MAKING A MURDERER | Season 2 on October 19th!

[deleted]

Acts like he's the ONLY person on NT who's researched the case after seeing the doc

Acts like the ONLY valid opinion after looking at more information is that Avery is the murderer

Acts like anyone who believes in Avery's innocence is a rube who was manipulated by the documentary or a conspiracy theorist

And then wonders why he was met with hostility

 

[mac2008]

Acts like he's the ONLY person on NT who's researched the case after seeing the doc

Acts like the ONLY valid opinion after looking at more information is that Avery is the murderer

Acts like anyone who believes in Avery's innocence is a rube who was manipulated by the documentary or a conspiracy theorist

And then wonders why he was met with hostility

I mean I clearly did more research than you did ...

But that's fine if that's your opinion.

I stand by my posts. I see reasonable people coming into the thread and seeing my posts vs people coming at me with craziness. They don't feel the way you do.

 

[deleted]

Probably 90% of the frequent posters in this thread have visited that reddit...you are not special b

Your assertion that Avery is the murderer is not more valid because you went to reddit...sorry

 

[mac2008]

Probably 90% of the frequent posters in this thread have visited that reddit...you are not special b

Your assertion that Avery is the murderer is not more valid because you went to reddit...sorry

Reddit is full of people who think like you and think there is no possible way he did it. Just so you know. I'm guessing your not in that 90%. The Reddit links I posted were posted because they have a lot of sources together in one spot that make it easier for ppl to read up on things, if they are interested. I see you are not interested in thinking outside of the doc. That is fine. I could care less if you think he truely didn't do it. I came in here to share the info the doc left out, which many ppl who just saw the doc didn't know. Which you can tell by responses, and how now, days later people are posting links to articles. We don't agree about Averys involvement. That's fine. Let it go.


Now if you want to dicuss anything about the case or facts about the murder I'm down. But please stop just posting about how much I think he did it and I'm the only one. I am not. I am interested in the case and in dicussion on th facts.

 

[deleted]

I'm sorry

I'll stop

 

[getback]

Now if you want to dicuss anything about the case or facts about the murder I'm down. But please stop just posting about how much I think he did it and I'm the only one. I am not. I am interested in the case and in dicussion on th facts.

So aside from the physical evidence presented in the series, what else points to Steven aside from hearsay and accusations? Because it seems like the bones, blood evidence and key is really the only thing they have to make a case on, but most of it is tainted. I haven't really browsed all those links, I just saw the one about Brendan't baseless accusations of "touching" which are irrelevant.

 

[mac2008]

So aside from the physical evidence presented in the series, what else points to Steven aside from hearsay and accusations? Because it seems like the bones, blood evidence and key is really the only thing they have to make a case on, but most of it is tainted. I haven't really browsed all those links, I just saw the one about Brendan't baseless accusations of "touching" which are irrelevant.

Well if you want to know, click those links or look up the stuff on your own. I have posted pretty much all I know, had links handy for. People keep ignoring the info and links and then just asking me. When I point them out, it's baseless. ( nothing you find will be more "baseless" than saying stuff was planted. It could've been for sure. But nothing proves it is )If you want the sources, look for them. I'm not asking anyone to take my word for it. But there is no excuse to be ignorant and lazy.

 

[getback]

Well if you want to know, click those links or look up the stuff on your own. I have posted pretty much all I know, had links handy for. People keep ignoring the info and links and then just asking me. When I point them out, it's baseless. ( nothing you find will be more "baseless" than saying stuff was planted. It could've been for sure. But nothing proves it is )If you want the sources, look for them. I'm not asking anyone to take my word for it. But there is no excuse to be ignorant and lazy.

You've typed essays. You can't just make a bulleted list/cliffs?

You want people to hear you out and look at it objectively. Now that someone asks, all the sudden you don't care? Ok.

 

[mac2008]

I have made cliffs , long posts, posted links ...

I'm happy to dicuss something in particular that you have an interesting point of view on.

 

[getback]

I have made cliffs , long posts, posted links ...

I'm happy to dicuss something in particular that you have an interesting point of view on.

What in particular leads you to believe that Steven did it beyond a reasonable doubt?

 

[mister doitnice]

I don't think Mac believes it beyond a reasonable doubt. He has repeatedly said that he doesn't think there was enough evidence for a conviction but he does in fact think Avery is guilty. I can understand that line of thinking, after you read about certain things that weren't in the doc. I don't necessarily agree but I understand.

 

[getback]

I can see both sides of the coin. I just don't know what the evidence (aside from that shown in the doc) really drives home peoples' feeling that he did it.

Answering the door in the towel? Theresa thinking he was a creep? Brendan's sexual assault allegations?

 

[mac2008]

What in particular leads you to believe that Steven did it beyond a reasonable doubt?

I don't think in terms of "beyond a reasonable doubt". I'm not a court room. But I can give you reasons why I think he did it. I have posted sources or most of these, or have seen them elsewhere. Also, some things from the doc. You don't have to take my word that they are "facts", but please try to look something up before you try to discredit it.

- Avery was last person to see her Alive(he admits this, not disputed.) her cell phone activity stops during the time she was at Avery's. ( this alone is HUGE) can throw in th was asked specifically to come take pics. The appointment was made in Barbs name. I believe it was her van, though no one disputes that Avery was always the one who was gonna interact with th. She also commented on being at his property before and he showed up in towel only. She said it was gross.
- Avery's phone called th the day of the murder. The first two calls were *67', third one was made at 430, witnesses and Avery say she was already at his property at this time. This call was NOT blocked with *67.
- th purse and contents were found in barrel 20 ft from Avery's door.Bobby Dassey says he saw Avery put bag in barrel before he left hunting. Brendan also says he saw her purse and camera in this barrel.
- Avery purchased sex restraints 3 weeks before the murder. Brendan's confession seems to show this type of thing was used.
- Avery was already about to be charged with sexual Abuse from a family member. Also Brendan talks to his mom about Avery's inappropriate sexual behavior. She seemed to know already. Also can throw in the lighting a cat on fire incident. Shows Avery has a lack of empathy at the very least.
- His DNA was in car. By ignition and he also had a cut on his right hand. Also, none blood DNA found on hood latch of car. EDTA was found in his vial of blood but not found in car sample. These tests are not common but in OJ case, same type of test was done and EDTA was detected. So it is possible to detect. If you read defense expert trial transcripts, she didn't really say anything other than she's unfamiliar with the procedure.
- bullet found in his garage with th DNA matched the gun that was kept in his room. (Think doc only mentions it matches type. It matched specifically)
- Bobby Dassey returns home the night of the murder with bleach on his pants. His mom confirmed and so did testing. He told his mom he was helping Avery clean his garage. Now he says this, to his mom, night of the murder. Before his confession. During confession he admits he was cleaning blood with bleach, gas and paint thinner. ( I can't find where I say this next part admittedly, but think it was in Dassey trial transcripts.) bleach was detected on sa floor.
- vehicle found on his property. ( want to point out something the doc says. Doc does a good job questioning why Acery didn't crush the car. What it doesn't mention is when you crush a car you don't drive in, hit a button, Then walk away and wiping your hands off. You must strip it, drain it, and prepare it for the crusher. This takes time, and people would notice sa working on this vehicle in the company garage )
- her bones were found in his burn pit, one he admits using night of her murder. ( some bones are scattered, but ALL were on Avery property.
- ( my opinion) after watching full videos of Dassey confession, I think he was involved. Seemed like he first tried to mini,keep his involvement, and then kept giving in until he admitted how involved he really was. I think there are parts where he does not stick to yes or no, he goes into great detail on his own. Also, when I watched the doc and heard the prosecution say "he did it because he wanted to feel what sex was like". I was angry, like how could they just say he did it because of that. Then I saw video and Brendan says this is why he did it. His own words.

That's all I can think of on top of my head. I'm sure people can point to theories or reasons they don't think one is correct individually. However, I think anyone who tries to discredit all of it would look completely ridiculous. I'm opem to hear new ideas from people though! Just don't respond with " couldn't have .." Or something like that. Yes anything is possible but I believe most of the things I posted are pretty hardened pieces of evidence.

 

[getback]

The most damning evidence is the bones in the burn pit. For some reason, I don't remember them addressing that in the documentary as it pertains to possible conspiracy theories.

 

[mac2008]

I think they point out how bones are found in a couple different places. But they don't mention all those places are on Avery property. I guess they are saying the police burned th body then brought them to Avery yard. Which is pretty ridiculous.

 

[$tatus $ymbol]

How is it ridiculous? I guess we're gonna turn a blind eye to how shady this police department was the entire time.


The only damning piece of evidence imo is Stevens sweat on the key and on the car. Other than that I'm not seeing how it was Steven. He shot her in the garage then him and his slow nephew cleaned the place spotless of any DNA with bleach lmao No dna on the concrete, no blood splatter anywhere the place is wiped clean of Teresa's dna by Avery LOL

The cut on his hand means nothing. None of his prints are in the car so he would have had to have on gloves, yet somehow he manages to get his blood in the car.


My personal belief is that Steven killed her but is was absolutely not in the method that the prosecution claimed. I also believe that Brendan had nothing to do with this. The fact that the so called confession is looked to as credible is asinine.

 

[quise2024]

I wanna read and post but i just started it last night, finished 3 episodes last night

 

[mac2008]

Guess I should say I PERSONALLY think the police department burning a body of a human being and then planting her remains in someone's back yard is ridiculous. If you don't, that's your opinion. If you say the key could've been planted, I can't argue you that, seems like a high possibility. The prosecution provided a story that she was killed in bedroom/garage, doesn't mean that's where it happen. I think it probably did though, I think they could've burned all the bedding like the confession says and then cleaned up the spot she was on the garage floor. But I see why ppl question the lack of blood found. I just don't think lack of blood means it didn't happen. There are murder cases where blood isn't found all the time.

 

[monstar]

I appreciate mac providing and continuing to support his beliefs. The doc is great but like many leaves some things out and does a great job of playing on your emotions. At the emd of the day i can honestly believe that Steven wasnt given a fair shake by law enforcement. But had he not been wrongly arrested the 1st time people's feelings would be different.

Also wasnt anonymous supposed to realease addiitonal info? Guess that never happened

 

[thenewjs23]

Watching now and its got me legit hot. The Avery's are poor and very illiterate.

 

[Chopper]

Watching now and its got me legit hot. The Avery's are poor and very illiterate.

Spoiler

Really said. Dude said "what does inconsistent mean", "I don't know." I just felt bad after that, and when he said, "I'm stupid Mom." Damn he's never had a chance.

 

[BANLEU]

Long post so I'll put in a spoiler:

Spoiler

Why are y'all going so hard at mac? You guys are coming at him like Steven is a member of your own family . All he's doing is giving his opinion on why he thinks Avery is guilty (like a few of you asked for in the beginning of the thread), and when he does you guys proceed to bash him for it. It's funny because he's not even doing it on some "He's guilty because I say so. No I don't need evidence. Nah nah na nah nah" trolling type ish. He's actually providing information with sources to back his opinion that anyone with an open mind could read for themselves and then make an informed decision to either agree or disagree. Dude isn't even saying he would convict Steve since he agrees that the police in that county were shady as hell and quite possibly tampered with evidence. Only that he believes he's guilty after researching the case for himself.

Initially I too believed Steve was completely and 100% innocent. I voted "yes" in the tread, signed the petition, brought this documentary up to coworkers and expressed my outrage, etc, etc. But after reading a couple of the links Mac posted in here, I'm not so sure. No I'm not saying he did it, just that I'm not certain he didn't. So far I've only been reading the transcripts of Brendan's interviews and a lot of things don't add up. Some of the details he gives seem too personal to be coerced. Like how he couldn't look when Steve shot her because he "Can't watch stuff like that", or how he didn't ejaculate when he had sex with Teresa (they even ask him if he knows what sex is and in his own words he says its when a guy puts his penis in a girl's vagina).

One thing I noticed is that all of his answers weren't one word like the doc portrayed them to be. There were plenty of times where they would just let him talk without interjecting and it felt like, at least to me, like he was covering something up. It sounded less like he was being fed answers and more like a kid lying his way out of something. It was like a mix of lies, half truths and hard facts. Some of the things he said didn't even make sense to the interviewers. A lot of things he knew truthfully (his level of involvement, Steve's level, who carried her to the garage, what she said while it was happening), and other things he guessed on (the times certain events happened, the length of the knife, how far in he stabbed her; which by the way, he admitted to lying about her throat being slit. They each stabbed her once - Steve first in the chest and then Brendan in the stomach). Other times his story would completely change and you'd get new details that were never mentioned before (like how Steve and him planned it a few days prior, or how he went over there earlier in the day and Steve came out the trailer sweating -Teresa was already there - and he told Brendan to go home and he'd call him later to come over).

I haven't read through all of the links that have been posted yet, but just the few I have read leave me with doubts of Steve's innocence. Again, I'm not saying he's guilty, just that I'm not sure he's innocent. I sincerely hope he is innocent. I would be pissed at the way this documentary had me so emotionally invested in this man's story, only to find out he really did do it . But, in keeping an open mind, I know that there are 3 sides to every story and none of us knows the truth. It's impossible for us to know because we weren't there. All we can do is give our opinions and the more informed it is, the better.

Side note: those of you feeling for Brendan not being able to watch Wrestlemania, he actually did. He just caught the last 15 minutes of it though

I think one thing that you and mac aren't taking into account in regard to Dassey is his intellectual level and possible learning disability. I'm not a child psychologist or speech expert, but I do know a bit about special education and I can't stress enough the role that this could have played.

Also, how do we know that the stabbing and raping portion are even accurate? That's the police's theory of what happened based on his questioning, but there is no evidence that points to her being stabbed, raped, or throat cut because her body was cremated. He easily could have made all that up because he thought that it's what the police wanted to hear. The only physical evidence is that she was shot in the head, which is based on the bullet marks found on the skull fragments.

- Avery was last person to see her Alive(he admits this, not disputed.) her cell phone activity stops during the time she was at Avery's. ( this alone is HUGE) can throw in th was asked specifically to come take pics. The appointment was made in Barbs name. I believe it was her van, though no one disputes that Avery was always the one who was gonna interact with th. She also commented on being at his property before and he showed up in towel only. She said it was gross.

[COLOR=#red] I don't think the cell phone activity stopping is as damming as you make it seem. Just because it stopped when she got to Avery's doesn't mean that she couldn't have been killed by someone else after she left his property or that someone else associated with Avery could have killed her (i.e. Bobby or Scott). [/COLOR]​

- Avery's phone called th the day of the murder. The first two calls were *67', third one was made at 430, witnesses and Avery say she was already at his property at this time. This call was NOT blocked with *67.

[COLOR=#red]The only person putting her on the property around 4:00 was the bus driver and judging by the simplicity of her transaction with Avery it's likely that she was gone by 4:30. Avery may have called because he forgot something. Again, I don't think the *67 stuff or the calls is that damming. [/COLOR]​

- th purse and contents were found in barrel 20 ft from Avery's door.Bobby Dassey says he saw Avery put bag in barrel before he left hunting. Brendan also says he saw her purse and camera in this barrel.

[COLOR=#red]It's likely that Brendan heard Bobby say this sometime after Avery was arrested and he was just repeating it. Again, I don't think either Bobby or Scott were investigated enough. [/COLOR]​

- Avery purchased sex restraints 3 weeks before the murder. Brendan's confession seems to show this type of thing was used.

[COLOR=#red]I looked through some of the links you provided but I couldn't find anything about these restraints? Even if he did purchase restraints, were they ever found or tested for evidence?The lab technician admitted that Halbach's DNA wasn't found on anything but the car and the bullet[/COLOR]​

- Avery was already about to be charged with sexual Abuse from a family member. Also Brendan talks to his mom about Avery's inappropriate sexual behavior. She seemed to know already. Also can throw in the lighting a cat on fire incident. Shows Avery has a lack of empathy at the very least.

[COLOR=#red]So every person that harms animals lacks empathy and could be a cold-blooded killer/rapist? I guess it's just a matter of time before Mike Vick kills someone, right?[/COLOR]​

- His DNA was in car. By ignition and he also had a cut on his right hand. Also, none blood DNA found on hood latch of car. EDTA was found in his vial of blood but not found in car sample. These tests are not common but in OJ case, same type of test was done and EDTA was detected. So it is possible to detect. If you read defense expert trial transcripts, she didn't really say anything other than she's unfamiliar with the procedure.

[COLOR=#red]If I'm not mistaken, they said the EDTA tests hadn't been done by the FBI or any other company in many years (10?) possibly because the tests aren't accurate enough. Also, didn't the FBI only test three of the six samples and then extrapolate their results from their? Idc what you say, but that isn't good science.[/COLOR]​

- bullet found in his garage with th DNA matched the gun that was kept in his room. (Think doc only mentions it matches type. It matched specifically)

[COLOR=#red]The defense never argued that the bullet didn't match his gun or that he didn't fire it. They argued that the test that found Halbach's DNA on the bullet was invalid because it was contaminated. If I remember correctly, they found 10 other shell casings but only one bullet. Why weren't other bullets recovered? [/COLOR]​

- Bobby Dassey returns home the night of the murder with bleach on his pants. His mom confirmed and so did testing. He told his mom he was helping Avery clean his garage. Now he says this, to his mom, night of the murder. Before his confession. During confession he admits he was cleaning blood with bleach, gas and paint thinner. ( I can't find where I say this next part admittedly, but think it was in Dassey trial transcripts.) bleach was detected on sa floor.

[COLOR=#red]I didn't see anything about bleach being found on Dassey's clothes. But even if there was, he wasn't a suspect until 5 months after Avery was arrested. Isn't it possible that his clothes could have gotten bleached at some point during that time? Also, I distincly remember the defense arguing that Avery's floor hadn't been bleached because his DNA was found on it and hers wasn't. [/COLOR]​

- vehicle found on his property. ( want to point out something the doc says. Doc does a good job questioning why Acery didn't crush the car. What it doesn't mention is when you crush a car you don't drive in, hit a button, Then walk away and wiping your hands off. You must strip it, drain it, and prepare it for the crusher. This takes time, and people would notice sa working on this vehicle in the company garage )

[COLOR=#red] Avery also had his own garage where he could have stripped the car down and nobody would have noticed. It seems to me that he had plenty of time to strip the car and crush it if he really wanted to. [/COLOR]​

- her bones were found in his burn pit, one he admits using night of her murder. ( some bones are scattered, but ALL were on Avery property.

[COLOR=#red] Why move some bones, but not others? If he's smart enough to realize that it could incriminate him, then you have to think that he would have been more careful then that. [/COLOR]​

- ( my opinion) after watching full videos of Dassey confession, I think he was involved. Seemed like he first tried to mini,keep his involvement, and then kept giving in until he admitted how involved he really was. I think there are parts where he does not stick to yes or no, he goes into great detail on his own. Also, when I watched the doc and heard the prosecution say "he did it because he wanted to feel what sex was like". I was angry, like how could they just say he did it because of that. Then I saw video and Brendan says this is why he did it. His own words.

[COLOR=#red]See my explanation about learning disabilities and intellectual capacity. [/COLOR]​

@mac2013 in red is my rebuttal to some of your points. I know I'm not going to convince you, but I thought I'd at least offer some explanation/alternate theory.

You also mentioned on another page that Avery and Dassey could have burned the sheets, but that still doesn't explain why her blood was never found on the bed? If her throat was in fact cut then there would have been everywhere and likely would have stained the bed through the sheets.

Also, it's hard to imagine that someone in Halbach's position didn't sweat out of fear and yet no sweat or other forms of DNA was found in his room. People question the lack of blood because of the manner in which the police say he killed her.

More importantly, if he did stab her or cut her throat, then why take her to the garage at all? She would have bled out or succumbed to the stabbing eventually. It just doesn't make sense that he would take her to another part of his property to shoot her in the head when that likely wasn't needed.

The police framing him isn't that ridiculous either when you consider that they did it once before and that they were facing a $30 million lawsuit. That would have been incentive enough to frame him. That scumbag officer that said they easily could have killed Avery instead of framing him is full of it. Killing him would have been much more suspicious than framing him.

Personally, I think that someone else killed her and the police again ignored those leads and planted evidence to make sure that Avery got convicted.

 

[mac2008]

Thank you for your opinion and theories !

I will respond to some ! Of course I'm not saying the stuff uou said COULDNT have happened. But for it all to have happened is far fetched, I think we all would agree.


- her cell phone not having activity after she was at Averys isn't the end all be all, but it would def make the police have a good place to start

- you said *67 wasn't damming but the fact he hid his number while calling when she was alive, then didn't when she was dead/ in his house. To me. It is.

- I posted a link that talks about restraints. No DNA was found on them however. (Doesn't mean they weren't used lol. This forum is huge on DNA when it isn't found. But when it is. It's planted. If the police wanted to make sure they nailed Avery they would've put her DNA in his house )

- the EDTA test isn't common. CuAuse how often do ppl think their blood is planted ? I can only think of two cases. And in one they FOUND edta. So the test works. The doc made it sound like junk science, I know. But the last time it was done, they found it. And what does it matter how many samples they test? If just one had no edta, he was in that car. Also hopd DNA wasn't blood.
- bullet itself was not contaminated at all. The sample DNA test had the techs DNA. She messed up that test.
- bleach was found on his pants. They were presented as evidence at the trial. And it was after the murder they were tested, however barbs interview where she said he came home with bleach that night was a lot earlier.


- also something that I am sure not many people here know , in his initial interview with police, Avery denied having a bonfire that night. That alone would make me think he did it honestly. But there's plenty more that can take you to that conclusion.

 

[Baby Face Nelson]

You keep bringing up EDTA from the FBI which you portray to be a slam dunk. Right now the FBI is in a scandal for giving flawed testimonies dating back to 1989. You would argue that science is science, and it should be that way but it's not. A lab tec job performance is evaluated by someone in the district attorney or state attorney general's office. You can see how that leads to bias and favorable convictions for the prosecution. Criminal Justice Ethnics did a study in 2013 and found that several states are provided remuneration upon conviction. Guess what, Virginia is one of those states.

Everywhere I looked online it still was 3/6 samples that were tested, and if they came from TH, there wouldn't be any EDTA in it. So we don't know where the sample levels came from, or the detection levels for their own test they made up. You could tell with all of his face twitching during cross examination, that his statement about corrupt cops and finding them was BS.

 

[BANLEU]

Thank you for your opinion and theories !

I will respond to some ! Of course I'm not saying the stuff uou said COULDNT have happened. But for it all to have happened is far fetched, I think we all would agree.


- her cell phone not having activity after she was at Averys isn't the end all be all, but it would def make the police have a good place to start

[COLOR=#red]I agree that Avery's was a good place to start, but the problem is that the police never took their focus off of him or followed up on other suspicious leads. [/COLOR]​

- you said *67 wasn't damming but the fact he hid his number while calling when she was alive, then didn't when she was dead/ in his house. To me. It is.

[COLOR=#red]Your assuming that she was dead by 4:30 when we don't know for sure what time she was killed. For me, it's hard to believe that the bus driver saw her at 4:00 and by 4:30 she had been raped twice, stabbed, sliced, and shot in the head. Not to mention that she was out there to take pictures of the car.[/COLOR]​

- I posted a link that talks about restraints. No DNA was found on them however. (Doesn't mean they weren't used lol. This forum is huge on DNA when it isn't found. But when it is. It's planted. If the police wanted to make sure they nailed Avery they would've put her DNA in his house )

[COLOR=#red]I mean you can't have it both ways. You can't say her blood and DNA was all over the car because of her injuries, but it was no where to be found on the restraints, bed, garage floor, etc. [/COLOR]​

- the EDTA test isn't common. CuAuse how often do ppl think their blood is planted ? I can only think of two cases. And in one they FOUND edta. So the test works. The doc made it sound like junk science, I know. But the last time it was done, they found it. And what does it matter how many samples they test? If just one had no edta, he was in that car. Also hopd DNA wasn't blood.

[COLOR=#red]Again, the OJ test was done many years before the Avery test so it's hard to believe that the FBI could do a test that they haven't done in a long time with such ease and accuracy. I work for the government and I can tell you that nothing ever happens that quickly. Everything is burdened by levels of bureaucracy. In Maryland, where I work, there are thousands of untested rape kits that there is no way to test accurately and efficiently. Yet, you expect me to believe that the FBI can somehow calibrate their equipment in a fraction of the time that they expected to do it in? Like I said, you can't extrapolate the results from three samples to all of the samples because it's possible that the three samples they tested had such low levels of EDTA that they weren't detected. More importantly, there isn't a third-party company that can independently verify the FBI's testing. [/COLOR]​

- bullet itself was not contaminated at all. The sample DNA test had the techs DNA. She messed up that test.

[COLOR=#red]How can you say that the sample wasn't contaminated and admit that the techs DNA was on it in the same sentence? That's contradictory. That sample should have been inadmissible because of that contamination. [/COLOR]​

- bleach was found on his pants. They were presented as evidence at the trial. And it was after the murder they were tested, however barbs interview where she said he came home with bleach that night was a lot earlier.

[COLOR=#red]I'll go back and look for information about this because I'm still not convinced. [/COLOR]​

- also something that I am sure not many people here know , in his initial interview with police, Avery denied having a bonfire that night. That alone would make me think he did it honestly. But there's plenty more that can take you to that conclusion.

[COLOR=#red]Avery also had a low IQ and I'm not sure that any admission or denial that he made during his initial interrogation could be accurate. [/COLOR]​