- Feb 16, 2011
- 8,382
- 8,117
Got curry in the blender early.
**LA LAKERS THREAD** Sitting on 17! 2023-2024 offseason begins
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by licensed to ball,
- Start date
- Jan 8, 2006
- 30,559
- 33,906
Feel like he didn’t as much love as the new additions but he’s as perfect of a fit as it gets
- Aug 2, 2008
- 37,531
- 13,031
This is a play that will be there all year.
Whether DLo or AR are the attacker.
Weak side corner is going to collapse on AD as the roll man. Because if you don’t, easy lob over the top to AD.
Even Christian Wood’s offensive abilities has a good amount of gravity.
And it’s up to Rui, Prince and *gulp* Vando to hit the open 3s on the skip.
Whether DLo or AR are the attacker.
Weak side corner is going to collapse on AD as the roll man. Because if you don’t, easy lob over the top to AD.
Even Christian Wood’s offensive abilities has a good amount of gravity.
And it’s up to Rui, Prince and *gulp* Vando to hit the open 3s on the skip.
- Sep 5, 2010
- 92,708
- 128,939
Modern basketball. 
- Sep 5, 2010
- 92,708
- 128,939
Reloaded Lakers may have finally fixed their biggest weakness: 3-point shooting
Following a Western Conference finals run fueled by an elite defense, the Los Angeles Lakers entered this past offseason with a key goal in mind: to revamp their middling offense.
Through four preseason games, the results have been impressive. There is a tangible shift in Los Angeles’ identity, with the offense looking far more potent than the defense as the team acclimates to the start of the 2023-24 season.
“Our offense might be a little bit ahead of our defense right now,” Lakers head coach Darvin Ham admitted before the Lakers’ 129-125 preseason loss to the Golden State Warriors at Crypto.com Arena Friday.
For years, the scouting report against the Lakers has been to pack the paint against LeBron James and Anthony Davis and cajole a supporting cast who usually possessed limited shooting aptitude into beating them. Outside of their championship season, when they ranked in the middle of the pack, the Lakers have been a bottom-10 3-point shooting team in terms of volume and percentage. They’ve succeeded at times in spite of their offensive limitations, with defensive-minded role players doing the dirty work as James and Davis carry most of the offensive load.
But with Austin Reaves’ emergence as a legitimate third option over the second half of last season, the trade deadline additions (and re-signings) of D’Angelo Russell and Rui Hachimura and the offseason additions of Gabe Vincent, Taurean Prince and Christian Wood, the Lakers are confident they have more offensive firepower than at any point in the James-Davis era.
With the required caveat that preseason basketball doesn’t always translate into the regular season and the acknowledgment that four games is a minuscule sample size, the early returns on the Lakers’ offense are that this season’s group won’t suffer from the same fate as previous iterations.
Over the five quarters that the Lakers have played a semi-regular rotation – the first half against Brooklyn and the first three quarters against Golden State – they have scored 177 points. That averages out to 35.4 points per quarter, or 141.6 points per game. They’ve scored at least 30 points in all five quarters, effortlessly creating wide-open 3-point looks, getting to the rim and drawing fouls (they were 21 of 33 from the free-throw line in the first three quarters against the Warriors). That scoring pace is unsustainable, but last season’s group rarely flashed this type of offensive potential.
Part of the early improvement is because of continuity, with most of the rotation having played together last season. Part of it is because of the roster improvements around that core, with the additions of Vincent, Prince and Wood. Part of it is because of Ham, in his second season, having more time to tweak his offensive system to better fit his more consistent personnel.
“It’s the habits and the connectivity,” Ham said of the team’s offensive progress. “We do a lot of breakdowns, whether it’s two-man pick-and-rolls, three-man actions, four and five-man actions, we script a lot and we constantly work on concepts and reads. Having the type of team that we have – everyone can dribble, pass and shoot – just that unselfishness, moving the ball, that all it comes down to. … As long as that camaraderie, continuity and communication on the offensive side of the ball continues to grow and build, there’s no doubt in my mind the sky’s the limit.”
Six Lakers scored in double figures against the Warriors: Prince (17 points), Reaves (16), Davis (13), Wood (13), James (12) and Russell (12). Los Angeles made nine 3s in the first quarter, matching their season-high for a quarter last season. (They made nine 3s in the first quarter on March 14, 2023 – also known as the “Malik Beasley game.”). That comes just two games after the Lakers made 20 3-pointers against the Nets, more than they made in any regular-season or playoff game last season.
Preseason defenses aren’t exactly the Bad Boys Pistons, but the Lakers’ shooting improvement seems legitimate. Even without Vincent, who missed Friday’s game because of back tightness, 10 different Lakers made 3s against the Warriors, including all five starters. The newcomers are helping, with Prince (50 percent from 3 on 4.5 attempts per game this preseason) and Vincent (37.5 percent on 5.3 attempts) shooting well and prominently featuring into the rotation. Most importantly, Davis, whose jump shot is the key to the Lakers’ playoff offense, has made four of his eight attempts over three games.
Lineup data isn’t available for the preseason on NBA.com, but four of the Lakers’ five starters have offensive ratings that would’ve led the NBA last season when extrapolated to a team context: Davis (the Lakers have scored 127.1 points per 100 possessions with him on the floor), Reaves (124.
, Russell (123. and Prince (119.2). Interestingly, James is the only starter with a below-average offensive rating (110.8, which would’ve ranked 27th leaguewide).
With Russell and Reaves running the show as primary ballhandlers in pick-and-roll and side-to-side actions, James and Davis have frequently been used as finishers, spotting up and back-cutting for their points. That helps preserve their legs for defense and crunch time. The team is also playing at a much faster pace and its assist percentage is up slightly, indicating an increase in ball movement and better shot quality.
“Anytime you can play with a group of guys longer, you build that chemistry,” Reaves said. “You build just really the feel of playing as a unit. That leads to not a good shot, but a great (one). So we try to preach a lot of good-to-great. … We’ve brought in guys that can really shoot the ball and play the right way. So it’s really a testament to all of that.”
It’s possible the Lakers traded some of their defensive effectiveness for offensive proficiency, though the defensive downgrade at backup point guard from Dennis Schröder to Vincent is minimal because Vincent is a capable on-ball defender in his own right. If that occurs, it’s probably a fair, if necessary tradeoff. An elite defense will always be an important championship ingredient, but an elite offense, and particularly an elite 3-point shooting team, has become just as important of an ingredient, if not more, for modern title contenders.
Of course, Ham will always be a defensive-first coach, and Davis, one of the game’s best defenders and rim protectors, gives the team one of the strongest foundations in the NBA. But the Lakers have been long overdue in needing to modernizing their offense, and it’s clear through four preseason games that this group is on track to doing so.
“We have a plethora of guys that can carry that (offensive) load and we’re going to need every one of them,” Ham said. “Every person in that locker room we’re going to lean on them if we plan on this being a nine-month journey.”
Following a Western Conference finals run fueled by an elite defense, the Los Angeles Lakers entered this past offseason with a key goal in mind: to revamp their middling offense.
Through four preseason games, the results have been impressive. There is a tangible shift in Los Angeles’ identity, with the offense looking far more potent than the defense as the team acclimates to the start of the 2023-24 season.
“Our offense might be a little bit ahead of our defense right now,” Lakers head coach Darvin Ham admitted before the Lakers’ 129-125 preseason loss to the Golden State Warriors at Crypto.com Arena Friday.
For years, the scouting report against the Lakers has been to pack the paint against LeBron James and Anthony Davis and cajole a supporting cast who usually possessed limited shooting aptitude into beating them. Outside of their championship season, when they ranked in the middle of the pack, the Lakers have been a bottom-10 3-point shooting team in terms of volume and percentage. They’ve succeeded at times in spite of their offensive limitations, with defensive-minded role players doing the dirty work as James and Davis carry most of the offensive load.
But with Austin Reaves’ emergence as a legitimate third option over the second half of last season, the trade deadline additions (and re-signings) of D’Angelo Russell and Rui Hachimura and the offseason additions of Gabe Vincent, Taurean Prince and Christian Wood, the Lakers are confident they have more offensive firepower than at any point in the James-Davis era.
With the required caveat that preseason basketball doesn’t always translate into the regular season and the acknowledgment that four games is a minuscule sample size, the early returns on the Lakers’ offense are that this season’s group won’t suffer from the same fate as previous iterations.
Over the five quarters that the Lakers have played a semi-regular rotation – the first half against Brooklyn and the first three quarters against Golden State – they have scored 177 points. That averages out to 35.4 points per quarter, or 141.6 points per game. They’ve scored at least 30 points in all five quarters, effortlessly creating wide-open 3-point looks, getting to the rim and drawing fouls (they were 21 of 33 from the free-throw line in the first three quarters against the Warriors). That scoring pace is unsustainable, but last season’s group rarely flashed this type of offensive potential.
Part of the early improvement is because of continuity, with most of the rotation having played together last season. Part of it is because of the roster improvements around that core, with the additions of Vincent, Prince and Wood. Part of it is because of Ham, in his second season, having more time to tweak his offensive system to better fit his more consistent personnel.
“It’s the habits and the connectivity,” Ham said of the team’s offensive progress. “We do a lot of breakdowns, whether it’s two-man pick-and-rolls, three-man actions, four and five-man actions, we script a lot and we constantly work on concepts and reads. Having the type of team that we have – everyone can dribble, pass and shoot – just that unselfishness, moving the ball, that all it comes down to. … As long as that camaraderie, continuity and communication on the offensive side of the ball continues to grow and build, there’s no doubt in my mind the sky’s the limit.”
Six Lakers scored in double figures against the Warriors: Prince (17 points), Reaves (16), Davis (13), Wood (13), James (12) and Russell (12). Los Angeles made nine 3s in the first quarter, matching their season-high for a quarter last season. (They made nine 3s in the first quarter on March 14, 2023 – also known as the “Malik Beasley game.”). That comes just two games after the Lakers made 20 3-pointers against the Nets, more than they made in any regular-season or playoff game last season.
Preseason defenses aren’t exactly the Bad Boys Pistons, but the Lakers’ shooting improvement seems legitimate. Even without Vincent, who missed Friday’s game because of back tightness, 10 different Lakers made 3s against the Warriors, including all five starters. The newcomers are helping, with Prince (50 percent from 3 on 4.5 attempts per game this preseason) and Vincent (37.5 percent on 5.3 attempts) shooting well and prominently featuring into the rotation. Most importantly, Davis, whose jump shot is the key to the Lakers’ playoff offense, has made four of his eight attempts over three games.
Lineup data isn’t available for the preseason on NBA.com, but four of the Lakers’ five starters have offensive ratings that would’ve led the NBA last season when extrapolated to a team context: Davis (the Lakers have scored 127.1 points per 100 possessions with him on the floor), Reaves (124.
, Russell (123. and Prince (119.2). Interestingly, James is the only starter with a below-average offensive rating (110.8, which would’ve ranked 27th leaguewide).With Russell and Reaves running the show as primary ballhandlers in pick-and-roll and side-to-side actions, James and Davis have frequently been used as finishers, spotting up and back-cutting for their points. That helps preserve their legs for defense and crunch time. The team is also playing at a much faster pace and its assist percentage is up slightly, indicating an increase in ball movement and better shot quality.
“Anytime you can play with a group of guys longer, you build that chemistry,” Reaves said. “You build just really the feel of playing as a unit. That leads to not a good shot, but a great (one). So we try to preach a lot of good-to-great. … We’ve brought in guys that can really shoot the ball and play the right way. So it’s really a testament to all of that.”
It’s possible the Lakers traded some of their defensive effectiveness for offensive proficiency, though the defensive downgrade at backup point guard from Dennis Schröder to Vincent is minimal because Vincent is a capable on-ball defender in his own right. If that occurs, it’s probably a fair, if necessary tradeoff. An elite defense will always be an important championship ingredient, but an elite offense, and particularly an elite 3-point shooting team, has become just as important of an ingredient, if not more, for modern title contenders.
Of course, Ham will always be a defensive-first coach, and Davis, one of the game’s best defenders and rim protectors, gives the team one of the strongest foundations in the NBA. But the Lakers have been long overdue in needing to modernizing their offense, and it’s clear through four preseason games that this group is on track to doing so.
“We have a plethora of guys that can carry that (offensive) load and we’re going to need every one of them,” Ham said. “Every person in that locker room we’re going to lean on them if we plan on this being a nine-month journey.”
- Jul 29, 2012
- 4,733
- 5,519
I've been critical of the squad the past few years with size, shooting, defense, but Lakers got what they need this year. Bron and AD still need to hit their 3s to truly unlock the offense, but all the pieces are there.
- Feb 17, 2019
- 16,711
- 17,709
All Pelinka had to do was follow the formula and find the right fits and balance of youngsters and hungry veterans with chips on their shoulders.
'19-'20 top 6 3-point Shooters: Green, KCP, Kuzma, Bron, AD, Bradley
'23-'24 top 8 3-point shooters: Prince, DLo, AR, Bron, Wood, AD, Rui, Vincent
'19-'20 top 8 defenders: Caruso, KCP, Green, Bradley, Rondo, Bron, AD, Kuzma
'23-'24 top 7 defenders: Prince, Vincent, AR, AD, Vando, Christie, Bron
'19-'20 Size and Length: McGee, Howard, AD, Morris, Kuzma, Bron
'23-'24 Size and Length: Hayes, Wood, AD, Rui, Vando, Bron, Castleton
A balanced, well-oiled "championship ready" squad for the first time in 3 years
- Feb 17, 2019
- 16,711
- 17,709
Jaxson Hayes played like 
last night. Aside for one impressive block on CP3, he didn't do anything else. Plus/minus of -10 as a result, against a small ball team.
Wood continues to provide what we brought him here to do which is be a scoring threat from the inside and outside coming off the bench. Really like what I'm seeing from him and his offensive consistency.
Prince has proven to be a great fit, kinda like how Tayshaun Prince was the perfect fit playing with Chauncey, Rip, Sheed, and Big Ben.
last night. Aside for one impressive block on CP3, he didn't do anything else. Plus/minus of -10 as a result, against a small ball team.Wood continues to provide what we brought him here to do which is be a scoring threat from the inside and outside coming off the bench. Really like what I'm seeing from him and his offensive consistency.
Prince has proven to be a great fit, kinda like how Tayshaun Prince was the perfect fit playing with Chauncey, Rip, Sheed, and Big Ben.
Last edited:
- Feb 17, 2019
- 16,711
- 17,709
PNR then skip pass to the corner or a couple of swing passes on the perimeter off the PNR to get the defense mad rotating so we can hit the open three?Modern basketball.
They were doing this with regularity in the 90s and 00s too.
The only thing that's "modern" is that big men can shoot threes much better, the post up game is nearly nonexistent, and teams shoot 40+ threes a game.
But as far as the clip Essential showed of DLo coming off a PNR then skips a pass to Prince in the corner for the 3, this play ain't "modern" basketball cause they been doing that since the dawn of time. Even Phil's triangle offense incorporated those elements because of the spacing the triangle brought to the offense.
- Sep 19, 2012
- 7,722
- 10,698
After trading Kuz, the best wing player on the roster outside of Lebron might've been Troy Brown Jr... now there are a couple of really good players in Rui, Vando, and Prince (could even throw Christie, Reddish and maybe one day Lewis)
That's always been the missing piece for me, they never replaced that 3&D wing... they've signed a couple of backup bigs since the title.
- Feb 17, 2019
- 16,711
- 17,709
THT, Wes Matthews, washed Carmelo, washed Ariza, Bazemore, Ellington, Stanley Johnson, Juan Toscano, Troy Brown, Matt Ryan
SMH
grittyman
Lakers 3&D wings the last few years definitely weaksauce.
Since the title Pelinka wanted to stay big, as evidenced by the signings of Gasol, Drummond, Bamba, Jones,Bryant, Jordan, TT, etc, so you exactly right. These bigs just didn't fit with Bron and AD like McGee and Howard did.
But as we have seen the last 2-3 years, having one or the other doesn't cut it. Gotta have both 3&D wings and Bigs who impact the game in order for the squad to gel and be a true championship contender.
"The Others", word to Big Shaq
SMH
grittyman
Lakers 3&D wings the last few years definitely weaksauce.
Since the title Pelinka wanted to stay big, as evidenced by the signings of Gasol, Drummond, Bamba, Jones,Bryant, Jordan, TT, etc, so you exactly right. These bigs just didn't fit with Bron and AD like McGee and Howard did.
But as we have seen the last 2-3 years, having one or the other doesn't cut it. Gotta have both 3&D wings and Bigs who impact the game in order for the squad to gel and be a true championship contender.
"The Others", word to Big Shaq
Last edited:
- Sep 19, 2012
- 7,722
- 10,698
So a couple of things…THT, Wes Matthews, washed Carmelo, washed Ariza, Bazemore, Ellington, Stanley Johnson, Juan Toscano, Troy Brown, Matt Ryan
SMH
Lakers 3&D wings the last few years definitely weaksauce.
Since the title Pelinka wanted to stay big, as evidenced by the signings of Gasol, Drummond, Bamba, Jones,Bryant, Jordan, TT, etc, so you exactly right. These bigs just didn't fit with Bron and AD like McGee and Howard did.
But as we have seen the last 2-3 years, having one or the other doesn't cut it. Gotta have both 3&D wings and Bigs who impact the game in order for the squad to gel and be a true championship contender.
"The Others", word to Big Shaq
Don’t think the Lakers ever really pivoted to being a small team, the roster construction was a result of the available options at the time. They signed or traded for multiple big men since the title year… for various reasons it just didn’t work out.
And whether it was the title year or anything that followed, AD and LeBron are your impactful bigs (5 and 4 positions)… but they haven’t really had any impactful wings since Kuz.
- Sep 5, 2010
- 92,708
- 128,939
It's early, but JHS is shooting 5-28 in pre-season, 1-11 from three so far. In summer league, he shot 32-of-94, including 5-of-23 from three.
I'll give the benefit of the doubt to the Lakers scouts, but woof.
I'll give the benefit of the doubt to the Lakers scouts, but woof.
MIKE LOWERY
formerly chuck finster
- Mar 1, 2007
- 7,590
- 4,720
I still believe in JHS, but this team, right now, ain't the place for him. I'm still lost on what they were thinking on draft night, but he is a great kid and Pelinka probably fell for him like GSW did with Wiseman.
- Jun 4, 2016
- 8,932
- 20,496
Cam Whitmore should’ve been the pick over JHS,it was a easy slam dunk
- Jan 18, 2006
- 40,354
- 45,100
It really was. When he was there I prayed we would pick him.
Imagine him with this squad.
- Apr 24, 2006
- 18,752
- 13,100
Man. Ever since that Rui trade we’ve been a serious front office and a serious basketball team. Can’t wait for this season
- Sep 5, 2010
- 92,708
- 128,939
I would've taken Whitmore or Clowney.
I can somewhat understand not taking Whitmore because they didn't have his medicals, but the roll of the dice was worth it.
I can somewhat understand not taking Whitmore because they didn't have his medicals, but the roll of the dice was worth it.
- Mar 24, 2001
- 44,833
- 66,536
D'lo and Lonzo were just as bad. Imma wait it out
- Jul 29, 2012
- 4,733
- 5,519
Yeah, that's been the knock on him. Good vision, court sense, feel for the game, but can't shoot, and no range. Guess they were hoping for Rondo, but he's got to make some strides to get there
- Oct 8, 2017
- 1,556
- 1,210
We still need a big body big
- Jan 18, 2006
- 40,354
- 45,100
- Sep 19, 2012
- 7,722
- 10,698
Some perspective maybe…
Lakers have a championship level roster and a small window open to compete in the LBJ/AD era… the only rookie from this class that would crack this team’s rotation is Wemby. So doesn’t really matter much who they drafted, it was a move for the future not the present.
As far as Cam vs JHS the prospect? Obviously pg is the hardest position to play in the league, and most rookies guards are going to struggle. Cam is athletic and can score, time will tell if he can do other things to round his game out. If he can’t, I’m not really that high on his ceiling long term.
Not putting much stock in to anything right now. But since JHS is on the squad I’m rooting for him to do well.
- Mar 24, 2001
- 44,833
- 66,536
The D is for defense
- Nov 2, 2006
- 15,448
- 16,780
If we get this throughout the season?.... Scary minutes.
