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I mean, is that not NBA history (and frankly life)? The king gets more leeway while being paid handsomely while the supporting cast have to bring other things to the table, but are ultimately expendable.
**LA LAKERS THREAD** Sitting on 17! 2023-2024 offseason begins
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by licensed to ball,
- Start date
Rockabilly Zombie
formerly sithlord22
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??????
I suppose so. NBA history is littered with one way players winning titles while teams focused really heavy on the margins.
Exactly how I've always seen the NBA......
darthska
Staff member
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"I don't hate Lebron."Oh, we bringin up players that only play one side of the ball here?
Cuz you seemed to forget one.......
I wonder why.
"I don't have a problem with Bron."
"I'm not anti-Lebron. You know that, right?"
darthska
Staff member
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Nah, I love this.
Right off the top, straight out the gate, "I'm here for the team, not you."
Love it.
I quite literally don't.
I just askin why we sendin a couple one way players to China but maxin another. I feel like it's fair to ask.
DLo in prime, good on offense only, send to China.
Vando in prime, good on defense only, send to China.
Bron past prime, good on offense only, MAX CONTRACT!!!
Gosh, we used to compete for Finals every year, I just don't understand why it stopped, oh, winning's hard now, so, oh well, on to next season!!!!
Total mystery.
darthska
Staff member
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So simple.
It's crazy how 1-sighted fans have the audacity to blast players for not being 2-way phenoms.
"Why doesn't he play 2 ways?"
Why don't you see more ways than the 1 way you've been stuck in since Mikan?
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
darthska
Staff member
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And I'm a happy, loyal, committed vegan.
(Currently cooking breakfast sausage. Real pork sausage. Jimmy Dean. Ready in 5.)
Promise. I'm literally a vegan.
Hakeem.
darthska
Staff member
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Nope. Don't do that.Hey uh.....how you know I meant Bron?
What if I was talkin about Rui? Or Reaves?
"You must know I was talking about Lebron because you also know he's a horrible 2-way player."
No I knew you were talking about Bron...
... because it's you.
God you're so predictable and simple. Jesus Herbert Christ.
darthska
Staff member
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"more difficult"
As evidenced by needing to go back THIRTY YEARS for an example.
There are 2 main reasons people argue:
- To understand the other person better and have an intelligent conversation.
- To be right.
You're right.
And I'm a happy, loyal, committed vegan.
(Currently cooking breakfast sausage. Eat in 5.)
Promise. I'm literally a vegan.
Sorry man, I don't. You guys just don't like anything that isn't blind *** homerish.
One press conference. Man had ONE press conference and all of a sudden everybody fallin in love with JJ.
We been gabbin about it FOR MONTHS not him not him not him, he has ONE press conference.....
Ya know.......maybe he gonna be alright.......
That's not me. Bron is a legend. He has far more credit with me than JJ does, or Kobe's agent etc. But I don't just look the other way.
You know how much I've typed for Kobe. You of all people. I CRUSHED this franchise when they gave him 48.5. I mean crushed. And that was Kobe, man. Kobe. Dude, KOBE.
I don't just homer cuz it makes folks feel better.
I want what is absolutely best for the franchise AT ALL TIMES. Be it tanking (for better pick positions) or not paying old folks, or not firing coaches every other year whatever. Giving away talent for nothing (Zubac, Caruso)
I not just gon lay back and "let things happen" when it's clear as day moves will cause trouble.
"You don't know the future" etc etc etc. When we still not winning the next couple years I guarantee you I will remember all of these convos.
You build championship teams around elites in their prime. THAT is NBA History. The entire NBA shows us this. We aren't trying to win titles anymore. We tryin to make money and honor a legend and stay relevant on TV and news cycles. I'm not ok with that.
Especially after last week.
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LeBron James, Anthony Davis and the Lakers’ (real) draft decisions that loom large
The Lakers’ head coaching box has been checked — again.
JJ Redick was formally introduced on Monday, when one of the weirder coaching searches you’ll ever see ended with the very outcome that so many predicted at its outset. That’s seven coaches in the 13 years since Phil Jackson departed in 2011 — eight if you count Bernie Bickerstaff’s five-game tenure in an interim role — and a whole lot of pressure coming Redick’s way after he decided to make his first coaching job one of the most high-profile positions in all of sports.
But as the NBA Draft nears on Wednesday, when the Lakers will finally be able to canvass the league for significant roster upgrades because of the three first-round picks at their disposal, the truth about their situation is that the latest coaching change is the least of their problems. They need more high-level talent, and they need it fast if they’re going to keep LeBron James and Anthony Davis from growing frustrated about this uncertain Lakers future ahead.
James has the leverage that comes with his forthcoming free agency, as he has until Saturday to decide whether to pick up his $51.4 million player option or opt out and sign a new deal (with the Lakers or elsewhere). Davis, meanwhile, has the organizational capital that comes with being a 31-year-old, nine-time All-Star who is signed through the 2027-28 season. And if the franchise cornerstones had their way, league sources say, the Lakers would prove their desire to win this week by going all-in for another elite player.
As of Wednesday, the Lakers will be able to trade up to three first-round picks along with whatever players they choose in a trade. But are they willing to, especially when it comes to the prospect of trading a player like Austin Reaves or Rui Hachimura, who have long since become favorites within the Lakers ownership and front office walls? Therein lies the question that will likely dictate the mood going forward.
James’ looming free agency puts him front-and-center in the Lakers’ spotlight right now, and with good reason. League sources say the 39-year-old has not given the Lakers any indication about what he will do, even if the widely held expectation around the league is that he will either return on his player option or sign a new deal. He wasn’t involved in the coaching search — never mind that it involved his podcast partner — and has made it clear that he’s in wait-and-see mode when it comes to the Lakers’ offseason business and the part it might play in his decision. If he opts out, as so many expect, don’t be surprised if he takes his time in free agency from there.
As Lakers owner Jeanie Buss has always said about this partnership, James’ happiness is the key to it all. Yet while some have surmised that James might be content coasting in these final Lakers years, enjoying all the benefits of living in Los Angeles while continuing to make his incredible mark on the league’s history books, league sources say he desperately wants to win at the highest of levels again. What’s more, James’ unprecedented play at this stage means he remains open to the prospect of playing two, or even three, more seasons before retiring.
As for the Bronny James factor, league sources say LeBron’s plans will not be impacted by where his son lands in this week’s draft. Still, it’s worth noting that the former USC guard only worked out for the Lakers (who have No. 17 and No. 55) and Phoenix (which has No. 22). The Athletic’s draft expert, Sam Vecenie, has Bronny going to the Lakers with the 55th pick in his latest mock.
But Davis’ view of the Lakers’ offseason strategy matters as much, if not more. He’s the one who is smack dab in the middle of his prime, and who represents the Lakers’ best chance at contention in the back end of this decade. And considering the lesson learned from early May, when league sources say the Lakers’ concern about how Davis viewed then-coach Darvin Ham played a part in their choice to make that change, it’s clear that his perspective carries significant weight.
To hear Lakers president of basketball operations Rob Pelinka assess the Lakers landscape at Redick’s introductory news conference on Monday was to get a glimpse of the internal dynamics at play here. He made an early reference to the Lakers’ desire to keep their payroll below the “second apron,” the highly restrictive luxury tax region that is part of the league’s latest collective bargaining agreement. Pelinka mentioned the need to “lean hard into that player development piece,” and Redick even highlighted the Lakers’ G League team which will play a pivotal part in their plan.
“If those two players are at the core of what you’re building, we like our chances,” Pelinka said. “And of course we’ll continue to have conversations as we approach free agency here, in the next week or so, of how we want to tweak or change — make roster changes — to put (the Lakers) in a competitive position built around those two players.”
When asked by The Athletic about the prospect of using the three first-rounders to make a move this week, Pelinka downplayed the possibility.
“In this (CBA) system … some of the trades are more difficult, especially if you have a second-apron team (negotiating with) a first-apron team,” Pelinka said. “There’s a chance we’ll be in the first apron. The trades are less prevalent than they used to be. So will we look for trades that help us become a better team? Absolutely. Are those trades — do they have the same probability that they had under the old system? No, it is a different system. So we’ve got to be mindful and thoughtful around that.
“If the perfect trade comes along, and we can use picks to make it and win a championship, yeah, we’ll do it. Is that trade going to be there? I don’t know. It’s harder in this system to find perfect trades.”
Redick, in turn, emphasized the importance of depth while making it clear that adding another star wasn’t their primary focus.
“If you look at the NBA right now, the group matters more than ever,” he said. “You certainly need the stars, but the group matters more than ever. You need six, seven, eight guys, who can play minutes deep into the playoffs. The Boston Celtics, the Dallas Mavericks, the Pacers, the Timberwolves. It wasn’t about the individual. It was about the group.”
As messaging goes, they didn’t exactly make it sound like a significant upgrade to the roster was happening anytime soon — whether it’s Cleveland’s Donovan Mitchell, Atlanta’s Dejounte Murray, Chicago’s Zach LaVine, Portland’s Jerami Grant, Charlotte’s Miles Bridges (who will be a free agent) or someone else of that ilk. Mitchell has long been seen as a premier target for the Lakers, but, according to The Athletic’s Shams Charania, the Cavaliers are optimistic that he’ll sign a $209 million extension soon. Murray, meanwhile, was a player that the Lakers could have had at the February trade deadline if they’d been willing to put Reaves into the deal. He’s a possibility now, as well, but league sources say the Lakers’ stance on Reaves remains the same.
If this is the direction they’re headed — rolling with this roster after going 47-35 last season and falling to Denver in the first round — then it will be very interesting to see what comes next. Does James still re-sign as expected, or is there any chance he explores options elsewhere for the twilight of his storied career? And what about Davis, whose appetite for title contention is driving his long-term decisions as well?
As for Redick, who will be the hire of the century if he can lead this group to the organization’s 18th title, he shared a different view when asked about the championship expectations that almost always come with this job.
“Yes, I think (the expectations are) reasonable,” Redick said. “I don’t look at the current roster as being that far off from a championship-caliber team.”
The Lakers’ head coaching box has been checked — again.
JJ Redick was formally introduced on Monday, when one of the weirder coaching searches you’ll ever see ended with the very outcome that so many predicted at its outset. That’s seven coaches in the 13 years since Phil Jackson departed in 2011 — eight if you count Bernie Bickerstaff’s five-game tenure in an interim role — and a whole lot of pressure coming Redick’s way after he decided to make his first coaching job one of the most high-profile positions in all of sports.
But as the NBA Draft nears on Wednesday, when the Lakers will finally be able to canvass the league for significant roster upgrades because of the three first-round picks at their disposal, the truth about their situation is that the latest coaching change is the least of their problems. They need more high-level talent, and they need it fast if they’re going to keep LeBron James and Anthony Davis from growing frustrated about this uncertain Lakers future ahead.
James has the leverage that comes with his forthcoming free agency, as he has until Saturday to decide whether to pick up his $51.4 million player option or opt out and sign a new deal (with the Lakers or elsewhere). Davis, meanwhile, has the organizational capital that comes with being a 31-year-old, nine-time All-Star who is signed through the 2027-28 season. And if the franchise cornerstones had their way, league sources say, the Lakers would prove their desire to win this week by going all-in for another elite player.
As of Wednesday, the Lakers will be able to trade up to three first-round picks along with whatever players they choose in a trade. But are they willing to, especially when it comes to the prospect of trading a player like Austin Reaves or Rui Hachimura, who have long since become favorites within the Lakers ownership and front office walls? Therein lies the question that will likely dictate the mood going forward.
James’ looming free agency puts him front-and-center in the Lakers’ spotlight right now, and with good reason. League sources say the 39-year-old has not given the Lakers any indication about what he will do, even if the widely held expectation around the league is that he will either return on his player option or sign a new deal. He wasn’t involved in the coaching search — never mind that it involved his podcast partner — and has made it clear that he’s in wait-and-see mode when it comes to the Lakers’ offseason business and the part it might play in his decision. If he opts out, as so many expect, don’t be surprised if he takes his time in free agency from there.
As Lakers owner Jeanie Buss has always said about this partnership, James’ happiness is the key to it all. Yet while some have surmised that James might be content coasting in these final Lakers years, enjoying all the benefits of living in Los Angeles while continuing to make his incredible mark on the league’s history books, league sources say he desperately wants to win at the highest of levels again. What’s more, James’ unprecedented play at this stage means he remains open to the prospect of playing two, or even three, more seasons before retiring.
As for the Bronny James factor, league sources say LeBron’s plans will not be impacted by where his son lands in this week’s draft. Still, it’s worth noting that the former USC guard only worked out for the Lakers (who have No. 17 and No. 55) and Phoenix (which has No. 22). The Athletic’s draft expert, Sam Vecenie, has Bronny going to the Lakers with the 55th pick in his latest mock.
But Davis’ view of the Lakers’ offseason strategy matters as much, if not more. He’s the one who is smack dab in the middle of his prime, and who represents the Lakers’ best chance at contention in the back end of this decade. And considering the lesson learned from early May, when league sources say the Lakers’ concern about how Davis viewed then-coach Darvin Ham played a part in their choice to make that change, it’s clear that his perspective carries significant weight.
To hear Lakers president of basketball operations Rob Pelinka assess the Lakers landscape at Redick’s introductory news conference on Monday was to get a glimpse of the internal dynamics at play here. He made an early reference to the Lakers’ desire to keep their payroll below the “second apron,” the highly restrictive luxury tax region that is part of the league’s latest collective bargaining agreement. Pelinka mentioned the need to “lean hard into that player development piece,” and Redick even highlighted the Lakers’ G League team which will play a pivotal part in their plan.
“If those two players are at the core of what you’re building, we like our chances,” Pelinka said. “And of course we’ll continue to have conversations as we approach free agency here, in the next week or so, of how we want to tweak or change — make roster changes — to put (the Lakers) in a competitive position built around those two players.”
When asked by The Athletic about the prospect of using the three first-rounders to make a move this week, Pelinka downplayed the possibility.
“In this (CBA) system … some of the trades are more difficult, especially if you have a second-apron team (negotiating with) a first-apron team,” Pelinka said. “There’s a chance we’ll be in the first apron. The trades are less prevalent than they used to be. So will we look for trades that help us become a better team? Absolutely. Are those trades — do they have the same probability that they had under the old system? No, it is a different system. So we’ve got to be mindful and thoughtful around that.
“If the perfect trade comes along, and we can use picks to make it and win a championship, yeah, we’ll do it. Is that trade going to be there? I don’t know. It’s harder in this system to find perfect trades.”
Redick, in turn, emphasized the importance of depth while making it clear that adding another star wasn’t their primary focus.
“If you look at the NBA right now, the group matters more than ever,” he said. “You certainly need the stars, but the group matters more than ever. You need six, seven, eight guys, who can play minutes deep into the playoffs. The Boston Celtics, the Dallas Mavericks, the Pacers, the Timberwolves. It wasn’t about the individual. It was about the group.”
As messaging goes, they didn’t exactly make it sound like a significant upgrade to the roster was happening anytime soon — whether it’s Cleveland’s Donovan Mitchell, Atlanta’s Dejounte Murray, Chicago’s Zach LaVine, Portland’s Jerami Grant, Charlotte’s Miles Bridges (who will be a free agent) or someone else of that ilk. Mitchell has long been seen as a premier target for the Lakers, but, according to The Athletic’s Shams Charania, the Cavaliers are optimistic that he’ll sign a $209 million extension soon. Murray, meanwhile, was a player that the Lakers could have had at the February trade deadline if they’d been willing to put Reaves into the deal. He’s a possibility now, as well, but league sources say the Lakers’ stance on Reaves remains the same.
If this is the direction they’re headed — rolling with this roster after going 47-35 last season and falling to Denver in the first round — then it will be very interesting to see what comes next. Does James still re-sign as expected, or is there any chance he explores options elsewhere for the twilight of his storied career? And what about Davis, whose appetite for title contention is driving his long-term decisions as well?
As for Redick, who will be the hire of the century if he can lead this group to the organization’s 18th title, he shared a different view when asked about the championship expectations that almost always come with this job.
“Yes, I think (the expectations are) reasonable,” Redick said. “I don’t look at the current roster as being that far off from a championship-caliber team.”
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darthska
Staff member
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Reaves provides really good value as a quasi-third/fourth option. Hard to give that up.
darthska
Staff member
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MVP
Supporter
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Sorry man, I don't. You guys just don't like anything that isn't blind *** homerish.
One press conference. Man had ONE press conference and all of a sudden everybody fallin in love with JJ.
We been gabbin about it FOR MONTHS not him not him not him, he has ONE press conference.....
Ya know.......maybe he gonna be alright.......
That's not me. Bron is a legend. He has far more credit with me than JJ does, or Kobe's agent etc. But I don't just look the other way.
You know how much I've typed for Kobe. You of all people. I CRUSHED this franchise when they gave him 48.5. I mean crushed. And that was Kobe, man. Kobe. Dude, KOBE.
I don't just homer cuz it makes folks feel better.
I want what is absolutely best for the franchise AT ALL TIMES. Be it tanking (for better pick positions) or not paying old folks, or not firing coaches every other year whatever. Giving away talent for nothing (Zubac, Caruso)
I not just gon lay back and "let things happen" when it's clear as day moves will cause trouble.
"You don't know the future" etc etc etc. When we still not winning the next couple years I guarantee you I will remember all of these convos.
You build championship teams around elites in their prime. THAT is NBA History. The entire NBA shows us this. We aren't trying to win titles anymore. We tryin to make money and honor a legend and stay relevant on TV and news cycles. I'm not ok with that.
Especially after last week.
They seem to be transitioning to building around AD though now who is a 2 way guy. And much of the NBA is that model with duos now. Outside of the Celtics and maybe Clippers none of these teams have multiple elite 2 way stars. It's at most one (Giannis, Joker, Ant, SGA) and the other one is really good on one side (Dame, Murray, KAT).
You know I don't wanna commit that much money and that many years to Bron moving forward, but hey they don't really have a choice unless he walks away of his own accord.
darthska
Staff member
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Love it, if true.
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JJ has a vision. It’s a nice vision. It’s a great thought.
But to think they are doing it fully when Rui and AR are seemingly not on the block is hilarious.
2 way players? 90% of the team isn’t that.
So outside of Bron and AD everybody has to go.
And because they are not doing that.
They are either running it back. Or worse adding CP3 and a MLE level player, and will try to convince you that DFS for Vando is a step forward in some manner.
But to think they are doing it fully when Rui and AR are seemingly not on the block is hilarious.
2 way players? 90% of the team isn’t that.
So outside of Bron and AD everybody has to go.
And because they are not doing that.
They are either running it back. Or worse adding CP3 and a MLE level player, and will try to convince you that DFS for Vando is a step forward in some manner.
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TBH, not sure if AD has it in him to be a hub, but his passing has improved considerably in the last year.
