ''It's not going to make things worse.''

Now a term that was once considered militant is going mainstream. '' 'African-American' reflects a post-modern black consciousness,'' said Dr. Roderick Watts, an assistant professor of psychology at Yale University, who last year founded a community group with the name the Association of Agencies Serving African-Americans. ''It has a self-affirming quality that seems to fit right now.''

http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/31/u...-many-of-america-s-blacks.html?pagewanted=all

Seems ya got a historical wrong to write.. [emoji]128133[/emoji]

you don't bat an eye associating non latino, non african american black person AS african american ("ya leaders") but let someone dare do that to you.

 

[luckyluchiano]

Which I find a bit hypocritical.

It boils down to the negative stigma and narrative created about Black Americans. Continental Africans, West Indians, and Black Latinos from what I have seen tend to get along no problem when it comes to doing business and being cordial. In America the narrative has been created for Blacks that when you come to America dont mess with Black Americans.

Now of course you have people who can see through the bull, but you have a ton of people who fall for the trap which is why you can have an African, Latino, or West Indian say stuff like "man these black people are so lazy", not understanding that in America they are considered black too. lol

White folks dont care about your tribe, ethnic group, etc. They look at your skin and features and sign you off as being black.

 

[ninjahood]

ksteezy

You see this? Black at NO point was EVER designated to latinos...someone's argument is completely dust now

The argument at hand now is Black as a Description vs Black as a title.

Black as a Title falls in line with the various names African Americans had to carry from Negro to Colored to Afro American to African American to Black. So your statement that Latinos were never given those titles (although they may have been given something else which isn't used in America) is valid.


In the West all these titles are used to describe the "New Ethnic Groups" that came about due to the unfortunate historical circumstances.

Thats all i ever said here.

Latino denotes our nations of mixed DNA that share a common ethnicity because its all jumbled, so in our culture, it frankly doesn't matter and not given importance da way Americans OBSESS over it here.

Im glad YOU get it, ksteezy, diego & me been saying da same **** for days.

 

[luckyluchiano]

DING DING DING....now we're getting somewhere. African Immigrants are RACIST as **** against African Americans. Matter of fact there's a Nigerian/Ibo slur for African Americans. I can see how someone like ninjahood could've been socialized to not want to associate himself with African Americans, who i proudly call my kin.

Really Nigerians and some East Africans are the ones who are on that Racist Steeze mainly because they are the only Africans really immigrating to America in large numbers lol. Most West Africans dont even rock with Nigerians like that because cats are scammers. East Africans and Nigerians tend to come to America on education or Work Visas which is why they come and have their noses turnt up high, lol Africans that come on Refugee status arent like that.

Very few Black people Globally can see whats going on and the "Bigger picture".

 

[filthyjiujitsu]

This had me You look like someone on Irish money. I used to date this Mexican chick who had legit red hair like Louie Ck, I thought it was a myth..


 

Exactly why the Black/White title doesn't fit with latinos.

 

[ksteezy]

 

[luckyluchiano]

Thats all i ever said here.

Latino denotes our nations of mixed DNA that share a common ethnicity because its all jumbled, so in our culture, it frankly doesn't matter and not given importance da way Americans OBSESS over it here.

Im glad YOU get it, ksteezy, diego & me been saying da same **** for days.

The issue is saying you arent Black to an African America is essentially taking a dump on the Blood Sweat and Tears shed by the ones who Built America and are essentially the reasons other people of the Diaspora are even allowed to set foot in America. You can replace Black with anything, but the context people are arguing is that understanding everyone is on the same page when it comes to us having a common ancestor.

Thats where the semantics comes in, but cause true you arent African American so in your eyes your arent "Black" since "Black" as a title is essentially an American Concept, but saying you arent "Black" from the eyes of an African America is like saying you are denouncing your African Ancestry, which is what people are arguing about.

 

[luckyluchiano]

That's why when people try to use African immigrants as a lithmus test of how Black Americans should be better achieving I laugh at them. A lot, but not all of the immigrants who come to this country from Africa were already either well educated or well established in their country of origin.

I'm supposed to compare Black Americans to the son of a Ghanaian diplomat who went to Oxford? Seriously? :\

yea pretty much, the "Down" Africans are still on the continent struggling and arent getting approved for Visas, and Africa isn't like Mexico where people can just hop a fence. Like I said African Refugees tend to be the most understanding.

 

[ksteezy]

The issue is saying you arent Black to an African America is essentially taking a dump on the Blood Sweat and Tears shed by the ones who Built America and are essentially the reasons other people of the Diaspora are even allowed to set foot in America. You can replace Black with anything, but the context people are arguing is that understanding everyone is on the same page when it comes to us having a common ancestor.

Thats where the semantics comes in, but cause true you arent African American so in your eyes your arent "Black" since "Black" as a title is essentially an American Concept, but saying you arent "Black" from the eyes of an African America is like saying you are denouncing your African Ancestry, which is what people are arguing about.

And this is when it gets all convoluted and things get misinterpreted and people get wrongfully accused of racism/racial shame an African American views it as denouncing African roots, while most Latinos will view it as embracing their Latino ethnicity....so at the end of the day we have 60 pages of an argument that literally moves in circles.

 

[ksteezy]

The social disparities that exist in those countries shows why it does.


A lot of them come to this country and try to act like their race isn't a factor. Let's be real, a lot of white latinos proudly check that white box. Ninjahood is only mad cause he doesn't have that luxury. A lot of the videos posted touched on how overrepresented white latinos are in the media and telemundo. It's an issue that needs to be addressed as much as you people want to brush it under the rug.

You are wrong, feel free to go have a conversation about it with a "white" Latino.....is cute to make assumptions to try and back up your point....white Latinos denounce the label of white just as much as black Latinos denounce the label of black IN AMERICA.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Aight well I know who's back I ain't got if **** goes down. Ol "we good over here" selfish muh *******.

Born alone die alone b.

That whole African American = black is ya leaders fault

Go blame Jessie Jackson

African-American' Favored By Many of America's Blacks
By ISABEL WILKERSON, Special to the New York Times
Published: January 31, 1989
FACEBOOK
TWITTER
GOOGLE+
EMAIL
SHARE
PRINT
REPRINTS
CHICAGO, Jan. 30— A movement led by the Rev. Jesse Jackson to call blacks African-Americans has met with both rousing approval and deep-seated skepticism in a debate that is coming to symbolize the role and history of blacks in this country.

The term, used for years in intellectual circles, is gaining currency among many other blacks, who say its use is a sign that they are accepting their difficult past and resolving a long ambivalence toward Africa.

The term has already shown up in the newest grade-school textbooks, been adopted by several black-run radio stations and newspapers around the country and appeared in the titles of popular books and in the conversations of many blacks as they warm to the idea and speak of visiting Africa one day.

For many, the issue is already settled, not only in their minds but in their hearts. ''Whenever I go to Africa,'' said Roger Wilkins, a senior fellow at the Institute for Policy Studies, ''I feel like a person with a legitimate place to stand on this earth. This is the name for all the feelings I've had all these years.''

Mr. Wilkins's feelings are not shared by all. Skeptics, many of them older blacks who have lived through previous name changes, are resisting the move. Some say they do not identify with Africa and resent prominent blacks telling them what to be called. Others fear that the debate over a new name draws attention away from problems like unemployment and drug abuse.

Leaders of the movement to change the language say it was concern about those problems and growing involvement in the fight to end racial separation in South Africa that led to the search for a clearer group identity.

They say they want to shift the definition of the group from the racial description black to a cultural and ethnic identity that ties the group to its continent of origin and fosters dignity and self-esteem.

''This is deeper than just name recognition,'' said Mr. Jackson who, along with others, called for the change at a news conference in late December. ''Black tells you about skin color and what side of town you live on. African-American evokes discussion of the world.''

Few people who favor the new term expect to see it replace ''black'' entirely, although they would like it to be the principal reference eventually. For now, there does not seem to be the distaste toward ''black'' that many felt toward ''Negro'' or ''colored'' two decades ago. Instead, there is a feeling that ''African-American'' can sometimes convey a significance that ''black'' cannot.

The debate among blacks comes at a time when other minority groups are also struggling toward redefinition. In recent months, Jews here and in Israel have been torn over the question ''who is a Jew?'' Hispanic Americans have grappled with the use of Latino and Hispanic. And Asian-Americans, seeking recognition of their many nationalities, have successfully lobbied the Census Bureau to delineate Asian groups in the 1990 census, even listing Samoans and Guamanians.

The push for a change from ''black'' to ''African-American'' came too late to become a category in the 1990 census, said Nampeo McKenney, director of the agency's special populations division. The form will say ''Black or Negro'' in the section on race. But in light of growing pressure, the agency is adding special instructions telling those filling out the forms that ''Black or Negro includes African-Americans.'' The term African-American cannot be used officially until the agency tests it in a process that takes several years, she said. Turning Point Is Seen

Still, the push by Mr. Jackson is seen by black historians as an important step. ''This is a significant psychological and cultural turning point,'' said Dr. Walter Allen, a professor of sociology at the University of Michigan who is black. ''This makes explicit what was implicit. First we had to convince everyone to come into the fold as black. Now we are clarifying what that means.''

Dr. Ramona Edelin, president of the National Urban Coalition, said: ''There were bitter battles when we went from 'Negro' to 'black.' We don't want that this time.'' Dr. Edelin said that when she brought up the idea for adopting the term African-American at a meeting of 75 black groups convened by Mr. Jackson late last month, there was ''overwhelming consensus'' favoring the change. The meeting attracted scores of people from fraternities, sororities and civic and social groups.

Several school districts, including Atlanta and Chicago, have adopted the term in their curriculums and encourage teachers to use it. ''We just feel it's a more accurate term,'' said Dr. Alice Jurica, director of social studies for the Chicago public schools.

Two of the largest black-oriented radio stations in New York City, WWRL and WLIB, have been using the term. Now more listeners who call in refer to themselves as African-Americans, although once they get going they often slip back to using black, said David Lampel, WLIB program director. ''Often they will use black and African-American in the same phone call,'' he said. Changes in the Press

The heightened awareness has brought a bit of confusion. The station recently broadcast a report that referred to a woman with a dark complexion and a Hispanic surname. ''Everybody in the newsroom was struggling with what to call her,'' Mr. Lampel said. ''They decided on African-Latino.''

Several black newspapers, like The Amsterdam News in New York and The Chicago Daily Defender, are now changing their usage rules to accommodate the new term, to the delight of black editors like J. Lowell Ware of The Atlanta Voice, who replaced ''black'' with ''African-American'' 10 years ago.

'' 'Black' just never looked right to me,'' Mr. Ware said. '' 'Black' does not define a race of people. It's a color. It's an adjective, not a noun. And a long time before it was accepted, it was not accepted. It was one word we couldn't stomach from anyone. I just couldn't stand it anymore, so I changed it.''

Editors in mainstream journalism, including The Associated Press and The New York Times, said they had made no decision on the term. ''We're waiting to see how usage develops among writers and speakers generally,'' said Allan M. Siegal, assistant managing editor of The New York Times, which uses black ordinarily and African-American in references to advocacy of the term. Dictionary Editors Cautious

Similarly, editors of the major dictionaries said they were reserving judgment. ''We would have to see a preponderance of citations to make such a drastic change,'' said Eugene Schewmaker, senior editor of Random House dictionaries.

The question of a name has caused pain and controversy since the first Africans were captured and shipped to the Americas in the 17th century. The slaves called themselves Africans at first, but slave masters gave them English names and called them Negroes, the Portuguese word for black, historians say. That term was resented by some blacks who said it was degrading when whites mispronounced it, accidentally or intentionally.

The term African-American has had several incarnations in previous years, with ''Afro-American'' having spurts of popularity since the late 19th century and particularly in the 1960's. But supporters of the current movement find fault with that usage. ''We came from Africa,'' said Dr. Olive Taylor, a professor of history at Howard University. ''We didn't come from 'Afro.' ''

Arthur Ashe decided to use the term in his new book, ''A Hard Road to Glory: A History of the African-American Athlete,'' published late last year by Amistad-Warner. ''It was given a great deal of thought; it was definitely not going to be 'black,' '' the tennis player said. '' 'African-American' is much more appropriate and correct than 'Afro-American' or 'black' or any other alternative. And I didn't want to leave the wrong impression with something so permanent as a book.''

Now others are getting accustomed to the term. Hilda Whittington, a Chicago lawyer, has been calling herself an African-American since Mr. Jackson's remarks last month and is now planning a trip to West Africa next year. ''After thinking about it, I kind of like it,'' Mrs. Whittington said. ''We should call ourselves African-Americans and get it over with. This is it for me.''

But not for everyone. ''When did they take a vote on what blacks wanted to be called?'' C. Hutherson, a black Chicagoan, asked in a letter to The Chicago Sun-Times. ''They must have done it while I was asleep. Jesse Jackson and other black leaders have a lot of nerve speaking for all blacks.'' 'I Want to Stay Black'

In a recent discussion in Eva Brown's sophomore history class at Chicago's Kenmore Academy, several students were suspicious of the term. ''I want to stay black,'' said Madonna Cliff, who is 16 years old.

Nor should blacks see changing a name as a panacea, many say. ''This doesn't mean that everything will be wonderful and all the poor people will get taken care of,'' said Mary Frances Berry, a professor of history at the University of Pennsylvania who is a member of United States Civil Rights Commission.

''But with the devastating problems in the community now, building self-esteem can't be all bad,'' said Professor Berry, who is black. ''It's not going to make things worse.''

Now a term that was once considered militant is going mainstream. '' 'African-American' reflects a post-modern black consciousness,'' said Dr. Roderick Watts, an assistant professor of psychology at Yale University, who last year founded a community group with the name the Association of Agencies Serving African-Americans. ''It has a self-affirming quality that seems to fit right now.''

http://www.nytimes.com/1989/01/31/u...-many-of-america-s-blacks.html?pagewanted=all

Seems ya got a historical wrong to write.. [emoji]128133[/emoji]

you don't bat an eye associating non latino, non african american black person AS african american ("ya leaders") but let someone dare do that to you.

-Me: I'm black but I'm West Indian. Not all black people in America are "African Americans"

Ninja: Nah b, in America you is African American, it mean the same thing as black

-Me: Brah you're black and Latino. You can be both at the same time

Ninja: Nah be, I'm in no way black, why you denying me my culture, da census, da MLB, da dispora. I just want to identify as Latino

Me: Ok brah cool, that's your choice, I respect that. Does that mean you gonna acknowledge that I'm a black West Indian, not African America?

Ninja: Nah b, Da psychologist say to African America mean black. So imma rock wit that

Steezy: HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT TO NINJA, well not "you", BUT YOU

 

[ninjahood]

Let's be real, a lot of white latinos proudly check that white box. Ninjahood is only mad cause he doesn't have that luxury.

LMAO.

This where we are now.

When da hate dont work da lies come out [emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji][emoji]128514[/emoji]

 

[ksteezy]

Trolllolololololo

 

[ninjahood]

The social disparities that exist in those countries shows why it does.


A lot of them come to this country and try to act like their race isn't a factor. Let's be real, a lot of white latinos proudly check that white box. Ninjahood is only mad cause he doesn't have that luxury. A lot of the videos posted touched on how overrepresented white latinos are in the media and telemundo. It's an issue that needs to be addressed as much as you people want to brush it under the rug.

You are wrong, feel free to go have a conversation about it with a "white" Latino.....is cute to make assumptions to try and back up your point....white Latinos denounce the label of white just as much as black Latinos denounce the label of black IN AMERICA.

He has now shown his ***. [emoji]128514[/emoji]

And dunce even posts a sketch comedy of depicting da exact opposite.

Look at that resentment oozing out its pitiful..

 

[luckyluchiano]

At the end of the day this thread just further proves how idiotic the Western Concept of Race is.

In the Old world your nation and ethnicity tended to be synonymous.

In the West you have people who were told even though they built these countries it is not their nation and they are not human thus comes in all of this idiotic confusion as people are trying to find logic in a system/belief system that is illogical.

Hell even with Africa you have people being told their Nationality is a Country that didnt even exist when their Great Grand parents were alive all because some Europeans drew up some political lines to divide land they stole among each other.